Dividing the Land

[mlaw31]

Shalom everyone,
First I want to introduce myself, and elucidate my response to the question are you a Christian. I do not consider myself to be a Christian; I am a Hebrew Israelite. I did read the definition given of a Christian, but I unlike most Christians do not celebrate the holidays that Christians do and I adhere to the biblical instruction given in the Torah (God’s teaching and instruction); however, I do believe that Yeshua (Jesus) is the messiah, and I of course believe in one God. Hear O Israel the Lord our God the Lord is one.
My question to all of you is in regards to current affairs. Forgive me if this has previously been discussed, I am new to this site. The question at hand: How do you feel about dividing the land of Israel? I am pro-Israel and against the division of the land; regardless of the promises of peace. How do you feel???

[Ayala]

Welcome my friend. Before I answer your question, I would like to say that the celebration of any certain holiday has zero to do with being a Christian. A Christian is one who believes Yeshua to be the Messiah of mankind, who died for our sins and raised from the dead. If you stand by that, I would most definitely say that you are indeed a Christian.

As for your question, I believe that the land of Israel belongs to Israel...pretty simple lol. The things that are passing, are passing as God always knew they would...there is purpose behind everything.

[matthew94]

Hello

Though you do not like the term 'Christian,' you expressed faith that Jesus is the Messiah and, so I'll assume, that you are a fellow believer and 'in Christ'

Personally, I don't see the geogaphical land you're referring to as very significant in God's plans. I believe the land promises of the Old Covenant were a shadow of the fact that the meek will inherit the earth. We who have believed enter the rest of the promised land in Christ.

The contemporary struggle for the land is a political struggle in my view. We should be on the side of justice.

[quiet dove]

The question at hand: How do you feel about dividing the land of Israel? I am pro-Israel and against the division of the land; regardless of the promises of peace. How do you feel???

I agree with you, the land should not be divided. I think it nothing short of miraculous that Israel in 1948 became a nation again. I believe that Jerusalem belongs to God and need not be messed with if one has any brains at all. I also believe that the wars won by Israel against such odds are further proof of how God feels about the land of Israel and the Israelites. So no, I do not think the land should be divided for peace. I do not really believe that the dividing of the land will bring true peace.

[TEITZY]

Joel 3:2 I will also gather all nations, And bring them down to the Valley of Jehoshaphat; And I will enter into judgment with them there On account of My people, My heritage Israel, Whom they have scattered among the nations; They have also divided up My land.

Anyone who divides the land of Israel is under God's judgment. The only division God has ever sanctioned is the division among the tribes of Israel. Above, Joel describes the return of the Messiah to judge the nations and part of the basis of this judgment on the Gentile nations is because of the dividing of the land. Note, that God says that it is "My land", which is why messing with it is such serious business.

Cheers
Leigh

[danield]

The question at hand: How do you feel about dividing the land of Israel? I am pro-Israel and against the division of the land; regardless of the promises of peace. How do you feel???

I think it is horrible for US to encourage Israel to divide its land. I do not understand why our Government is commited to running the world, and I am shocked that they are pressuring Israel into giving its land away. It is not like we don't have enough problems here for us to worry about. But as for scripture, we are not to divide a land that God has given to Israel as stated many times in the old testiment. I am just glad we have an election coming up soon.

[Nihil Obstat]

This topic is very close to my heart (because it is very close to God's heart). God made covenant not just with the people of Israel, but with the very land itself! God chose that land much in the same way that He chose that people. The land is promised to the people under certain conditions, and when they disobey God or play the harlot, He raises up a foreign nation to judge the Israelites. He most often raises up a foreign nation that is already ripe for judgment - if they keep God's commandments, they receive a blessing; if they transgress by crossing the line and bringing more judgment upon the Israelites than they were brought up to do, they are in turn destroyed. This is a sobering truth, as the last time America divided Israel's land, God sent hurricane Katrina. The nation of America stands in need of divine correction, as we have the cries of 50 million aborted babies crying out from the ground. But Israel has broken covenant with God as well, having made covenant with abortion too (not to mention, they have greatly denied Jesus as their Messiah). Seems that God could be using America, who is ready for chastisement, to bring God's judgment upon His people and land Israel, who are also in need of His correction. So how do I feel about dividing the land in Israel? I'll answer that with a question: Is Israel in need of His judgment? Because the Scriptures are plain - when Israel loses their land, or when Israel is enslaved, they turn back to God, and He hears them! - Lk.11

[My heart's Desire]

I agree with you, the land should not be divided. I think it nothing short of miraculous that Israel in 1948 became a nation again. I believe that Jerusalem belongs to God and need not be messed with if one has any brains at all. I also believe that the wars won by Israel against such odds are further proof of how God feels about the land of Israel and the Israelites. So no, I do not think the land should be divided for peace. I do not really believe that the dividing of the land will bring true peace.

Me too. Complete agreement!

[mlaw31]

Thanks for your post, I am glad to see you agree the land has and always will belong to God. I did not mean to imply that celebrating a certain holiday makes you a Christian, but it is a fact that as a Christian you believe certain things some of which the Christian faith can not agree on, and others that are held very dear. Celebrating certain holidays might not make you a Christian but they are certainly included in Christian behavior. Being a Christian or part of any religious group is more than confession, it is a lifestyle.

[ImmenseDisciple]

Being a Christian or part of any religious group is more than confession, it is a lifestyle.

Not trying to start a discussion, because we're not really allowed to discuss on this part of the board but - to me being a Christian isn't really a lifestyle. To know Christ is to truly be alive, knowing Him defines and changes who you are. And that's the full extent of my definition of Christianity, really - one who knows Christ. Any religion without Christ though, I agree, is just a lifestyle. Very much on a par with, say, being a fan of fusion jazz

[Ayala]

Celebrating certain holidays might not make you a Christian but they are certainly included in Christian behavior. Being a Christian or part of any religious group is more than confession, it is a lifestyle.

I'd just like to say that I don't consider myself to be "religious" or apart of any said "religious group"...rather I live with an eternal relationship. Religion is man-made...Love is of God.

But anyways, I wouldn't define Christian behavior as such. And holidays can differ from place to place. My being a Christian is simply the acknowledgement of being a sinner in need of Christ's saving grace and living according to His will. And my lifestyle is soley a reflection of that truth. But like ID said, if we wanna discuss this further, we can talk about it somewhere else...for now, this is your welcoming thread.

[quiet dove]

Thanks for your post, I am glad to see you agree the land has and always will belong to God. I did not mean to imply that celebrating a certain holiday makes you a Christian, but it is a fact that as a Christian you believe certain things some of which the Christian faith can not agree on, and others that are held very dear. Celebrating certain holidays might not make you a Christian but they are certainly included in Christian behavior. Being a Christian or part of any religious group is more than confession, it is a lifestyle.

I do not consider being a Christian a lifestyle. It is more than just confession also, there must be true faith/belief behind the confession. A lot of people confess to be Christians and do not even know what it means to be so. That is evident by the different religious organizations that claim to be Christians but do not teach the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

Being a Christian is: being in Christ Jesus;
believing in His death and resurrection,
believing He is the Son of God-the promised Messiah,
believing that He is the only name under heaven in which a man can be saved,
believing salvation is mercy and grace and not something a man can earn,
believing that in Christ Jesus I am saved, covered by His atoning sacrifice.

So this is not a lifestyle, living a life in Him is walking in the Spirit and not in the flesh. Much more than a lifestyle or confession (if only the mouth, must be in the heart also)

Any "religion" that teaches anything other than the Gospel of Jesus Christ is not Christian, they may call themselves Christian but if they believe or teach any other Gospel than that of Jesus Christ, they are not Christian and they are not saved. There can be no disagreement here and still be a Christian, a man saved by Grace through Jesus Christ.

Other issues in regards to interpretation and understanding the Bible can and do have disagreement, like end time events for example. But when it comes to -Jesus Christ, salvation, man, there can be no disagreement and still be a Christian.

[Mograce2U]

(Isa 65:9 KJV) And I will bring forth a seed out of Jacob, and out of Judah an inheritor of my mountains: and mine elect shall inherit it, and my servants shall dwell there.

(Mat 21:37-41 KJV) But last of all he sent unto them his son, saying, They will reverence my son. {38} But when the husbandmen saw the son, they said among themselves, This is the heir; come, let us kill him, and let us seize on his inheritance. {39} And they caught him, and cast him out of the vineyard, and slew him. {40} When the lord therefore of the vineyard cometh, what will he do unto those husbandmen? {41} They say unto him, He will miserably destroy those wicked men, and will let out his vineyard unto other husbandmen, which shall render him the fruits in their seasons.

(John 7:42 KJV) Hath not the scripture said, That Christ cometh of the seed of David, and out of the town of Bethlehem, where David was?

(Acts 3:25-26 KJV) Ye are the children of the prophets, and of the covenant which God made with our fathers, saying unto Abraham, And in thy seed shall all the kindreds of the earth be blessed. {26} Unto you first God, having raised up his Son Jesus, sent him to bless you, in turning away every one of you from his iniquities.

(Rom 1:3-6 KJV) Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh; {4} And declared to be the Son of God with power, according to the spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead: {5} By whom we have received grace and apostleship, for obedience to the faith among all nations, for his name: {6} Among whom are ye also the called of Jesus Christ:

(Gal 3:16 KJV) Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

(Gal 3:29 KJV) And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

(Heb 1:1-4 KJV) God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets, {2} Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds; {3} Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high; {4} Being made so much better than the angels, as he hath by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they.

Since Jesus has paid the price to redeem the land and its people, He is the Heir to whom it belongs. If the Arabs were to take control of the land and sold it off to the highest bidder, would that supercede Christ's claim? You cannot sell what does not belong to you in the first place. And it does not matter what name you call yourself by - if you are not His, then you have no authority one way or the other. Which makes your unlawful actions void in the end and of no consequence.

[mlaw31]

It seems people have gotten away from the question at hand and the reason behind this thread Israel. This will be the last response I make to Christiananity being a life style. life·style· (līf′stīl′)
noun
the consistent, integrated way of life of an individual as typified by his or her manner, attitudes, possessions, etc.
Im sorry, I thought the Christian faith taught a way of life, manner and attitude. Look for my thread titled Lifestyle. this seems to be a desirable topic.

[Revinius]

Christians believe they are the new israel and i doubt God relies on human designations of countries. Jewish birthright is only relevant in regards to the responsibility placed upon them as the original bearers of Gods light to the world. They shirked that responsibility leading to Christs rescue mission.