is a New World Order even in the bible?

[moonglow]

moonglow:

I know what you believe and we have agreed to disagree which is fine, but I was wondering where you see the world headed in the next decade or two and what you believe the End of the World will be.

I have always, and still do, believed the The Great Tribulation was a part of the End of Days. Since you believe it has happened, what do you see the end as? Just something I was wondering about.

And if you have explained this before, I am sorry, but I have forgotten.

Again, just want to hear your view as an interested listener.

Thanks

http://freebooks.entrewave.com/freeb...kgbr/kgbr.html

The Beast of Revelation
by Kenneth L. Gentry, Jr 1989


The Last Days

This book is about the last days. It is not about the end times. The last days are different from the end times. The last days are not in the present or in the future; they are in the past. Still confused? So are millions of other Christians. The confusion stems from the fact that Christians have jumped to the conclusion..a wholly erroneous conclusion ..that the "last days" spoken of in the New Testament refer to the last days of the church (or to the misleading identified "Church Age") This conclusion is not warrented by the various biblical texts. The last days spoken of in the New Testament were scatological last days only for the national Israel, not for the New Covenant church. The "last days" were in fact the early days of the church of Jesus Christ.

How do we know this? How do we know that we are not now living in the last days and never will be? How do we know that the New Testament was written in the last days, which came to a close over 1,900 years ago? Because the New Testament clearly says so. The author of the Epistle to the Hebrews specifically identified his own era as the "last days." He wrote that God "Hath in this last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds" (Heb. 1:2). He was quite clear: he and his contemporaries were living in the last days.

The Destruction of the Temple

So, we need to ask this obvious question: The last days of what? The answer is clear: the last days of the Old Covenant, including national Israel. The New Testament writers were living in the last days of animal sacrifices in the temple. This is the primary message of the Epistle to the Hebrews: the coming of a better sacrifice, a once-and-for-all sacrifice, Jesus Christ. We read:" And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of enternal inheritance. For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator" (Heb. 9:15-16). The inescapable concomitant of Jesus' sacrifice at Calvary was His annulment of the Old Covenant's sacrificial system:

And almost all the things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission. It was therefore necessary that the patterns of things in the heavens should be purified with these; bu the heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices than these. For Christ is not entered into the holy places made with hands, which are the figures of the true: but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us.......

But what about the Beast?

Well, what about the beast? If my thesis is correct--that the phrase "the last days" refers to the last days of Old Covenant Israel and the destruction of the temple in A.D. 70..then who was the beast? After all if Net Testament prophesies regarding the beast were not fulfilled during the lifetime of John, but refer to some individual still in the church's future, there wold seem to be no reason to believe that the other prophecies regarding 'the last days' were also fulfilled in his day. These prophecies must be taken as a unit. It is clear that the beast is a figure who is said to be alive in the last days. This is why it is imperative that we discover who the beast is or was. If he has not yet appeared, then the last days must also be ahead of us, unless we have actually entered into them. If he has already appeared, then the last days are over. This book identifies the prophesied beast beyond any reasonable doubt. This much I will tell you now; it is not Henry Kissinger.

If all of the potential buyers of The Beast of Revelation were to discover in advance that it is not filled with prophecies about brain-implanted computer chips, tattoos with identification numbers, cobra helicopters, nuclear war, and New Age conspiracies, most of them would not buy it. Customers of most Christian bookstores too often prefer to be excited by the misinformation provided by a string of paperback false prophecies than to be comforted by the knowledge that the so-called Great Tribulation is long behind us. and that it was Israel's tribulation, not the church's. (For bibical proof, see David Chilton's book, The Great Tribulation.)

12 They want thrills and chills, not accurate Bible exposition' they want a string of 'secret insights,' not historical knowledge. Like legions of imaginative children sitting in front of the family radio back in the 1930's and 1940's who faithfully bought their Oval tine, tore off the wrapper, and sent it to receive an official "Little Orphan Annie secret decoder," fundamentalist Christians are repeatedly lured by the tempting promise that they can be 'the first ones on their block' to be 'on the inside'...to be the early recipients of the 'inside dope.' And that is just exactly what they have been sold, decade after decade.

I realize this didn't exactly answer your question....but I thought it was relevant. I think satan has to be released from the pit and then literally all hell will break out. Exactly what will happen...I don't know yet..still studying on that. Right now all I could do is guess. Then of course the return of Christ...the resurrection...the Great White Throne judgment and finally all death and all sin will be done away with...at last. And Paradise will be restored as God intended.

Oh and I should say I am sorry if parts of this article offends some. Since I was in that camp at one time, I realize how sensitive this can be...but that is what I now feel I fell for...the thrills and chills of the end times put out by those with intentions to make a buck and have a little feeling of power...

I do not live in fear of the beast or worrying about what the mark is..I doubt I will even still be alive when satan is released and its a wonderful freeing feeling to not try to connect every world event to the end times and wonder if 'this is it'. I lived that way most of my life and its not a fun way to live for sure....even though I thought I would be raptured 'before the bad stuff really started' their was still this horrible fear.. I am so glad I am free from that now.

God bless

[Gods Child]

Well that is a different view...while I don't agree with it, I thank you for sharing it...the more we study the more we learn!

Most read it as the eight rulers of Rome since the bible says 'kings'. From my end time view, the little horn was Nero.

http://www.forerunner.com/daniel/X00...ion_of_Da.html
Daniel 7

By Jay Rogers
Published May 2008
21. I beheld, and the same horn made war with the saints, and prevailed against them;

The same horn made war with the saints — Nero began a persecution of the saints which began in AD 63 and lasted until his death.

22. Until the Ancient of days came, and judgment was given to the saints of the most High; and the time came that the saints possessed the kingdom.
23. Thus he said, The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth, which shall be diverse from all kingdoms, and shall devour the whole earth, and shall tread it down, and break it in pieces.
24. And the ten horns out of this kingdom are ten kings that shall arise: and another shall rise after them; and he shall be diverse from the first, and he shall subdue three kings.

Another shall rise after them — Nero was not in the direct line of succession, but three Emperors were assassinated to make way for him.

25. And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.

Until a time and times and the dividing of time — Literally, “time, times, half a time.” If we understand a time to mean a year, then it is three and a half years. Nero’s persecution of the church lasted exactly 42 months or three and a half years. (the full article is at the link).

God bless

I do not understand. Why they would say Daniel 7 was referring to Nero?
It just does not add up.
Take a look....
In verse 13 it is plain that it says at this time is when the Son of Man comes in the clouds. Jesus did not come in the clouds at the time of Nero.
Verse 17 says these beast are four kings that come out of the earth at this time. Nero is not for kingdoms.
Verse 18 the Saints posses the kingdom for ever and ever at this time…The Saints did not poses the kingdom in the days of Nero.
Verse 22 Ancient of Days came (Jesus=clouds=VS 13) Saints poses the kingdom….Again Jesus did not come in the days of Nero and the Saints did not poses the Kingdom then.
Verse 25 He speaks words against God for 42 months…Same as Rev 13, which would place the timing at just prior to Jesus 2nd coming.
Verse 26 tells us that happens at the end….Nero was not the end.
Verse 27 the everlasting kingdom…Serve and obey Jesus…This did not happen for sure during the days of Nero.

7:13 I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him.
7:17 These great beasts, which are four, are four kings, which shall arise out of the earth.
7:18 But the saints of the most High shall take the kingdom, and possess the kingdom for ever, even for ever and ever[/b].
7:22 Until the [b]Ancient of days came, and judgment was given to the saints of the most High; and the time came that the saints possessed the kingdom.
7:25 And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.( Rev 13:5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.)
7:26 But the judgment shall sit, and they shall take away his dominion, to consume and to destroy it unto the end.
7:27 And the kingdom and dominion, and the greatness of the kingdom under the whole heaven, shall be given to the people of the saints of the most High, whose kingdom is an everlasting kingdom, and all dominions shall serve and obey him.

Rev 12:14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.

By reading Daniel 7, I really do not see how this could be referring to the days of Nero.

[White Spider]

moonglow:

Thank you

I'm trying to really study partial-preterism and full, any books or sites you could point me too would also help.

It's just always seemed to me the tribulation was part of satan's release and God's return.

But looking at things there is a possibility they are separate, though just a possibility right now

Anyways, Thank You, God Bless

[moonglow]

I do not understand. Why they would say Daniel 7 was referring to Nero?
It just does not add up.
Take a look....
In verse 13 it is plain that it says at this time is when the Son of Man comes in the clouds. Jesus did not come in the clouds at the time of Nero.

The phrase, coming on the clouds, does not mean the Second Coming of Jesus...it means judgment.

http://blog.absolutetruth.us
How did they understand the language about clouds in the Old Testament culture setting?

Clouds are depicted as the chariots of God and indicative of his MAJESTY. In Job 22:12ff Job exalts Jehovah as the one who is in the height of heaven and covered with thick clouds. In Psalm 18 which is a highly apocalyptic description of David's deliverance from Saul the former shepherd tells how Jehovah bowed the heavens...and came down with darkness under his feet, he rode upon a cherub, and flew; He flew upon the wings of the wind. He made darkness His secret place; His canopy around Him was dark waters and thick clouds of the skies.

Now one can look but in vain to find a physical event matching these words. Jehovah had acted to deliver his servant and thus he had come. He had acted and his actions had vindicated his righteousness, thus he was depicted as coming in majesty in the clouds. Psalm 68:32-35 also speaks of God who rides on the heaven of heavens and his strength is in the clouds. Again the concept is his majesty and sovereignty. Psalms 104:3 tells us God makes the clouds his chariots and walks on the wings of the wind.

The idea of God's coming in the clouds is also associated with the exercise of his sovereignty in JUDGING his enemies. In Isaiah 19 Jehovah rides on a swift cloud and will come into Egypt. We know from chapter 20 that it was the Assyrians who were God's instrument of wrath on Egypt, see Isaiah 20:1-4; yet it is said that Jehovah was coming on a cloud. In Zephaniah 1:14-16 we are told the great day of the Lord is near; and that it would be a day of wrath, distress, and a day of clouds, when the Lord would come. We know this is a prediction of the impending judgment on Jerusalem, 1:4ff. This judgment came in 606-586 BC.

Similar language is found in Nahum in the prediction of Nineveh's fall. Jehovah has his way in the whirlwind...and the clouds are the dust of his feet. El Shaddai would come, the mountains would melt, the earth would be destroyed at his presence when he came on the clouds. We know that Nineveh was destroyed, not by a literal coming of Jehovah out of heaven on the clouds, but by the invading armies of the Chaldeans and Medes in approximately 612 BC.

Yet another though related concept of the coming with the clouds is the Messianic motif of Daniel. In Daniel 7 one like the Son of man is depicted as coming in the clouds of heaven. This concept of Messiah on the clouds was certainly one well known in the first century. For John to say in Revelation 1:7 that Jesus would come with the clouds was nothing less than an assertion of his Messianic role as the ruler of the kingdom of God. In his coming in the clouds he was exercising the sovereignty and demonstrating the majesty of deity so well known in the Old Covenant.

The idea is not a literal coming with the clouds so much as an identifying factor of the one under consideration. He is to be viewed not just as man but the One, who, like Jehovah, rides on the clouds. The association of Jesus coming in the clouds then was a way for the Biblical writers to IDENTIFY Jesus, in a manner well known to those conversant with Old Testament symbolism, as God's Messiah, as the Judge, worthy of majesty and honor.

This is precisely the thought Jesus was conveying to Caiaphas when he told him he would see him coming in the clouds. When Jesus said he was going to come in the clouds this was a claim to the Messianic office and divine nature; Caiaphas responded, He has spoken blasphemy Caiaphas was not responding to a claim that Jesus would literally return on a physical cloud. He was responding to the IDENTITY which Jesus was claiming by associating himself as the one to come in the clouds of heaven

One final thought. We would note the New Testament TIME FRAME for the coming of Jesus in the clouds. Patently Jesus told Caiaphas he would see Jesus' return in the clouds. He did not say he would die and millenia later be resurrected to view the parousia. He was living and was told he would witness Jesus' return, which we hope is now understood to be the exercise of his Messianic sovereignty by an act of judgment.

In Matthew 24:30-34 we are told emphatically that the disciples' generation would see the Son of Man coming in the clouds of heaven. Reader, how can the honest student of the word ignore such emphatic chronological parameters? How can we divorce Revelation 1:7 and the promise of the coming in the clouds, from Revelation 1:1-3 and the prediction it must shortly come to pass and was at hand ?

All these things are profound but easily understood as long as we take the time to study them in their original (language, culture, politics and historical setting in which the Bible was originally written.

Verse 17 says these beast are four kings that come out of the earth at this time. Nero is not for kingdoms.

Four great beasts — These again are the four great kingdoms, the Chaldean, Medio-Persian, Greek and Roman Empires. This is the same vision as in chapter two, but with different symbolism. While some choose to understand the fourth beast as the successors of Alexander, especially the kings who ruled in Asia and Syria, the thrust of the whole prophecy of Daniel indicates that it is the Roman Empire at the time of the coming of Christ.

Ten horns — These are the ten kings also mentioned in Revelation 17:12. These ten kings are the ten Emperors of the Roman Empire to AD 70. The Roman Emperors were greater than all the other world rulers before them. Including Julius Caesar, there are ten Emperors until the time of the destruction of Jerusalem. They are Julius, Augustus, Tiberius, Gaius, Claudius, Nero, Galba, Otho, Vitellius, Vespasian. The reign of these kings parallel the period of the ministry of the Messiah and of the Apostles.

8. I considered the horns, and, behold, there came up among them another little horn, before whom there were three of the first horns plucked up by the roots: and, behold, in this horn were eyes like the eyes of man, and a mouth speaking great things.

Another little horn — Some have applied this to the Syrian ruler Antiochus Epiphanes during the time after Alexander. Antiochus’ desecration of the Temple in 167 BC is prophesied in Daniel 8:9. But keeping with the consistent application of this passage to the Roman Empire, I must conclude that this speaks of Nero Caesar. He is the little horn “among them” the sixth of the ten Emperors. Thus he is “another little horn.”

Verse 18 the Saints posses the kingdom for ever and ever at this time…The Saints did not poses the kingdom in the days of Nero.

http://www.forerunner.com/daniel/X00...ion_of_Da.html

Dominion, and glory, and a kingdom — Christ was given the keys of the kingdom by God the Father when he sat down at the right hand of God after His resurrection and ascension. This kingdom is not a future kingdom. It began in the days of the Roman Empire. It overcame Rome and will overcome all the kingdoms of this world. It will last forever.

The saints of the most High shall take the kingdom — Here is a dominion mandate given not only to Christ, but to the saints. We are to possess the whole kingdom the whole world for the dominion of Jesus Christ. This commission was given at the time of Christ.

An everlasting kingdom — The purpose of this passage, and the entire prophecy of Daniel, is to give the Jews a correct understanding of the time when the Messiah would come and to declare when the kingdom of heaven would come on earth. When Jesus declared that the kingdom of heaven was at hand, he alluded to Daniel stating that He was the Messiah, the Son of man spoken of by Daniel.


Matthew 4:17
From that time Jesus began to preach and to say, “Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.”

Verse 22 Ancient of Days came (Jesus=clouds=VS 13) Saints poses the kingdom….Again Jesus did not come in the days of Nero and the Saints did not poses the Kingdom then.

see above..

Verse 25 He speaks words against God for 42 months…Same as Rev 13, which would place the timing at just prior to Jesus 2nd coming.

http://www.forerunner.com/daniel/X00...ion_of_Da.html
Until a time and times and the dividing of time — Literally, “time, times, half a time.” If we understand a time to mean a year, then it is three and a half years. Nero’s persecution of the church lasted exactly 42 months or three and a half years.

Judgment came....but it wasn't the Second Coming of Christ. We have been told for so long that means the Second coming of Christ, but comparing it to other expressions in the bible we can see this isn't what it really means. It means judgment.

Verse 26 tells us that happens at the end….Nero was not the end.

It was the end of Rome. At that time Rome ruled the world and oppressed the Jews and Christians. They were a pagan nations. As long as you worshiped pagan gods and their kings you were ok. If not, you paid with your life many times. When Nero killed himself the 'beast suffered a fatal wound'...meaning Rome the body of the beast died. Nero had no succeors as he had kicked his pregnant wife to death. See every ruler had to have a blood relative to take their place back then. There was no voting for who might rule. Since there were no blood relatives left....he had killed them all Rome went into civil war. But the 'beast rose again'...came back from the brink of 'death'. The death of a nation. The other kings also went after the Christians but eventually the beast was 'overcome by the testimony of the saints' and Constantine stopped the persecution of the Christians. Allowed the Christians to live in peace..his own mother was a Christian. While he acknowledged the Christian God, he never quite gave up his pagan god worship. But this was the first major step in allowing Christians to live in peace in Rome and eventually as we see, its the center of the Catholic faith and where the pope is. In some ways we could also say the beast isn't totally dead....overcome...restrained...but not totally dead. I don't want to say anymore on this as I realize that is a touchy subject and I don't want to offend or hurt anyone's feeling. The point is though Rome no longer feeds Christians to the lions!

Verse 27 the everlasting kingdom…Serve and obey Jesus…This did not happen for sure during the days of Nero.

see above

By reading Daniel 7, I really do not see how this could be referring to the days of Nero.

I hope the information I gave you helped.
More on Constantine:http://www.fsmitha.com/h1/ch24.htm

God bless

[moonglow]

moonglow:

Thank you

I'm trying to really study partial-preterism and full, any books or sites you could point me too would also help.

It's just always seemed to me the tribulation was part of satan's release and God's return.

But looking at things there is a possibility they are separate, though just a possibility right now

Anyways, Thank You, God Bless

gee WS are you running a fever? I think you need to check into the hospital and see if you are ok.... I can't believe you are even checking this stuff out! But of course I am always happy when someone at least studies other views...I have studies quite a few other end time views (not all of them...seems like there are more then I can keep up with!) Doesn't hurt us one bit to just study them...might help with whatever view you already have too...you never know.

That last post I did for you did include a link to a free book...http://freebooks.entrewave.com/freeb...kgbr/kgbr.htmlTHE BEAST OF REVELATION

Now for whatever reason the spelling on it is messed up...I don't know if someone did a rush job in putting it on the net or if some HTML codes messed it up or what...other then that its pretty good.

Here is another one you can download to PDF.

Before Jerusalem Fell by Gentry
http://www.entrewave.com/freebooks/docs/2206_47e.htm

It gives a good arguement for an early dating of Revelation also.

God bless

[blkbeauti2004]

The Star of David or to be more accurate, the Star of Solomon was first associated with the Jews when Amshel Mayer Rothschild adopted it in the 1700's.
Most Jews did not go by last names in the small neighborhoods in Germany, but used symbols to represent their family. His family was a merchant and took the last name Bauer which translates to "farmer" in German, perhaps to hide their true wealth.
Later in life Amshel was a dealer of valuable coins and trinkets and found that lending was a lucrative business and found favor with Prince William IX of Hesse who endorsed Bauer's business. Bauer used the hexagram above the door of his business and later changed his sirname to Rothschild which translates as Rot(Red) and Schild(Shield) in German.
Rothschild was an Ashkenazi Jew, a Zionist, and a member of the Illumanti. His involvement in these secret societies play huge part in the world's financial debacles, wars, and is the reason that the flag of Israel bears the hexagram.

Yes, but that flag was designed after the holocaust in 1948 when Israel became a Nation again.

I do know the Pentagram is strong in occultism, but the hexagram is as well. Again the symbol of Saturn, whom many Pagan's worshipped is most commonly the hexagram.

1 Kings 11:7 ~ On a hill east of Jerusalem, Solomon built a high place for Chemosh the detestable god of Moab, and for Molech the detestable god of the Ammonites.

Moloch, Molech, Molekh, Molek, Ba'al, or Remphan are among the names used for this god, as well as other names. Here's a few verses where Moloch is referenced in various forms of his name (1 Kings 11:5, 1 Kings 11:33, 1 Kings 22:53, 2 Kings 23:13 and Zephaniah 1:5)

This is where the star comes from:

Amos 5:26 ~ But ye have borne the tabernacle of your Moloch and Chiun your images, the star [Saturn] of your god, which ye made to yourselves.

Acts 7:43 ~ Yea, ye took up the tabernacle of Moloch, and the star [Saturn] of your god Remphan, figures which ye made to worship them: and I will carry you away beyond Babylon.

Saturn's symbol:



The six pointed star was used by Solomon when he turned to Pagan gods, the Seal of Solomon. It was used in ancient times as you pointed out, but it was not of Jewish use. People often confuse that and there is a lot of misinformation on the web because Solomon is the son of David and was right with God for a time, they think because Solomon used it it was Jewish, but he used it after turning away from God for Pagan purposes. Also why it's wrongly considered the "Star of David" which it most certainly is not.

As I stated before it did not become Jewish until Hitler used it to mark the Jews. Why did he mark the Jews with the symbol of Moloch/Remphan etc. you may wonder?

The ancient Greek writer poet and historian Lucian (in his dialogue entitled Saturnalia) describes the festival’s observance in his time. In addition to human sacrifice, he mentions these customs: widespread intoxication; going from house to house while singing naked; rape and other sexual license; and consuming human-shaped biscuits. (The ginger bread man )

As I said before it was not until Hitler used the star to mark the Jews was it even related in any way to Judaism. And he marked them for sacrifice.

Holocaust by definition is - "burnt sacrifice"

[ross3421]

That is a good point there. Though I never heard of the New World Order being in reference to the New Heaven and New Earth...its always been related to the antichrist (beast).

God bless

The kingdom of God is a "type" of a new world order is it not?

[Equipped_4_Love]

http://freebooks.entrewave.com/freeb...kgbr/kgbr.html

The Beast of Revelation
by Kenneth L. Gentry, Jr 1989


The Last Days

This book is about the last days. It is not about the end times. The last days are different from the end times. The last days are not in the present or in the future; they are in the past. Still confused? So are millions of other Christians. The confusion stems from the fact that Christians have jumped to the conclusion..a wholly erroneous conclusion ..that the "last days" spoken of in the New Testament refer to the last days of the church (or to the misleading identified "Church Age") This conclusion is not warrented by the various biblical texts. The last days spoken of in the New Testament were scatological last days only for the national Israel, not for the New Covenant church. The "last days" were in fact the early days of the church of Jesus Christ.

How do we know this? How do we know that we are not now living in the last days and never will be? How do we know that the New Testament was written in the last days, which came to a close over 1,900 years ago? Because the New Testament clearly says so. The author of the Epistle to the Hebrews specifically identified his own era as the "last days." He wrote that God "Hath in this last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds" (Heb. 1:2). He was quite clear: he and his contemporaries were living in the last days.

The Destruction of the Temple

So, we need to ask this obvious question: The last days of what? The answer is clear: the last days of the Old Covenant, including national Israel. The New Testament writers were living in the last days of animal sacrifices in the temple. This is the primary message of the Epistle to the Hebrews: the coming of a better sacrifice, a once-and-for-all sacrifice, Jesus Christ. We read:" And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of enternal inheritance. For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator" (Heb. 9:15-16). The inescapable concomitant of Jesus' sacrifice at Calvary was His annulment of the Old Covenant's sacrificial system:

And almost all the things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission. It was therefore necessary that the patterns of things in the heavens should be purified with these; bu the heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices than these. For Christ is not entered into the holy places made with hands, which are the figures of the true: but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us.......

But what about the Beast?

Well, what about the beast? If my thesis is correct--that the phrase "the last days" refers to the last days of Old Covenant Israel and the destruction of the temple in A.D. 70..then who was the beast? After all if Net Testament prophesies regarding the beast were not fulfilled during the lifetime of John, but refer to some individual still in the church's future, there wold seem to be no reason to believe that the other prophecies regarding 'the last days' were also fulfilled in his day. These prophecies must be taken as a unit. It is clear that the beast is a figure who is said to be alive in the last days. This is why it is imperative that we discover who the beast is or was. If he has not yet appeared, then the last days must also be ahead of us, unless we have actually entered into them. If he has already appeared, then the last days are over. This book identifies the prophesied beast beyond any reasonable doubt. This much I will tell you now; it is not Henry Kissinger.

If all of the potential buyers of The Beast of Revelation were to discover in advance that it is not filled with prophecies about brain-implanted computer chips, tattoos with identification numbers, cobra helicopters, nuclear war, and New Age conspiracies, most of them would not buy it. Customers of most Christian bookstores too often prefer to be excited by the misinformation provided by a string of paperback false prophecies than to be comforted by the knowledge that the so-called Great Tribulation is long behind us. and that it was Israel's tribulation, not the church's. (For bibical proof, see David Chilton's book, The Great Tribulation.)

12 They want thrills and chills, not accurate Bible exposition' they want a string of 'secret insights,' not historical knowledge. Like legions of imaginative children sitting in front of the family radio back in the 1930's and 1940's who faithfully bought their Oval tine, tore off the wrapper, and sent it to receive an official "Little Orphan Annie secret decoder," fundamentalist Christians are repeatedly lured by the tempting promise that they can be 'the first ones on their block' to be 'on the inside'...to be the early recipients of the 'inside dope.' And that is just exactly what they have been sold, decade after decade.

I realize this didn't exactly answer your question....but I thought it was relevant. I think satan has to be released from the pit and then literally all hell will break out. Exactly what will happen...I don't know yet..still studying on that. Right now all I could do is guess. Then of course the return of Christ...the resurrection...the Great White Throne judgment and finally all death and all sin will be done away with...at last. And Paradise will be restored as God intended.

Oh and I should say I am sorry if parts of this article offends some. Since I was in that camp at one time, I realize how sensitive this can be...but that is what I now feel I fell for...the thrills and chills of the end times put out by those with intentions to make a buck and have a little feeling of power...

I do not live in fear of the beast or worrying about what the mark is..I doubt I will even still be alive when satan is released and its a wonderful freeing feeling to not try to connect every world event to the end times and wonder if 'this is it'. I lived that way most of my life and its not a fun way to live for sure....even though I thought I would be raptured 'before the bad stuff really started' their was still this horrible fear.. I am so glad I am free from that now.

God bless

You know, I was really starting to take this guy's views seriously -- until he went into his rant mocking and judging other Christians who DO believe in the pre-trib rapture. Sorry, but I can't take someone who likes to make fun of other Christians who hold doctrinal differences seriously.

Thank you, though, for the clip.

[moonglow]

You know, I was really starting to take this guy's views seriously -- until he went into his rant mocking and judging other Christians who DO believe in the pre-trib rapture. Sorry, but I can't take someone who likes to make fun of other Christians who hold doctrinal differences seriously.

Thank you, though, for the clip.

Are you referring to this part of what I posted?

12 They want thrills and chills, not accurate Bible exposition' they want a string of 'secret insights,' not historical knowledge. Like legions of imaginative children sitting in front of the family radio back in the 1930's and 1940's who faithfully bought their Oval tine, tore off the wrapper, and sent it to receive an official "Little Orphan Annie secret decoder," fundamentalist Christians are repeatedly lured by the tempting promise that they can be 'the first ones on their block' to be 'on the inside'...to be the early recipients of the 'inside dope.' And that is just exactly what they have been sold, decade after decade.

If so I don't see it as mocking at all but he really is stating what goes on among some Christians. This secret insight they crave can be applied to much more then the end times also. Its a very dangerous thing actually as these people pretend to have an insight to God that others don't and the Lord was very stern and harsh and judgmental when it came to false prophets..which is what he is talking about here. Plus the bible does give us permission to judge other Christians when they are sinning. 1 Corinthians 5This is a sin of pride...just to mention one thing. Now that doesn't mean that their aren't true prophets...not saying that at all. But if you take a look at the highest selling books on the Christian market...most are about the end times and the authors tend to claim having these kinds of secret insights. The author of this article didn't say it was just pretrib rapture believers, or mid term, or whatever that did this but in fact said:

fundamentalist Christians are repeatedly lured by the tempting promise that they can be 'the first ones on their block' to be 'on the inside'

And we are. We tend to be very gullible at times. I have heard more then one pastor say this is why we are refereed to as sheep in the bible. Without a Shepherd we are indeed going to just be wandering around lost.

God bless

[Equipped_4_Love]

Yes, I understand what you are saying but the truth of the matter is, he is treading on the territory of judging every Christian's motive who holds a view that disagrees with his. How does HE know what is in their hearts?!