Once saved always saved....

[9Marksfan]

I believe I am qualified for it right now.

And what has qualified you for it?

One thing I am certain of is God's judgment. It will always be just...always.

Oh I'm certain of it too - if God were truly JUST, then NONE of us would stand - it's God's MERCY in Christ that we need - are you certain of THAT?!?

Those who seek glory and honor will receive eternal life and those that don't won't.

But we don't EARN it! It's the gracious outworking of all that GOD has worked in and through believers! "Without me you can do NOTHING" says King Jesus.

1. krima (κρίμα, 2917) denotes (a) “the sentence pronounced, a verdict, a condemnation, the decision resulting from an investigation,” e.g., Mark 12:40; Luke 23:40; 1 Tim. 3:6; Jude 4; (b) “the process of judgment leading to a decision,” 1 Pet. 4:17 (“judgment”)

OK - what's your understanding of the difference between krima and krisis?

House of God is exactly what it is. You could say that it is the "temple" of the body. Since Peter is speaking of suffering.

Is it not the visible church, made up of sheep and goats, wise and foolish builders/virgins, good and bad fish/servants, wheat and tares?

[9Marksfan]

I didn't want you to get upset so I put you first!

OK - but biblically I'd put the last option second!!!!

[Buck shot]

Originally Posted by 2 Peter 2:20
So I guess we need to make another category...

POTS
OSAS
NOSAS
NYOSASBOD...Not yet once saved always saved but one day

I like the order! It's in order of how biblical each doctrine is!

[Buck shot]

Now tell some of the NOSAS'ers to start loving, because:
1Co 13:8 Love never fails!!

1Co 13:4 Love is patient, love is kind; love does not envy; love does not boast, is not puffed up;
1Co 13:5 does not behave disgracefully, does not seek its own, is not provoked to anger, thinks no evil;
1Co 13:6 does not rejoice over unrighteousness, but rejoices with the truth;
1Co 13:7 bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.

1Co 13:8 Love never fails.

And that:

Rom 8:28 And we know that all things work together for good to those who love God, to those who are called according to His purpose.

If we love Him, it will work out that we will always love Him, or this verse fails.

Okay ya'll, START LOVING!


Can you image what would happen if this really happened? Folks stopped sinning and started loving their neigbors...REVIVAL!

[Buck shot]

See the definition of the Greek...

1) can be sin
2) I don't think is sin
3) same as 2

But hey I have been known to be wrong! Don't tell Buckshot...He thinks I'm perfect.

Brother you have got to be close. Climb up here on this fence with me!

[2 Peter 2:20]

OK - but biblically I'd put the last option second!!!!

That is pretty close to POTS!

[Partaker of Christ]

But that's not a finished salvation that we receive by faith! That's a partial salvation that takes our faith to complete it! Unbelief HAS to be atoned for by Christ - we DON'T atone for it by believing!

I thought that is what I said

[2 Peter 2:20]

Brother you have got to be close. Climb up here on this fence with me!

I assume you mean close to perfect... You either need glasses or the ones you are wearing are dirty!
Pete and Repeat settin' on a fence. Pete fell off "Who's left?"

[Buck shot]

Read the Book of Job.

If Job's salvation had been assured, there would have been no need for this book in the Bible.

I disagree on this point, if Job had lost his salvation there would have been no need for the book. The book of Job is telling me that God trusted Job not to turn from Him so much that he allowed Satan to blast Job with everything he had. Job is a book of trust from God. We can indure!

If you look closely, you will see that the passages that seemingly guarantee salvation and those that clearly state that salvation can be rejected, contain one common element...faith.

YES, by faith! Whichever side of the fence!

In those that seemingly say one is guaranteed salvation (OSAS), we see throughout them that the guarantee is predicated upon our true belief and faith in Jesus Christ.
In those that say there is no further sacrifice to those who were once saved and had received the gift of salvation if they reject the Holy Spirit and they truly disown God.
Where is the common element here?
In both cases, salvation is assured if one remains faithful to God, and endures to the end of their life.

YES, I see another fence walker coming!

In other words, the OSAS belief is true, as long as we want it to be.
The NOSAS belief is just as true, if one no longer desires that it be true, and they knowingly reject their faith.
The common element here is that ones faith must never waiver.

The Book of Job is the classic example of someone remaining faithful throughout extreme personal adversity.
When taken in the entire context of the Bible, Job's salvation was at stake throughout his test, and if he had rejected it because of everything that was happening in his life, he would have done so with full knowledge of the cost, he would have known that God was real, but in his dispair, he would not have cared, and his salvation would have been forfeit...so much for OSAS, no matter what.

No, get back up on this fence! Your almost there, Job's salvation was never at stake, God knew Job would not forfeit his faith because He's God, so he let the Satan put his hands where his mouth was and proved we can be secured by faith.

The temptation to reject God when faced with adversity is sinister and very real.

The story that the truly saved should take away from the Book of Job is this;
No matter what happens in our life, our faith must remain and when it does, so shall our salvation.
May God Bless

There you go! Good finally!

[2 Peter 2:20]

And what has qualified you for it?

Believing in my heart and confessing with my mouth that Jesus is Lord of my life, set me on the path.

Oh I'm certain of it too - if God were truly JUST, then NONE of us would stand - it's God's MERCY in Christ that we need - are you certain of THAT?!?

Yes, all condemned without Christ

No other name given...

But we don't EARN it! It's the gracious outworking of all that GOD has worked in and through believers! "Without me you can do NOTHING" says King Jesus.

Agreed. I have never thought that I earned it but because I accepted Christ I will be judged more strict because of that. Now I have the Spirit that leads me and guides me and I have no excuse IF I sin.
[/color]

OK - what's your understanding of the difference between krima and krisis?

I'll get back to you on this one...my Bible software is on my home computer.

Is it not the visible church, made up of sheep and goats, wise and foolish builders/virgins, good and bad fish/servants, wheat and tares?

I think it is speaking of the "Don't you know that your body is the temple of God". I see in this passage the suffering of the physical body and if their suffering was bad and they are Christians how bad will it be in the end for the ungodly and the sinner. There suffering will be far worse in comparison!

[My heart's Desire]

I am certain that if I listen to the Spirit, am led by the Spirit and do not grieve or quench it I will receive eternal life. At the same time I am certain that if I don't do these things then I will stand condemned on that day. The only thing that is certain is what God says and I know John 10:28 but the Bible didn't stop there. I can't take this one passage and throw out the dozens of other passages that Paul, Peter, James, and even John wrote.

Galatians
19The acts of the sinful nature are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; 20idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.

Romans
6God "will give to each person according to what he has done." 7To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life. 8But for those who are self-seeking and who reject the truth and follow evil, there will be wrath and anger. 9There will be trouble and distress for every human being who does evil: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile; 10but glory, honor and peace for everyone who does good: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile. 11For God does not show favoritism.

These things are for certain.

Yes, and God will give to each lost person according to what HE HAS DONE (works). Only those who are in Christ can do good. As far as truth, Jesus is truth. He is the Way the Truth and the Life. So those who reject truth (Jesus) are lost and do follow evil and have wrath and anger.

[My heart's Desire]

I saw an interesting sign in front of a church yesterday. It said, Those who are almost saved are totally lost. Can't give credit because the sign didn't give credit.

[2 Peter 2:20]

Yes, and God will give to each lost person according to what HE HAS DONE (works). Only those who are in Christ can do good. As far as truth, Jesus is truth. He is the Way the Truth and the Life. So those who reject truth (Jesus) are lost and do follow evil and have wrath and anger.

The only difference is I think a true (for lack of a better word) believer can accept the truth and then one day down the road reject/walk away from it.

This can be done by grieving and quenching the Spirit that lives in us. And we both know that is a scriptural statement and not a doctrinal statement.

You think that can't happen.

[2 Peter 2:20]

I saw an interesting sign in front of a church yesterday. It said, Those who are almost saved are totally lost. Can't give credit because the sign didn't give credit.

In the end you will either be totally lost or totally saved. But it is not until the end that it is ultimately determined.

There is no riding the fence...Buckshot!

[Buck shot]

I assume you mean close to perfect... You either need glasses or the ones you are wearing are dirty!
Pete and Repeat settin' on a fence. Pete fell off "Who's left?"

Yes, I was talkin about how close to perfect you are! (Ken's guy just showed up)