Are you saying that the blood of bulls and goats was sufficient before the cross to wash away sins and that is how men got saved before the Cross?
What has it to do with then? This is what I am trying to establish.So if in the Millennial God says kill a bull, then thats what will be done, has nothing to do with atoning for sin.
Sinner saved by grace
The Feast of tabernacles (Zech 14:16-21), the passover (Eze. 45:21), the Feast of trumpets (Eze. 45:25). (see also Isa. 56:7; 66:20-23; Jer. 33:18; Mal. 3:3-4).
The sacrifices were in fact for a memorial.
...it may be a memorial for the children of Israel before the Lord, to make atonement for yourselves. Ex. 30:16
...And the priest shall burn it [fine flour and oil will frankincense] as a memorial on the altar, an offering made by fire, a sweet aroma to the Lord. Lev. 2:2
The blood of bulls could never "take away" or "blot out" sins, they were simply an appeasement.
So, to whom was this conditional covenant of Eze. 40-44 given?
From Azubah to Hephzibah.
It shall be that I will gather all nations and tongues; and they shall come and see My glory. Is 66:18
Then they shall bring all your brethren...to My holy mountain. Is. 66:20
These verses have not been fulfilled and we can see that the operation of priests and Levites (vs. 21) and the visits of Gentiles up Jerusalem (vs. 23) implies something yet future.
The verses mentioned above speak the comprehensive identity of believers a priests before the Lord - a very important, and overlooked ministry. Isaiah plainly tells us in verse 21 that only some of these are chosen to be priests and Levites, therefore negating the application of these previously mentioned verses to this specific group.
Where does it say, "Do not sacrifice"? Where does it say that sacrifices are the law?
Last edited by Joyfulparousia; Sep 2nd 2008 at 11:29 AM. Reason: added comment
From Azubah to Hephzibah.
From Azubah to Hephzibah.
There is nowhere in Ezekiel 40-47 that it suggests that these will be memorials to look back to the cross. After the Lord's glorious return we definitely do not need the mass slaughter of animals to remind people about Christ. Surely the Word of God is eternal? Surely it will be available in your millennium? We don't need to see Jesus hands literally to believe He died for us.
Sinner saved by grace
Maybe. My point was that Isaiah was talking about the conversion of so many Jews in the first century, just after the ascension. These Jews did in fact set the wheels in motion. They took the Gospel to the nations. Bear in mind that I included Isaiah 66:19 into the context. Where you have somehow placed this text in a future semi-temporal kingdom, I placed it in the first century.Originally Posted by Joyfulparousia
(19) And I will set a sign among them, and I will send those who escape from them to the nations of Tarshish, Pul, and Lud, drawers of the bow; to Tubal and Javan, to the far away coasts that have not heard My fame nor seen My glory. And they shall declare My glory among the nations.
I'm inclined to believe that Peter shared the gospel with Cornelius sometime after the ascension, I would guess about three years. Prior to this, the Gospel was exclusively given to Jews. Cornelius and his family were the first gentiles to have received the good news. Acts 10:45-47 describes the surprise that Peter and his Jewish entourage displayed upon seeing gentiles receive the Holy Spirit. Pretty well indicates that a precedent had been set.Originally Posted by Joyfulparousia
Also in Acts 13:46, at probably around the same time, we see in Antioch where Paul and Barnabas proclaim that the word was to be spoken to the Jews first, but since they would deem themselves not worthy of eternal life they turned to nations. Thus the Gospel began it's flow to the gentiles.
(46) But speaking boldly, Paul and Barnabas said, It was necessary for the Word of God to be spoken first to you; but since you indeed thrust it away and judge yourselves not worthy of eternal life, behold, we turn to the nations.
Not necessary, vs 19 speaks of a group that escapes and and will declare God's glory among the nations. Some of these are set aside as priests and Levites. Both Peter and John speak of these in the following verses;Originally Posted by Joyfulparousia
(5) Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.
(9) But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:
(6) And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.
....they just haven't been brought to the holy mountain as of yet. This will take place at the second coming.
I disagree, at least in part. Under the Mosaic Law. only Levites were to hold the office of priest. Were Peter and John speaking of Levites in 1Peter 2:5; 2:9 and Rev 1:6? It's not that the prophecy in question has been fulfilled but rather it's in the process of being fulfilled. It will find it's complete fulfillment at the second coming.Originally Posted by Joyfulparousia
Possibly, but it also doesn't say that these that are chosen to be levites and priests are set aside for same exact functions that the aaronite priest performed in the temple.Originally Posted by Joyfulparousia
(16) for me to be a minister of Jesus Christ to the nations, sacredly ministering the gospel of God, that the offering of the nations might be acceptable, sanctified by the Holy Spirit.
(17) But if indeed I am poured out on the sacrifice and service of your faith, I rejoice; yea, I rejoice with you all.
(5) you also as living stones are being built a spiritual house, a holy priesthood, to offer spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ.
(16) But do not be forgetful of doing good and sharing, for God is well pleased with such sacrifices.
The offerings were the sanctified souls of the people of the nations. The acts of Love. Those that make these offerings to God, I believe are the priests that he has set aside in Isa 22:21
No but as I pointed out, the NT teaches that the law including the sacrificial system is considered to be a dangerous snare and an unnecessary burden. This being the case why would a glorified Christ (who incidentally served as the ultimate sacrifice in His death), re institute a religious system that has been proven to be a heavy yoke. Didn't Jesus say in Matt 11:30 that His yoke was easy and His burden was light?Originally Posted by Joyfulparousia
Jesus did come to fulfill the law, and what is that fulfillment? "Love the Lord your God with all your heart and mind and soul and strength and likewise, love your neighbor as yourself. The fulfillment of the law is love and and Christ Jesus is Love.Originally Posted by Joyfulparousia
As I said before, I don't think that NT does say that it is forbidden to sacrifice. If you should choose to do so then please, by all means have at it. I strongly recommend reading the Book of Galatians first though.Originally Posted by Joyfulparousia
I believe that book of Deuteronomy is where the directives for sacrifices are tied to the law. I can't give you chapter and verse though.Originally Posted by Joyfulparousia
Live simply. Love generously. Care deeply. Speak kindly.
Leave the rest to the Lord.
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