The Law of Christ

[Literalist-Luke]

Does this seem like kosher laws. Eating food without blood in it. It seems wierd.

Okay, thank you. Question though. Aren't all of those OT laws?
Since the argument is that the OT laws are done away with and we are no longer under them, I am really looking for the NT laws, the laws of Christ, for the new covenant people.

It should be no surprise that there would be some carryover from the Old Testament. That fact is that meat with raw blood in it is not as healthy as fully cooked meat. Eating healthier food is a good enough reason for me, regardless of whether it was in the Old Testament or not.

[keck553]

So Christ was all about ritual cleanliness?

So Christ was all about gourging on hogs?

[fewarechosen]

if there is a law of christ as its called

it would be love

in my opinion it is wayyyy more than the original ot laws
the laws now are infinate yet oh so simple

preach with actions

it is that every action should be for and towards god

things like getting married, sure its fine to do so.
but the better way is to attend to things of god and not earthly things

god doesnt care what we eat but he cares about how it is influencing those around us, when i am eating some fatty greesy foods am i casting a stumbling block to my brother ? am i taking god for granted ?

when i watch a movie does it edify god at all ?

does the car i drive have an influence on people around me ?

do i need a car ?

do i spend time on a message board when i should be ringing my neighbors doorbell and telling him im a christian and i should be doing more to help my neighbor so could i cut your grass or something just to help

do i lay down every action i do in life ?

is my life truly laid down for my neighbor ?
if my life is laid down every action i take will be for my neighbors good

for we are to love my neighbor as my self, i love to do things for myself so should i not love to do them for my neighbor ?

why do i spend the 10 bucks on a movie, why do i not give it to a person who needs to eat ? is my need to see a movie greater than someone elses need to eat ?

why do i not give away all my money and all my food having nothing for myself, then let god feed me

have i gone 40 days with no food nor water

surely god will not let me starve to death

do i love my own family more than anothers family who does me harm ?

when someone attacks my family do i realize it was my family attacking my family or am i drawing a line between us

do i feed and shelter the very people who wish to do me harm or am i all talk.

christs law was love, lay down your life for your neighbor
every action you take should be the laying down of your life for anothers

[Brother Mark]

No, I don't think God intended us to eat meat. Where does it say Adam killed cows and sheep to survive in the Garden of Eden? He allowed us to eat meat after the flood for the same reason He let Moses allow for multiple wives.

Actually, there's a big difference. God gave the animals for food to Noah. It wasn't that he allowed it, he gave it.

Gen 9:3-4
3 Every moving thing that is alive shall be food for you; I give all to you, as I gave the green plant.
NASB

In the same spirit that he gave us the green plant, he gave us animals to eat.

[Ta-An]

Applogies accepted.Wow! Have you looked at that list?

Have you counted them??

[Brother Mark]

Thank you all for your input so far.
I would just point out the focus of this thread, and encourage everyone to stick to that please.
Thank you Jesusinmyheart for the link. I'll look at it. Sure would have liked the list though, even if it is 3 posts long.

Hi Kahtar. I responded to at least one post before reading this one. So at this point, I'll throw something out there.

The only NT law that I know of that is completely new, and maybe someone can correct me if it is not new or if there are more is this one...

John 13:34

34 A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another.
KJV

I suspect that all or most other NT commands are just repeating OT commands.

[fewarechosen]

Hi Kahtar. I responded to at least one post before reading this one. So at this point, I'll throw something out there.

The only NT law that I know of that is completely new, and maybe someone can correct me if it is not new or if there are more is this one...

John 13:34

34 A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another.
KJV

I suspect that all or most other NT commands are just repeating OT commands.

i feel christ didnt really repeat them as much as elaborate on them, he also let us know that he is sending us the comforter which is the law written in our hearts

thats the new law the old law was not written in the hearts and minds, the new law is. thank god for that

thats the biggest difference and all the difference between old law and new, the new is in us

[keck553]

Actually, there's a big difference. God gave the animals for food to Noah. It wasn't that he allowed it, he gave it.

Gen 9:3-4
3 Every moving thing that is alive shall be food for you; I give all to you, as I gave the green plant.
NASB

In the same spirit that he gave us the green plant, he gave us animals to eat.

That's called 'mercy'.

[Kahtar]

Have you counted them??

Yeah. 1050! .....................

[Kahtar]

Hi Kahtar. I responded to at least one post before reading this one. So at this point, I'll throw something out there.

The only NT law that I know of that is completely new, and maybe someone can correct me if it is not new or if there are more is this one...

John 13:34

34 A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another.
KJV

I suspect that all or most other NT commands are just repeating OT commands.

Is that really new, though? Isn't that simply 'love your neighbor as yourself stated a different way?

[Kahtar]

i feel christ didnt really repeat them as much as elaborate on them, he also let us know that he is sending us the comforter which is the law written in our hearts

thats the new law the old law was not written in the hearts and minds, the new law is. thank god for that

thats the biggest difference and all the difference between old law and new, the new is in us

I agree, but, what IS that law written in our hearts? Can you describe it, or them?

[Brother Mark]

Is that really new, though? Isn't that simply 'love your neighbor as yourself stated a different way?

I don't think so and here's why...

Jesus prayed in the garden "Father, if it be possible, remove this cup from me". But it wasn't going to happen. That was a prayer of self preservation. Nothing wrong with loving yourself as we are told to do so and Jesus loved himself. But then, Jesus loved God and others more than he did himself and offered himself up as a sacrifice. So to love others as Jesus loved us puts the command on the level of a God kind of love.

A man may not love himself much and can still love others as much as he loves himself. But when a man loves as Christ loves, that is a love beyond what most of us understand. In that sense, it is a new command. It is one that could not be kept under the old covenant because only God can love that way. But in the new covenant, we have God in us so now, we too can love like God loves.

Rom 5:5

5 And hope maketh not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us.
KJV

[Kahtar]

if there is a law of christ as its called

it would be love
Agreed, but that is simply the entirely of the law summed up in one word.Summed up in to statements, it is 'love God', and 'love neighbor'.
Still not new, though. That's OT law.

[keck553]

So, what is Love? I try hard to define this in God's terms, not mine, for my terms are self centered.

Yeshua was not teaching anything already laid out in Torah (which most here say is dead), except for one new command he gives to His talmidim (mroe on this later).

Matthew 22:37-28: "Yeshua said to them, 'You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.' This is the first and greatest commandment."

"..in that I command you today to love the Lord your God, to walk in His ways, and to keep His commandments, His statutes, and His judgements, that you may live and multiply; and that the Lord your God will bless you in the land which you to to possess" - Deuteronomy 30:16

Does the western culture have a good idea of what "love" is? Considering the fact that it's a major subject in songs, books, magazines and movies you'd think we have it down pat. With that mindset, looking at how scripture defines 'love' indeed is confusing. Consider the movie that proclaimed "Love never means saying your sorry". or the sick euphamism that equates love with sexual deviancy. No, love is not how our
culture defines it. Biblical Love is not an emotion. Please consider:

Think about a few things you love, like chocolate, or your dog, or your job.

The hebew word for love is "ahav". It is spelled with the Hebrew letters "alef-hay-bet." Like the english term, the hebrew word can be used for anything from nobel to profane. The fist usage of "ahav" is in Genesis 22:2

Gen 22:2 And He said, Now take your son, Isaac, your only one whom you love, and go into the land of Moriah. And there offer him for a burnt offering on one of the mountains which I will say to you.

Reading Genesis 22:1-2 and 11-12, we see the things implied that Abraham loved. How did Abraham prove his love?

Ahav represents an interesting hebrew pictograph if one starts with hebrew "av" (father) and add teh letter "hay" in the middle, you can see the word 'ahav' (the hebrew alphabet only contains consonants). The adding of the letter 'hay' points to the Spirt of God, the heart of a matter, and shows that love is the focus of the Father. In other words, the heart of the Father is Love.

Genesis 27:1-5 reveals to us what Isaac loved (verse 4).

Then in Exodus 20:5-6 comes the first use of the word "ahav" in the context of loving God. Reading this, ask yourself what God links to loving Him?

Exo 20:5 you shall not bow to them, and you shall not serve them; for I am Jehovah your God, a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of fathers on sons, on the third and on the fourth generation, to those that hate Me;
Exo 20:6 and doing kindness to thousands, to those loving Me, and to those keeping My commandments.

The verse below should be fairly obvious as to what God says to do to love Him.

Deu 11:1 "You shall therefore love the LORD your God, and always keep His charge, His statutes, His ordinances, and His commandments.

So, what does God love? Does He tell us?

Psa 11:7 For the LORD is righteous, He loves righteousness; The upright will behold His face.
Psa 33:5 He loves righteousness and justice; The earth is full of the lovingkindness of the LORD.
Psa 87:2 The LORD loves the gates of Zion More than all the other dwelling places of Jacob.

The Greek word used in the Septuagint for Love in Genesis 22:2 comes from the Greek word "Agapao". This is the same word used in John 3:16. Think about how John 3:14-17 relates to Genesis 22:2.

When reading the Apostolic writings, we need to be careful not to use definitions that are not supported by scripture. I've heard it said agapao is "God's unconditional love for man." Is that the only use for the word "agapao" though? For example in Matthew 22:37, Yeshua quotes from Deuteronomy 6:5. The word 'agapao' is used - but as a command for us to love God, not the other way around. Please read the following:

Luk 7:41 "A moneylender had two debtors: one owed five hundred denarii, and the other fifty.
Luk 7:42 "When they were unable to repay, he graciously forgave them both. So which of them will love him more?"
Luk 7:43 Simon answered and said, "I suppose the one whom he forgave more." And He said to him, "You have judged correctly."

then:

Joh 10:17 "For this reason the Father loves Me, because I lay down My life so that I may take it again.

then:

Joh 14:21 "He who has My commandments and keeps them is the one who loves Me; and he who loves Me will be loved by My Father, and I will love him and will disclose Myself to him."

Note the relationship of love to commands.

So, what are we to love?

Deu 6:5 and you are to love Adonai your God with all your heart, all your being and all your resources.
Psa 119:47 I shall delight in Your commandments, Which I love.
Psa 119:97 o mem O how I love Your law! It is my meditation all the day.
Psa 119:159 Consider how I love Your precepts; Revive me, O LORD, according to Your lovingkindness.
Mat 5:44 "But I say to you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you,Mat 22:37 And He said to him, " 'YOU SHALL LOVE THE LORD YOUR GOD WITH ALL YOUR HEART, AND WITH ALL YOUR SOUL, AND WITH ALL YOUR MIND.' Mat 22:38 "This is the great and foremost commandment. Mat 22:39 "The second is like it, 'YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.'
Joh 13:34 "A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another, even as I have loved you, that you also love one another.
Joh 14:23 Jesus answered and said to him, "If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our abode with him.
Joh 14:24 "He who does not love Me does not keep My words; and the word which you hear is not Mine, but the Father's who sent Me.
Joh 15:9 "Just as the Father has loved Me, I have also loved you; abide in My love. Joh 15:10 "If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love; just as I have kept My Father's commandments and abide in His love.
Joh 15:11 "These things I have spoken to you so that My joy may be in you, and that your joy may be made full.
Eph 5:25 Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ also loved the church and gave Himself up for her,
1Jn 4:7 Beloved, let us love one another, for love is from God; and everyone who loves is born of God and knows God.
1Jn 4:8 The one who does not love does not know God, for God is love.

In 1 John 2:15 we are told what NOT to love.
Do you think the prosperity preachers who say the law is dead except for tithing read that?

Then in 1 John 4:16 we are told God is love. This verse is misused often to teach a different Gospel. It is used by some to water down the fact that God is holy and expects people to obey. It is used to 'change' the God of the Old Testament into a different God of the New Testament.

God has not changed.

A false teaching stems from a misunderstanding of Matthew 22:37-39 (parallel verses in Mark 12 and Luke 10). This has been used to create a false doctrine that Yeshua instituted a 'new law', the "Law of Love" which supercedes and replaces God's holy commandments. What Yeshua points out here is the connection between God's commandments and loving Him. The "Law of Love" has always been the summation of God's commands, otherwise the Torah teachers wouldn't have agreed with Him. If we don't want to obey Him, we do not love Him.

The second greatest command is to "love you neighbor as yourself." This is a quote from Leviticus 19:18. All along, love has been the summation of all that God has commanded. Love motivates our desire to obey Him, and validates we are His children.

[Kahtar]

I don't think so and here's why...

Jesus prayed in the garden "Father, if it be possible, remove this cup from me". But it wasn't going to happen. That was a prayer of self preservation. Nothing wrong with loving yourself as we are told to do so and Jesus loved himself. But then, Jesus loved God and others more than he did himself and offered himself up as a sacrifice. So to love others as Jesus loved us puts the command on the level of a God kind of love.

A man may not love himself much and can still love others as much as he loves himself. But when a man loves as Christ loves, that is a love beyond what most of us understand. In that sense, it is a new command. It is one that could not be kept under the old covenant because only God can love that way. But in the new covenant, we have God in us so now, we too can love like God loves.

Rom 5:5

5 And hope maketh not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us.
KJV

Okay, I'll go along with that. But really, it's still love, just a much greater level of love. In fact, a level not attainable by us without Christ.