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Ta-An
Jun 15th 2012, 11:43 AM
What were the names of the two spies send out by Joshua?

Fenris
Jun 15th 2012, 11:55 AM
Bible doesn't say.


Why the sudden interest in this story?

andrew_no_one
Jun 15th 2012, 12:22 PM
Tradition says Caleb and Phinehas, but I don't see any real proof.

Ta-An
Jun 15th 2012, 12:30 PM
Bible doesn't say.


Why the sudden interest in this story?
If I tell you.......

My dear friend, ...

I am full of questions.... and it makes my hair turn white....

Ta-An
Jun 15th 2012, 12:31 PM
Tradition says Caleb and Phinehas, but I don't see any real proof.

And from which tribe was Phineas :hmm:

Fenris
Jun 15th 2012, 12:39 PM
And from which tribe was Phineas :hmm:

Levi.

15 characters.

andrew_no_one
Jun 15th 2012, 12:43 PM
And from which tribe was Phineas :hmm:

Exodus 6:25
Eleazar son of Aaron married one of the daughters of Putiel, and she bore him Phinehas. These were the heads of the Levite families, clan by clan.

Ta-An
Jun 15th 2012, 12:54 PM
Levi.

:hmm: well then if so.....:confused

Okay...changing the question: What is the meaning of Isaih 51:9 Awake, awake, put on strength, O arm of Jehovah, Awake, as `in' days of old, generations of the ages, Art not Thou it that is hewing down Rahab, Piercing a dragon! regarding Rahab

Ta-An
Jun 15th 2012, 12:56 PM
Exodus 6:25
Eleazar son of Aaron married one of the daughters of Putiel, and she bore him Phinehas. These were the heads of the Levite families, clan by clan.

Thank you.... .

andrew_no_one
Jun 15th 2012, 12:57 PM
:hmm: well then if so.....:confused

Okay...changing the question: What is the meaning of Isaih 51:9 Awake, awake, put on strength, O arm of Jehovah, Awake, as `in' days of old, generations of the ages, Art not Thou it that is hewing down Rahab, Piercing a dragon! regarding Rahab


Isn't Rahab Egypt? Am I making things up? Hmmmmm

Ta-An
Jun 15th 2012, 01:07 PM
Isn't Rahab Egypt? Am I making things up? Hmmmmm She lived on the wall of Jericho

andrew_no_one
Jun 15th 2012, 01:13 PM
She lived on the wall of Jericho

Well yes. :) But not in the context of Isaiah 51.

andrew_no_one
Jun 15th 2012, 01:15 PM
Psalm 87:4 (http://bibleforums.org/passage/?search=Psalm+87:4&version=NIV1984)
“I will record Rahab and Babylon among those who acknowledge me— Philistia too, and Tyre, along with Cush — and will say, ‘This one was born in Zion.’”

Psalm 89:10 (http://bibleforums.org/passage/?search=Psalm+89:10&version=NIV1984)
You crushed Rahab like one of the slain; with your strong arm you scattered your enemies.

Isaiah 30:7 (http://bibleforums.org/passage/?search=Isaiah+30:7&version=NIV1984)
to Egypt, whose help is utterly useless. Therefore I call her Rahab the Do-Nothing.

Ta-An
Jun 15th 2012, 01:15 PM
Well yes. :) But not in the context of Isaiah 51. Why not :hmm:

Fenris
Jun 15th 2012, 01:15 PM
:hmm: well then if so.....:confused

Okay...changing the question: What is the meaning of Isaih 51:9 Awake, awake, put on strength, O arm of Jehovah, Awake, as `in' days of old, generations of the ages, Art not Thou it that is hewing down Rahab, Piercing a dragon! regarding Rahab

Rashi says it's talking about Egypt and the תַּנִּין/ dragon or sea monster is Pharaoh.

See Isaiah 30:7 For Egypt helpeth in vain, and to no purpose; therefore have I called her arrogancy that sitteth still. The hebrew for "arrogance" in 30:7 is "Rahab" רַהַב

Fenris
Jun 15th 2012, 01:16 PM
Nice research, Andrew. I can't rep you for it or I would. :)

andrew_no_one
Jun 15th 2012, 01:17 PM
Nice research, Andrew. I can't rep you for it or I would. :)

Your compliment is the finest of all reps. :)

Slug1
Jun 15th 2012, 01:18 PM
Isn't Rahab Egypt? Am I making things up? Hmmmmm


She lived on the wall of Jericho Rahab in the context of Isaiah 51:9... is referring to Egypt, not the person.

Check out Isaiah 30:7 :)

edit: Now that I've continued reading through the thread, I see that Andrew and Fenris touched on this... HOOAH!

Ta-An
Jun 15th 2012, 01:21 PM
Rashi says it's talking about Egypt and the תַּנִּין/ dragon or sea monster is Pharaoh.

See Isaiah 30:7 For Egypt helpeth in vain, and to no purpose; therefore have I called her arrogancy that sitteth still. The hebrew for "arrogance" in 30:7 is "Rahab" רַהַב Rahav?? :hmm:

jayne
Jun 15th 2012, 01:25 PM
I was just looking in Strong's Concordance at this verse you cited and there are two separate "Rahabs". One is the woman we know of in Joshua, Matthew, Hebrews, and James. The other is a word that Strong's said meant "storm or arrogance" and was a poetical term for Egypt.

I looked at a couple of commentaries and one said that since the word there meant "pride (arrogance) that it could be refering to God's cutting down of Pharoah. The other said that since in was mentioned in conjunction with a "serpent" that the cutting down of the pride was about God's defeat of Satan in the Garden.

And don't forget about Psalm 89:10 - "You crushed Rahab like one of the slain; with your strong arm you scattered your enemies." and Psalm 87:4 (where it's clearer that Rahab is referring to a nation, not the woman.) - "I will make mention of Rahab and Babylon to them that know me: behold Philistia, and Tyre, with Ethiopia; this man was born there."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

EDIT: Ah, I see I'm a tad bid late to the party....HA!!

Fenris
Jun 15th 2012, 01:27 PM
This place is just awesome.

Ta-An
Jun 15th 2012, 01:36 PM
So who married Rahab (the one of Jericho)

Fenris
Jun 15th 2012, 01:43 PM
So who married Rahab (the one of Jericho)
Didn't we have that discussion already? :hmm:

Jewish tradition says Joshua.

The NT says Salmon, although I've seen Christians scholars say that it wasn't the same Rahab as the book of Joshua.

Ta-An
Jun 15th 2012, 01:49 PM
Didn't we have that discussion already? :hmm: yeah we did.... Thank you for your patience :hug:


Jewish tradition says Joshua. Then it can't be the Rahab of Jericho....


The NT says Salmon, although I've seen Christians scholars say that it wasn't the same Rahab as the book of Joshua. you see that is why I ask....
There are so many names that mean different people, and same people with differently spelled names... eg. Judah in book of Matthew different translations spells it : Judah, Juda, and others even says Judas :o

Fenris
Jun 15th 2012, 02:11 PM
Some things we may never know.

awestruckchild
Jun 15th 2012, 02:14 PM
Okay, so this is a new one on me....
Holy Spirit washing over me in massive waves at the entire reading of this thread, but....I do not understand what has been talked about in here....
Could you talk some more about what you are thinking Ta-an? All I know is that you are on the right path.

jayne
Jun 15th 2012, 04:46 PM
So who married Rahab (the one of Jericho)

I am not a bible scholar and I do not claim to know everything, but I believe that the Rahab that hid the spies married Salmon and became the great-great-grandmother of King David. I have three reasons for that.

I. The timeline is correct.
Everywhere I look, I see that scholars put the time of the crossing over into the Promised Land anywhere between 1407-1400 B.C. Here’s just an example:

The date for the Exodus and resultant entry into the promised land is fixable by reference to 1 Kings 6:1 – “And it came to pass in the four hundred and eightieth year after the children of Israel were come out of the land of Egypt, in the fourth year of Solomon's reign over Israel, in the month Zif, which is the second month, that he began to build the house of the LORD.” The science of archaeology has fixed the date of the temple to around 961BC and thus the Exodus was thus close to 1441 BC. With 40 years of wilderness wandering, this gives an entry into the promised land of 1401 BC.
If the Rahab from Matthew is the same Rahab from Joshua, then she is Boaz’s mother and Ruth’s second mother-in-law. The book of Ruth begins with “in the time of the Judges”. The book of Judges, according to Bible scholars, begins about 1375 B.C. The famine, described at the beginning of Ruth, according to what I’ve read was around 1305 B.C.
There is time for Rahab to have married Salmon and for a generation to have passed before their son Boaz (who according to the book of Ruth to was much older than Ruth – logically Rahab, his mother would have been dead by the time he met Ruth) to have met and married Ruth.

II: The women in Matthew’s genealogy have a common theme to part of their lives - association, deservedly or not, with former immorality.
Tamar – She was a woman (some say a Canaanite, but the Bible doesn’t say) who was forced to pose as a prostitute to get the attention of her father-in-law, Judah, who had cast her out. Both of his sons that she married (at two different times) died and he superstitiously blamed her. She made the wrong choice, of course, but Judah confessed to have wronged her, took the blame, and declared her "more righteous than I" and never has sexual relations with her again. One of her twin sons is Jesus’ ancestor.
Rahab – She was a Gentile woman who was a prostitute by choice, but a repentant one. The Israelites took her in to live with them and she lived with them all of her days. Her son, Boaz, is Jesus’ ancestor.
Ruth – Her people were Moabites. God said not to intermarry with them in Deuteronomy 7 because their foreign worship of false gods would turn His people’s hearts from Him. (Spiritual prostitution, if you will.) I Kings 11 says that Moabite women were among the wives of Solomon and indeed he because an idolater and his heart was turned away from God. But Ruth was grafted into the Israelite nation, nonetheless, like many other Gentiles were and her son, Obed, is Jesus’ ancestor.
Bathsheba (the wife of Uriah) – She was more than likely a Hittite. Her husband was a Hittite man. She was treated like a prostitute by King David. And after he finished with her, he cast her out and sent her home. Yet after his sin was pointed out, he confessed he brought her into his palace, married her, and their son, Solomon, is Jesus’ ancestor.
Mary – Some say she is the only Jewish woman in this lineage. I can’t say for sure because I can’t say for sure about Tamar. And she found favor with God. But can’t you just imagine what people claimed about her – maybe even called her a whore or a prostitute? People are very cruel. Even her husband, Joseph, initially did not believe her and wanted to cast her aside like an immoral woman. But after he was enlightened, he gladly took her in.

III: Why would God leave out vitally important women like Sarah, Rebekah, and Leah from Matthew’s genealogy and put in an obscure and unknown woman coincidentally named Rahab?

Ta-An
Jun 16th 2012, 04:04 PM
I am not a bible scholar and I do not claim to know everything, but I believe that the Rahab that hid the spies married Salmon and became the great-great-grandmother of King David. I have three reasons for that.

I. The timeline is correct.

Everywhere I look, I see that scholars put the time of the crossing over into the Promised Land anywhere between 1407-1400 B.C. Here’s just an example:
.
If the Rahab from Matthew is the same Rahab from Joshua, then she is Boaz’s mother and Ruth’s second mother-in-law. The book of Ruth begins with “in the time of the Judges”. The book of Judges, according to Bible scholars, begins about 1375 B.C. The famine, described at the beginning of Ruth, according to what I’ve read was around 1305 B.C.
There is time for Rahab to have married Salmon and for a generation to have passed before their son Boaz (who according to the book of Ruth to was much older than Ruth – logically Rahab, his mother would have been dead by the time he met Ruth) to have met and married Ruth.


II: The women in Matthew’s genealogy have a common theme to part of their lives - association, deservedly or not, with former immorality.

Tamar – She was a woman (some say a Canaanite, but the Bible doesn’t say) who was forced to pose as a prostitute to get the attention of her father-in-law, Judah, who had cast her out. Both of his sons that she married (at two different times) died and he superstitiously blamed her. She made the wrong choice, of course, but Judah confessed to have wronged her, took the blame, and declared her "more righteous than I" and never has sexual relations with her again. One of her twin sons is Jesus’ ancestor.
Rahab – She was a Gentile woman who was a prostitute by choice, but a repentant one. The Israelites took her in to live with them and she lived with them all of her days. Her son, Boaz, is Jesus’ ancestor.
Ruth – Her people were Moabites. God said not to intermarry with them in Deuteronomy 7 because their foreign worship of false gods would turn His people’s hearts from Him. (Spiritual prostitution, if you will.) I Kings 11 says that Moabite women were among the wives of Solomon and indeed he because an idolater and his heart was turned away from God. But Ruth was grafted into the Israelite nation, nonetheless, like many other Gentiles were and her son, Obed, is Jesus’ ancestor.
Bathsheba (the wife of Uriah) – She was more than likely a Hittite. Her husband was a Hittite man. She was treated like a prostitute by King David. And after he finished with her, he cast her out and sent her home. Yet after his sin was pointed out, he confessed he brought her into his palace, married her, and their son, Solomon, is Jesus’ ancestor.
Mary – Some say she is the only Jewish woman in this lineage. I can’t say for sure because I can’t say for sure about Tamar. And she found favor with God. But can’t you just imagine what people claimed about her – maybe even called her a whore or a prostitute? People are very cruel. Even her husband, Joseph, initially did not believe her and wanted to cast her aside like an immoral woman. But after he was enlightened, he gladly took her in.

Thank you for this..... unfortunately I have to spread the rep before I can give it to you again.....


III: Why would God leave out vitally important women like Sarah, Rebekah, and Leah from Matthew’s genealogy and put in an obscure and unknown woman coincidentally named Rahab? Maybe to make clear that there is hope for us as Gentiles?? :hmm:

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