Jesus says no to war!

[LaidDownHisLIfe]

1]they do not read the whole thread
2]they refuse to accept the truth

all one can do is quote it over and over again

until it sinks in.

Jesus said it.so just get on and do it!
stop arguing with Him.

He said:"love your enemies"
[this may be foolish to those who are perishing]

so do it, and stop trying to justify war with foolish arguments

[jewel4Christ]

OK, I just wanted to make sure cause "we" and I'm speaking for American soldiers, don't war against "innocent blood". Our soldiers war against those that would kill you just because you're not "them".

It's nice you pulled scripture from the OT where God ordered His servants to kill an entire city of men, women, children and even the livestock and then told His servants to leave all treasure. Then when that treasure was stolen the entire family of the man who took the treasure was killed to include the livestock this man owned.

Were any of these people who didn't even lift a finger against Joshua innocent?

So, when innocent people are killed due to the effects of wars today/ you know they now call it colateral damage, they are not innocent?

As for the other stuff....it must be understood in light of the time then. Not in light of what has been revealed to us now.

Mixing old and new covenants is also part of the apostacy.

peaceandlove,

janet

[ProjectPeter]

That which the Lord dictates. He alone knows whom is and whom is not innocent. WE DO NOT.

There is this huge conspiracy in the land....men thinking they are god.

Haven't you heard?

peaceandlove,

janet

Gotta be honest Janet... don't speak your super secret code language. That could mean a whole bunch of different things to a lot of different people.

Tell me Janet... do you think God still uses man to kill another?

[jewel4Christ]

Um... Actually he wasn't allowed to build it because he shed so much blood. He was a man of war. That did not change the fact though that David was still a man after God's own heart and God was pleased with him.

True...but, that does not mean that we call "evil" good, does it?

Woe unto those whom call evil good...we all sin. We all have our faults, but, the day we begin to call our sins "good" is the day we are going to be cut off...most sins are done in ignorance, though...so, God takes that into consideration..once it is brought to light, He expects more.

peaceandlove,

janet

[jewel4Christ]

Gotta be honest Janet... don't speak your super secret code language. That could mean a whole bunch of different things to a lot of different people.

Tell me Janet... do you think God still uses man to kill another?

Secret code language? LOL....that is funny.....

Yes, I believe God STILL uses man to kill others. HE is going to use the beast, for example. That is why we, as christians had better come out of the spirit of this world, before we find ourselves being used by God as part of the beast.

Tell me, do you believe the beast is a godly entity?

peaceandlove,

janet

[ProjectPeter]

True...but, that does not mean that we call "evil" good, does it?

Woe unto those whom call evil good...we all sin. We all have our faults, but, the day we begin to call our sins "good" is the day we are going to be cut off...most sins are done in ignorance, though...so, God takes that into consideration..once it is brought to light, He expects more.

peaceandlove,

janet

You are calling it evil but then if God ordered it then you are saying God ordered David to commit evil. You keep tossing out all sorts of Scripture trying to make killing evil and yet there is no such thing written Scripturally. If killing was evil then God ordered evil to be followed.

Take for example this:

Genesis 9:1 *And God blessed Noah and his sons and said to them, "Be fruitful and multiply, and fill the earth.
2 *"And the fear of you and the terror of you shall be on every beast of the earth and on every bird of the sky; with everything that creeps on the ground, and all the fish of the sea, into your hand they are given.
3 *"Every moving thing that is alive shall be food for you; I give all to you, as I gave the green plant.
4 *"Only you shall not eat flesh with its life, that is, its blood.
5 *"And surely I will require your lifeblood; from every beast I will require it. And from every man, from every man's brother I will require the life of man.
6 *"Whoever sheds man's blood, By man his blood shall be shed, For in the image of God He made man.


Now... was God ordering Noah to follow the way of evil?

[ProjectPeter]

Secret code language? LOL....that is funny.....

Yes, I believe God STILL uses man to kill others. HE is going to use the beast, for example. That is why we, as christians had better come out of the spirit of this world, before we find ourselves being used by God as part of the beast.

Tell me, do you believe the beast is a godly entity?

peaceandlove,

janet

Okay... by beast I assume you mean the AntiChrist?

[Slug1]

So, when innocent people are killed due to the effects of wars today/ you know they now call it colateral damage, they are not innocent?

As for the other stuff....it must be understood in light of the time then. Not in light of what has been revealed to us now.

Mixing old and new covenants is also part of the apostacy.

peaceandlove,

janet

I did not murder them which is what God has told us is a sin, not killing. Otherwise we have all been murdering even when God ordered it... does not make sense.

I can say "I" because I have killed in this capacity and it is a terrible part of war. I did not hold anything sinful in my heart. I have lived it, I have fought a few wars and God not once made it known I was not in His will.

Killing needs to be done, it's a tool... has a purpose... that God uses to see His will done here on earth. Who is to do this for Him? Non-Christians?

[fewarechosen]

OK, I just wanted to make sure cause "we" and I'm speaking for American soldiers, don't war against "innocent blood". Our soldiers war against those that would kill you just because you're not "them".

It's nice you pulled scripture from the OT where God ordered His servants to kill an entire city of men, women, children and even the livestock and then told His servants to leave all treasure. Then when that treasure was stolen the entire family of the man who took the treasure was killed to include the livestock this man owned.

Were any of these people who didn't even lift a finger against Joshua innocent?

now i have a long family line of people in the military and lots of friends, my uncles and grandfather , have purple hearts and what not from ww2 and others.

so when you say

"Our soldiers war against those that would kill you just because you're not "them"."

i say those who seek to kill me cant kill me till god sees fit. so any war you wage is pointless to me and has nothing to do with my protection.

you make it sound like god came to our president and said go wage war. david made known who his orders came from to his people.

now soldiers dont think they war against innocent blood, but make no mistake they shed it.

when a soldier fires a bullet and it strays through a building and hits a 3 year old in the face -- that soldier just shed innocent blood.

it would be better that i got shot in the face than for me to cause that to a 3 year old.

when a bomb strays and kills a family that has no idea why there is war going on , they shed innocent blood.

that is harsh truth, that is often looked away from and brushed aside as a casualty of war.

now those who are chosen in due time are led to understand that you do not shed anothers blood , you let them shed yours ---- just as christ did

[jewel4Christ]

You are calling it evil but then if God ordered it then you are saying God ordered David to commit evil. You keep tossing out all sorts of Scripture trying to make killing evil and yet there is no such thing written Scripturally. If killing was evil then God ordered evil to be followed.

Take for example this:

Genesis 9:1 *And God blessed Noah and his sons and said to them, "Be fruitful and multiply, and fill the earth.
2 *"And the fear of you and the terror of you shall be on every beast of the earth and on every bird of the sky; with everything that creeps on the ground, and all the fish of the sea, into your hand they are given.
3 *"Every moving thing that is alive shall be food for you; I give all to you, as I gave the green plant.
4 *"Only you shall not eat flesh with its life, that is, its blood.
5 *"And surely I will require your lifeblood; from every beast I will require it. And from every man, from every man's brother I will require the life of man.
6 *"Whoever sheds man's blood, By man his blood shall be shed, For in the image of God He made man.


Now... was God ordering Noah to follow the way of evil?

No, you are taking my words out of context to what I have said. I have said over and over that God DOES use carnal men to fulfill HIS WILL and purpose.

Just like the beast.

So, please if you are going to quote me, please at least quote what I do say.


David was carnal when God used him in war.

So were the others.

This is what the bible states....in CONTEXT.

Once David was converted, he despised the ways of this world, hated wars, and why men go that route, or do you deny those verses, too?


peaceandlove,

janet

[LaidDownHisLIfe]

point 1] jesus said:"love your enemies."
not :"go into a just war".
OBEDIENCE TO ANY STATE THAT SAYS GO AND FIGHT WAR IS DISOBEDIENCE TO GOD!! read Rom12

[ProjectPeter]

now i have a long family line of people in the military and lots of friends, my uncles and grandfather , have purple hearts and what not from ww2 and others.

so when you say

"Our soldiers war against those that would kill you just because you're not "them"."

i say those who seek to kill me cant kill me till god sees fit. so any war you wage is pointless to me and has nothing to do with my protection.

you make it sound like god came to our president and said go wage war. david made known who his orders came from to his people.

now soldiers dont think they war against innocent blood, but make no mistake they shed it.

when a soldier fires a bullet and it strays through a building and hits a 3 year old in the face -- that soldier just shed innocent blood.

it would be better that i got shot in the face than for me to cause that to a 3 year old.

when a bomb strays and kills a family that has no idea why there is war going on , they shed innocent blood.

that is harsh truth, that is often looked away from and brushed aside as a casualty of war.

now those who are chosen in due time are led to understand that you do not shed anothers blood , you let them shed yours ---- just as christ did

So then here is what we have... your emotions dictate Scripture?

Tell me something... when the walls of Jericho came down... do you think there weren't some 3 year olds in that city? Sure there were.... likely even several newborn babies. Nevertheless... they died. You make God guilty of sin if you try and tie that as a sin. War ain't pretty. Wasn't pretty back then and isn't pretty now. Folks die in the things.

[jewel4Christ]

I did not murder them which is what God has told us is a sin, not killing. Otherwise we have all been murdering even when God ordered it... does not make sense.

I can say "I" because I have killed in this capacity and it is a terrible part of war. I did not hold anything sinful in my heart. I have lived it, I have fought a few wars and God not once made it known I was not in His will.

Killing needs to be done, it's a tool... has a purpose... that God uses to see His will done here on earth. Who is to do this for Him? Non-Christians?

Did you actually kill an innocent? If not, then, you are not even guilty.

btw....please note that we all have secret sins that God has not yet revealed to us, to deny that is to deny the scripture on it.

peaceandlove,

janet

[Brother Mark]

It has been shown already that once David was converted, that he dispised war, etc, and I am not going to go through all those verses again. Everyone needs to do their OWN homework, because that is the ONLY way truth is confirmed in us anyway. I cannot change your mind, and you are NOT going to change mine..on this issue.

David was converted as a youth. God chose him because he was a man after his own heart. From a very young age, David was born again.

I will agree, you will not change my mind nor I yours.

...what God does is not what we are allowed to do. That has been said more than once. We do NOT have the capacity to know the hearts of men, as God does...and, HE ALONE has a right to take someone out..at HIS OWN calling. Now, when He uses carnal minded men and nations to fulfill His will, they do so on His direction, but NOT by indwelling of the holy spirit. That is a contradiction, because that indwelling teaches us to LOVE OUR ENEMIES..PERIOD, and love does not harm anyone...otherwise the whole word of God makes NO sense at all.

We don't have to judge the heart. Just the action. God also commanded government to shed the blood of those evil men that shed innocent blood. I hope my government will honor that purpose God gave it.

YES, they were used the same way God will use the BEAST in the end time. God is not going to be mocked, those whom take up the sword shall die by the sword....and, ONCE David was converted and indwelt, HE DESPISED the ways of this world, and WAR.

David was saved as a youth. He wasn't converted after he was a king. He continued to grow as king.

Look up those verses again...anyone whom has come to hate war, does NOT support war. It is a contradiction in terms, bro.

No one hates war as much as the soldier that fights it. One can hate war and still fight for what is good and right.

..and, in this case not ONE innocent was killed....and, this is what you are missing. When innocent blood is killed, God is NOT in it. Wars today are not fought without innocent blood being shed. Ask the muslim men whom have lost their woman and children, if you do not believe me. Ask the men and woman whom lay dead in the streets of jerusalem, or the men, woman and children whom lay dead in viet nam, etc...IF men fought with a bone, this would NOT be done. You are denying facts here. Why do you suppose God had them use a bone to begin with? Weapons of mass destruction are the RESULT OF evil men. When they are used, innocents are killed. God hates it and in no way would He EVER support this type of warfare. I don't care if you don't believe me...I know it to be the truth. If you go to war, you better just take a bone, or else you are not doing things in the same manner as what God would allow.

Really? So when God destroyed all the babies in the flood, were they innocent? Or when Saul was commanded to kill the men, women and children of Amalek, were they innocent? When Joshua killed all the residents that refused to leave in Jericho, were they innocent?

I already explained that to you, but you did not "get IT". They were innocent in more than ONE way. They will be raised, and judged by what they had available to them in that day. The word of God speaks to that. It will be more tolerable on the day of judgement, for example for the cities of sodom and gomorrah, than it will be for Jerusalem this side of the new covenant. The bible says that during that time, of IGNORANCE< God is able to overlook their unbelief..and, He alone will judge them fairly in the coming judgement. You must rightly divide the word of God, and stop making it contradict itself everywhere. Now, answer my question..why is it OK for you to kill innocents, while you think in your mind that God is sending you to do what has been done to others? Is God confusion? Does He speak out of both sides of His mouth? No, and in fact, He detests that twosided mouth issue, and that too, is written.

The point being, they are not as innocent as we make them out to be. When a civilization supports the war machine, they partake of that war machine. Without the support of the people, the god emperor of Japan could not have waged war, just as Agag could not wage war without his people. It will be more tolerable for Sodom in the day of judgment because of what they did not know. But it did not stop God from destroying them. To know more is to be held to the standard of the knowledge that is revealed. But in Romans 1, we know that Sodom suppressed the truth that God did reveal to them.

You did not answer the question. WHY was David NOT allowed to build a house of WORSHIP to the ONE true God, while he was in his "war" state?

Sure I did. I answered it, and as you said to me, you didn't get it. Because God is not a God of war. It's not what he is all about. Though he does do it because it is a need. He raises up his men to do it. So David was not allowed because he was a man of war. Doesn't mean he was out of character with God, just that is not the part of God that reigns supreme. Mercy is better than judgment and that is what God wishes to display.

Samson, having the Holy Spirit upon him is not carnal. When God raises up other nations to war, he doesn't do so with his holy Spirit. It is the Prince of Babylon that he uses for that. But when it is His Children that are to fight, then he uses the Holy Spirit.

[Brother Mark]

So then here is what we have... your emotions dictate Scripture?

Tell me something... when the walls of Jericho came down... do you think there weren't some 3 year olds in that city? Sure there were.... likely even several newborn babies. Nevertheless... they died. You make God guilty of sin if you try and tie that as a sin. War ain't pretty. Wasn't pretty back then and isn't pretty now. Folks die in the things.

Yea. This is the part few want to talk about. God sent Saul to kill babies when he was to destroy the Amalekites. Many babies died in the flood and many died within the walls of Jericho.