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THOM
Apr 29th 2009, 04:54 PM
It is Written,

"Now it came to pass on a certain day, that HE went into a ship with HIS Disciples: and HE said unto them, 'Let us go over unto the other side of the lake.' And they launched forth. But as they sailed HE fell asleep: and there came down a storm of wind on the lake; and they were filled with water, and were in jeopardy. And they came to HIM, and awoke HIM, saying, 'MASTER, MASTER, we perish.' Then HE arose, and rebuked the wind and the raging of the water: and they ceased, and there was a calm. And HE said unto them, 'Where is your faith?' And they being afraid wondered, saying one to another, 'What manner of MAN is this! for HE commands even the winds and water, and they obey HIM.' And they arrived at the country of the Gadarenes, which is over against Galilee. (Luke 8:22-26)"

Why would JESUS ask HIS Disciples such a question as this?

After all, they have left all just to follow HIM; They have been obedient to HIM; Another version of this Story tells us that HE commanded them to get into the boat, and they got into the boat; They obeyed HIM; They don't just believe in HIM, they also believe on HIM; In the midst of a storm, they wake HIM up so that HE can help them get through this storm; They've brought their problem to JESUS. . .like we're supposed to do...; HE calms the storm, and ask (seemingly rather abruptly) them, "Where is your faith?"?

Now what had they done, or not done, that would cause JESUS to ask them that kind of question?

And here's a guarantee: You can refer to the other version(s) of this Account if you'd like to, in order to answer the question, but you really don't have to. . .because the answer to the question is found right there in the Story of this event.

Vhayes
Apr 29th 2009, 06:03 PM
Thom, I'm not sure if this is the answer you are looking for but when the disciples were fearful, they were focused on their circumstances. Their focus should have been on Jesus.
V

theBelovedDisciple
Apr 29th 2009, 06:32 PM
Thom, I'm not sure if this is the answer you are looking for but when the disciples were fearful, they were focused on their circumstances. Their focus should have been on Jesus.
V


Yes I agree.. and I have done this too in my walk with Him.. God's Promise is planted in your heart.. then all of a sudden all these tnings start to happen.. taking your eyes and heart off of the Promise.. you start to look at the circumstances and those things surrounding you.. those things that are 'opposite' to the Promise.. telling you it will never happen or that it cant happen.. or that God will not do that for you.. and you stop right in your tracks.. fearful... and you begin to sink in your faith.. and you almost stop beleiving..

but God is Faithful.. and He will carry you thru.. and pick you back up.. Because He loves you...

another incident close to this was when Jesus was walking on water.. Peter saw Him.. and started to walk towards Him walking on water As Jesus did.. but when He saw the waves and the turmoil of the Water.. He started to sink.. He tooks His eyes off of Jesus.. and His Faith waivered....

but Look at the Grace of God and Mercy of God...

as Jesus Outstretched His Arms and Hand and Picked Peter up out of the Water... when His Faith failed and waivered..

God was even there to pick Him Back up and HELP HIM... most likely in the Arms of the Saviour......even when Peter's faith waivered and he didn't believe..

God allows us to go these things to Grow.. and each time it happens you grow more..

there are times when you will not fail.. and you will go the distance... and there will be times when your faith will waiver... but take Heart and be of Good Cheer.and be of Good Courage.......... He is always Near and He is Faithful... He will help your Faith and unbelief.....

You Faith will be 'tested'.. and if Your Faith is Grounded in what He accomplshed on that Bloody Tree... What He has done For You... then you can rest assure that He is there when the Storms come and your faith is Tested.. He is Near.. to Encourage and to Help you thru those... so that your Faith will be stronger on the other side.... of those trials.. the trials of your Faith..

Dani H
Apr 29th 2009, 06:32 PM
I find this subject marvelous because obviously, faith is something we can place where we choose. God has given us each a measure of it and it's up to us where we place it.

I don't think Jesus was rebuking the disciples for looking at their circumstances. I think He was rebuking them because their faith was obviously not in God or they would have not been fearful. He was addressing an issue that went deeper than the obvious, and more far reaching.

This is an interesting subject to me because as recently as last year, God called me on the carpet because I had placed my faith all over the map; in God, of course, but also in certain people and certain other things, and it blew me away when He said very plainly that those people had let me down and those other things were falling apart because that is where some of my faith was, instead of the entirety of it being in Him alone. And I had to yank all my faith back from all these people and places and things where I had put it (some of it without even fully realizing it) and place it firmly in God, all of it.

People cannot deliver us! Our jobs and money and things cannot deliver us!

You can very easily see where people's faith is because that is what they look to for deliverance and blessings. So the disciples weren't as much looking at the circumstances, as they were looking to something other than God as their source, and Jesus called them on it for what it was. This can obviously be a very subtle thing, this mis-placement of faith, and something the Holy Spirit has to show us.

THOM
Apr 29th 2009, 07:06 PM
Thom, I'm not sure if this is the answer you are looking for but when the disciples were fearful, they were focused on their circumstances. Their focus should have been on Jesus.
V


Yes I agree.. and I have done this too in my walk with Him.. God's Promise is planted in your heart.. then all of a sudden all these tnings start to happen.. taking your eyes and heart off of the Promise.. you start to look at the circumstances and those things surrounding you.. those things that are 'opposite' to the Promise.. telling you it will never happen or that it cant happen.. or that God will not do that for you.. and you stop right in your tracks.. fearful... and you begin to sink in your faith.. and you almost stop beleiving..

but God is Faithful.. and He will carry you thru.. and pick you back up.. Because He loves you...

another incident close to this was when Jesus was walking on water.. Peter saw Him.. and started to walk towards Him walking on water As Jesus did.. but when He saw the waves and the turmoil of the Water.. He started to sink.. He tooks His eyes off of Jesus.. and His Faith waivered....

but Look at the Grace of God and Mercy of God...

as Jesus Outstretched His Arms and Hand and Picked Peter up out of the Water... when His Faith failed and waivered..

God was even there to pick Him Back up and HELP HIM... most likely in the Arms of the Saviour......even when Peter's faith waivered and he didn't believe..

God allows us to go these things to Grow.. and each time it happens you grow more..

there are times when you will not fail.. and you will go the distance... and there will be times when your faith will waiver... but take Heart and be of Good Cheer.and be of Good Courage.......... He is always Near and He is Faithful... He will help your Faith and unbelief.....

You Faith will be 'tested'.. and if Your Faith is Grounded in what He accomplshed on that Bloody Tree... What He has done For You... then you can rest assure that He is there when the Storms come and your faith is Tested.. He is Near.. to Encourage and to Help you thru those... so that your Faith will be stronger on the other side.... of those trials.. the trials of your Faith..


I find this subject marvelous because obviously, faith is something we can place where we choose. God has given us each a measure of it and it's up to us where we place it.

I don't think Jesus was rebuking the disciples for looking at their circumstances. I think He was rebuking them because their faith was obviously not in God or they would have not been fearful. He was addressing an issue that went deeper than the obvious, and more far reaching.

This is an interesting subject to me because as recently as last year, God called me on the carpet because I had placed my faith all over the map; in God, of course, but also in certain people and certain other things, and it blew me away when He said very plainly that those people had let me down and those other things were falling apart because that is where some of my faith was, instead of the entirety of it being in Him alone. And I had to yank all my faith back from all these people and places and things where I had put it (some of it without even fully realizing it) and place it firmly in God, all of it.

People cannot deliver us! Our jobs and money and things cannot deliver us!

You can very easily see where people's faith is because that is what they look to for deliverance and blessings. So the disciples weren't as much looking at the circumstances, as they were looking to something other than God as their source, and Jesus called them on it for what it was. This can obviously be a very subtle thing, this mis-placement of faith, and something the Holy Spirit has to show us.

Hello V, Beloved, and Dani!!!
I'm in 100% agreement with your answers. They're great answers, but there's still something I really want us to all see about this situation. I know, just from all of your answers you're really thinking about this. "Where's Thom coming from this time?" I'm praying its shown to you in much the same way that it was shown to me, only seconds before it was told to me. And I tell you this, when you get and grab hold of it, your "faith" should never be called into question again.

Consider this:
Where were they going? JESUS was on board with them, albeit asleep. . .but when you know what JESUS knows you can sleep too. Some of them were Fishermen; they had been in similar storms. There focus was on HIM, in their trial. . .after all, they woke HIM up. They believed HE could resolve their delima. . .which HE did. But based on JESUS' question, they still had missed something very important, otherwise HE wouldn't have asked them what HE did. Don't you agree? So once again,


What caused JESUS to ask them that kind of question?

divaD
Apr 29th 2009, 07:07 PM
It is Written,

"Now it came to pass on a certain day, that HE went into a ship with HIS Disciples: and HE said unto them, 'Let us go over unto the other side of the lake.' And they launched forth. But as they sailed HE fell asleep: and there came down a storm of wind on the lake; and they were filled with water, and were in jeopardy. And they came to HIM, and awoke HIM, saying, 'MASTER, MASTER, we perish.' Then HE arose, and rebuked the wind and the raging of the water: and they ceased, and there was a calm. And HE said unto them, 'Where is your faith?' And they being afraid wondered, saying one to another, 'What manner of MAN is this! for HE commands even the winds and water, and they obey HIM.' And they arrived at the country of the Gadarenes, which is over against Galilee. (Luke 8:22-26)"

Why would JESUS ask HIS Disciples such a question as this?

After all, they have left all just to follow HIM; They have been obedient to HIM; Another version of this Story tells us that HE commanded them to get into the boat, and they got into the boat; They obeyed HIM; They don't just believe in HIM, they also believe on HIM; In the midst of a storm, they wake HIM up so that HE can help them get through this storm; They've brought their problem to JESUS. . .like we're supposed to do...; HE calms the storm, and ask (seemingly rather abruptly) them, "Where is your faith?"?

Now what had they done, or not done, that would cause JESUS to ask them that kind of question?

And here's a guarantee: You can refer to the other version(s) of this Account if you'd like to, in order to answer the question, but you really don't have to. . .because the answer to the question is found right there in the Story of this event.



What was the first thing Jesus said unto them? Let us go over unto the other side of the lake.

What part of that statement did they not believe, since they obviously feared for their lives even before they made it to the other side?

THOM
Apr 29th 2009, 07:46 PM
What was the first thing Jesus said unto them? Let us go over unto the other side of the lake.

What part of that statement did they not believe, since they obviously feared for their lives even before they made it to the other side?

That's it!!! Bless you Diva!

HE told them where they were going. But like so many of us, when trials come, we forget what HE's already told us, "Let us go over unto the other side...". HE didn't tell them it was going to be all smooth sailing, but HE did tell them, "Let us go over unto the other side...". See, some of us have so much "faith" in JESUS, but hardly any "faith" in what JESUS has said. Some of us don't really hear what JESUS is Saying until HE ask us, "Where is your faith?" And some of us even get a 'tude' with/at JESUS when he questions the location and/or focus of our "faith". But if we're more focused on HIM calmly sitting at THE RIGHT Hand of THE FATHER, when it seems like all Hell has broken loose in some of our circumstances down here, that what HE has already told us (like this paraphrased: "I give unto you ETERNAL LIFE; and you shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck you out of MY hand. MY FATHER, which gave you to ME, is GREATER than all; and no man is able to pluck you out of MY FATHER's hand." John 10:28-29ff), then HE gonna want know of you and/or I, "Where is your faith?"

Mani, if you're reading this, JESUS didn't say that floods wouldn't come, nor did HE say that you wouldn't get flooded out, but HE did say, "I will never leave thee, nor forsake thee. (Hebrews 13:5ff)"

Aliosias
May 26th 2009, 03:38 PM
Luke 8:23-25 - But as they sailed He fell asleep. And they came to Him, and awoke Him, saying, Master, master, we perish. Then He arose, and rebuked the wind and the raging of the water: and they ceased, and there was a calm. And He said unto them, "Where is your faith?"


Even after the disciples got their answer to prayer (a stilled storm), Jesus asked them about their unbelief. For most of us an answer to prayer is the reward for our great faith. In this case they got the answer but were said to be small in faith.
He expected them to exercise the authority He had given them to quiet the seas themselves. Instead they asked Him to do it. We often pray in the place of risky obedience.

Partaker of Christ
May 28th 2009, 12:13 AM
That's it!!! Bless you Diva!

HE told them where they were going. But like so many of us, when trials come, we forget what HE's already told us, "Let us go over unto the other side...". HE didn't tell them it was going to be all smooth sailing, but HE did tell them, "Let us go over unto the other side...". See, some of us have so much "faith" in JESUS, but hardly any "faith" in what JESUS has said. Some of us don't really hear what JESUS is Saying until HE ask us, "Where is your faith?" And some of us even get a 'tude' with/at JESUS when he questions the location and/or focus of our "faith". But if we're more focused on HIM calmly sitting at THE RIGHT Hand of THE FATHER, when it seems like all Hell has broken loose in some of our circumstances down here, that what HE has already told us (like this paraphrased: "I give unto you ETERNAL LIFE; and you shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck you out of MY hand. MY FATHER, which gave you to ME, is GREATER than all; and no man is able to pluck you out of MY FATHER's hand." John 10:28-29ff), then HE gonna want know of you and/or I, "Where is your faith?"

Mani, if you're reading this, JESUS didn't say that floods wouldn't come, nor did HE say that you wouldn't get flooded out, but HE did say, "I will never leave thee, nor forsake thee. (Hebrews 13:5ff)"

2Ti 2:13 If we believe not, yet he abideth faithful: he cannot deny himself.

1Th 5:24 Faithful is he that calleth you, who also will do it.

2Th 3:3 But the Lord is faithful, who shall stablish you, and keep you from evil.

Alaska
May 28th 2009, 03:04 AM
In hindsight, what could have been the behaviour of Peter and them, so that Jesus would not have asked "where is your faith?
Should they not even have woken him up, knowing that this was a trial of their faith and hence not become afraid?
This somehow reminds me of Moses when he smote the rock and got himself into trouble. In hindsight, what should he have done?

One thought; as long as we are on board with Jesus, we have no reason to fear, no matter what the circumstances are.
I believe it is possible to be so close to Jesus that even if faced with death, we can be calm and at peace.

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