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Equipped_4_Love
Apr 25th 2009, 05:54 AM
I've been thinking a lot about this statement lately, and have noticed that, when used in the Bible, it only speaks of judgment.

Is there a place in the Bible where it's referred to in the positive -- for example, the Spirit of God completely consuming your life, or consuming the sin that dwells in you?

I think that this is such a beautiful thought, but if it's only used in terms of judgment, that sort of throws that idea out of the window.

bagofseed
Apr 25th 2009, 06:06 AM
NASB (http://dev.bible.org/drupal/Bible_Copyrights)
biblegateway Sos 8:6 (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?version=49&search=Sos+8:6)
"Put me like a seal over your heart, Like a seal on your arm. For love is as strong as death, Jealousy is as severe as Sheol; Its flashes are flashes of fire, The very flame of the LORD.

Both Love and Jealousy are flashes of fire.

Deu (http://net.bible.org/bible.php?book=Deu&chapter=4#24) 4:24 (http://net.bible.org/verse.php?book=Deu&chapter=4&verse=24)http://net.bible.org/images/advanced.gif
For the Lord your God is a consuming fire; he is a jealous God.

Proper Jealousy come out of Love.

Isa (http://net.bible.org/bible.php?book=Isa&chapter=10#17) 10:17 (http://net.bible.org/verse.php?book=Isa&chapter=10&verse=17)http://net.bible.org/images/advanced.gif
The light of Israel 1 (http://net.bible.org/search.php?search=fire%20flame&mode=exact&scope=#) will become a fire, their Holy One 2 (http://net.bible.org/search.php?search=fire%20flame&mode=exact&scope=#) will become a flame


Isa (http://net.bible.org/bible.php?book=Isa&chapter=43#2) 43:2 (http://net.bible.org/verse.php?book=Isa&chapter=43&verse=2)http://net.bible.org/images/advanced.gif
When you pass through the waters, I am with you; when you pass 1 (http://net.bible.org/search.php?search=fire%20flame&page=2&mode=exact#) through the streams, they will not overwhelm you. When you walk through the fire, you will not be burned; the flames will not harm 2 (http://net.bible.org/search.php?search=fire%20flame&page=2&mode=exact#) you.

Oba (http://net.bible.org/bible.php?book=Oba&chapter=1#18) 1:18 (http://net.bible.org/verse.php?book=Oba&chapter=1&verse=18)http://net.bible.org/images/advanced.gif
The descendants of Jacob will be a fire, and the descendants of Joseph a flame.

Luk (http://net.bible.org/bible.php?book=Luk&chapter=12#49) 12:49 (http://net.bible.org/verse.php?book=Luk&chapter=12&verse=49)http://net.bible.org/images/advanced.gif
“I have come to bring fire on the earth – and how I wish it were already kindled!


Dan (http://net.bible.org/bible.php?book=Dan&chapter=3#27) 3:27 (http://net.bible.org/verse.php?book=Dan&chapter=3&verse=27)http://net.bible.org/images/advanced.gif
Once the satraps, prefects, governors, and ministers of the king had gathered around, they saw that those men were physically 1 (http://net.bible.org/search.php?search=fire%20flame&page=11&mode=exact#) unharmed by the fire. 2 (http://net.bible.org/search.php?search=fire%20flame&page=11&mode=exact#) The hair of their heads was not singed, nor were their trousers damaged. Not even the smell of fire was to be found on them!

Nothing quite like being fireproof in Jesus.

Equipped_4_Love
Apr 25th 2009, 06:17 AM
NASB (http://dev.bible.org/drupal/Bible_Copyrights)
biblegateway Sos 8:6 (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?version=49&search=Sos+8:6)
"Put me like a seal over your heart, Like a seal on your arm. For love is as strong as death, Jealousy is as severe as Sheol; Its flashes are flashes of fire, The very flame of the LORD.

Both Love and Jealousy are flashes of fire.

Deu (http://net.bible.org/bible.php?book=Deu&chapter=4#24) 4:24 (http://net.bible.org/verse.php?book=Deu&chapter=4&verse=24)http://net.bible.org/images/advanced.gif
For the Lord your God is a consuming fire; he is a jealous God.

Proper Jealousy come out of Love.

Yes -- but that last verse is referring to judgment. Doesn't God's consuming fire ever refer to anything positive?

bagofseed
Apr 25th 2009, 06:35 AM
Gods judgment is positive.

Equipped_4_Love
Apr 25th 2009, 06:44 AM
Gods judgment is positive.

I appreciate your responses, but I think you've misunderstood my original question.

I am asking if the idea of God being a consuming fire is used to describe anything besides His judgment.

I like to think of God's Spirit being a consuming fire in my own life, and as my relationship to Him deepens, His Spirit consumes mine -- not as in destroying it, but as in taking it over. I think this is such a beautiful thought -- the fact that God's Spirit can completely consume me, as a fire in my soul.

That is what I was getting at, but from my reading of Scripture, the only consuming fire that is mentioned is that of judgment.

crossnote
Apr 25th 2009, 07:17 AM
I appreciate your responses, but I think you've misunderstood my original question.

I am asking if the idea of God being a consuming fire is used to describe anything besides His judgment.

I like to think of God's Spirit being a consuming fire in my own life, and as my relationship to Him deepens, His Spirit consumes mine -- not as in destroying it, but as in taking it over. I think this is such a beautiful thought -- the fact that God's Spirit can completely consume me, as a fire in my soul.

That is what I was getting at, but from my reading of Scripture, the only consuming fire that is mentioned is that of judgment.

Hmmm maybe..

And I will put this third into the fire, and refine them as one refines silver, and test them as gold is tested. They will call upon my name, and I will answer them. I will say, 'They are my people'; and they will say, 'The LORD is my God.'"
(Zec 13:9)

OR how about this angle...

And suddenly there came from heaven a sound like a mighty rushing wind, and it filled the entire house where they were sitting. And divided tongues as of fire appeared to them and rested on each one of them. And they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in other tongues as the Spirit gave them utterance.
(Act 2:2-4)

Equipped_4_Love
Apr 25th 2009, 07:46 AM
Hmmm maybe..

And I will put this third into the fire, and refine them as one refines silver, and test them as gold is tested. They will call upon my name, and I will answer them. I will say, 'They are my people'; and they will say, 'The LORD is my God.'"
(Zec 13:9)

Yes -- when something is put into the fire, the impurities are consumed. This can totally relate to what I'm getting at -- as God's Spirit fills us, it is like a fire, refining us, and consuming all of our impurities....It is a consuming fire.

Ya -- I think these were the lines along which I was thinking.


OR how about this angle...

And suddenly there came from heaven a sound like a mighty rushing wind, and it filled the entire house where they were sitting. And divided tongues as of fire appeared to them and rested on each one of them. And they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in other tongues as the Spirit gave them utterance.
(Act 2:2-4)


Oh, ya -- that's a great refenrce. I'd forgotten about that!!!

bagofseed
Apr 25th 2009, 09:31 PM
Isa (http://net.bible.org/bible.php?book=Isa&chapter=10#17) 10:17 (http://net.bible.org/verse.php?book=Isa&chapter=10&verse=17)http://net.bible.org/images/advanced.gif
The light of Israel will become a fire, their Holy One will become a flame

Oba (http://net.bible.org/bible.php?book=Oba&chapter=1#18) 1:18 (http://net.bible.org/verse.php?book=Oba&chapter=1&verse=18)http://net.bible.org/images/advanced.gif
The descendants of Jacob will be a fire, and the descendants of Joseph a flame.


I believe that fire is first and foremost love.
I believe that fire in jealous judgment comes from love.
I believe that we ourselves become part of that flame, in partaking in His nature.

I believe all that can be consumed will be, just like all that can be shaken will be.

The big question is are we only fuel or also flame?

brakelite
Apr 25th 2009, 09:51 PM
I posted this originally about a year ago.

About 7 or 8 years ago in the US were some terrible forest fires, such as has never before been experienced, nor since. Here in NZ we watched for months on the news constant reports of the ever advancing fires that were devestating the forests in, if I remember correctly, over ten states, from Florida to Oregon, and most in between. Firefighters from Australia Canada and here went to assist in the disaster. When they were finally under control, it was nature and not man that brought the fires to an end.
I well remember a reporter asking a forest service officer the cause of such a devastating fire. "Why so bad?", she asked. The reply was shocking, but immediately understandable. "Because we were too good at putting out previous fires."
Do you see the significance of that reply? You see, too much rubbish and dry rotted and waste timber had built up on the forest floor and thus there was a huge amount of fuel for the fire to feed off. Couple that with a particularly dry summer and the result was a disaster. Allowing controlled fires to previously burn off that rubbish would have been far less dangerous, lest costly, and more manageable.
Scripture alludes to the child of God as a tree. (See Psalm 1)
I see many trees as a forest, thus the church as a forest. There is rubbish (sin) within each believer and within the church that must be allowed to be burnt off. The Holy Spirit is the agent of fire. We are to be tried as gold in the fire that the impurities may be cleansed. Jesus says "Re 3:18 I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.

We must not act as firefighters. We must allow the fire of the Holy Spirit to do His work. If we resist the Holy Spirit, if we refuse to allow Him to cleanse us or we deny that there is cleansing to be done, then the rubbish will build up to such an extent that there will be only one fire capable of the cleansing. Sadly, if we are not separated from the sin in our lives now, we will be destroyed along with it later.

Fire is a healthy instrument for the forest and the church.. Freeing the forest/church from the rubbish on the floor allows new trees/Christians to germinate and grow without hindrance.
Dead wood/sin within each tree/Christian burnt off allows freedom to grow and bear fruit.
Stronger trees/Christians make for stronger forests/churches.
There are many other parallels and similarities - the point being that we must consider what we are now undergoing and accept it for what it is. A cleansing sanctifying work being accomplished by a holy sovereign gracious God who is making us fit for His kingdom.

Jas 1:2 My brethren, count it all joy when ye fall into divers temptations;
3 Knowing this, that the trying of your faith worketh patience.
4 But let patience have her perfect work, that ye may be perfect and entire, wanting nothing.

1Pe 1:7 That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ:

Equipped_4_Love
Apr 26th 2009, 01:34 AM
That was awesome, brakelite. Thanks

Josie
Apr 26th 2009, 02:06 AM
I've been thinking a lot about this statement lately, and have noticed that, when used in the Bible, it only speaks of judgment.

Is there a place in the Bible where it's referred to in the positive -- for example, the Spirit of God completely consuming your life, or consuming the sin that dwells in you?

I think that this is such a beautiful thought, but if it's only used in terms of judgment, that sort of throws that idea out of the window.
In my view you are not wrong, God is consuming all the trash and garbage in our lives.

To be judged by God in this life is a beautiful thing, My belief when God is working in your life he is getting us ready for his kingdom.
It can be painful though because it is a convicting power of when we have did an injustice to someone or a sin.
If you are truly sorry you will never want to do this again, God a consuming fire burns it out of us.
This is repeated by God as long as we live to cleanse us.
God's judgement is good and fair.

Vhayes
Apr 26th 2009, 02:26 AM
Hi Welder -

Look at these verses and see what you think -
I Corinthians 3
10 - According to the grace of God which was given to me, like a wise master builder I laid a foundation, and another is building on it. But each man must be careful how he builds on it.
11 - For no man can lay a foundation other than the one which is laid, which is Jesus Christ.
12 - Now if any man builds on the foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, straw,
13 - each man's work will become evident; for the day will show it because it is to be revealed with fire, and the fire itself will test the quality of each man's work.
14 - If any man's work which he has built on it remains, he will receive a reward.
15 - If any man's work is burned up, he will suffer loss; but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire.

While these verses are taling of judgement, I think it goes much deeper than that. To me it says that the works we do here on earth to build up the body of Christ will withstand the fire and come out refined and beautiful to behold while those things which were done in the flesh will be burned up - never to be thought of again.

I also personally believe we are forged here on earth to become the dreation He would have us be. Trials are never "fun" but they are a way of forging us and shaping us into maturity so we can accomplish those works which God has planned for us.

Hope that helps a bit -
V

Vhayes
Apr 26th 2009, 01:09 PM
I thought of another - When God led the Israelites out of Egypt and through the desert, He did so as a cloud by day and a pillar of fire by night. I had a pastor/teacher who taught the cloud by day shaded the people from the withering sun and the pillar of fire by night provided adequate light and warmth throughout the dark and cold desert nights.
V

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