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edmondsean
Dec 15th 2009, 07:38 AM
Deu 22:5 The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman's garment: for all that do so are abomination unto the LORD thy God.

For years, culture has defined what gender each garment of clothing was for. However, I have noticed a few discrepancies throughout history that do not align with the law of Moses.

In the times of Egypt, it was said that butchers wore high heeled shoes. Not sure if this is true. However, I suspect this is to eliminate the labour of trudging through animal remains...

In the Victorian era they were first worn by men to keep their feet in the stirrups of their horse. Later, Kings and people of wealth worn them as a symbol of status. At this time, women started to wear them. The french revolution however ended this fad as wealth or status were shunned among the common folk.

Currently, women dominate the market of high heeled shoes. If a man was to wear them, they would be looked down upon.

The same goes for pants...

Man wore pants first. It was only until the feminist movement that a number of women began to break into the style.

In Greece and Ireland, skirt like garments are worn.

So, the question is this... Is everyone sinning?

I want to hear your interpretations before I comment.

IsItLove?
Dec 15th 2009, 09:17 AM
The OT addresses outwardly the spiritual things.

It has always been about the matters of the heart.

Does the man or woman seek not to be as God created them.

In the NT God makes is clear that despite of our physical clothing we are naked, because we need spiritual clothing which is righteousness before God.

edmondsean
Dec 15th 2009, 09:22 AM
The OT addresses outwardly the spiritual things.

It has always been about the matters of the heart.

Does the man or woman seek not to be as God created them.

In the NT God makes is clear that despite of our physical clothing we are naked, because we need spiritual clothing which is righteousness before God.

You will have to explain. Deuteronomy 22:5 has nothing to do with "Spirital Clothing which is righteousness". Do you contend that we should walk naked?

IsItLove?
Dec 15th 2009, 10:10 AM
You will have to explain. Deuteronomy 22:5 has nothing to do with "Spirital Clothing which is righteousness". Do you contend that we should walk naked?
The Old Testament shows spiritual things through physical means, physical examples for people to see that show spiritual truths that most people are unable to see because they are not of God.
Much like Jesus parable stories.

Mat (http://net.bible.org/bible.php?book=Mat&chapter=13#13) 13:13 (http://net.bible.org/verse.php?book=Mat&chapter=13&verse=13)http://net.bible.org/images/advanced.gif
For this reason I speak to them in parables: Although they see they do not see, and although they hear they do not hear nor do they understand.

Isaiah 6:9 He said, “Go and tell these people: ‘Listen continually, but don’t understand!
Look continually, but don’t perceive!’
6:10 Make the hearts of these people calloused;
make their ears deaf and their eyes blind!
Otherwise they might see with their eyes and hear with their ears,
their hearts might understand and they might repent and be healed.”

So when you see a physical example or standard in the OT look at it as teaching Spiritual truths and ask God if He might open your eyes to see.


Pro (http://net.bible.org/bible.php?book=Pro&chapter=25#2) 25:2 (http://net.bible.org/verse.php?book=Pro&chapter=25&verse=2)http://net.bible.org/images/advanced.gif
It is the glory of God to conceal a matter, and it is the glory of a king to search out a matter.

tt1106
Dec 15th 2009, 02:35 PM
No they are not sinning. The Law was fulfilled. Righteousness is not about keeping the law of Moses. It is about Christ.

Scruffy Kid
Dec 15th 2009, 03:11 PM
Biblically, what constitutes the gender of clothing

Deu 22:5 The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman's garment: for all that do so are abomination unto the LORD thy God.

For years, culture has defined what gender each garment of clothing was for. However, I have noticed a few discrepancies throughout history that do not align with the law of Moses. ...

In Greece and Ireland, skirt like garments are worn.

So, the question is this... Is everyone sinning?
Skirtlike garments (kilts) used to be worn by men in Scotland, and may be on ceremonial occasions (e.g. playing the bagpipes). Skirtlike garments for men are common in parts of India, and standard in Myanmar (Burma). Liturgical garb (robes, for choirs, ministers, servers at the alter) in churches with liturgical services, and academic robes for faculty (on ceremonial occasions) and still at exams for students at Oxford, and sometimes robes for judges, and -- not so long ago -- for all class attendence at Oxford, all derive from the fact that this was standard male garb in Roman times, and gets retained in professions with ancient origins. Gowns were also standard for distinguished persons in parts of the Orient, until recently.

I don't think that the Biblical verse is saying that there are particular clothing styles which are timelessly prescribed by God for men and women.
The intent, rather, is that people should not be cross-dressing.

The intent here, I think, is to have clear differentiation of men (and boys) as versus women (and girls).
Thus, IMO, this verse aims to nix the creating of gender mix-up and ambiguity -- something very fashionable now, alas.
It's not a verse prescribing or proscribing particular-style garments for men or for women.
Whatever the cultural context, the garments distinctive for men in that culture shouldn't be worn by women, and vice versa.

edmondsean
Dec 15th 2009, 03:57 PM
The Old Testament shows spiritual things through physical means, physical examples for people to see that show spiritual truths that most people are unable to see because they are not of God.
Much like Jesus parable stories.

Mat (http://net.bible.org/bible.php?book=Mat&chapter=13#13) 13:13 (http://net.bible.org/verse.php?book=Mat&chapter=13&verse=13)http://net.bible.org/images/advanced.gif
For this reason I speak to them in parables: Although they see they do not see, and although they hear they do not hear nor do they understand.

Isaiah 6:9 He said, “Go and tell these people: ‘Listen continually, but don’t understand!
Look continually, but don’t perceive!’
6:10 Make the hearts of these people calloused;
make their ears deaf and their eyes blind!
Otherwise they might see with their eyes and hear with their ears,
their hearts might understand and they might repent and be healed.”

So when you see a physical example or standard in the OT look at it as teaching Spiritual truths and ask God if He might open your eyes to see.


Pro (http://net.bible.org/bible.php?book=Pro&chapter=25#2) 25:2 (http://net.bible.org/verse.php?book=Pro&chapter=25&verse=2)http://net.bible.org/images/advanced.gif
It is the glory of God to conceal a matter, and it is the glory of a king to search out a matter.

Deuteronomy 22:5 is not a parable. It is clear, cut and dry. You can not compare this to parable because a parable could mean anything.

Do not advocate ignorance, it is unholy...

2 Corinthians 3:9|18 - For if the ministry of condemnation has glory, then the ministry of justification has an overwhelming glory. In fact, that which once had glory lost its glory, because the other glory surpassed it. For if that which fades away came through glory, how much more does that which is permanent have glory? Therefore, since we have such a hope, we speak with great boldness, not like Moses, who kept covering his face with a veil to keep the people of Israel from gazing at the end of what was fading away. However, their minds were hardened, for to this day the same veil is still there when they read the old covenant. Only in union with Christ is that veil removed. Yet even to this day, when Moses is read, a veil covers their hearts. But whenever a person turns to the Lord, the veil is removed. Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Lord's Spirit is, there is freedom. As all of us reflect the glory of the Lord with unveiled faces, we are being transformed into the same image with ever-increasing glory by the Lord's Spirit.

Hos 4:6 My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge: because thou hast rejected knowledge, I will also reject thee, that thou shalt be no priest to me: seeing thou hast forgotten the law of thy God, I will also forget thy children.

Job 28:28 - And unto man he said, Behold, the fear of the Lord, that is wisdom; and to depart from evil is understanding.

Psalms 32:9 - Be ye not as the horse, or as the mule, which have no understanding: whose mouth must be held in with bit and bridle, lest they come near unto thee.

notuptome
Dec 15th 2009, 07:48 PM
Men should not endeavor to look like a women and women should not endeavor to look like a man.

Many things like this are greatly influenced by culture. Today there are slacks made for men and slacks made for women. There are differences in the tailoring of each and it is apparent if you transpose the two.

I am certain that God gave this ordinance to prevent Israel from being influenced by those outside the camp.

Sodomites often are thought of when one considers the idea of wearing clothes intended for the opposite sex.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

goykodesh
Dec 15th 2009, 08:30 PM
It seems many here are focused on the outward letter of God's command about clothing.

Perhaps it would be better to ask what the intent of the command is. Every command in the "Law" is centered around relationship with God, man and responses to natural circumstances. So if we just look at the letter of what value is that? I think people need to search themselves for an answer to this question - Do I trust God's wisdom or my own reasoning or what men say? Do I nullify His command because I find comfort in the religion of men or my own thoughts? The first step to a healty relationship with God is - trust.

In my humble opinion.

-SEEKING-
Dec 15th 2009, 08:37 PM
Closed temporarily since OP can not currently reply.

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