Love? Just Lust.

[fairyflght]

My parents are in the middle of a stressful divorce. Im a senior in High School and I have a younger brother (14) and a younger sister (12). My dad works a lot so the divorce wasn't hard on any of us at first. I mean we barely noticed when my dad moved out since we hardly saw him before. However, as we have started trying to get into the routine of visiting dad, splitting holidays, and trying to please both parents, its gotten harder and harder. As the oldest child and with an emotionally crazed mom, I feel a lot of the burden on myself. I finally managed to separate myself from the stuff at home with the Lord's help after one year without my dad.
I recently got my first boyfriend. He's a great guy, really sweet, and very understanding. We've been together for two months and he's just said "I love you". I was in total shock. I honestly went into immediate emotional shutdown. I found myself questioning the idea of love. In today's world, divorce is so common! people think nothing of it! I find myself becoming unable to believe in love. Sure there's a Heavenly love; I don't doubt that at all. But a human love?....I just keep thinking that Human Love doesn't exist, just fairy tales.
True Love does not exist; it is merely a myth made by humans in order to make themselves feel good for a short period of time. Love exists only as a byproduct of an initial lust. The lust is not merely a physical attraction but an emotional mental one as well. How can true love exist when a couple can get a divorce after 20 long years of marriage? If the love was truly as deep as true love, they would be able to conquer any obstacle.
How can I get past this? I hate feeling this way, but everywhere I look, I see evidence of heartbreak and divorce and the nonexistence of love in the world. Please, help me! I don't know what to do!:giveup:

[Uriel]

Let me tell you marriage is more than just love it is also a lot of hard work. One of the problems with people today is that they think of divorce as a way out of marriage but if both people go into the marriage with the understanding that divorce is never an option, then things can work. Not that it won't be hard and might not function well sometimes but with some help and maybe some oil from outside help it can work.

My parents got separated almost 12 years ago, never divorced for money reasons. But lived in separate places and still did not get along very well. So I don't have the best experience to look up to but I have made the choice that no matter how bad things get or anything like that I will not divorce my wife. She has the same view. We have friends and a church that will hold us to that.

Real love is not about what I can get out of this or how I feel about this. Love as Christ taught us is about sacrifice. It is what can I do for the one that I love to show that they are one of the most important things in my life. I write all this to try and encourage you that love does exist and that even if we don't have the best examples of it at home we can make vows that we will change the pattern of behavior.

It has taken me a long time to really see what love is. It is not getting flowers for the one I love it is not doing sweet little things that will make her day. It is really and truly giving up my will for her and sacrificing for her. Is it easy? No! Do I always do that? No! Does she always do it for me? No! We are selfish beings that is why it is hard being in love. We have to work at it everyday. People can love each other but not always like each other. Do I always like the woman that I am going to marry? No. Sometimes she does things that make me very mad, but I still love her because I make that conscious effort to put her first instead of myself and I see her do the same thing for me.

So I hope this has helped some it might seem like love is a myth and a mystery; but it really is not. I have had friends who did not believe in marriage and love because his mom had three divorces and it really messed up his ideas of love and marriage. He is 23 and he has been in a relationship for a little over six months and is learning that he might one day be able to see himself marrying someone. Sometimes it takes a while to find the right person to really love. I for instances was seriously thinking of becoming a monk before my wife to be came into my life, then I saw that God had something else planned for me. It might seem like there is a lot of heart break and pain in relationships right now and I hate to say it but that is really what high school is. I know I was there I thought I loved people in high school but I came to learn that it was really not love. Now I did like them and they did make me happy but it was not really love, because I would not have put them first I would not have sacrificed for them. Now that is not to say that some high school relationships don't work because they do, but they are even harder I'd bet. Ok I have rambled enough sorry hope this has been helpful in some way. I just don't want you to give up hope on love.

[Xel'Naga]

My parents are in the middle of a stressful divorce. Im a senior in High School and I have a younger brother (14) and a younger sister (12). My dad works a lot so the divorce wasn't hard on any of us at first. I mean we barely noticed when my dad moved out since we hardly saw him before. However, as we have started trying to get into the routine of visiting dad, splitting holidays, and trying to please both parents, its gotten harder and harder. As the oldest child and with an emotionally crazed mom, I feel a lot of the burden on myself. I finally managed to separate myself from the stuff at home with the Lord's help after one year without my dad.


I recently got my first boyfriend. He's a great guy, really sweet, and very understanding. We've been together for two months and he's just said "I love you". I was in total shock. I honestly went into immediate emotional shutdown. I found myself questioning the idea of love. In today's world, divorce is so common! people think nothing of it! I find myself becoming unable to believe in love. Sure there's a Heavenly love; I don't doubt that at all. But a human love?....I just keep thinking that Human Love doesn't exist, just fairy tales.

True Love does not exist; it is merely a myth made by humans in order to make themselves feel good for a short period of time. Love exists only as a byproduct of an initial lust. The lust is not merely a physical attraction but an emotional mental one as well. How can true love exist when a couple can get a divorce after 20 long years of marriage? If the love was truly as deep as true love, they would be able to conquer any obstacle.
How can I get past this? I hate feeling this way, but everywhere I look, I see evidence of heartbreak and divorce and the nonexistence of love in the world. Please, help me! I don't know what to do!:giveup:
I'm sorry I can't answer from personal experience, I'll have to borrow from others. That's exactly what I'm going to do...

A few months ago I read Ravi Zacharias' Jesus Among Other Gods and in chapter five (Is God the Source of my Suffering? - if you can find the chapter on google books, go read it) he recounts the story of Dr. J. Robertson McQuilkin. McQuilkin was [formerly] the president of Columbia Bible College and Seminary. He was also a noted author and speaker. Anyway. McQuilkin's wife was diagnosed and lived with Alzheimers disease for over twenty years. McQuilkin gave up his presidency and other responsibilities to care for and love his wife*.

McQuilkin wrote a book entitled 'A Promise Kept' where he recounts this portion of his life. In his book he recounts an incident at an airport:
Once our flight was delayed in Atlanta, and we had to wait a couple of hours. Now that's a challenge. Every few minutes, the same questions, the same answers about what we're doing here, and are we going home? And every few minutes we'd take a fast paced walk down the terminal of in earnest search of--what? Muriel had always been a speed walker. I had to job to keep up with her!

An attractive woman sat across from us, working diligently on her computer. Once, when we returned from an excursion, she said something, without looking up from her papters. Since no one spoke to me or at least mumbled in protest of our constant activity, "Pardon?" I asked. "Oh," she said, "I was just asking myself, 'Will I ever find a man to love me like that?'"[1]
Ravi Zacharias commented on the above with the following words:
...In the old English usage of words in the wedding ceremony of the Church of England, each spouse standing before the altar pledged to the other, "With my body, I thee worship." That was a remarkable pledge. It meant that there was an exclusivity and reverence physically expressed that gave a language to that love. Until we understand that kind of love we will never understand why it cannot be programmed ... From worship flows this love.[2]
It's my belief that this sort of love comes only through a faithful, deep and strong relationship with the Lord. It is a belief in and working out of the two greatest commandments, as Jesus said in Matthew 22:36-39, "Teacher, which is the great commandment in the Law?" And He said to him, " 'YOU SHALL LOVE THE LORD YOUR GOD WITH ALL YOUR HEART, AND WITH ALL YOUR SOUL, AND WITH ALL YOUR MIND.' "This is the great and foremost commandment."The second is like it, 'YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF." Husbands are commanded to love their wives as Christ loved the church - how many 'men' today would die for their wives? Probably not so many. Our culture doesn't know what commitment means. It doesn't know what love means and most importantly it's lost all concept of sacredness.

Divorce is a horrible thing and I couldn't imagine having my parents go through one or having to go through one myself. I think with that said, though, the 'good' (if you can call it that) coming out of this is that you're going to question and wonder exactly what it means to say, 'I love you' and to keep loving someone. I think your cynicism is completely expected, however, I'd ask you not to lose your faith in love. God loves us, right? Jesus also loved us? We're commanded to follow Jesus - that's why we're Christians, Christ followers... Followers of Christ. I'm confident we're very much able, ourselves, to display love, not lust.

Usually I don't tell people they really aren't in love. They won't believe me and so it's better just to say, 'Well, if you are in love (and you would know)...' However, in this case I would have to say that chances are, this person doesn't actually love you. It's quite possible he feels very strong emotions for you (it's only been a couple of months so most likely a lot of those emotions are merely infatuation), however I probably wouldn't describe it as love myself.

Lust is wanting things for yourself - it is the opposite of love. From lust I do not believe for one moment that love could be a byproduct. If we're to believe there are myths floating around, we should believe there is a myth which states: "nothing is sacred".

I would say that if you want to get past this you should do a few things. Work out your emotions. Pray and read scripture daily. Surround yourself with friends and those wiser 'old[er]' people. When's the last time you've read the Psalms? David was quite open with God - I think lamenting is something we've lost as a culture; you could probably do with a few good laments.

As always, will be praying ;}

[1] Roberston McQuilkin, A Promise Kept (Wheaton, Ill.: Tyndale House Publishers, Inc., 1998), 18-19.
[2] Ravi Zacharias, Jesus Among other Gods (Nashville, TN.: Thomas Nelson, Inc., 2000), 129.
* Here is a link to a video (http://www.tangle.com/view_video.php?viewkey=228dd8d3ebb664623220&page=1&viewtype=&category=) with a portion of McQuilkins resignation speech, I recommend watching

[fairyflght]

I just can't see how love could exist in this world. A world where there are countless reports of spousal and child abuse, fathers who sexually assault their CHILDREN, where divorce is so common and nonchalant. I KNOW there's a Godly love, but are humans truly capable of an honest love? Husbands and wives cheat on each other, even when they've been together for countless years. I know marriage is hard work and its more than just the initial "love" But is it really love? or merely a superficial lust?

[Xel'Naga]

I just can't see how love could exist in this world. A world where there are countless reports of spousal and child abuse, fathers who sexually assault their CHILDREN, where divorce is so common and nonchalant. I KNOW there's a Godly love, but are humans truly capable of an honest love? Husbands and wives cheat on each other, even when they've been together for countless years. I know marriage is hard work and its more than just the initial "love" But is it really love? or merely a superficial lust?

How do you respond to examples of couples who show the love you doubt we're capable of? (Love is definitely not 'superficial lust,' whatever that is.)

[Tonton]

I just can't see how love could exist in this world. A world where there are countless reports of spousal and child abuse, fathers who sexually assault their CHILDREN, where divorce is so common and nonchalant. I KNOW there's a Godly love, but are humans truly capable of an honest love? Husbands and wives cheat on each other, even when they've been together for countless years. I know marriage is hard work and its more than just the initial "love" But is it really love? or merely a superficial lust?

There is love, created perfectly by God, and then there is Satan - the destroyer of relationships.

The fact that Satan is successful in destroying so many relationships - even of people who were happily together for years - only talks to the "state of the nation" as far as our battle between the spirit and the flesh is concerned.

People use the word "LOVE" of "I LOVE YOU" with different motives. Some with the wrong motives. Even just to get to the "next base" in the relationship - and you are right to be sceptical about that. But Godly love exists. Christ gave His life in love. God gave His Son in love. Jesus wept for His people - in love. The whole new testament is based upon love.

Satan would like us to believe love doesn't exist. Then his work is done.

My advice to you is NEVER to forsake LOVE. Wait for God to show you when you are really loved by someone (it may - or may not - be the one that already told you he loves you), and handle love carefully and biblically. That way it will prevail if it is real love. Also understand the different types of love - the love for a spouse, the love for your children, the love for your neighbour - all Godly love. Satan's version of "love" is spelled "lust" - and he often succeeds in misleading us that that is real love. But that is dead love. You remain thirsty. God's love satisfies forever. Seek that.

If a relationship develops, keep it Godly. Pray together. If one comes to you with a spirit of false love (lust) they will flee the presence of God!

With Godly love,
Anton

[fairyflght]

i see them as fake. Or 'out of convenience' i guess. I don't know maybe fake isn't the riht word. not genuine? It's not that they might go home and fight, I understand that's natural. But there are so many husbands who cheat on wives or vice versa. Or such a lack of desire to be near one another that doesn't always come out in public. I know personally I can put on a great outward appearance when everything's tumbling down. Im just good at doubting what my eyes see. But I haven't had many good examples of a couple who displays love in my life. one aunt has divorced 3 times, another refuses to marry. another constantly complains about how miserable she is in her marriage. both sets of grandparents are divorced and my dad has been cheating on my mom for the past year. I haven't had real examples. I guess I'm pretty scared that as I grow olde and start seriously thinking about marriage, I'll be marrying as others, out of convenience or temporary content. and I'll end up getting a divorce and putting my own children through this turmoil

[DaniHansen]

Love is a choice.

So regardless of what you see other people do, or not do, that choice is entirely yours to make to love that other person you will choose to spend your life with when the time comes.

We cannot use other people's failures as a measuring stick of what is possible, because then we've just given ourselves the excuse to compare ourselves to people who have missed it.

Why don't you instead look to people who have made it, and find out how they did it?

[livingwaters]

Before being born-again, I thought I knew what love was and how it worked....evidently, I didn't, as I have been divorced twice...Now, I am single and will not be married unless God oks it! By that I mean, I now have the knowledge from God's Word as to what love means!!! As mere humans, we cannot do ANYTHING alone!!! But, with God on our side, and us truly seeking HIM at every turn, how can we go wrong? Who can be against us if God is for us!!! Alleluia...Glory to God!!!

Also, being born-again opened my eyes to selfishness!!! Boy, was I that!!!! So, now I pray for direction from my Heavenly Father everyday and in every aspect of my life! I pray daily for HIS wisdom, love for others, compassion and mercy. Otherwise, it won't work! Hope this helps you. Read your Bible, especially those scriptures on love. Look in the back of your Bible and look up love, selfishness, marriage, divorce, lust, and any other issues that you need God's help with.:pp:pp HE will lead your life, if you let HIM!!!!!

God Bless:)

[NotMyOwn]

Love is more than just a verbal expression "I love you", it is evidenced in what two people do for and with each other on a daily basis. When you get to the point when you are willing to give yourself completely to someone without condition then you have truly found love.

Don't let the mistakes of others cloud your view of love, rather rely on Jesus' model of love which is complete and without condition.

[Kharisma]

My parents are in the middle of a stressful divorce. Im a senior in High School and I have a younger brother (14) and a younger sister (12)....I recently got my first boyfriend. He's a great guy, really sweet, and very understanding. We've been together for two months and he's just said "I love you". I was in total shock. I honestly went into immediate emotional shutdown. I found myself questioning the idea of love. In today's world, divorce is so common! people think nothing of it! I find myself becoming unable to believe in love... Love exists only as a byproduct of an initial lust... How can true love exist when a couple can get a divorce after 20 long years of marriage? If the love was truly as deep as true love, they would be able to conquer any obstacle.
How can I get past this? I hate feeling this way, but everywhere I look, I see evidence of heartbreak and divorce and the nonexistence of love in the world. Please, help me! I don't know what to do!:giveup:

God bless you for being so insightful and strong in the midst of such turmoil in your life because of your parents divorcing. Human love does exist but it comes through earthen vessels meaning imperfect people. So that love will always appear imperfect to one person or another because our expectations of love changes as we change with each phase of life. Your boyfriend may really love you from where he is at this point in his life. Will he love you 10 yrs from now, who knows? Are you only going to treat him a certain way ONLY if you can be sure that he will still love you 10 yrs from now or will you treat him with love because that is in your heart? Not doing it just to get something back. As someone said earlier you shouldn't live life based on what other people are doing or have done with love. How will you love? Will you betray your morals based on someone telling you those three words? Will you love based on the hope that you will get back everything you've put in it? Those are conditions used to get something to get something - like an even exchange. But love should be based on God's love. He loves us based on not us being perfect to Him and not ever making a mistake but based on His own faithfulness. Strive to love based on God's love. Love because He loves you and have put LOVE in your heart to share with others. Remember though that LOVE isn't simply about sharing your body with someone based on them saying those words. For some reason many girls and women act as if those three words make them lose their minds and throw all common sense and morals out the window. Then later when it backfires on them they refuse to take responsibility for their own foolish actions which led to their misery. LOVE based simply on emotions and/or physical heat is not love but LUST and as you pointed out that is what many men and women are into but calling it the euphemism "love". Love is doing your best for someone based on what God would have you do. Sometimes the best way to love someone is to walk away from them because you know you are the NOT the right one for them. This is love because it's saving them the pain of it happening when they've invested even more time and emotions in you or have put greater hopes in a relationship with you. There are many examples of human love that we never hear of. It's just that are even more stories of lust mascarading as love that usually self-implodes and of course those are the stories we hear. Usually the person that cries the loudest is the one that compromised the most in their integrity and morality. They paid a big price and got nothing but diminishing returns.

[Xel'Naga]

i see them as fake. Or 'out of convenience' i guess. I don't know maybe fake isn't the riht word. not genuine? It's not that they might go home and fight, I understand that's natural. But there are so many husbands who cheat on wives or vice versa. Or such a lack of desire to be near one another that doesn't always come out in public. I know personally I can put on a great outward appearance when everything's tumbling down.

Fake, not genuine... That's the same thing, isn't it? The thing about relationships is that they don't survive on the superficiality you're suggesting (you're constantly pointing this out in your examples). In public everything may seem fine because they put on the show but in private, that's where the problem is, that's why things fall apart. The way people behave in public is proportional to the state of their private lives. It's sort of like people, the state of our heart (internal) affects our actions towards others and ourselves (external). Acting out of convenience doesn't apply to the example I posted in my first reply - how was this man acting out of convenience? He gave up everything.

The reality of the matter is simply, you'll never be able to explain away the actions of those I'm talking about (as the man in my first post) outside of the fact that he (or these kind of people) truly, genuinely and fully loved his wife. It wasn't lust (or superficial lust - which I still don't understand), it wasn't out of convenience. It's selfless, biblical love as it should be practiced. I agree with you in that in the West, at least, it's extremely rare - the state of the Church (and by that I mean the people who make up the church) is in a bad condition. With all of that said, though, people are still very much capable of love. Otherwise, why would God trust us with His mission?

When it comes down to it I could provide all the examples anyone would ever want. However, it's a matter of you making a decision. All the counter-examples in the world may perhaps be meaningless if you've already made your decision.


Im just good at doubting what my eyes see. But I haven't had many good examples of a couple who displays love in my life. one aunt has divorced 3 times, another refuses to marry. another constantly complains about how miserable she is in her marriage. both sets of grandparents are divorced and my dad has been cheating on my mom for the past year. I haven't had real examples. I guess I'm pretty scared that as I grow olde and start seriously thinking about marriage, I'll be marrying as others, out of convenience or temporary content. and I'll end up getting a divorce and putting my own children through this turmoil

I'm quite 'good at doubting' myself. Naturally I'm a nihilist to a degree that would frighten most people. I'm also highly analytical and skeptical. With that said, however, I'm also reasonable. My grandfather was an abusive alcohol that tried to kill my father and when his wife was diagnosed with Alzheimers he stuck her in a home and forgot about her. One of my uncles is on his third marriage, another on his second. One my aunts is miserable in her marriage, her husband (a pastor) drinks a little too much. I have another aunt who, with her husband, has completely cut herself off from the family. I still have yet another aunt who isn't saved who's husband was an inch from death and like the person in my example above, she put her life on hold - her husband (my uncle) is completely restored - now all that's left is for them to become saved. Perhaps after they stop trying to explain away the miraculous.

I've had horrible examples of love in my life and I've had good examples of love in my life (my parents being one of those examples). I could look to the bad and decide love does not exist, that all the good love I see is merely coincidental, convenient or lust, or I can decide that to understand the reality of bad love I must also know what good love is, both as a concept and in practice.

You know what love isn't, you don't have to fall into the same traps as the people you know - why not make sure of that? Start in God's word.

[DandyAndy]

I don't know if you've been able to find more about love towards human or how things have been with you and your family. but i can imagine that it's been a tough couple months since you've posted this.

i'm not here to give you any answers that would "lighten the load" but i mean...all i can do would be to just share my thoughts and my experiences and what i've come to know at this point in my life.


i'm still young. i'm a rising junior in college but i disagree with what you say. that it's just impossible to see eros love out there in the world.

Yes, love shown from God is known. As well as brotherly love. And I understand that romantic love is hard to accept and acknowledge but would God really say that there is such a thing as love towards humans if there wasn't? would God allow marriage if it meant it'd end in tragedy for us?


I don't believe that God is a twisted God of any kind but that He does and wants the best for us and the way I've come to know this is through my own dad.

Like you, my dad doesn't really spend much time with the family, he's always working but I know that he's working for my sake. for my brothers sake and for my moms sake. Even though we're going through a real rough patch (my parents are talking of divorce) I can still see my dad doing his best for me. When i got my drivers license, he wanted to buy me a Lexus for my first car. unbelievable right? I was against the idea. I still am although I've been driving it for a couple years now but I came to realize if it were my kid...wouldn't i want the same? I'd want my kid to have the best. why would I give my son, whom i love so much, a second rate thing?

and in that same sense, I asked myself...why would God, who loves us SO MUCH that he sent his one and only son (john 3:16)... just so we could get second rate things. Wouldn't God want to give us the best of the best? I always feel as though God is giving me more and more each and every day and I can't help but thank Him each and every day.


By learning that, I came to learn that Love does exist. If love weren't to exist, wouldn't God mention something about that in the bible? he clearly says to NOT LUST multiple times in the Bible but he never says "Do not Love". He tells us many times in different contexts to love... to love Him, our brothers and sisters, friends, families, people we don't know, strangers, people who curse us, everybody. including our significant other. (this one i came to the conclusion by him talking of marriage. by allowing marriage. Paul states how marriage is such a blessing and a great gift given to us by God) so I believe in love. I believe that out there, millions upon millions of people are experiencing true love each and every day.


I can completely understand when you say you feel as if theres just no love that you can see. I've been like that for a long time. but now i'm beginning to see it more and more when i meet new people. I see the way they treat their wives/husbands and it just makes my heart melt knowing that there are people out there, that there are couples out there who built their relationship upon God and that they search for God together and build each other up. That's what i believe Love is. But then again, I believe that Love towards each other in a romantic sense can't be defined in one way. As God created all people differently, I like to think that this Eros love is different based on our personalities as well but that in the end, it should all revolve around God.

Sorry to drag, I just like to type alot when I'm tired :) I've been unable to sleep all day because my pastor was sent to the hospital. He's ok now, but he had a potassium deficiency that caused him to be extremely weak and unable to move. But yea, I mean, I really hope you comment back on this forum or through a PM or something and just let us know how you're doing.

[My_King]

Maybe it's a question of what love "is."

Some people forget that love is actually an act of GIVING to the other person. Love is not all about "me" or what I "get out of it." It's all about what I "give to the other" as commanded by God. That's real love. And that's where a marriage is at it's best.

However, human beings are horribly selfish in nature and it's only with God's direct contact within the marriage can one truly always look to HIM to have instructions on how to truly love their husband / wife.

Marriage, overall - is not an easy road to take. It's hard work, a lot of sacrifice, and a lot of GIVING. But it's also one of the most beautiful joys in this world that God places us in..... God loves us, He wouldn't design a Holy Institution that was meant to harm us...although human beings may pervert the program and harm others...it was not God's intent.

[fairyflght]

Thank you all for your replies and support! The reassurance has truly helped me to at least slide away from my constant doubt. I still am, I guess at this point, scared of what God has for me in the future and scared that I won't be patient enough. But that's something that can only be resolved through time and especially prayer. Thank you for helping me through this tough struggle! I am doing a lot better and am able to see the world through a different light! Your insight has truly benefited me. Thank you for sharing your wisdom!

[bagofseed]

i see them as fake. Or 'out of convenience' i guess. I don't know maybe fake isn't the riht word. not genuine? It's not that they might go home and fight, I understand that's natural. But there are so many husbands who cheat on wives or vice versa. Or such a lack of desire to be near one another that doesn't always come out in public. I know personally I can put on a great outward appearance when everything's tumbling down. Im just good at doubting what my eyes see. But I haven't had many good examples of a couple who displays love in my life. one aunt has divorced 3 times, another refuses to marry. another constantly complains about how miserable she is in her marriage. both sets of grandparents are divorced and my dad has been cheating on my mom for the past year. I haven't had real examples. I guess I'm pretty scared that as I grow olde and start seriously thinking about marriage, I'll be marrying as others, out of convenience or temporary content. and I'll end up getting a divorce and putting my own children through this turmoil
One trick, be whole hearted.
Look for someone who is also.

What ever you are be the same on the outside as the inside, same in private as public.

If you are like this you will find what you have is real relationships.
Both with God and with people.

Of course you may come to the truth that you are a selfish jerk, but it's all good God changes people who are humble and honest and draw near to Him through Jesus.