Jeffinator
Sep 1st 2008, 09:24 PM
In Matthew 16:28 Jesus is talking to his disciples and says to them:
"Truly I say to you, there are some of those who are standing here who will not taste death until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom.”
Yet Jesus has not come back yet and all those he said this to have died.
Did he not keep his promise??
Literalist-Luke
Sep 2nd 2008, 01:57 AM
In Matthew 16:28 Jesus is talking to his disciples and says to them:
"Truly I say to you, there are some of those who are standing here who will not taste death until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom.”
Yet Jesus has not come back yet and all those he said this to have died.
Did he not keep his promise??At the Mount of Transfiguration, the ones there saw Jesus as He will appear at His 2nd Coming. That was the fulfillment.
markedward
Sep 2nd 2008, 02:56 AM
Recognize the context
Verse 27, Jesus is talking about the Son of Man coming with the angels of the Father. Immediately after He speaks of coming "in His Kingdom" and that this event would take place before some of the people standing right in front of Him had died.
Now, I can't seem to find anything in Christ's speech that indicates that He is changing subjects between verse 27 and verse 28, from the Son of Man coming with the angels for judgment and the Son of Man coming with His kingdom. There is simply nothing in the text that tells us He is speaking of an event far in the future and then suddenly He is switching to speaking of an event only six days in the future.
Examine the claim
Christ is making a prophecy. Unless He was expecting most of His disciples to die within the next six days so that only some of them will be left, His prophecy isn't exactly fitting to the Transfiguration. His prophecy infers that only some of the people standing will leave to see the coming of the Kingdom.
Let's put it this way: even though the Transfiguration was a miraculous event, it still doesn't fit the nature of His prophecy. He implies that only some people will be remaining to live to see the coming of the Kingdom, but within six days, everyone He had spoken to was still alive. Wouldn't He have rather said "all you who are standing here will not taste death" instead of just "some of you who are standing here will not taste death" then if He was prophesying an event that would take place while everyone was still alive?
No, the manner in which He is speaking of the coming of the Kingdom infers that it going to take place more than a week later in time, because He was essentially telling His disciples that only some people would "not taste death" until the coming of the kingdom had taken place.
Read with consistency
In all three of the Synoptic Gospels (Matthew, Mark, Luke), Jesus only ever use the "coming of the Son of Man" (or any variance of those key words: "the Son of Man comes," etc.) phrase when referring to a specific singular event that we know was to take place after His death.
Again, consistency. When Jesus spoke of the "son of man" He always used it as a third-person reference to Himself. We know this because we read it consistently. We never pick a random verse and say "Oh, in this one instance He was speaking of someone other than Himself." Right? Likewise, it makes no sense for us to pick this one verse 16:28 that mentions the "coming of the Son of Man" ("when the Son of Man comes in His kingdom") as an event different from every other instance He prophesied about the Coming of the Son of Man.
Reading in tandem
When reading other verses that Jesus gave about the timing of the Coming of the Son of Man, it fits perfectly with the most natural reading of 16:27-28. In Matthew 13, Jesus prophesies that His disciples, when persecuted, would not be able to go through all of the cities of Israel before the Son of Man came. In Matthew 24, Jesus prophesies that "all these things," which included the Coming of the Son of Man, would take place before His own generation had died out.
Reading these three verses in tandem, in their most natural manners gives us a timeline that is beyond that of His earthly ministry, but before the lifetime of His contemporaries had ceased.
Summary
So, when we...
recognize the context of His prophecy (there is no indication of a subject-change between verses 27 and 28, and the two verses, when taken as referring to one subject, are consistent with each other)
examine the claim of His prophecy (His implication that only some people in front of Him would be alive to see the Coming of the kingdom, as opposed to all of them being alive within the next week)
read with consistency (in all of the three Synoptic gospels, He only ever used the phrasing of "the Son of Man comes" or "the coming of the Son of Man" when referring to a single event that would take place following His resurrection and ascension, never an event that was to take place before His crucifixion)
read in tandem (the few verses Christ gives in regards to the timing of His prophecies are consistent with one another and project a timeframe far later than a mere six days in the future)
Then we can see that He was not prophesying about the Transfiguration. It's simply inconsistent with the rest of His claims.
This may not answer your question directly, Jeffinator, but it can give you a step towards a more accurate answer.
livingword26
Sep 2nd 2008, 03:09 AM
I believe this is talking about pentacost, the coming of the power of His church:
Mar 9:1
(1) And he said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That there be some of them that stand here, which shall not taste of death, till they have seen the kingdom of God come with power.
Luk 9:27
(27) But I tell you of a truth, there be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the kingdom of God.
dan
Sep 2nd 2008, 07:39 AM
In Matthew 16:28 Jesus is talking to his disciples and says to them:
"Truly I say to you, there are some of those who are standing here who will not taste death until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom.”
Yet Jesus has not come back yet and all those he said this to have died.
Did he not keep his promise??
...Do you know that they all died?
Also, Jesus making water into wine and raising Lazarus from the dead don't make a lot of sense, unless Jesus had the power of God.