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SweetEnigma
Apr 21st 2009, 05:05 PM
Curious question, but is it possible for 2 believers to not be equal in their faith for Christ. This question dawned on me after reading this:

The Parable of the ten virgins. Matthew 24:1-13. The believers of Christ are likened to ten virgins. Five were wise and kept their lamps filled. Five were foolish. Like the wise and the foolish builders, this refers to faith. Five were strong in the faith, having a personal relationship with God and letting their lights shine forth. Five were foolish or hypocritical. They slumbered and let their lamps of faith go out.

Is Christ saying there that believers aren't entirely equal in their levels of faith?

I wonder this because I am a "baby" Christian, I've only been reading the bible for a little under 4 months now. For the past 8 months, I've dated a man who has been a devout Christian all of his life. He is very comfortable with prayer, and it seems like he prays a lot more than I do... also he spends much of his time in church and volunteering and reading the bible. I'm concerned that maybe we are unequally yoked still despite me finding Christ (which was totally independent of anything to do with him).

I'd like to hear other's thoughts on this...

Followtheway
Apr 21st 2009, 07:54 PM
Yes, there are those that are at different levels of their faith. Unequally yoked generally refers to a believer and unbeliever, but it would also be good to have to close in their faith rather than one on milk and one on solid food because it will definitly help in the marriage. My wife and I are at different levels I would say she is still on milk while im on meat, but that does not mean I love her any less, we just fight a little more and I look forward to bringing her to where I am.

My_King
Apr 21st 2009, 08:03 PM
My husband was a baby Christian when we married. I was more mature in knowledge, but not really in heart. Yes, this caused a lot of issues between us, however in spite of them, or maybe because of them, it created an environment for me to grow closer to God. I think my maturity REALLY happened during those first few years of marriage.

I wouldn't change that for anything.

However, to answer your basic question - I'm not really sure! I was always under the impression it was referring to unbelievers and believers.

kricaud
Apr 22nd 2009, 01:02 AM
I think (and this is only my opinion) that the parable of the ten virgins refers more to being diligent in your faith. If you "fall asleep" in your faith, satan has a lot more opportunities to deceive you and pull you away from Christ as your savior. It is important to be in God's word and prayerfully committed to Him as a Christian.

Your boyfriend will hopefully be a guide for you in your faith. You will also hopefully be a reminder to him of the joys of having Christ in your life and the glories found in exploring the Bible and having your faith grow.

The most important thing is that you both have Christ as the foundation of your relationship. Yes, there will still be problems and issues, but the best relationships and marriages involve 3 (man, woman and Jesus).

I pray for you to continue to find joy, peace, love and wonder as your faith grows! It is an amazing blessing to have in your life when things are good or when things are more of a struggle.

Hope this helped some.

Moxie
Apr 22nd 2009, 02:32 AM
Believers are never going to be at the same place in their faith even if they professed faith at the same time......why? because God is always in the process of making us more and more like His Son Jesus. Romans tells us we are transformed by the renewing of our mind.

We all have different issues/hangups/backgrounds etc...that we must work through in order to be transformed. How willing we are to submit to God, how much we are in the word and how prayerful we are will all contribute to how "quickly" we mature as Christians.

As Christians, we will have "dry spells" when we feel we haven't grown or we don't feel God is as near as He once was. At times, we will feel as if He has made major changes in us in just a short period.

Stay in His word.....remember those who hunger and thirst after his righteousness will be filled. :)

HisLeast
Apr 22nd 2009, 02:57 AM
I'm going to say no, with the qualification of defining "Christian" as someone who's sold out to God. Not someone who goes to church, reads the bible occasionally, and is a BasicallyGoodPerson™ .

Why say no? Because it opens up pandoras box. The unequally yoked passage is clearly talking about a believer and a non-believer first of all, using the metaphor of a yoke as one partner will go straight (towards God) and the other will go a different direction (towards the world/self). Make it about two CHRISTIANS and just watch the way we'll start force ranking and quantifying each others Christianlyness. In my opinion, there's far too much of this already.

bagofseed
Apr 22nd 2009, 03:04 AM
unequal yoke would be like putting an Ox and a donkey in the same yoke.

Meanwhile it was common to put a stronger more mature Ox in the same yoke with a younger one so it would learn.

9Marksfan
Apr 22nd 2009, 10:12 AM
unequal yoke would be like putting an Ox and a donkey in the same yoke.

Meanwhile it was common to put a stronger more mature Ox in the same yoke with a younger one so it would learn.

Excellent analogy! The thing is - are you OK to learn from your boyfriend and is he OK to "bring you on" in the faith? Would you LIKE to be as committed as he is?

Also, Sweet Enigma, the parable of the ten virgins is not a good analogy - in fact, I believe it is speaking about the visible, professing church in every age - it is a mixed bunch of folks who are truly Christ's and those who are not - remember the end? Christ did not know the foolish virgins - and Jesus says that He KNOWS His own (Jn 10:14) - His sheep (v27). If Jesus doesn't know us, then we're not Christians.

Are you sure you know Jesus? Because if He knows us - we'll know Him! (Jn 10:14, Gal 4:9)

inluvwjesus
Apr 22nd 2009, 07:57 PM
Well for me and what scripture says is that unequally yoked is when a follower of Jesus Christ as LORD and Saviour and an unbeliever develop an intimate relationship and want to become married. I understand by many responses that there are people who claim to be Christian, but their lifestyles do not reflect the love of God. When someone is obviously not a Christian then it is an easy decision, absolutely not okay to be unequally yoked. I wrote a piece that God gave me last year where He reminded me of the movie Osmosis Jones in which Bill Murray has starred. In that movie which turned to cartoon, the character Osmosis Jones was a white blood cell acting as a police officer over the city which was the body. There was a dark evil enemy known as Thrax, short for Anthrax that he had to defeat and the person, Bill Murray's character almost died because of "Thrax". So the LORD revealed to me that being unequally yoked would be if Thrax were a female and Osmosis Jones became attracted to her and they got married. They are from two kingdoms, one which seeks to protect and edify the body, the other bent on its destruction, so is the yoking of a believer to an unbeliever. I was so impressed by what the LORD was telling me I wrote a piece but cannot yet share my website since I am new.

9Marksfan
Apr 23rd 2009, 08:58 AM
Well for me and what scripture says is that unequally yoked is when a follower of Jesus Christ as LORD and Saviour and an unbeliever develop an intimate relationship and want to become married. I understand by many responses that there are people who claim to be Christian, but their lifestyles do not reflect the love of God. When someone is obviously not a Christian then it is an easy decision, absolutely not okay to be unequally yoked. I wrote a piece that God gave me last year where He reminded me of the movie Osmosis Jones in which Bill Murray has starred. In that movie which turned to cartoon, the character Osmosis Jones was a white blood cell acting as a police officer over the city which was the body. There was a dark evil enemy known as Thrax, short for Anthrax that he had to defeat and the person, Bill Murray's character almost died because of "Thrax". So the LORD revealed to me that being unequally yoked would be if Thrax were a female and Osmosis Jones became attracted to her and they got married. They are from two kingdoms, one which seeks to protect and edify the body, the other bent on its destruction, so is the yoking of a believer to an unbeliever. I was so impressed by what the LORD was telling me I wrote a piece but cannot yet share my website since I am new.

I look forward to the moment when you can! :)

TrophyofGrace
Apr 26th 2009, 07:57 PM
Curious question, but is it possible for 2 believers to not be equal in their faith for Christ.

Oh yes. Even though "unequally yoked" refers to an unbeliever and a believer, it's possible for two Christians to be so unequal in their faith it's little better than being with an unbeliever.... I've observed it more often than I care to.

motormouf
May 26th 2009, 02:49 PM
Curious question, but is it possible for 2 believers to not be equal in their faith for Christ. This question dawned on me after reading this:

The Parable of the ten virgins. Matthew 24:1-13. The believers of Christ are likened to ten virgins. Five were wise and kept their lamps filled. Five were foolish. Like the wise and the foolish builders, this refers to faith. Five were strong in the faith, having a personal relationship with God and letting their lights shine forth. Five were foolish or hypocritical. They slumbered and let their lamps of faith go out.

Is Christ saying there that believers aren't entirely equal in their levels of faith?

I wonder this because I am a "baby" Christian, I've only been reading the bible for a little under 4 months now. For the past 8 months, I've dated a man who has been a devout Christian all of his life. He is very comfortable with prayer, and it seems like he prays a lot more than I do... also he spends much of his time in church and volunteering and reading the bible. I'm concerned that maybe we are unequally yoked still despite me finding Christ (which was totally independent of anything to do with him).

I'd like to hear other's thoughts on this...


Definately- because there are some christians who altho they are saved dont look and act like it- some drink party curse fornicate etc. And to me them hooking up with a strong, devoted serious Christian would be disasterous ive seen it happen b4. Often, the stronger Christian gets weaker and pulled down via the association

Anje
May 26th 2009, 05:38 PM
Believers are never going to be at the same place in their faith even if they professed faith at the same time......why? because God is always in the process of making us more and more like His Son Jesus. Romans tells us we are transformed by the renewing of our mind.

We all have different issues/hangups/backgrounds etc...that we must work through in order to be transformed. How willing we are to submit to God, how much we are in the word and how prayerful we are will all contribute to how "quickly" we mature as Christians.

As Christians, we will have "dry spells" when we feel we haven't grown or we don't feel God is as near as He once was. At times, we will feel as if He has made major changes in us in just a short period.

Stay in His word.....remember those who hunger and thirst after his righteousness will be filled. :)

I absolutely agree. Nicely said.:)

9Marksfan
May 27th 2009, 11:41 AM
Definately- because there are some christians who altho they are saved dont look and act like it- some drink party curse fornicate etc.

Scripture says that such people are not born of God = not saved.

Athanasius
May 27th 2009, 03:06 PM
Definately- because there are some christians who altho they are saved dont look and act like it- some drink party curse fornicate etc.

If it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck...

motormouf
May 28th 2009, 08:31 PM
Scripture says that such people are not born of God = not saved.

I really wouldn't go as far as to say that they aren't saved. Because -All have sinned and come short of the glory of God. I've found that some people can start out, willing to live the christian life but if they are not careful, they may be led out into the world and we all know that the devil will look for any way to get them whether it be drinking , sex, bad friends. And i am saved and i have done things in my life that i know Christians shouldn't do repeatedly (not proud, just being honest:() and i know it can be a struggle against. SO i really cant agree on that point about saying they're not saved. I'm not disagreeing with the Bible, but maybe you may have misinterpreted it

9Marksfan
Jun 2nd 2009, 01:36 PM
I really wouldn't go as far as to say that they aren't saved. Because -All have sinned and come short of the glory of God.

Granted, but we are not to stay in sin once we have believed in Christ (Rom 6:1).


I've found that some people can start out, willing to live the christian life but if they are not careful, they may be led out into the world and we all know that the devil will look for any way to get them whether it be drinking , sex, bad friends. And i am saved and i have done things in my life that i know Christians shouldn't do repeatedly (not proud, just being honest:() and i know it can be a struggle against. SO i really cant agree on that point about saying they're not saved. I'm not disagreeing with the Bible, but maybe you may have misinterpreted it

The Bible says whoever continues to practise sin is not born of God. How do you know you were saved when you did these things? What do you think would have happened to you if you'd been killed/died suddenly in that state?

motormouf
Jun 2nd 2009, 08:06 PM
Granted, but we are not to stay in sin once we have believed in Christ (Rom 6:1).



The Bible says whoever continues to practise sin is not born of God. How do you know you were saved when you did these things? What do you think would have happened to you if you'd been killed/died suddenly in that state?


You have a verse for that? But I know i was still saved because i got saved at about 7, and have been saved even since then and you really cant lose it
can you?- Ephesians 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God. ie My salvation is not based on my works but God's grace, so my poor work cant make me lose it. And while i did it, i wasn't all proud and happy but shamed and wanted to escape, (thank God i have done it) showing that the Holy Spirit was convicting me.

So IMO you really cant go as far to say that i might not have been saved at that point. So if i died I'd have gone to heaven. But it wouldn't be as good a journey as if i would have if i did it without the sin in my life

Good reference- David and Solomon were men of God but at one point they fell into sin-David- sleeping with and marrying Bathsheba, killing Uriah. Solomon -worshiping false gods and marrying women who didn't serve God. Eventually they returned to God and Godly life styles, but does it mean they were not for God in the first place?

9Marksfan
Jun 3rd 2009, 03:33 PM
You have a verse for that?

Heb 10:26-31, Tit 1:16, 2 Cor 13:5, Heb 6:4-8


But I know i was still saved because i got saved at about 7, and have been saved even since then and you really cant lose it
can you?

I agree you can't lose it, but how can you think you really had it if you have not repented and continue to live like the world?


- Ephesians 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God. ie My salvation is not based on my works but God's grace, so my poor work cant make me lose it.

But our works show whether our faith is real or not - and grace teaches us to turn away from sin and live for God:-

For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men, teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly in the present age Tit 2:11-12 NKJV


And while i did it, i wasn't all proud and happy but shamed and wanted to escape, (thank God i have done it) showing that the Holy Spirit was convicting me.

So IMO you really cant go as far to say that i might not have been saved at that point.

Why not? I'm assuming you mean "not yet saved" rather than "lost salvation"?


So if i died I'd have gone to heaven. But it wouldn't be as good a journey as if i would have if i did it without the sin in my life

Got a verse for that? You died in a sinful state - true believers persevere to the end and don't continue in sin. I'm wanting you to think through the seriousness of what you did and the folly of posting that truly saved people can behave in this way and it's somehow OK because saved people regularly behave in this way (that was the clear inference of your post).


Good reference- David and Solomon were men of God but at one point they fell into sin-David- sleeping with and marrying Bathsheba, killing Uriah.

Granted, but if you read Ps 51, I trust that you'll agree that David would never have spoken as glibly about his sin as you have done...


Solomon -worshiping false gods and marrying women who didn't serve God. Eventually they returned to God and Godly life styles, but does it mean they were not for God in the first place?

Where does it say that Solomon returned? His sin was so persistent that God was against him and pursued him...(1 Kgs 11).

motormouf
Jun 3rd 2009, 04:57 PM
Heb 10:26-31, Tit 1:16, 2 Cor 13:5, Heb 6:4-8



I agree you can't lose it, but how can you think you really had it if you have not repented and continue to live like the world?

But our works show whether our faith is real or not - and grace teaches us to turn away from sin and live for God:-

It teaches us alright but being human there still is the chance that we will fall isnt there. Satan will try to tempt u especially since you are a Christian (Eph : 6.11) many have fallen in the past. Does it mean they werent saved?


For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men, teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly in the present age Tit 2:11-12 NKJV



Why not? I'm assuming you mean "not yet saved" rather than "lost salvation"?



Got a verse for that? You died in a sinful state - true believers persevere to the end and don't continue in sin. I'm wanting you to think through the seriousness of what you did and the folly of posting that truly saved people can behave in this way and it's somehow OK because saved people regularly behave in this way (that was the clear inference of your post).



Granted, but if you read Ps 51, I trust that you'll agree that David would never have spoken as glibly about his sin as you have done...



Where does it say that Solomon returned? His sin was so persistent that God was against him and pursued him...(1 Kgs 11).



Obviously you are mis interpreting me. I'm not saying that i'm living in that sin and proud of it. I'm saying i HAD a struggle with that problem all the while i acknowledged that it was a sin and made many efforts to escape, along with constant prayer for forgiveness and God's guidance to escape.Sometimes there was success, sometimes there was failure, but the fact was i made an effort during that time. Right now, i've escaped that problem and i'm struggling to keep out and continue to grow spiritually.

It wasnt "glibly" as you say it was, i was being honest about what i went through. Trust me i know the difference between callously sinning and struggling with sin. Ive seen examples

Ecclesiasities is seen by some as a reflection of Solomon of his sin and the pointlessness of it. It is believed that he wrote it after he had repented and turned back to God.

You do know that you basically deny the salvation of all Christians who backslid and eventually returned by making that statement and remember, it can be you one day. 1 Corinthians 10:12 .Let him who thinketh he standeth...

9Marksfan
Jun 3rd 2009, 10:19 PM
Obviously you are mis interpreting me. I'm not saying that i'm living in that sin and proud of it. I'm saying i HAD a struggle with that problem all the while i acknowledged that it was a sin and made many efforts to escape, along with constant prayer for forgiveness and God's guidance to escape.Sometimes there was success, sometimes there was failure, but the fact was i made an effort during that time. Right now, i've escaped that problem and i'm struggling to keep out and continue to grow spiritually.

It wasnt "glibly" as you say it was, i was being honest about what i went through. Trust me i know the difference between callously sinning and struggling with sin. Ive seen examples

OK - we're more on the same wavelength than I realised - but you didn't say anything about struggling with sin in your first post, which is why Xel'Naga and I disagreed with you. But you're absolutely right - the struggle is all important - my point is there are professing "Christians" who live like this and have no struggle - and no conscience...


Ecclesiasities is seen by some as a reflection of Solomon of his sin and the pointlessness of it. It is believed that he wrote it after he had repented and turned back to God.

Just testing! I agree - I believe it is the most profound expression of true repentance in the whole bible - Ps 51 is probably the most profound expression of sorrow for sin (which led to David's repentance) - but Solomon's book Ecclesiastes shows that he has thought long and hard about his later life - and has completely changed his mind.


You do know that you basically deny the salvation of all Christians who backslid and eventually returned by making that statement and remember, it can be you one day. 1 Corinthians 10:12 .Let him who thinketh he standeth...

It has been me - and by God's grace I have returned - but returning is key - I am hugely conscious of God's mercy. There are those however - millions I'm sure - who profess faith, go back to the world and never come back. I don't believe they were ever saved. And I think the most dangerous thing any of us can believe is that we're certainly not one of them - and when we're next tempted to sin, we take the risk, reassuring ourselves that it's OK, because we're bound to come back to God, because we're saved - that's turning the grace of God into licentiousness - I'm pretty sure you don't think that way but at least two Mods on this forum took your first post that way - glad you've cleared things up for us - and everyone else! :)

motormouf
Jun 4th 2009, 01:42 AM
OK - we're more on the same wavelength than I realised - but you didn't say anything about struggling with sin in your first post, which is why Xel'Naga and I disagreed with you. But you're absolutely right - the struggle is all important - my point is there are professing "Christians" who live like this and have no struggle - and no conscience...



Just testing! I agree - I believe it is the most profound expression of true repentance in the whole bible - Ps 51 is probably the most profound expression of sorrow for sin (which led to David's repentance) - but Solomon's book Ecclesiastes shows that he has thought long and hard about his later life - and has completely changed his mind.





It has been me - and by God's grace I have returned - but returning is key - I am hugely conscious of God's mercy. There are those however - millions I'm sure - who profess faith, go back to the world and never come back. I don't believe they were ever saved. And I think the most dangerous thing any of us can believe is that we're certainly not one of them - and when we're next tempted to sin, we take the risk, reassuring ourselves that it's OK, because we're bound to come back to God, because we're saved - that's turning the grace of God into licentiousness - I'm pretty sure you don't think that way but at least two Mods on this forum took your first post that way - glad you've cleared things up for us - and everyone else! :)

Fair enough. but we're staying from the point.People might flame me for this but to be honest sometimes i think some "Christians" are better off being in relationships with unbelievers than with other Christians. Why?
Because some of them are so carnal that they can potentially destroy the growth of promising other Christians, and are better off with an unsaved person who lives like them.

I've seen a case where one Christian hooked up with another who had fornicated repeatedly in the past. Eventually what happened, they started getting into the act as well and we heard stories of them gravitating over to that lifestyle and instigating it. And yet another one with a ministry ruined.

IMO alot of us get fooled by the lie that if someone is saved, they become a great potential partner. Some people need ALOT of growth before they reach that point. Which is why i think its best to leave new converts alone for a while so they can grow. Some people dont pause at all

Reynolds357
Jun 4th 2009, 03:12 AM
Curious question, but is it possible for 2 believers to not be equal in their faith for Christ. This question dawned on me after reading this:

The Parable of the ten virgins. Matthew 24:1-13. The believers of Christ are likened to ten virgins. Five were wise and kept their lamps filled. Five were foolish. Like the wise and the foolish builders, this refers to faith. Five were strong in the faith, having a personal relationship with God and letting their lights shine forth. Five were foolish or hypocritical. They slumbered and let their lamps of faith go out.

Is Christ saying there that believers aren't entirely equal in their levels of faith?

I wonder this because I am a "baby" Christian, I've only been reading the bible for a little under 4 months now. For the past 8 months, I've dated a man who has been a devout Christian all of his life. He is very comfortable with prayer, and it seems like he prays a lot more than I do... also he spends much of his time in church and volunteering and reading the bible. I'm concerned that maybe we are unequally yoked still despite me finding Christ (which was totally independent of anything to do with him).

I'd like to hear other's thoughts on this...
My wife is baptist and I am pentecostal and to be perfectly honest; it causes some huge problems in our relationship.

9Marksfan
Jun 4th 2009, 09:00 AM
Fair enough. but we're straying from the point.People might flame me for this but to be honest sometimes i think some "Christians" are better off being in relationships with unbelievers than with other Christians. Why?
Because some of them are so carnal that they can potentially destroy the growth of promising other Christians, and are better off with an unsaved person who lives like them.

Surely they're better off to remain single or repent? Would you encourage them to indulge in sin?!?



I've seen a case where one Christian hooked up with another who had fornicated repeatedly in the past. Eventually what happened, they started getting into the act as well and we heard stories of them gravitating over to that lifestyle and instigating it. And yet another one with a ministry ruined.

No surprise there - more fool the Christian who entered the relationship (if they knew about the other's promiscuity). You know, in some way I agree - it maybe is right for us to say "Fine, go on ahead" to them - but we should add "But realise this - people who live this way will not enter the kingdom of God - no matter HOW much you protest that you're saved. If you are, you'll stop living like this and not want to continue in it. Maybe you need to ask yourslef if you're really saved." My scripture for that is 2 Cor 13:5 - something we ALL oughta be doing on a regular basis...


IMO alot of us get fooled by the lie that if someone is saved, they become a great potential partner.

Agreed - but it's also a lie that if someone is saved, there will be no obvious change - even after years....


Some people need A LOT of growth before they reach that point. Which is why i think its best to leave new converts alone for a while so they can grow. Some people dont pause at all

Exactly.

9Marksfan
Jun 4th 2009, 09:01 AM
My wife is baptist and I am pentecostal and to be perfectly honest; it causes some huge problems in our relationship.

Did you go through your theological differences before you got married? Did you realise that they existed? Do you worship at the same church?

motormouf
Jun 4th 2009, 04:30 PM
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Surely they're better off to remain single or repent? Would you encourage them to indulge in sin?!?





No surprise there - more fool the Christian who entered the relationship (if they knew about the other's promiscuity). You know, in some way I agree - it maybe is right for us to say "Fine, go on ahead" to them - but we should add "But realise this - people who live this way will not enter the kingdom of God - no matter HOW much you protest that you're saved. If you are, you'll stop living like this and not want to continue in it. Maybe you need to ask yourslef if you're really saved." My scripture for that is 2 Cor 13:5 - something we ALL oughta be doing on a regular basis...



Agreed - but it's also a lie that if someone is saved, there will be no obvious change - even after years....

[color=#ff0000]

Exactly.

Oh i dont actually encourage them to do that. Its just a personal thought Ideally, they're better off single or repenting, but honestly they probably wont do that, so i'd rather them hook up with an unsaved person l who lives like them than a more serious christian who they can corrupt. I've seen it happen before and its heart breaking.

Athanasius
Jun 4th 2009, 06:01 PM
Oh i dont actually encourage them to do that. Its just a personal thought Ideally, they're better off single or repenting, but honestly they probably wont do that, so i'd rather them hook up with an unsaved person l who lives like them than a more serious christian who they can corrupt. I've seen it happen before and its heart breaking.

So rather than 'corrupt' a strong Christian, you would have them 1) suffer in their own relationship with God while 2) destroying their own relationship with God while 3) not leading the unsaved person to Christ? Or maybe what's really being said is that these 'Carnal Christians' don't have a relationship with God to begin with, aside from their affiliation with a title...

motormouf
Jun 4th 2009, 07:52 PM
So rather than 'corrupt' a strong Christian, you would have them 1) suffer in their own relationship with God while 2) destroying their own relationship with God while 3) not leading the unsaved person to Christ? Or maybe what's really being said is that these 'Carnal Christians' don't have a relationship with God to begin with, aside from their affiliation with a title...

Pretty much, rather than- 1) suffer in their own relationships with God, 2) destroy their own relationship with God AND 3) mess up the spiritual growth of another promising christian and trust me the leading the unsaved to Christ belief isnt really realistic. I used to think so, but experience and observation showed me that the Christian is more likely to get led away from Godly living than the unsaved will be led towards salvation.We call it missionary dating ( i hook up and i can save you) but its rarely successful. Some people seem to be interested in church until they get what they want (sometimes just sex) and then when they get it just leave. Some people should win an Emmy for the type of acting they do. ( I want you so i'll act interested in church)

skidmark1027
Jun 5th 2009, 01:20 AM
My husband was a baby Christian when we married. I was more mature in knowledge, but not really in heart. Yes, this caused a lot of issues between us, however in spite of them, or maybe because of them, it created an environment for me to grow closer to God. I think my maturity REALLY happened during those first few years of marriage.

I wouldn't change that for anything.

However, to answer your basic question - I'm not really sure! I was always under the impression it was referring to unbelievers and believers.

Be happy you got "years" to work it out. My wife wants a divorce after under a year. It'll be 11 months tomorrow, but the relationship started turning south in April. I thought we were happy - but she wasn't.

She told me tonight that she never felt loved throughout most of the relationship. What a stab to my heart.

I think we're unequally yoked...I know I'm saved - but she doesn't know she is. I asked her last night if she knew for sure and she said that she wasn't sure. That to me screams "Not saved." She goes to church and turned me onto it, which in turn saved me, but I think she's not bearing fruit.

Anyway, be happy that you got years to get marriage to get it right. My wife is ready to throw in the towel in spite of any Biblical teaching. In fact, she doesn't read the bible. Ever. It "turns her off" (her words, not mine).

I pray for my marriage to heal every day. I pray for her heart to soften up again. I pray for mine to soften as well. Only the LORD knows what is in store for me. Maybe I was meant to be saved and divorce my wife. If it comes to it and her and I are still at impasse, then so be it - it what's best for my service to God.

Take care!

Reynolds357
Jun 5th 2009, 02:55 AM
Did you go through your theological differences before you got married? Did you realise that they existed? Do you worship at the same church?

We discussed our theological differences before we got married. The only problem was that she did not express some of her views until after we got married. She kept quiet about them when we were in counseling. We go to the same church on Sunday morning when I am off duty at police department. I go to church alone on Sunday night and Wed. night.

9Marksfan
Jun 5th 2009, 08:26 AM
We discussed our theological differences before we got married. The only problem was that she did not express some of her views until after we got married. She kept quiet about them when we were in counseling. We go to the same church on Sunday morning when I am off duty at police department. I go to church alone on Sunday night and Wed. night.

Maybe you should both go and see your pastor about it - from my own experience of these things, if they're not dealt with early on, then they just get worse and worse...

Reynolds357
Jun 5th 2009, 09:25 PM
you are probably right. The answer we would get would depend on which pastor we went to.

motormouf
Jun 6th 2009, 02:18 AM
[quote=Reynolds357;2095132]you are probably right. The answer we would get would depend on which pastor we went to.[/qu


man, it must be hard but if you dont mind me asking, what exactly are the theological differences that you have that are so problematic

9Marksfan
Jun 6th 2009, 10:56 AM
you are probably right. The answer we would get would depend on which pastor we went to.

But don't you both go to the same church? Or does your church have more than one pastor who might give different answers? :confused

Reynolds357
Jun 7th 2009, 02:10 AM
But don't you both go to the same church? Or does your church have more than one pastor who might give different answers? :confused

We go to the same church on Sunday morning. This is church that she attended when we got married. I work many Sundays at the police dept, so there are many days she goes without me. That church does not have Sunday night service. I go to Sunday night and Wed. night service at my old church. She rarely ever goes with me.

Reynolds357
Jun 7th 2009, 02:12 AM
[quote=Reynolds357;2095132]you are probably right. The answer we would get would depend on which pastor we went to.[/qu


man, it must be hard but if you dont mind me asking, what exactly are the theological differences that you have that are so problematic

Typical baptist vs. charismatic issues. Tongues, operation of the power gifts of the Spirit, healing, etc.

skidmark1027
Jun 8th 2009, 01:46 AM
We go to the same church on Sunday morning. This is church that she attended when we got married. I work many Sundays at the police dept, so there are many days she goes without me. That church does not have Sunday night service. I go to Sunday night and Wed. night service at my old church. She rarely ever goes with me.

I feel that one completely. My wife got me interested in going to church - 50 miles from home near her mother's house. She "feels comfortable" there. I found fellowship much closer to home - about 8 miles away. They've been a HUGE help emotionally, that is. So far. It's really really difficult to talk about our understanding of God when she feels like she can't go anywhere else. And I feel like she doesn't want to explore faith and Christianity because she won't even read the Bible and that scripture "turns her off." She said that to me.

Right now, I would give anything to have her have the differences you and your wife have. It sure beats teetering on the cusp of divorce like I am.

I'll keep you in my prayers.

Elijah's Mantle
Jun 30th 2009, 04:40 AM
:hmm: It is a very interesting question ,and one that I have never fully given serious thought toward , but apparently yes 2 differing Christians can be or even become unequally yoked , It is a sad situation when (doctrinal divides) do more to tear down fellowships and friendships and sometimes even marriages :( I have witnessed seeing in some instances for myself how particular religious right fighters will go off on their tangents and name calling in their over driven zeal to heretic hunt ,they are called that because if others do not agree with what they believe they are then somehow judge able beatable and some how the one insisting they are right has to be just that :rolleyes: This type of problem has been the cause of massive church splits so forth and so on . I can understand religious concerns regarding being strapped in legalism and types of religions that push it ,then again cults in today's world are very pervasive ,I after giving the question thought believe yes 2 Christians can be unequally yoked . I believe all Christians would be more better off to allow scripture to validate scripture the answers we should get should not depend upon a pastor but upon the Holy Spirit and God's word taken to heart :)

9Marksfan
Jun 30th 2009, 09:21 AM
I'm getting quite concerned with this thread - I feel it's quite wrong for us to use 2 Cor 6:14 here, because it's saying that one of the spouses is an unbeliever - in other words, unsaved - not a Christian at all - the following verses make this plain.

However, the fact that Christians that are married to one another disagree is a pretty common state of affairs and needs to be dealt with biblically - ideally during the engagement! But if disagreements arise, they should be dealt with by the couple's pastor or elders.

So, in short - can two Christians be unequally yoked? Absolutely impossible.

Can two Christians walk together unless they are agreed? Well, that's another matter.........(Amos 3:3).

Elijah's Mantle
Jun 30th 2009, 01:56 PM
So, in short - can two Christians be unequally yoked? Absolutely impossible.

:idea: :hmm: upon careful study regarding what may appear imposable , look at the word and meaning of "Unequally yoked"

the word alone is very rare it is heterozugeo It is found only one place in Old covenant writings Lev. 19:19
and once in the New covenant writings.

the only other passages that paul could have had in mind when he penned what he wrote was Deuteronomy 22:10
" you shall not plow with a ox and a donkey together "

such would deem a "Unequally yoking" which literally means "Not equal in strength"

one would over power the other ,with negative results .

I could see how this could be applicable to marriage as well as Religion . Oil and Vinegar just does not mix even when forced together .

A believer of for instance of "signs ,miracles and gifts , would be "unequal to that of a believer of "Legalism"
How well would a Catholic and a Baptist mix ? :confused
Paul did not mean that unbelievers were to be totally isolated from believers that would be absurd , we will never be totally seperated from until were taken from the world . I think Paul meant when one Power or principle of it is so unequal to another ,it does not mix well even forced ,it is like oil and vinegar . you do have a point about believers ,but I would not classify any unequal because with God "all" have equal standing .
what in common does a priest have with lets say a "child" both can believe ,but one has more standing and it would not necessarily be that of the knowledge of the priest . Knowledge does not necessitate "faith in belief"

HisLeast
Jun 30th 2009, 02:04 PM
A believer of for instance of "signs ,miracles and gifts , would be "unequal to that of a believer of "Legalism"
How well would a Catholic and a Baptist mix ? :confused

How about my wife and I have you over for supper and you can see for yourself?

Elijah's Mantle
Jun 30th 2009, 02:05 PM
:idea: ok God makes it very clear what happens to us when we start judging other believers :o it is found in Acts 10:28. there is something important noted ,of course it is important regarding "believers"

Elijah's Mantle
Jun 30th 2009, 02:17 PM
How about my wife and I have you over for supper and you can see for yourself? http://bibleforums.org/images/buttons/quote.gif (http://bibleforums.org/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=2118530)

:o :eek: maybe I should have said a "reformed Calvinist" and a "word of faith believer" (s) then :rofl: Just kidding ya :spin:

yes I have looked to see if I could find any suggestion from God's word that when it comes to Gods Grace there would be "Unequal measure"

even race is not a applicable meaning ,there is no race ,when it comes to God's grace and that would be applicable to two believers in Christ Jesus who were not of the same rare , I see in the Old Covenant where Jews were forbidden to intermarry with Gentiles ,but then in the New covenant it all changed :confused so hmm it gets interesting to dig deeper into thats for sure :hmm:

Elijah's Mantle
Jun 30th 2009, 02:21 PM
:help: Im getting in way over my head :o

for instance the one reference I stumbled onto was about how Angels mated with women and some how Plants were used :confused uuh I don't :help: understand this :confused

:help:

Elijah's Mantle
Jun 30th 2009, 02:30 PM
:hmm: this may not be applicable to this specific topic but i was a wondering about a impossible question

"did God destroy all the unequally yoked ones when the great flood occurred regarding Angels mating with women ?
or is that DNA still in the gene pool ,like for instance what is modernly called Gargantuan ism a rare disease where some one can grow to be a giant ? :hmm: I don't know :confused

Dani H
Jun 30th 2009, 02:42 PM
Typical baptist vs. charismatic issues. Tongues, operation of the power gifts of the Spirit, healing, etc.

But you don't operate in these things while you're at home, do you? What difference does it make when you're at home eating supper or paying bills or deciding how to discipline the kids, or watching TV or doing whatever it is you guys do as a family or couple at home or while you're with friends?

Why would they affect your marriage so deeply?

I'm thinking there must be more going on. I do think that couples often use "hot topics" to mask something else underlying.

I'm charismatic/pentecostal, my husband is a lot more traditional (we attend a baptist church due to him just not feeling comfortable in a more charismatic environment), and so we're in the same boat you guys are, yet we don't have the problems you describe (any more ... it's been a matter of openly communicating and agreeing to disagree on some matters that don't affect our salvation).

I'm thinking you and your spouse just need to learn that these matters are not important to a marriage relationship. You're certainly not unequally yoked. You're perhaps just allowing things to interfere with your marriage relationship that really don't matter all that much, in the grand scope of things. What if you and your wife took a step back, and allow your differing beliefs to enrich one another, instead of divide one another? That's what my hubby and I learned to do, and believe me when I tell you, a charismatic can learn a lot from a baptist, and vice versa. :hug:

I personally used to be quite the staunch Pentecostal, until God moved me clear across the country for a while and dropped me dead smack into a Baptist church. Which made me squirm in my seat, until God confronted me with some personal prejudices and had me publicly repent. Which was quite humbling, but well received, and really opened the door to great communication and fellowship. God can do amazing things if we're willing to be wrong about our approach to things, and our secret little prejudices that we have placed above just simply loving another person the way God wants us to. :)

9Marksfan
Jun 30th 2009, 11:09 PM
:idea: :hmm: upon careful study regarding what may appear imposable , look at the word and meaning of "Unequally yoked"

the word alone is very rare it is heterozugeo It is found only one place in Old covenant writings Lev. 19:19

Septuagint, I'm guessing (as OT was written in Hebrew)? The context there is the same - mixing two that are utterly different kinds - Paul uses the term when referring to a believer and an unbeliever, not two believers wiht different persepctives or at different stages in their experience of God. Because of the very rare use of the term (as you say, only twice in the whole bible), it MUST be used in context, so really cannot be used to describe two Christians - it's a denial of the essential unity of believers in Christ.


and once in the New covenant writings.

the only other passages that paul could have had in mind when he penned what he wrote was Deuteronomy 22:10
" you shall not plow with a ox and a donkey together "

such would deem a "Unequally yoking" which literally means "Not equal in strength"

No - not equal in essence, in nature. It's not a strong ox and a weak ox.


one would over power the other ,with negative results .

I could see how this could be applicable to marriage as well as Religion . Oil and Vinegar just does not mix even when forced together.

That's a better analogy.


A believer of for instance of "signs ,miracles and gifts , would be "unequal to that of a believer of "Legalism"

No - they're both believers.


How well would a Catholic and a Baptist mix ? :confused

Very badly - in all likelihood, there would be an unequal yolk there - the RC gospel is not the gospel that Baptists believe.


Paul did not mean that unbelievers were to be totally isolated from believers that would be absurd , we will never be totally seperated from until were taken from the world.

He makes that clear elsewhere in 1 Cor but here he is saying that we must not be unequally YOKED - this speaks of unions such as marriage, business and - in particular - ecumenical union.


I think Paul meant when one Power or principle of it is so unequal to another, it does not mix well even forced, it is like oil and vinegar. you do have a point about believers, but I would not classify any unequal because with God "all" have equal standing.

My point EXACTLY.


what in common does a priest have with lets say a "child" both can believe, but one has more standing and it would not necessarily be that of the knowledge of the priest. Knowledge does not necessitate "faith in belief"

If you mean an RC priest, we have a problem - but if a pastor and a believing child are both truly born again (to alter your analogy), then they are still believers, just at different stages of growth (actually there's a good likelihood the child's faith will be more pleasing to God!).

Hope that helps.

Elijah's Mantle
Jul 1st 2009, 01:21 AM
Septuagint, I'm guessing (as OT was written in Hebrew)? The context there is the same - mixing two that are utterly different kinds - Paul uses the term when referring to a believer and an unbeliever, not two believers wiht different persepctives or at different stages in their experience of God. Because of the very rare use of the term (as you say, only twice in the whole bible), it MUST be used in context, so really cannot be used to describe two Christians - it's a denial of the essential unity of believers in Christ.:idea: yep I agree with that after studying bout it :hmm:


No - not equal in essence, in nature. It's not a strong ox and a weak ox.OOh ! ok nature ,makes sense


No - they're both believers.:idea: yep and that makes what is written in Acts make sense ,God does not see believers as unequal or inferior to each other :pp which is awesome ,that means were the same :) I like that


Very badly - in all likelihood, there would be an unequal yolk there - the RC gospel is not the gospel that Baptists believe.yep I think that they don't believe the same things ,I am not exactly sure why :confused because I don't know what the differences is I just realize they have some


ecumenical union.what is that ? :confused


Hope that helps.

Tremendously 9Marksfan

9Marksfan
Jul 1st 2009, 09:00 AM
:idea: yep I agree with that after studying bout it :hmm:

Praise God! :pp


OOh ! ok nature ,makes sense

Like oil and vinegar!


:idea: yep and that makes what is written in Acts make sense ,God does not see believers as unequal or inferior to each other :pp which is awesome ,that means were the same :) I like that

...for you are all one in Christ Jesus. Gal 3:28b NKJV


yep I think that they don't believe the same things ,I am not exactly sure why :confused

Because it is in the nature of man to be religious and to have a system of works to earn salvation - it started with Cain and has been going ever since with every non-Christian religion and every perversion of the glorious gospel of grace.


because I don't know what the differences is I just realize they have some

That would be the subject of a whole thread! Check out World Religions and see some of the threads there on the RCC.


what is that ? :confused

Organic unity between various Christian denominations, usually with a view to having closer communion with Rome and always devoid of any concern for doctrinal unity beyond "Jesus is Lord". :rolleyes: Having said that, there have been some excellent moves in recent years to bring about a unity around the gospel - check out The Gospel Coalition's website:-

www.thegospelcoalition.org (http://www.thegospelcoalition.org)


Tremendously 9Marksfan

A pleasure! :)

vja4Him
Nov 2nd 2009, 10:46 PM
My x was supposedly a Christian ... I still wonder .... She left us (myself and my two boys) for her church, which was a very (extremely) radical Word Faith church. She loved her church and pastor and his wife more than our family.

She even told me that if I return to the church, and just sit in the back and shut up, she would give me all the sex that I wanted ... !!!

Can you believe that ... ??? Has that happened to anyone else ... ??? I was absolutely appalled and very hurt ... Marriage went down hill from there on rapidly, because I cannot and will not compromise my faith in Jesus Christ.

amazzin
Nov 2nd 2009, 10:47 PM
My x was supposedly a Christian ... I still wonder .... She left us (myself and my two boys) for her church, which was a very (extremely) radical Word Faith church. She loved her church and pastor and his wife more than our family.

She even told me that if I return to the church, and just sit in the back and shut up, she would give me all the sex that I wanted ... !!!

Can you believe that ... ??? Has that happened to anyone else ... ??? I was absolutely appalled and very hurt ... Marriage went down hill from there on rapidly, because I cannot and will not compromise my faith in Jesus Christ.

Sounds like a Jezebel spirit

vja4Him
Nov 2nd 2009, 10:57 PM
Sounds like a Jezebel spirit

There was definitely something demonic going on with the boys' mother, and I think also with the pastor ....

The boys' mother would see dark spirits floating around in our house! Especially in the boys' bedroom. She said the spirits were trying to strangle her and the boys, and she also saw blood on the floor from people who had lived there before and had been killed.

She heard voices, and imagined all kinds of things, was always paranoid, would hit and kick me in my privates, then act like a ninja and do it again, and laugh with a wicked kind of sinister evil spirited type of laugh ... and then pick up huge kives and wield them around and tell me she was going to cut off my privates, cook them up and make me eat them!!! She told the boys the same thing, which had us all terrified ... .

I think I was living in hell for a few years ....

Radagast
Nov 2nd 2009, 11:11 PM
I'm concerned that maybe we are unequally yoked still despite me finding Christ

"Unequally yoked" refers to marriages between Christians and non-Christians, where you have two people heading in different directions.

In marriages between two Christians, both are heading in the same direction. Obviously the more mature Christian helps the other along the road.

gringo300
Nov 2nd 2009, 11:16 PM
From what I can tell, the Bible verse is speaking of a saved person and an unsaved person being yoked together.

I could go into greater detail, but that might get into off topic territory, and I seem to have done a lot of that lately, judging by all the notifications I've been getting.

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