I find it hard to believe that so many Christians preach that women should dress modestly, but they don't see anything wrong with male gynecologists. Male gynecologists are definitely not morally above other men.

This is one of the most difficult issues most Christians have never thought about because we are taught that we should not question the medical industry and that it's okay for them to do anything. That is insane. God has the same expectations of everyone. Medical professionals are not above us morally.

Let me share my story. I am in my early 30s and still a virgin. I think I saw that something was wrong with male gynecologists around 1987 or1988 (21-22 years ago) when I was just 8 years old. I found out what a male gynecologist was when I was 8 years old and I’m still very shocked that they exist. Yes, my mom had a male gynecologist. Both my sister and I were delivered by a male ob/gyn. My mom actually had a c section with both of us. I questioned her a lot when I was a kid. At that time, she just pretty much ignored me. I didn’t understand because I was told as a kid that my father could not see me any more after a certain age. I didn’t get it how it was different for a strange male doctor. I think that my mom’s answer was something like “It’s different because he’s a doctor”. I didn’t buy my mom’s explanation because I knew that both the doctor and my father are men. They are no different. But over the past several years, she has changed her mind. She has decided she will no longer go to a male gynecologist because of some things I’ve brought attention to her so that’s good news. I see my mom as an innocent victim of the medical industry. I’ve convinced 25 year old sister to not go to a male gynecologist ever.

When I made the commitment to True Love Waits (http://www.lifeway.com/tlw/) as a teenager, I also thought about how I was never going to let another man (including doctor) other than my future husband to have access to certain parts of my body. It will probably be a pleasant surprise to my future husband since he might have never really thought about it. The truth is he was probably delivered by a male gynecologist just like I was since he would probably have been born sometime in the 1970s. I would let him know that I love him too much to let another man other than him have access to certain parts of my body. I am so thankful that God enlightened me on this subject because I get to give my future husband another special gift in addition to my virginity. It’s a priceless gift. I would not even go to a male gynecologist for $1 Million.

I am not against doctors at all, but I believe that God has the same expectations of them as us. I don’t care about the gender of the doctor when I go in for an ear infection or strep throat. I am speaking about private things. I believe that God only intended for women to be gynecologists. The good news is that 80% of ob/gyn residency students are female now.

I know that people often don’t question the medical industry. The truth is medical professionals are not above us morally. God has done a lot of wonderful things through doctors, but I don’t get it how it could be okay for men to do intimate exams on women who are not their wives. There were no intimate exams on women in the bible. I also know that babies were delivered by midwives in the bible. There is nowhere in the Bible that supports male doctors examining and looking at private parts of women who are not their wives. I have always felt like only women belonged to the ob/gyn field. I do know that in 1970 only 5% of the gynecologists were women. But we should not go by our culture because a lot of things in our culture have been wrong. There is not one word that mentions abortion in the bible, but there are several verses that support why abortion is wrong. For instance, abortion is murder. Look at this verse for example about how God feels about the unborn: For YOU created my inmost being; you knit me together in my mother’s womb. I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made; your works are wonderful I know that full well.” Psalm 139: 13-14. Look at Proverbs 6:17. Abortion didn’t exist in the biblical time. The bible preaches against nudity before the opposite sex except for between a husband and a wife. I don’t see anything wrong with seeing naked kids of the opposite sex in a certain age range. It’s not a big deal to see a 2 year old boy or girl running naked because he/she has not sexually matured yet.

I decided to reread the book, “Not Even a Hint (http://www.amazon.com/Not-Even-Hint-Guarding-Against/dp/1590521471)” by Joshua Harris. I’m not sure if you’ve ever read that book. I was disappointed that he didn't talk any about male gynecologists in his book. Joshua is a wonderful Christian pastor. He admits that he struggles with lust sometimes. He made a decision that he could no longer go to a certain beach in Florida because many women there were dressed immodestly and he struggled with thoughts. He also made a decision that he could not look at any catalogs that had lingerie in them and that his wife had to look through them. I know for sure that Joshua didn’t think to himself, I am going to that beach to enjoy women. I believe that many Christian men never intend to look at pornography at all to lust, but they choose to install porno filters to prevent themselves from accidentally seeing pornography. Every man is going to struggle with lustful thoughts no matter how strong Christian he is. A male gynecologist is a man and you cannot take “man” out of him. I find it very strange that many people think that male gynecologists don’t ever have lustful thoughts. Look at this example about Joshua. He never saw those women completely naked or examined their private parts and he had some thoughts. How in the world is it possible for a male gynecologist to never have any thoughts when he is between a woman’s legs and looking at her private parts? I know what goes on in a pelvic examination. I think it is strange that people think that male gynecologists are less likely than other men to have lustful thoughts especially when they actually get to see the woman naked and touch her private parts. I heard that male doctors in medical schools are taught to keep those thoughts to themselves. Most doctors don’t “act” on thoughts by going all way, but the Bible is very clear that there should not even be a hint of lust/impurity (Ephesians 5:3). There may be times when a male gynecologist examines a woman who is not attractive or smells terrible, but how is it okay for him to examine her private parts because she is not married to him? I’ve heard this crazy statement: Male gynecologists go to medical schools and they are trained to not have those sexual thoughts. If that was the case, why cannot teachers, pastors, electricians, computer programmers, accountants, firemen, and other men go through schools to train themselves to not have lustful thoughts? They are all men. Dr. Dobson from Focus on Family said that men are visually aroused by naked women’s bodies. I’ve heard this argument: Male gynecologists have seen so many private parts that they don’t lust anymore. If that was true, why do men who look at pornography continue to look at them? They see so many private parts of women. If this was true that they got tired, the men who look at pornography a lot would get tired and stop lusting. I heard that professors in medical schools understand that male doctors are going to lust so they encourage them to just keep those lustful thoughts to themselves. I am sure that so many women have gone to a male gynecologist not realizing how he might be enjoying doing the intimate exams on them and what’s really in his mind.

The issue of male gynecologist is a very touchy and difficult issue. I have learned so much this year and last year from a group called “How Husbands Feel About GYN Exams (http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/howhusbandsfeel/)”. There are some men in this group whose marriages were hurt because their wives went to a male gynecologist. Some of the men in this group are not even Christians and they see that male gynecologists are not right.

I am not against doctors and medical care at all. But I believe that men have no business being gynecologists. For example, I would not mind a male doctor tending to my knee as long as I was fully clothed. You know what I mean. I was very glad to hear that one male medical student in the “How Husbands Feel About Gyn Exams” talking about how his uncle, a family practice doctor refused to do any pelvic exams on females and that he let a female doctor in his practice handle all of the pelvic exams. I’m very proud of this male family practice doctor. We need more doctors who will stand up for what is right. If I was a female family practice doctor, I would refuse to do intimate examinations on male patients simply because I’m not married to them. I would be glad to treat them for other things that are not personal such as knee problem, diabetes, etc. I really don’t understand how mothers encourage their daughters to go to a male gynecologist, but they are upset if another man digitally penetrates their daughter with his fingers. I know that female patients submit to this, but it was because they were brainwashed that doctors can do anything. I can see how sometimes male gynecologists might not lust when a woman gives birth because I saw a lot of blood in some of the childbirth videos. I’ve heard that sometimes there’s poop from the baby or the lady so that’s gross. I’ve heard this argument from medical professionals: there are some gross things. I can agree with that, but it is still not okay for a male doctor to see the private parts of a woman who he is not married to. I feel like only female medical professionals and the husband of the woman should be there for the childbirth.

Some people say that male gynecologists are not sexual. My big question is how do they have family? If male gynecologists were not sexual, they would never have sex with their wives period.

I read a story of a teenage boy who was 14 years old. He shared a room with his 14 year old twin sister. He was embarrassed, but he said that it was very hard for him to stay pure in thoughts when he saw his sister changing clothes because she was attractive. I am pretty sure that every male gynecologist has had thoughts when they examine women no matter how much self control they may have. They just keep those thoughts to themselves most of the time.

Even if I could be guaranteed that a male gynecologist doesn’t have sexual thoughts, I still believe it is wrong. If it was not wrong, then I guess it must be okay for fathers to see their teenage or adult daughters naked.

In my biology class in high school, some boys giggled when the teacher showed a childbirth video and the lady’s private parts were exposed. What does that tell you?

My heart really goes to the male gynecologist’s wife. It’s sad that he sees so many women naked and touches their private parts. Rubber gloves make no difference. They are just to protect the male gynecologist from getting germs on his hands. The male gynecologist’s wife is not special at all. I am sure that he sees some women that probably have prettier bodies than his wife. I believe that God only intended one woman for each grown adult man to see naked and that’s their wife. The wife should be the only woman the husband should see naked based on common sense and Leviticus 18.

I feel like most women who have gone to male gynecologists are innocent victims of the medical industry. About 95% of women above the age of 45 have been to a male gynecologist at least one time in their life time. I know they set up appointments with a male doctor, but I believe it is because they fell to the cultural blind spot from the previous generation.

One lady that posted about patient modesty said the below paragraph and I agree with it.

The bond between a husband and wife is very special because each has pledged themselves to the other. This bond is strengthened and encouraged by the modesty of the couple. Saving some things to be admired solely by one’s spouse gives a sense of privilege, honor and intimacy. Anytime a person exposes their body to a member of the opposite sex they take away a part of the marriage intimacy and chance weakening the bonds between a husband and wife. This intimacy is further weakened by the encouragement of the medical establishment for women to expect to be examined intimately and for a woman to reveal intimate thoughts to her doctor, regardless of the reason for the visit to the doctor.

I hope more women in my generations will never go to male gynecologists in their whole lives just like me. I am encouraged to read on the Internet that 80% of ob/gyn residency students are female now. Men who want to be doctors should choose another specialty that would not require them to examine teenage or adult women patients intimately. It is certainly possible for a family practice doctor to make the decision he will not do anything gynecological and refer all women to a woman doctor for those things. If I were a family practice doctor, I would make it clearly to all of my male patients that I will not do any intimate male examinations on them and I will refer them to male doctors for those things.

I know of one guy in nursing school who was very upset when he was told that he had to do breast exams on some of female medical students. He ended up not having to do that. But unfortunately, he ended up giving in to doing some intimate things with women patients later on when he actually started working.

Well, my wife's GP has delivered both our children and does the routine checks on here during pregnancy. He acts professionally in doing his required examinations. My wife expresses no particular discomfort that would be alleviated with the use of the female GP or ob/gyn. If my wife has no issues, I have no issues.

For anyone who does, seek out a female ob/gyn.

I am grateful beyond words for my male gynecologist.

He is professional, treats me with dignity, respect, and we even laughed once. I wouldn't trade him for anything.

I insisted that my son be delivered by only women, after a dreadfully embarrassing examination by a man. Since then I've never allowed anyone other than a female to do any investigations of that area. But I think that is my personal preference. Personally I can't think of anything less alluring than a gynecological examination, and I can't imagine men deriving any pleasure out of it.

For those who want to make sure that no males are present for their childbirth, there are some good tips at http://patientmodesty.org/obgynpatients.aspx. Some women don't realize that if your female ob/gyn was not on call and there were some male ob/gyns in the practice, a male ob/gyn could end up delivering your baby which is not good.

This is one of those things that some of us guy's don't even want to think about so I'll just slowly back away and......*Runs*



Seriously though, even though I'm single now I can't remember if any of my ex's had a male Gynecologist and its something I would have never thought about or even asked about really.

To be honest, considering what most gyn's see when they look 'down there', I'm kinda surprised that they'd have any sex drive at all!! I have a good friend who works at a women's clinic, and she's told me some rather... colorful... stories of her patients. It's enough to make anyone cringe.

As I said in another thread, I worked in a administrative position in a residency training program....these doctors view the gyn parts as no more than a gallbladder or appendix. I see nothing wrong.

My wife has a male ob/gyn and has no problem with him. Really I doubt it is lustful or arousing because it is not in a sexual context. The only discomfort that my wife ever had with him was that he points out that she needs to lose a little bit of weight for health reasons, and even then she says that he is nice about it. She just doesn't want to hear about it (I feel the same way with my family doctor, I usually feel or say to myself "I get it I'm a little big I know you don't have to tell me I'm working on it").

I have a female family doctor and she examines me to check for stuff in the private area and trust me no arousal there. Because it is not done for the sake of arousal. The stuff that she does is not arousing.

I think many times we forget that the mind is really a big part of the sexual act. That is what pornography hinges on, many times it is not just throwing body parts out there saying here look at it. No there is a lot more that goes into it. Heck I can see my wife naked and not think about sex, not that she is not nice to look at, she is beautiful and I love her, but even as a young man (26) that is not where my mind jumps to right off the bat.

Private, I do wish to give a little rebuttal to a few things that you say. I don’t want to alter your beliefs, but just want to share mine. Woman to woman.

Woman to woman – I’ve thought about changing to a female ob/gyn not long ago. Not for modesty’s sake. Good grief. My current doctor and I have passed that stage a long time ago. But just because I am approaching 50 and would like to hear about things from the female point of view.

I had a female doctor in mind to go and see, but alas, she was only 32. She didn’t know any more about being a late 40’s kind of gal than my male doctor did! Ha!

So, I stuck with him. He is wonderful. There is ALWAYS, without fail, a female attendant present. I have seen a total of four different male gynecologists since I was 16 years old and I have never been in the room alone with one for an exam. There is always a female present.

I am of the opinion that each woman should make this decision for herself.

You are free to seek out a female only. I have no qualms with that.

But you are leaning on the side of claiming that those of us who do see a male doctor are sinning are at least contributing to his sinning. I do take acception to that.

Just consider this. I’m not trying to change your mind about who you see, just wishing you to be more accepting of who I see.


There were no intimate exams on women in the bible

There were no ob/gyn's in the Bible, but neither were there neurosurgeons, pediatricians, heart specialists, veterinarians, or cancer specialists. Your attempt to discredit male ob/gyn's on that foundation is unacceptable.

There were only male "physicians". Male doctors who treated or attempted to treat the entire body and did so poorly. There was much medical ignorance in those days.

Consider the woman in Luke with the issue of blood.

This woman was bleeding vaginally and had been for 12 years. She probably had a severe case of endometriosis or fibroid tumors and, of course, in those days they knew nothing of it. I taught with a dear friend who bled for 17 out of 28 days for 4 months before she finally resigned herself to surgery. If she had lived in Jesus' day, she could have very well been this woman. There would have been no medical answer. This woman in the Bible had spent all of her money on physicians.....male doctors. There were no female doctors that I know of in that time period.

Jesus didn't chastise her for that. She came to him, I'm sure she was ostracized by people. I'm sure that she had a perpetual bad odor about her. He healed her.

I don't accept this condemnation of male ob/gyn's on the basis of the fact that they are not mentioned in the bible. Neither are giraffes, the Himalaya mountains, garbage collectors, telephone operators, nor bone specialists.

They had no knowledge of the intricacies of the female reproductive system. Just like they had no knowledge of bacteria.


I also know that babies were delivered by midwives in the bible.

Yes, midwives used to deliver babies in the Bible days. These midwives weren't like the medical midwives of today. They had limited knowledge. And some women used to deliver their own babies while in the deserts, jungles, cotton fields, and rice paddies. But the infant mortality rate was phenomenal. The percentage of those babies who either were stillborn or did not see their 1st birthday would stagger us today. Also, those mothers did not have the same life expectancy that women do today. You, yourself, said we cannot go by cultural norms because they can be wrong. Well, some of the same Bible cultures that practiced midwifery also practiced homosexual orgies on the altars of their pagan gods. Just because the ancient cultures of the Bible practices a certain cultural norm because they had limited knowledge does not mean that it is a mandate from God. People in the Bible did a lot of benign things that caused no harm that were not commands from God, just things that they did.


I know that female patients submit to this, but it was because they were brainwashed that doctors can do anything. I feel like most women who have gone to male gynecologists are innocent victims of the medical industry.About 95% of women above the age of 45 have been to a male gynecologist at least one time in their life time. I know they set up appointments with a male doctor, but I believe it is because they fell to the cultural blind spot from the previous generations.

Well, I have never believed that nor do my circle of female friends.

I don't "submit" to my doctor. I am not brainwashed. I am not a victim. I have not fallen to any cultural blind spots.

I am of the opinion and have the experience with my family that now a days you have to TELL the doctor what to do and tell him or her what medicines you will or will not take and be your own advocate.

I’ve never believed in the “shining knight in a white coat” myth.

I love the doctors that I have and am ever so grateful for them, but we are a team, not a master and servant.


In my biology class in high school, some boys giggled when the teacher showed a childbirth video and the lady’s private parts were exposed. What does that tell you?

I taught school for 27 years. This tells me what I have known for decades. Adolescent boys are sexually inappropriate. They get sexually aroused and laugh with each other when someone sticks a pencil in the pencil sharpener. They ask red-haired girls what color their pubic hair is. They pop the girl’s bra straps and have sexually explicit nicknames for the “hot” teachers.

This teenage misconduct has no bearing on a grown man who is a doctor.

You seemed to speak a lot about the perversions of a male gynecologist.

A large part of what makes a man or a woman want to be an expert in this field is money. They want to deliver babies into this world because it is a joyful thing but most because is it very, very lucrative. Women will always be having babies and these doctors will always be making a fortune. The gynecology part of the ob/gyn is secondary. In order to be a trustworthy doctor who can safely deliver babies, one must also be an expert in the reproductive system of a female and women's health issues in general.

I'm glad that there are experts in the field of women's health.

Women's health issues cover so much more ground than just having babies. There are concerns about factor's that contribute to heart disease, strokes, obesity, and cancer that are peculiar to women, the ordeals of the menstrual cycle, perimenopause, menopause, osteoperosis, ovarian cancer (the silent killer), learning to live with the stigma of barreness, sexual dysfunctions, and much more.

The ob/gyn is about treating the whole women, from her pituitary gland in her brain to her thyroid in her neck which regulates her hormones to her ovaries all the way to her dry and cracked skin on the soles of her feet that are common in menopause.

Yes, for a physical exam, a woman is naked under a sheet and on her back with her knees practically next to her ears. But to say that a male physican examining her is fostering sexual perversion is demeaning to his profession and demeaning to the woman.

It doesn't take into account the entirety of the profession of the ob/gyn be he male or be she female.

It makes the woman reduced to her genitalia. That isn't what women's health is all about.

I think many times we forget that the mind is really a big part of the sexual act. That is what pornography hinges on, many times it is not just throwing body parts out there saying here look at it. No there is a lot more that goes into it. Heck I can see my wife naked and not think about sex, not that she is not nice to look at, she is beautiful and I love her, but even as a young man (26) that is not where my mind jumps to right off the bat.

Excellent.......!!!!

I find it hard to believe many people assume that male gynecologists are asexual. They are men like other men. If they were really asexual, why are many of them married with children? I know they are aroused by seeing their wives' private parts.

You should read what a doctor said at http://www.topix.com/forum/med/obstetrics-and-gynecology/TFC4747NUBFSG2JST/p4#c63. He gave up doing gynecological examinations because he realized it was wrong.

There are times male gynecologists may not have lustful thoughts in certain situations like when there's a lot of meconium in childbirth. But it doesn't make it right. Many husbands would be very upset if their male next door neighbor saw their wife nude even if she was having severe diarrhea. That is so gross. I can certainly see why a man would not have any sexual thoughts toward woman in situations like this.

Why do we have separate restrooms and locker rooms for men and women? If there's nothing wrotng with male gynecologists, we should no longer have separate restrooms or locker rooms.

Why have a number of doctors committed sexual misconduct? You should check out some cases at http://sexualmisconductbydoctors.com/misconductcasesbydoctors.aspx. Most male doctors never cross lines, but they do have lustful thoughts. You cannot read their minds.

Why have a number of doctors committed sexual misconduct? You should check out some cases at http://sexualmisconductbydoctors.com/misconductcasesbydoctors.aspx. Most male doctors never cross lines, but they do have lustful thoughts. You cannot read their minds.

You know what this tells me? This tells me that doctors are human. I can't read their thoughts, so therefore I cannot condemn them for their thoughts.

I find it hard to believe many people assume that male gynecologists are asexual. They are men like other men. If they were really asexual, why are many of them married with children? I know they are aroused by seeing their wives' private parts.

No one believe that these doctors are asexual. No one assumes it. No one has said it.

If these men are aroused by their wives, it is because they love them. Not because she exposes her genitals to him. GADS!! A wife could be out in the garden covered in dirt and overalls and if she gives him that little "look", he instantly desires her. She doesn't have to be naked. She's his wife.

And as one male poster has said, it's not his wife's nudity in and of itself that draws him to her in a sexual way.

You are blanketly associating nudity with sex.

We are not denying the sexuality of any human being. You are the one who is portraying these doctors in particular as over-sexed perverts.

Do you not see the difference?

And as for sexual misconduct?

Do you dare wish to know the percentages of pastors and preachers who have had sex with parishioners and even raped parishioners? I'm not talking about Catholic priests, here. I'm talking about Protestants - especially in the fundamentalist camps.

It will make you sick. Just research it for yourself.

There are sick people in every field. Teachers, doctors, lawyers, preachers, firemen, bankers, and ditchdiggers.

But we don't throw the baby out with the bathwater.

You don't HAVE to see a male doctor. But do not chastise me for doing so.

You don't have a Biblical leg to stand on.

in the last 5 yrs, i've been to a male OB/gyn and a female OB/gyn, both within the same practice.
i chose to continue seeing the male OB/gyn because he was a better doctor. he had a better bedside manner, he took more time with me and communicated w/ me a bit better than she did. he has since delivered my daughter.
what a shame it would be had he chosen not to enter this specialty based on some of the hang-ups you have described. alot of women in this city would've been deprived of a great physician.....

I find it hard to believe many people assume that male gynecologists are asexual. They are men like other men. If they were really asexual, why are many of them married with children? I know they are aroused by seeing their wives' private parts.

You should read what a doctor said at http://www.topix.com/forum/med/obstetrics-and-gynecology/TFC4747NUBFSG2JST/p4#c63. He gave up doing gynecological examinations because he realized it was wrong.

There are times male gynecologists may not have lustful thoughts in certain situations like when there's a lot of meconium in childbirth. But it doesn't make it right. Many husbands would be very upset if their male next door neighbor saw their wife nude even if she was having severe diarrhea. That is so gross. I can certainly see why a man would not have any sexual thoughts toward woman in situations like this.

Why do we have separate restrooms and locker rooms for men and women? If there's nothing wrotng with male gynecologists, we should no longer have separate restrooms or locker rooms.

Why have a number of doctors committed sexual misconduct? You should check out some cases at http://sexualmisconductbydoctors.com/misconductcasesbydoctors.aspx. Most male doctors never cross lines, but they do have lustful thoughts. You cannot read their minds.


Nobody said male gynaecologists are asexual, the point is that there is a time when seeing a woman with no clothes on has sexual connotations and times when it does not. The fact that somebody has no clothes on (or specific parts are revealed, even if some clothes are retained) does not automatically make a situation sexual.

Firstly, seeing a male or female doctor is largely a choice. Your point about mixed locker rooms misses the point completely - if I feel that as a man I only want to see a male doctor I have that choice. If I'd rather see the first available doctor I have that choice. My doctor's office lists the names of every doctor as well as their gender to enable people to make that choice if they so choose. A mixed changing room removes that choice and fails to respect those who wish to preserve their modesty.

Secondly, even when specific body parts are on show there isn't necessarily any element of arousal at all. As a woman I don't suppose you're overly familiar with the contents of what are euphemistically called "mens magazines" but I can say that at least some of them tend to focus on gynaecological detail to an extent that might be of some interest to an anatomy student but (for me at least) isn't arousing in the slightest. Honestly, I struggle to understand why anybody would read such a magazine more than once.

I can also tell you that even in the context of a marriage there are times when nudity just isn't sexual. My wife can look simply gorgeous in my eyes when she's fully clothed, and at the same time if she's eaten something that disagreed with her she might be half-naked while she's throwing up and the fact that certain parts might be showing isn't relevant at all, I'm more concerned about making sure she's OK than admiring the view.

For myself I'd rather see a male doctor for anything personal, any doctor for anything less personal, and the first doctor available regardless of gender for anything that could endanger my life.

I might as well be the one to realllllly set things on their ear.

I lived in a small town where everyone knew everyone else's business. Most of the women there had their children delivered by a male OB/GYN because of the three doctors in town, they were all male. There WAS no choice. Then, a female set up practice - a very intelligent woman doctor whom I had went to school with - personable, very caring about her patients. She rapidly became THE doctor of choice for all the females of the town. I stuck with my old OB/GYN because he was someone I trusted with my life - he actually saved the lives of both me and our son.

At any rate, it was about a year and a half into the whole 'Dr. So and so is GREAT!" that what I had known all along came to light - the female OB/GYN was a lesbian.

Just because one is female does not mean anything at all. Professionalism is what matters, no matter which gender a physician is.

What a lot of people don't realize is that in many areas of the country (including mine), female gynocologists are rare. In my area (the entire 5 county area), there is only 1 female OB/GYN and she has a very bad reputation and has almost had her license taken several times for mistakes she has made in treating women and delivering babies. I would much rather go to my OB/GYN than to her! My OB/GYN is male but he is very professional and has never even given me the slightest reason to feel uncomfortable around him. Why would I risk the health of my unborn child (I am 4 1/2 months pregnant) by going to the only female in my area when she is such a poor doctor? I do not believe that going to a male doctor is wrong. To undress in front of a male for medical reasons is a MUCH different thing than to undress in front of a male for sexual intentions. I am very happy with my OB/GYN and plan to stick with him! He has been a very good doctor to me and knows what he is doing. And as for going to a female who is located farther away, (in case you suggest that), I have a 13 month old. Going far away from home for an exam and waiting for hours in the waiting room/exam room and then making the long trip back home is just not practical with a toddler.

I might as well be the one to realllllly set things on their ear.

I lived in a small town where everyone knew everyone else's business. Most of the women there had their children delivered by a male OB/GYN because of the three doctors in town, they were all male. There WAS no choice. Then, a female set up practice - a very intelligent woman doctor whom I had went to school with - personable, very caring about her patients. She rapidly became THE doctor of choice for all the females of the town. I stuck with my old OB/GYN because he was someone I trusted with my life - he actually saved the lives of both me and our son.

At any rate, it was about a year and a half into the whole 'Dr. So and so is GREAT!" that what I had known all along came to light - the female OB/GYN was a lesbian.

Just because one is female does not mean anything at all. Professionalism is what matters, no matter which gender a physician is.

Amen Sister! Honestly, these doctors go to school for a long time to be who they are. If they had warped minds, they could have made porn films. By the post above, I'd rather have a male doctor than a lesbian one...just saying.

I honestly don't see a problem with male gynecologists.
My boys were delivered by men, who were very professional. I have seen both men and women, some have been good, some not so good.

44 years ago my mom went to see a male gyno and he discovered that she had ovarian and uterine cancer (she was 33 then and is 77 now) and he saved her life.
She loved him, said he was the best dr. she's ever had in her life.

I don't think gender should matter. As long as the physician is professional, yet caring and there is a good dr/patient relationship, that's all that really matters IMO.

Also, any woman who has a male gynecologist can request a chaperone during an examination , if they feel more comfortable with one present.

Jeanne

I might as well be the one to realllllly set things on their ear.

I lived in a small town where everyone knew everyone else's business. Most of the women there had their children delivered by a male OB/GYN because of the three doctors in town, they were all male. There WAS no choice. Then, a female set up practice - a very intelligent woman doctor whom I had went to school with - personable, very caring about her patients. She rapidly became THE doctor of choice for all the females of the town. I stuck with my old OB/GYN because he was someone I trusted with my life - he actually saved the lives of both me and our son.

At any rate, it was about a year and a half into the whole 'Dr. So and so is GREAT!" that what I had known all along came to light - the female OB/GYN was a lesbian.

Just because one is female does not mean anything at all. Professionalism is what matters, no matter which gender a physician is.

Good point and one I was going to make too.


For years I wanted a male doctor because the idea of a woman touching me just made me cringe. My male doctor saved my son's life when he was being born too.

Eventually I got over my issues with female doctors and now have one whom I like alot. Doctors have to see and deal with gross and disgusting things all the time. Not a job I would want. Sure there are bad ones...just like in any profession but the bible just doesn't say a word about this.

God bless

To the OP, I'll make it simple. Your mom has a male gynecologist and you prefer a woman. Then go to a woman gynecologist. I'm not sure what your worries are about. Nobody is forcing you to go to a male doctor if you don't want to go to one.

Frankly, I think there's a bigger problem from my perspective, and that's with medical doctors in general, as I don't believe in their philosophy. They are OK for trauma medicine, but not for worthless things like cholesterol meds, High BP meds, etc etc which don't do diddly except make pharmaceuticals rich at the hands of the common folks who can hardly eke out a living. So, likewise, I don't go to them at all nor do I ever take what they recommend. Likewise, you have that same type of choice with a gynecologist. Just do your own thing.

If the issue here is about them seeing you naked and having your private parts exposed, then let's cut out all male surgeons, as well, because last time I had surgery I had to take my clothes off and I know the doctor saw me naked when I was under.

If the issue here is about them seeing you naked and having your private parts exposed, then let's cut out all male surgeons, as well, because last time I had surgery I had to take my clothes off and I know the doctor saw me naked when I was under.

Amen! I know that my ex-wife wouldn't go to a female ob/gyn. She had been to one or 2 and found that they didn't have as good a touch as the males that she had been to.

Private,

First, I have to say that I have a profound respect for your desire to remain pure until marriage, and to encourage others to do so.

I also respect your conviction that you should not be treated by a male physician. I first read this thread, and thought not to post...

...but I simply have to say that while I have no doubt your convictions are sincere, I think you do a disservice to others in the manner in which you present them.

My Daughter in Law is pregnant with twins. This is her first pregnancy, and she and my son have much on their mind. She was raised very to be very modest, and is a wonderful wife to my son. I have no doubt that she will be a wonderful mother to my grandchildren.

The concerns she has are the common ones any first time mother might have (x2). :)

The idea that she would read this thread, and carry another concern with her to an appointment, or when she delivers is something I would not wish on her, or on any who fellowship here.

I understand the tone of your posts is a reflection of your belief. I submit that if what you believe is true (or even if it might be so for some)... that a less dogmatic approach may be more productive.

I might as well be the one to realllllly set things on their ear.

I lived in a small town where everyone knew everyone else's business. Most of the women there had their children delivered by a male OB/GYN because of the three doctors in town, they were all male. There WAS no choice. Then, a female set up practice - a very intelligent woman doctor whom I had went to school with - personable, very caring about her patients. She rapidly became THE doctor of choice for all the females of the town. I stuck with my old OB/GYN because he was someone I trusted with my life - he actually saved the lives of both me and our son.

At any rate, it was about a year and a half into the whole 'Dr. So and so is GREAT!" that what I had known all along came to light - the female OB/GYN was a lesbian.

Just because one is female does not mean anything at all. Professionalism is what matters, no matter which gender a physician is.

I was gonna say something along these lines. There used to be a lesbian ob/gyn not too far from here. Sexual attraction should definitely be as the Bible outlines it, but more times than we realize, sexual attraction is unnatural, and women are attracted to women. Still, I don't see where sexuality really comes into the picture when you are talking about ob/gyns. The job isn't about looking at women's private part, as it is helping them with female issues. Don't get me wrong, it's not exactly comfortable being seen by a male ob/gyn, but it isn't any more comfortable being seen by a woman, in my opinion. I don't want anyone seeing me other than my husband, but if I expect that kind of care as part of my medical screenings, somebody's got to do it.

I don't remember who said it here, but it is admirable that you wish to be pure for your future husband. I wish that all women (and men for that matter) felt the same convictions. I believe that those who remain pure sexually, will be a treasure to their future spouse. That's the way God intended it and he will bless you for it.

To the OP, I'll make it simple. Your mom has a male gynecologist and you prefer a woman.

I wanted to correct something you said. My mom has not been to a male gynecologist in about 11 years now. She decided to quit going to a male gynecologist after I brought some things to her attention. She feels that it's a cultural blind spot and that male gynecologists are indeed inappropriate. There have been a number of Christian women who realized that male gynecologists were wrong.

If the issue here is about them seeing you naked and having your private parts exposed, then let's cut out all male surgeons, as well, because last time I had surgery I had to take my clothes off and I know the doctor saw me naked when I was under.

I have no idea what kind of surgery you had. But patients have unnecessarily taken off their clothes for certain surgeries. For example, there are some horrible modesty violation cases at http://www.patientmodesty.org/modesty.aspx. I cannot believe that one man was stripped naked for hand surgery. You do have to be naked for certain surgeries. I like the successful stories at http://www.patientmodesty.org/rights.aspx. This shows us that we must stand up for our rights.

Private,

First, I have to say that I have a profound respect for your desire to remain pure until marriage, and to encourage others to do so.

I also respect your conviction that you should not be treated by a male physician. I first read this thread, and thought not to post...

...but I simply have to say that while I have no doubt your convictions are sincere, I think you do a disservice to others in the manner in which you present them.

My Daughter in Law is pregnant with twins. This is her first pregnancy, and she and my son have much on their mind. She was raised very to be very modest, and is a wonderful wife to my son. I have no doubt that she will be a wonderful mother to my grandchildren.

The concerns she has are the common ones any first time mother might have (x2). :)

The idea that she would read this thread, and carry another concern with her to an appointment, or when she delivers is something I would not wish on her, or on any who fellowship here.

I understand the tone of your posts is a reflection of your belief. I submit that if what you believe is true (or even if it might be so for some)... that a less dogmatic approach may be more productive.



It is so exicting that you will have twin grandchildren. Twins are so cute.

I believe that pregnant women should be able to get the modesty they wish for during childbirth. Some people assume that you have to give up your modesty, but that is not true. There are some great tips for ob/gyn patients at http://patientmodesty.org/obgynpatients.aspx. There are some links to birth plans on that page. Birth plans indicate who you want present for your birth. I believe that childbirth should be a joyous time and both wife and husband should be able to make decisions about who can be present (including only same gender doctors/nurses). One of my friends was planning on having her baby with a midwife, but she ended up having to go to the hospital to have a C Section because her baby was breech. She had a female ob/gyn, but she was very insensitive. My friend had requested in writing that no medical students be present, but this female ob/gyn ignored her wishes.

I was gonna say something along these lines. There used to be a lesbian ob/gyn not too far from here. Sexual attraction should definitely be as the Bible outlines it, but more times than we realize, sexual attraction is unnatural, and women are attracted to women. Still, I don't see where sexuality really comes into the picture when you are talking about ob/gyns. The job isn't about looking at women's private part, as it is helping them with female issues. Don't get me wrong, it's not exactly comfortable being seen by a male ob/gyn, but it isn't any more comfortable being seen by a woman, in my opinion. I don't want anyone seeing me other than my husband, but if I expect that kind of care as part of my medical screenings, somebody's got to do it.

I don't remember who said it here, but it is admirable that you wish to be pure for your future husband. I wish that all women (and men for that matter) felt the same convictions. I believe that those who remain pure sexually, will be a treasure to their future spouse. That's the way God intended it and he will bless you for it.

I definitely would not want a lesbian female ob/gyn at all. I don't want any male gynecologists or lesbian female gynecologists at all. It is very easy to find out if a female gynecologist is a lesbian. I do research on them. I suspect one female gynecologist about 30 minutes away from where I live is a lesbian and I would not go to her at all.

Normal female gynecologists don't get aroused by seeing naked women. You know how women don't struggle with seeing other women scantily dressed, but men do.

Normal female gynecologists don't get aroused by seeing naked women. You know how women don't struggle with seeing other women scantily dressed, but men do.
And you know this how exactly? Would you, as a regular person whose job did not involve examinations of any kind, become aroused at viewing a males private parts in a clinical setting? Probably not - I know I sure wouldn't and I get aroused fairly easily (sorry if that's too much information). So why oh why would you suggest a male physician who has trained for years and acquired a level of professionalism (as one poster said, if you've seen one you've seen 'em all) would become aroused at seeing a woman up in stirrups? Good night Irene.

As far as stripping for surgery - there are things known as germs - they are carried on clothing and other materials. I would rather be naked and have a better chance of survival that be all, "Oh no, you might see something you shouldn't" and die of an infection. But hey - that's just me. I have NO desire to return to the 19th century.

And you know this how exactly? Would you, as a regular person whose job did not involve examinations of any kind, become aroused at viewing a males private parts in a clinical setting? Probably not - I know I sure wouldn't and I get aroused fairly easily (sorry if that's too much information). So why oh why would you suggest a male physician who has trained for years and acquired a level of professionalism (as one poster said, if you've seen one you've seen 'em all) would become aroused at seeing a woman up in stirrups? Good night Irene.


Most women don't get aroused by seeing other women naked. Ask other women if they get aroused when they see other women naked in dressing room. Why is it that women and men have separate restrooms and dressing rooms?

If I were a nurse, I would not do any intimate procedures on male patients because that would go against my convictions. I feel I would disrespect my future husband and that man's wife or future wife even if I had no lustful thoughts. Women are much less likely to lust than men. Men have a harder time staying pure in thoughts when they see naked women.

You should check out what one doctor (I think he was a family practice doctor) said about how he gave up doing gynecological exams because he realized they were wrong at http://www.topix.com/forum/med/obstetrics-and-gynecology/TFC4747NUBFSG2JST/p4#c63. He also talks about how some of his male colleagues get aroused by doing intimate procedures on female patients.




As far as stripping for surgery - there are things known as germs - they are carried on clothing and other materials. I would rather be naked and have a better chance of survival that be all, "Oh no, you might see something you shouldn't" and die of an infection. But hey - that's just me. I have NO desire to return to the 19th century.

This is a big misconception. Many people don't know the truth about germs in hospital. Let me share some information with you.

I feel that medical professionals wanting to strip certain patients naked is more for their own convenience. It is absolutely unnecessary in so many cases especially when you are having hand, wrist, and knee surgeries. A person could not have pants on for knee surgery of course. But they should at least have surgical or disposable shorts on and a shirt/gown to cover chest of a lady.

I read a story of one man who had a wrist reconstruction surgery took his shirt off and kept his pants on. He boldly told the nurses and doctor they better not take his pants off during surgery. He put a notch in his belt so he would know whether they ignored his wishes. The good news is his wishes were respected and the surgery went well. The germs off his pants didn't affect his surgery at all.

One of my friends got a terrible MRSA infection from having knee replacement surgery. The reason he got the infection was at least one of the nurses or doctors didn't wash their hands. Staph infections are often acquired in hospitals because some doctors and nurses are lazy about washing their hands. They often go from patient to patient without washing hands. Most people didn't have staph infections before they went to the hospital.

Hospital floors are often contaminated with many germs.In many cases, medical gowns are probably not much cleaner than street clothes. Think about how patients have to change into medical gowns in changing rooms that are full of germs. Also many patients don't wash their hands before putting on the medical gowns so their contaminated hands touch the medical gown. Can you guarantee that the person who takes the medical gowns out of the dryer at the hospital has clean hands?

Here's information one lady who has been very educated about germs in hospital shared with me:

Operating rooms can be kept sterile. What that entails is *everything* brought into the room first be sterilized, including shoes. Floors *could be* sterilized, but, in fact, are disinfected.

Hospital gowns given to put on in the changing area or a hospital room are not sterilized. They are merely *clean*. Normally, for outpatient surgery, a person is told to shower before coming in, and wear clean clothes. Even if they were sterile, as soon as they got into a nonsterile environment, such as the changing room or the hospital room, they would no longer be sterile. However, in cases of emergency or urgent surgery, one does not have the option of showering and wearing clean clothes ahead of time. For instance, last year when I had surgery to put a rod in a badly fractured leg, I certainly did not shower right before going to the hospital! My clothes had about a day's wear on them.

The surgery I had in October was scheduled in advance, so I did have the instructions to shower and wear clean clothes. It was the same as another surgery I had years ago which was planned in advance, and I kept on my cotton underwear and cotton socks. I'm not sure what the importance of cotton is, but they insist upon it. This is even though most surgical uniforms are made of a cotton/polyester blend.

Skin simply CANNOT be sterilized. It can be disinfected, as they often do around a surgical incision. But, there are germs on the patient's skin. To remove them would kill the patient.

Also, as soon as they begin surgery, everything is no longer sterile, as the patient's body is not sterile, plus the reason for the surgery may be specifically to remove, clean, debrid (scrape off), some part of the body. For instance, if one is getting an appendectomy, by definition they will be cutting into the digestive tract, nearly always into an organ known to be infected!

There are PLENTY of airborn pathogenic germs in the air in hospitals! Even if everything were brought into the operating room sterile, it would not stay that way long if air from the hospital were circulated through without sterilizing it. That is done in cleanrooms. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cleanroom (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cleanroom) The point is that the technology exists, and works. It's just that hospitals do not use it, preferring their own definition of "clean" and "sterile". I suppose this means that computer memory and drives are more "important" than are hospital patients. Or, taking my dollar-analysis into this realm, if a computer component fails because of contamination, it is returned to the company to be fixed, replaced, and the company may be liable for consequential damages to the customer. All of these cost the computer company money, and they go to great lengths to minimize its occurrence. If a patient gets ill or infected from a contamination during surgery, that just brings them back for more treatments, medications, and surgeries. They make more money.

People will be in the operating room breathing. This too makes the air unsterile. The doctors, nurses, anesthesiologist, and the patient all breathe. The more people, the higher the chances of them breathing a harmful bacteria, germ, virus, or whatever else. The people in the operating room wear these little paper or cloth masks which were shown to be ineffective for preventing Spanish Flu, or even colds or seasonal flu. It will keep droplets of spittle off of the patient. People in the cleanrooms wear a special suit with headgear. In higher-class cleanrooms, they even have their own air supply, and filter and ventilation system - the same as a suit worn undersea or in space.

There are larger numbers of dangerous pathogens in hospitals. Quite simply, that is where sick people are.:) They HAVE such things as MRSA, strep, staph (including MRSA), antibiotic-resistant bacteria of all sorts. I mentioned it before because those are not the sorts of things you want your newborn infant exposed to!

Not to mention the number of medical and surgical equipment that is "outsourced" to be cleaned and sterilized, and sometimes comes back visually dirty. Is it really so difficult for them to clean the instruments, use the hospital sterilizer (hardly more than a dishwasher, really - that just has a hotter dry cycle)?

You should check out what one doctor (I think he was a family practice doctor) said about how he gave up doing gynecological exams because he realized they were wrong at http://www.topix.com/forum/med/obstetrics-and-gynecology/TFC4747NUBFSG2JST/p4#c63.

That was an anonymous comment: there's no way of knowing if it was actually by a doctor, let alone how accurate it is.


I feel that medical professionals wanting to strip certain patients naked is more for their own convenience.

I'm disturbed at these rather uninformed blanket attacks on medicine in general. Are you trying to talk people out of going to hospital? Why?

To take just one point, there are several reasons why hospital gowns are used: they allow quick access if things go wrong during surgery (there is always an element of risk when general anesthesia is used, or in any kind of childbirth); hospital gowns are a lot cleaner than the average person's street clothes; hospital gowns don't shed fibres which might get into an incision and cause problems.

I am certainly no doctor, but have been on many OB/GYN related medical calls that covered everything from hemorrhage to childbirth to severe trauma. As a matter of fact, I had to do an quick "look" on a trauma patient this past week. On any trauma, one of the first things we do when we get the patient in the truck is to cut off all of their clothes. If a female is having a heart attack and requires CPR, the first thing I am going to do is expose her breasts (so I can put the electrodes on). I can honestly say that not once have I ever thought "Wow. I am really enjoying this." or "She's hot!" EMS as well as doctors tend to be very mechanical about the whole "examination thing". I don't want to spend anymore time "down there" than I absolutely have to. I just really can't for the life of me imagine why this would be an issue...

IF this is truly a modesty thing, what would you do if you have an OB/GYN emergency (severe bleeding, childbirth, etc.) and two male medics showed up???

My thoughts on this is pretty simple. The only male I would want "down there" would be my husband. Those are MY private parts... not to be shown to another male except my husband. But that is just me

What would you do in an emergency?

You are now married, you have just given birth to a child. Something goes horribly wrong and you start bleeding profusely. Your husband calls 911 and two male medics show up at your door. Now what?

Do you refuse and most likely die leaving your husband to scramble trying to raise your newborn???

I may have felt the same way when I was much younger, however when I was in labor, I wouldn't have cared who looked at me down there, I was in PAIN!

Jeanne :D

I may have felt the same way when I was much younger, however when I was in labor, I wouldn't have cared who looked at me down there, I was in PAIN!

Jeanne :D

That is exactly what my wife says. Of course, I think everybody in the county came by and took a look when she was in labor. :D

I'd really like to know who all these guys are who are less concerned for their wives health than they are for their genital viewing exclusivity agreement. When it comes to the health of a vagina or a breast, I'm not an expert, so I trust my wife's health to whomever she feels is most qualified. That person might have a penis, or they might have a vagina... I frankly don't care. The only thing I care about is that they come equipped with the know-how.

If they're stupid enough to be inappropriate during an examination, I'll happily sue them into the 14th sphere of oblivion. If they wait until they get home to frantically abuse themselves fantasizing about my wife, then that's on their conscience, not ours. The net effect is it hasn't effected us in the least and my wife is healthier for it.

That is exactly what my wife says. Of course, I think everybody in the county came by and took a look when she was in labor. :D

LOL I hear that! It seemed like everyone and their brother (in Las Vegas) came by to have a look!

Jeanne :lol:

(as one poster said, if you've seen one you've seen 'em all)

One word and it need not go further than this... HAMBURGER. :o ;)

One word and it need not go further than this... HAMBURGER. :o ;)

A memory that will live in your visual mind forever.

I don't let people examine me. I let the Word of God do it for me.

I don't let people examine me. I let the Word of God do it for me.

What on earth does that mean?

Private: I think you have a very limited view of men in general and male gynecologists in particular. Nine times out of ten, they really aren't concerned with the sexual ramifications of the exam. They are looking for the purpose of ascertaining whether you are healthy, not for sexual pleasure, as is the case with the magazines you mentioned.

Men do not think of sex all the time, like tvs tuned to a singular station. They are complete human beings; they have failings and faults, like women (who, by the by, are just as lustful as men, it's just couched differently; men don't have the market on lust by a long shot) do. Most male doctors aren't looking at their female patient's body as some kind of living 'men's magazine' shot while they're examining them.

However, if you, personally, are not comfortable with it, don't do it -- just realize that in an emergency situation, you will not have a choice at all; I'd really try not to be so rigid in the seeking of purity, if I were you. There's such a thing as taking it too far -- and you're way, way past that line, condemning a whole group of people with very little factual evidence to go on.

And yes, I have been examined by male doctors, and found it no more bothersome than with a female doctor. Both make me uncomfortable, but I do it anyway, because embarrassment is more easily cured than disease.

I have no idea what kind of surgery you had. But patients have unnecessarily taken off their clothes for certain surgeries. For example, there are some horrible modesty violation cases at http://www.patientmodesty.org/modesty.aspx. I cannot believe that one man was stripped naked for hand surgery. You do have to be naked for certain surgeries. I like the successful stories at http://www.patientmodesty.org/rights.aspx. This shows us that we must stand up for our rights.

So what's your point? That some people abuse their position over others?

Some youth workers have been known to have sexually abused the children in their care? Does that mean we should stop youth work? Should we stop men from working with children, since most offenders are men?

Should we stop men from being parents, since some of them abuse their children? Perhaps we should just take baby girls away from their fathers at birth, just to be safe?

Or perhaps that we should just be wary of the few bad apples and root them out as early in the process as possible. Tarring everybody with the widest brush you can find serves nobody, demonises the many perfectly legitimate and professional medics and risks trivialising the serious misconduct that is shown by a very select few.

What on earth does that mean?

..................

:D

That was an anonymous comment: there's no way of knowing if it was actually by a doctor, let alone how accurate it is.



I'm disturbed at these rather uninformed blanket attacks on medicine in general. Are you trying to talk people out of going to hospital? Why?

To take just one point, there are several reasons why hospital gowns are used: they allow quick access if things go wrong during surgery (there is always an element of risk when general anesthesia is used, or in any kind of childbirth); hospital gowns are a lot cleaner than the average person's street clothes; hospital gowns don't shed fibres which might get into an incision and cause problems.


I agree with the surgery part, its not for their convenience, it's for sanitary reasons and you'd rather have just gowns on than have fibers floating and getting into your wound and infecting it, thats messy stuff when your incisions get infected. I work on the surgical floor with people after surgery and sometimes before surgery. They never ever go down with anything of hteir own but a bearclaw gown with is a papert gown or sometimes just the cloth hospital gowns that dont' shed Though the rooms get cleaned really well after each surgery, fibers can still find their way into the air and float from clothes and while you may not be infected by wearing clothes, the person after yo could. And for easy access too. Need to be more informed about htis stuff before making claims like that.

I have never gone to get examined though I should. But male gyns probably would make me uncomfortable but not due to what you have claimed Private, but just me being uncomfortable wiht having a guy look at me, though I'd be that way with a female too, but thats just my jitters. I'm not saying males are bad and shouldn't have that job. I'm sure there are very good ones. And i'm not going to turn down a male one either if its an emergbency, that'd be foolish for me. And who knows, if a male is the only one available for checkups, then I'd go to him. Anyone can be guilty of what you claim male gyn's are guilty of, so by your reasoning, we should just lock oursleves in our homes and never interact with anyone ever. Not meaning to be rude but they are everywhere, and I know people who have male gyns and have positive reviews of them. So be careful about the researches that come up, because there are some that may seem valid but can be bogus info, just based on someone's personal view or bad experience with one and then lumps all of them together as bad.

Private,

I think that I am speaking for all Christian women when I say that we do not "enjoy" having our private parts looked at by a man. But, there are situations in which having a male OB/GYN is the only option. I am almost 5 months pregnant. I have a male OB/GYN. I do not look forward to going to him and getting undressed. But, I do so for the safety and health of my child. The only female OB/GYN in my entire area is very incompetent. (I think that I mentioned that before). Anyway, there is no way that I would allow her to touch me and to risk the life of my unborn child. My relationship with my OB/GYN is strictly professional and he ALWAYS has a female nurse accompany him to the exam rooms as a witness. She is always in the room with him at all times. If it were not for him, my last child would have possibly died. He saved her life by doing an emergency C-Section because she was turned the wrong way and her heart rate was dropping. So, what would have happened if I did not want him looking at me? What if I had a woman doctor who did not know what to do and he just happened to be at the hospital when I was giving birth and he knew what to do? Would I be crazy enough to say "No, he isn't touching me because he is a man!"??? Of course not! My child's life was on the line. Private, what would you do if you had a teenage daughter who had a emergency at school and for some reason needed to be undressed for emergency medical care. Let's say that the school nurse was a male. Would you tell the school to take a chance on her living and not let the male nurse touch her?

No one will answer that question although it has been asked several times... :B

Male gynecologists ... now that's a touchy subject.

I would let a male nurse/gyn help me in emergency cases or in cases when they are the only ones available or if htey are really good. It may be discomforting but I'd be uncomfortable wiht a female looking at me butI would suck it up and get checked out to make sure I'm healthy or baby is healthy if/when I havfe kids. I'm not going to be fussy. Though last night at hte hospital, I had an elderly man who broke his arm that he uses and didn't want me to help him with the urinal due to me being a female and he a male. His wife had a look on her face too so i got his male nurse. Normally I see this mainly in women or teenage males, but not his age. But I don't know what he is going to do during days or nights when our two male nurses aren't there, its mostly females there...

Not saying that all the male patients who let me help them are comfortable wtih females seeing htem, but htey know its either hold it and hope that the male nurses we have are on that night or just let us help them when they ahve to go unless their family members are able to help them. and aside from making sure there aren't any sores, we don't watch them there when they go or look at them as they are getting in and out of bed or when we're not working in that area (as in baths/showers), I'm sure its like that with professionals, they proably won't even remember what you look like after you see them. they just check you out to make sure your healthy, nothing more.

No one will answer that question although it has been asked several times... :B

I guess you'd know if someone really had courage in their convictions if they would genuinely rather die than have a male nurse see their womanly bits.

If you're going to take that argument to its conclusion, it means you can never be examined by a male doctor, and you can never have surgery with males involved. The first thing after putting you under, is to undress and shave you to properly expose whatever area is undergoing surgery. It will be a great challenge, IMO, if you ever have an emergent need for surgery to make sure you avoid any male seeing you naked. That would include the nurses, surgeon, assistants, anesthetist, residents, technicians, supply staff, etc. I don't believe that is realistic.

As an object lesson, my wife just delivered our third child this past Friday (:pp). She had a post-delivery complication that needed some minor surgery to correct. I would guess something like 25 different people (doctors, nurses, and interns) all ended up 'having a look' at some point during the last 18 hours.

Congrats!!! And I will be keeping your family in my prayers. Give your wife a huge hug from me, please!
V

As an object lesson, my wife just delivered our third child this past Friday (:pp). She had a post-delivery complication that needed some minor surgery to correct. I would guess something like 25 different people (doctors, nurses, and interns) all ended up 'having a look' at some point during the last 18 hours.

Hey congratulations! Was it a boy or a girl??
Details!

Jeanne :)

Hey congratulations! Was it a boy or a girl??
Details!

Jeanne :)

Sorry, been a bit busy :).

Anyway, it was a boy, 8lbs 15oz. Fast delivery.

Sorry, been a bit busy :).

Anyway, it was a boy, 8lbs 15oz. Fast delivery.

Wow God bless your wife, he's a big guy!
I am very happy for the two of you!!

Jeanne :)

Weather I bath or place a catheter in a 18 yr old male say trauma patient or a 98 yr old with a fractured hip, trust me, it's just another body part to health care workers..;)

You guys and gals will be in for a shock if you ever have a bad accident.

The first thing we're going to do when you get to the ER is cut off all of your clothes.
Then the ER doc will jam his finger up your rear-end to check for blood in the pelvic cavity.
Then the next thing we'll do is take a catheter and insert it in your privates all the way up to your bladder.
Then the wonderful ICU nurses will bathe you once a day.




I decided to reread the book, “Not Even a Hint (http://www.amazon.com/Not-Even-Hint-Guarding-Against/dp/1590521471)” by Joshua Harris. I’m not sure if you’ve ever read that book. I was disappointed that he didn't talk any about male gynecologists in his book. Joshua is a wonderful Christian pastor. He admits that he struggles with lust sometimes. He made a decision that he could no longer go to a certain beach in Florida because many women there were dressed immodestly and he struggled with thoughts. He also made a decision that he could not look at any catalogs that had lingerie in them and that his wife had to look through them. I know for sure that Joshua didn’t think to himself, I am going to that beach to enjoy women. I believe that many Christian men never intend to look at pornography at all to lust, but they choose to install porno filters to prevent themselves from accidentally seeing pornography. Every man is going to struggle with lustful thoughts no matter how strong Christian he is. A male gynecologist is a man and you cannot take “man” out of him. I find it very strange that many people think that male gynecologists don’t ever have lustful thoughts. Look at this example about Joshua. He never saw those women completely naked or examined their private parts and he had some thoughts. How in the world is it possible for a male gynecologist to never have any thoughts when he is between a woman’s legs and looking at her private parts? I know what goes on in a pelvic examination. I think it is strange that people think that male gynecologists are less likely than other men to have lustful thoughts especially when they actually get to see the woman naked and touch her private parts. I heard that male doctors in medical schools are taught to keep those thoughts to themselves. Most doctors don’t “act” on thoughts by going all way, but the Bible is very clear that there should not even be a hint of lust/impurity (Ephesians 5:3). There may be times when a male gynecologist examines a woman who is not attractive or smells terrible, but how is it okay for him to examine her private parts because she is not married to him? I’ve heard this crazy statement: Male gynecologists go to medical schools and they are trained to not have those sexual thoughts. If that was the case, why cannot teachers, pastors, electricians, computer programmers, accountants, firemen, and other men go through schools to train themselves to not have lustful thoughts? They are all men. Dr. Dobson from Focus on Family said that men are visually aroused by naked women’s bodies. I’ve heard this argument: Male gynecologists have seen so many private parts that they don’t lust anymore. If that was true, why do men who look at pornography continue to look at them? They see so many private parts of women. If this was true that they got tired, the men who look at pornography a lot would get tired and stop lusting. I heard that professors in medical schools understand that male doctors are going to lust so they encourage them to just keep those lustful thoughts to themselves. I am sure that so many women have gone to a male gynecologist not realizing how he might be enjoying doing the intimate exams on them and what’s really in his mind.

I am pretty sure that every male gynecologist has had thoughts when they examine women no matter how much self control they may have.

This is just insulting. You apparently have a low opinion of men and don't know the power of the Holy Spirit. I cannot recall a time that I have 'lusted' after an unfortunate female victim that has came into the hospital. It's unethical and I would seriously consider leaving the medical field if I ever experienced those thoughts. I look at them with pity, not lust.




But unfortunately, he ended up giving in to doing some intimate things with women patients later on when he actually started working.

You can't group all men together because of one disgusting pervert.

Question for the OP. If you saw a naked man laying on the side of the road that was beaten, bloody, and robbed, would you offer assistance or would you keep driving because you would see his privates if you stopped.

LOL I hear that! It seemed like everyone and their brother (in Las Vegas) came by to have a look!

Jeanne :lol::lol:
That is hysterical. I remember thinking, "I don't care who looks, just get that thing out of me!!!":lol:

And as we continue the debate the OP was here for four days and hasn't been seen for a month.

And as we continue the debate the OP was here for four days and hasn't been seen for a month.

That always irritates me. We go on and on with each other and the OP doesn't even come back!:lol:
I always want to point that out...glad you did!

The original poster has long gone on to another forum that I frequent.

I won't talk about what other things she is spreading there, since she isn't here to defend herself. She hasn't been here in a long time and I am sure hasn't read much past her last post.

The original poster has long gone on to another forum that I frequent.

I won't talk about what other things she is spreading there, since she isn't here to defend herself. She hasn't been here in a long time and I am sure hasn't read much past her last post.

I've seen a similar thread elsewhere too, with much the same feedback as here.

Them's the breaks I guess...

She has posted the EXACT some thread on at least 3 Christian forums and a couple of medical websites...

I am bumping this thread.

If you have not read it, please take a look at the thread I started Be Ye Holy.... Yea right! (http://bibleforums.org/showthread.php/216137-Be-Ye-Holy....-Yea-right!?highlight=holiness). My desire is not to take issue with anyone's pursuit of holiness, and physical purity is certainly a goal for any believer.

I My earlier post in this thread was directed to the OP, she has long since concluded participation... It appears she wanted to post this and move on. This post is for the benefit of all our members who might read here.

This attitude of 'hyper-purity' can be dangerous.

Consider the effect of this teaching that has as it's subtext 'if a man sees my private parts, God does not love me any more'.

How might this effect;

- the victims of sexual predators?

- the young woman who needs an emergency procedure?

- a husband trying to honor his wife's expectations with a difficult pregnancy?

The reason I am bumping this thread is because this is having a profound impact on my family right now.

My dear Daughter in law is carrying my grandchildren right now. She was raised with this 'false purity' idea.

She attended a local (well known) school associated with a conservative christian college. They taught her that her righteous, and relationship with Christ was based on her conformance to THEIR rules.

She is so sensitive to anyone even helping her to the bathroom that she has severe anxiety right now. The stress is threatening the life of my grandchildren.

I share this so no one who reads this will be without excuse if they choose to inflict this on their children.

This attitude is harmful, and can be dangerous.



Posted in love.....

I find it hard to believe that so many Christians preach that women should dress modestly, but they don't see anything wrong with male gynecologists. Male gynecologists are definitely not morally above other men.

This is one of the most difficult issues most Christians have never thought about because we are taught that we should not question the medical industry and that it's okay for them to do anything. That is insane. God has the same expectations of everyone. Medical professionals are not above us morally.

Let me share my story. I am in my early 30s and still a virgin. I think I saw that something was wrong with male gynecologists around 1987 or1988 (21-22 years ago) when I was just 8 years old. I found out what a male gynecologist was when I was 8 years old and I’m still very shocked that they exist. Yes, my mom had a male gynecologist. Both my sister and I were delivered by a male ob/gyn. My mom actually had a c section with both of us. I questioned her a lot when I was a kid. At that time, she just pretty much ignored me. I didn’t understand because I was told as a kid that my father could not see me any more after a certain age. I didn’t get it how it was different for a strange male doctor. I think that my mom’s answer was something like “It’s different because he’s a doctor”. I didn’t buy my mom’s explanation because I knew that both the doctor and my father are men. They are no different. But over the past several years, she has changed her mind. She has decided she will no longer go to a male gynecologist because of some things I’ve brought attention to her so that’s good news. I see my mom as an innocent victim of the medical industry. I’ve convinced 25 year old sister to not go to a male gynecologist ever.

When I made the commitment to True Love Waits (http://www.lifeway.com/tlw/) as a teenager, I also thought about how I was never going to let another man (including doctor) other than my future husband to have access to certain parts of my body. It will probably be a pleasant surprise to my future husband since he might have never really thought about it. The truth is he was probably delivered by a male gynecologist just like I was since he would probably have been born sometime in the 1970s. I would let him know that I love him too much to let another man other than him have access to certain parts of my body. I am so thankful that God enlightened me on this subject because I get to give my future husband another special gift in addition to my virginity. It’s a priceless gift. I would not even go to a male gynecologist for $1 Million.

I am not against doctors at all, but I believe that God has the same expectations of them as us. I don’t care about the gender of the doctor when I go in for an ear infection or strep throat. I am speaking about private things. I believe that God only intended for women to be gynecologists. The good news is that 80% of ob/gyn residency students are female now.

I know that people often don’t question the medical industry. The truth is medical professionals are not above us morally. God has done a lot of wonderful things through doctors, but I don’t get it how it could be okay for men to do intimate exams on women who are not their wives. There were no intimate exams on women in the bible. I also know that babies were delivered by midwives in the bible. There is nowhere in the Bible that supports male doctors examining and looking at private parts of women who are not their wives. I have always felt like only women belonged to the ob/gyn field. I do know that in 1970 only 5% of the gynecologists were women. But we should not go by our culture because a lot of things in our culture have been wrong. There is not one word that mentions abortion in the bible, but there are several verses that support why abortion is wrong. For instance, abortion is murder. Look at this verse for example about how God feels about the unborn: For YOU created my inmost being; you knit me together in my mother’s womb. I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made; your works are wonderful I know that full well.” Psalm 139: 13-14. Look at Proverbs 6:17. Abortion didn’t exist in the biblical time. The bible preaches against nudity before the opposite sex except for between a husband and a wife. I don’t see anything wrong with seeing naked kids of the opposite sex in a certain age range. It’s not a big deal to see a 2 year old boy or girl running naked because he/she has not sexually matured yet.

I decided to reread the book, “Not Even a Hint (http://www.amazon.com/Not-Even-Hint-Guarding-Against/dp/1590521471)” by Joshua Harris. I’m not sure if you’ve ever read that book. I was disappointed that he didn't talk any about male gynecologists in his book. Joshua is a wonderful Christian pastor. He admits that he struggles with lust sometimes. He made a decision that he could no longer go to a certain beach in Florida because many women there were dressed immodestly and he struggled with thoughts. He also made a decision that he could not look at any catalogs that had lingerie in them and that his wife had to look through them. I know for sure that Joshua didn’t think to himself, I am going to that beach to enjoy women. I believe that many Christian men never intend to look at pornography at all to lust, but they choose to install porno filters to prevent themselves from accidentally seeing pornography. Every man is going to struggle with lustful thoughts no matter how strong Christian he is. A male gynecologist is a man and you cannot take “man” out of him. I find it very strange that many people think that male gynecologists don’t ever have lustful thoughts. Look at this example about Joshua. He never saw those women completely naked or examined their private parts and he had some thoughts. How in the world is it possible for a male gynecologist to never have any thoughts when he is between a woman’s legs and looking at her private parts? I know what goes on in a pelvic examination. I think it is strange that people think that male gynecologists are less likely than other men to have lustful thoughts especially when they actually get to see the woman naked and touch her private parts. I heard that male doctors in medical schools are taught to keep those thoughts to themselves. Most doctors don’t “act” on thoughts by going all way, but the Bible is very clear that there should not even be a hint of lust/impurity (Ephesians 5:3). There may be times when a male gynecologist examines a woman who is not attractive or smells terrible, but how is it okay for him to examine her private parts because she is not married to him? I’ve heard this crazy statement: Male gynecologists go to medical schools and they are trained to not have those sexual thoughts. If that was the case, why cannot teachers, pastors, electricians, computer programmers, accountants, firemen, and other men go through schools to train themselves to not have lustful thoughts? They are all men. Dr. Dobson from Focus on Family said that men are visually aroused by naked women’s bodies. I’ve heard this argument: Male gynecologists have seen so many private parts that they don’t lust anymore. If that was true, why do men who look at pornography continue to look at them? They see so many private parts of women. If this was true that they got tired, the men who look at pornography a lot would get tired and stop lusting. I heard that professors in medical schools understand that male doctors are going to lust so they encourage them to just keep those lustful thoughts to themselves. I am sure that so many women have gone to a male gynecologist not realizing how he might be enjoying doing the intimate exams on them and what’s really in his mind.

The issue of male gynecologist is a very touchy and difficult issue. I have learned so much this year and last year from a group called “How Husbands Feel About GYN Exams (http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/howhusbandsfeel/)”. There are some men in this group whose marriages were hurt because their wives went to a male gynecologist. Some of the men in this group are not even Christians and they see that male gynecologists are not right.

I am not against doctors and medical care at all. But I believe that men have no business being gynecologists. For example, I would not mind a male doctor tending to my knee as long as I was fully clothed. You know what I mean. I was very glad to hear that one male medical student in the “How Husbands Feel About Gyn Exams” talking about how his uncle, a family practice doctor refused to do any pelvic exams on females and that he let a female doctor in his practice handle all of the pelvic exams. I’m very proud of this male family practice doctor. We need more doctors who will stand up for what is right. If I was a female family practice doctor, I would refuse to do intimate examinations on male patients simply because I’m not married to them. I would be glad to treat them for other things that are not personal such as knee problem, diabetes, etc. I really don’t understand how mothers encourage their daughters to go to a male gynecologist, but they are upset if another man digitally penetrates their daughter with his fingers. I know that female patients submit to this, but it was because they were brainwashed that doctors can do anything. I can see how sometimes male gynecologists might not lust when a woman gives birth because I saw a lot of blood in some of the childbirth videos. I’ve heard that sometimes there’s poop from the baby or the lady so that’s gross. I’ve heard this argument from medical professionals: there are some gross things. I can agree with that, but it is still not okay for a male doctor to see the private parts of a woman who he is not married to. I feel like only female medical professionals and the husband of the woman should be there for the childbirth.

Some people say that male gynecologists are not sexual. My big question is how do they have family? If male gynecologists were not sexual, they would never have sex with their wives period.

I read a story of a teenage boy who was 14 years old. He shared a room with his 14 year old twin sister. He was embarrassed, but he said that it was very hard for him to stay pure in thoughts when he saw his sister changing clothes because she was attractive. I am pretty sure that every male gynecologist has had thoughts when they examine women no matter how much self control they may have. They just keep those thoughts to themselves most of the time.

Even if I could be guaranteed that a male gynecologist doesn’t have sexual thoughts, I still believe it is wrong. If it was not wrong, then I guess it must be okay for fathers to see their teenage or adult daughters naked.

In my biology class in high school, some boys giggled when the teacher showed a childbirth video and the lady’s private parts were exposed. What does that tell you?

My heart really goes to the male gynecologist’s wife. It’s sad that he sees so many women naked and touches their private parts. Rubber gloves make no difference. They are just to protect the male gynecologist from getting germs on his hands. The male gynecologist’s wife is not special at all. I am sure that he sees some women that probably have prettier bodies than his wife. I believe that God only intended one woman for each grown adult man to see naked and that’s their wife. The wife should be the only woman the husband should see naked based on common sense and Leviticus 18.

I feel like most women who have gone to male gynecologists are innocent victims of the medical industry. About 95% of women above the age of 45 have been to a male gynecologist at least one time in their life time. I know they set up appointments with a male doctor, but I believe it is because they fell to the cultural blind spot from the previous generation.

One lady that posted about patient modesty said the below paragraph and I agree with it.

The bond between a husband and wife is very special because each has pledged themselves to the other. This bond is strengthened and encouraged by the modesty of the couple. Saving some things to be admired solely by one’s spouse gives a sense of privilege, honor and intimacy. Anytime a person exposes their body to a member of the opposite sex they take away a part of the marriage intimacy and chance weakening the bonds between a husband and wife. This intimacy is further weakened by the encouragement of the medical establishment for women to expect to be examined intimately and for a woman to reveal intimate thoughts to her doctor, regardless of the reason for the visit to the doctor.

I hope more women in my generations will never go to male gynecologists in their whole lives just like me. I am encouraged to read on the Internet that 80% of ob/gyn residency students are female now. Men who want to be doctors should choose another specialty that would not require them to examine teenage or adult women patients intimately. It is certainly possible for a family practice doctor to make the decision he will not do anything gynecological and refer all women to a woman doctor for those things. If I were a family practice doctor, I would make it clearly to all of my male patients that I will not do any intimate male examinations on them and I will refer them to male doctors for those things.

I know of one guy in nursing school who was very upset when he was told that he had to do breast exams on some of female medical students. He ended up not having to do that. But unfortunately, he ended up giving in to doing some intimate things with women patients later on when he actually started working.

:pray::pray::pray::pray::pray::pray::pray::pray::p ray::note::note::note::note::note::note:

I have suffered in silence as a male for 30 years, my wife underwent these intimate examinations by a male doctor, I was beginning to think I was mad with my beliefs, thank goodness someone has the exact same beliefs.

I agree these proceedures should be carried out by lady Doctors and there are many out there.

Because a man dons a white coat it changes nothing, he remains a man, even though doctors deny any feeling for their patients, as a man I know otherwise and it is documented in survey's, as proof.

As time moves forward and men begin to talk about this problem rather than suffering and pretending it did not happen, this intimate examination will have to change in favour of lady Doctors.

The poster of this article is a helper from above !

As a man who has to perform examinations from time to time, I have to ask, what exactly do you think goes on in a man's mind? I am a minister of the gospel AND EMS. Am I a liar too? I promise you, the very last thing that goes through my mind is anything of a sexual nature. So by all means, tell me how you have been victimized my male doctors so bad that you have suffered for years in silence. Also please tell me what you would do in an emergency situation where EMS personnel would have to do an examination.

Professionals are professionals. They are trained rigorously to HELP people.

Seek out medical help from the BEST available PROFESSIONAL - whether they be male or female is completely secondary - maybe even thirdary :-)

If a woman is traumatized because a male physician is trying to save her life, then whomever placed that burden of shame on her is gonna have a whole lot to answer for in the sweet by and by. If a man is traumatized because a physician examined his wife, he needs to get over thinking of his wife as his possession - 'cause that's exactly ALL it is. I can hear it now - "MINE. ALL MINE!!!!!"

Either you value life or you do not. Decide and make a stand.

Holy Guacamole.

I've read most all of the posts in this thread. And here is my opinion. I'm almost 56. After I became a Christian at 33 I "preferred" to have a female doctor. Not for the reasons of modesty or anything like that (even tho I do feel a tad more comfortable with a female doc). My issue was if I am having female problems, a female doctor can more know what I am talking about. Yes, a male doctor has the clinical knowlege and experiences of other female patients but he can't truly know what PMS feels like, etc. Ok, fastward 23 years and now I live in an area with no female gynocologists and very few GPs (the ones there are don't take new patients). So I just have to go with what I have because I'm not going to drive for 8 hours just to see a female doctor. And plus, I'm older and just really don't care as much.

I just can't believe some people think a doctor is going to lust after them. Not to depersonalize the whole situation, but you are just another patient.

Obviously some have replied to PRIVATE's post' having failed to research the problem, look at the facts again.

Obviously its the woman's choice who carries out pelvic examinations Male/Female Doctors, if she is happy fair enough, but remember you allow this because it accepted by many, this does not make the procedure right!

A man is a man' a white coat changes nothing, all men have a sexual desire of a woman's body, nature proves it.

Quote NHS England.

If I need to talk to a sexual health doctor but I don’t want a bloke poking around me, what can I do?

"A lot of men don’t want another man examining them or even talking to them about sex. Some feel the same about women doctors. Most clinics now offer you a choice of a male or female doctor or nurse, although you might have to wait a little longer until the appropriate person for you becomes available."

It also states some women have been traumatised by this procedure carried by men in white coats, who remain a man, which is my main point !!

Quote New Zealand.

A 1993 poll of 400 New Zealand GPs by Alex Thomson found that two-thirds of doctors admitted having sexual feelings for their patients. Four out of five thought sex with a former patient was acceptable and 37% thought dating a current patient was alright. 10% said genital sex was alright in some circumstances.

There has been many Doctors struck off for inappropriate interference of the female genitals.

Muslim men/women do Not allow the intimate examination by male doctors.

Arab women prefer a lady doctor for intimate examinations and so do Hindu's.

Married men who are effected by this procedure must stop burying their heads, stop making excuses, stand up and be counted, this is a very serious ETHICAL issue.

We marry and become one for each other and certain body parts are private to the Christian marriage.

This post is not to make women on the receiving end feel abused, just pointing out they do as others, without doing any research. (TRUST me' being a man I know what I'm talking about).

My advice to married couple's having to expose to this intimate examination, use a lady doctor in future if possible!

pailrider

I am a man. I occasionally have to examine women. Are you saying that I lust after them?

This post is not to make women on the receiving end feel abused, just pointing out they do as others, without doing any research. (TRUST me' being a man I know what I'm talking about).

Trust me. I'm a man too and when it comes to the health of my wife's body I trust those with the medical expertise, whether they have a penis or a vagina.
I care a great deal more for the health of my wife than I do some insane exclusive viewing rights to her sex organs.

If a doctor is going to lust after her in his (or her) own time, then that is on their conscience, not mine.


My advice to married couple's having to expose to this intimate examination, use a lady doctor in future if possible!
And if not?

What happens if the female doctor is a lesbian???

The UK a few years ago' a female lesbian was banned by the courts from practicing in the medical profession.

She was banned because she liked to have sexual relations with woman !!

The answer, she was sacked from her job, for having the same feelings as a man does for a woman, what a joke hey !!

pailrider.

The UK a few years ago' a female lesbian was banned by the courts from practicing in the medical profession.

She was banned because she liked to have sexual relations with woman !!

The answer, she was sacked from her job, for having the same feelings as a man does for a woman, what a joke hey !!

pailrider.

Link to the story?

ATHANASIUS.

What are you trying to say ?? you mentioned the devil ??

Pailrider -

This:

The devil is a better theologian than any of us and is a devil still.
--A.W. Tozer

is Athansius' signature or tag line. It was not said in response to you.

Now - do you have a link for the story you referred to?

Closed. I think this has run it's course. Thanks to all, for your participation.

:)