Not Just Ten commandments!!!!!

[ProjectPeter]

I don't see that being said in the passage. Where do you see that?

Cow crap doesn't make for good fuel, does it?

Sure it does. Burns very well actually and the westward pioneer's used to collect it and put it in sheets they had attached to their wagons so they could use it for fuel when firewood wasn't available. Since they only eat grass etc... when it dries it burns very hot and for quite a while surprisingly enough.

Keep in mind too... he was first told to use human feces to cook his food with but God allowed him to use the cow dung instead after it freaked Ezekiel out.

Ezekiel 4:11 "And the water you drink will be the sixth part of a hin by measure; you shall drink it from time to time.
12 "And you shall eat it as a barley cake, having baked it in their sight over human dung."
13 Then the LORD said, "Thus shall the sons of Israel eat their bread unclean among the nations where I shall banish them."
14 But I said, "Ah, Lord GOD ! Behold, I have never been defiled; for from my youth until now I have never eaten what died of itself or was torn by beasts, nor has any unclean meat ever entered my mouth."
15 Then He said to me, "See, I shall give you cow's dung in place of human dung over which you will prepare your bread."

And again as was stated before... this was not a command for the people. It was a command to Ezekiel to do as an object lesson (for lack of a better term) to the people of Israel.

[Kahtar]

Kahtar

I would say everything we do must be governed by this principle.

Well, yes, but that doesn't really answer my question, does it? It almost does, though. 'everything we do' = what? What do we do?
Is it enough to just SAY we love our neighbor? Or is it enough to just FEEL love in our hearts toward our neighbor? Or are we expected to DO something as well?
James 2:14-18 What [doth it] profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him? (15) If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food, (16) And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be [ye] warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what [doth it] profit? (17) Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. (18) Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.

Another question: We are not saved by works. We all know this. Would you agree that that same principle applies to the law of Christ as well as the law of Moses? Will keeping the law of Christ save you? Or are you putting yourself under the law by keeping the law of Christ?

God is triune. God the Father and God the Son are one and the same God. Therefore the law of God and the law of Christ would be the same law, would it not?

I don't really expect anyone to answer these. No one has answered my questions in this thread yet. But I'll ask them anyway. Perhaps it will cause some to think beyond their narrow little boxes.

[Firstfruits]

Well, yes, but that doesn't really answer my question, does it? It almost does, though. 'everything we do' = what? What do we do?
Is it enough to just SAY we love our neighbor? Or is it enough to just FEEL love in our hearts toward our neighbor? Or are we expected to DO something as well?
James 2:14-18 What [doth it] profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him? (15) If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food, (16) And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be [ye] warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what [doth it] profit? (17) Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. (18) Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.

Another question: We are not saved by works. We all know this. Would you agree that that same principle applies to the law of Christ as well as the law of Moses? Will keeping the law of Christ save you? Or are you putting yourself under the law by keeping the law of Christ?

God is triune. God the Father and God the Son are one and the same God. Therefore the law of God and the law of Christ would be the same law, would it not?

I don't really expect anyone to answer these. No one has answered my questions in this thread yet. But I'll ask them anyway. Perhaps it will cause some to think beyond their narrow little boxes.

Though we are not saved by works, however we are to show love to one another.

Heb 6:10 For God is not unrighteous to forget your work and labour of love, which ye have shewed toward his name, in that ye have ministered to the saints, and do minister.

1 Thess 1:3 Remembering without ceasing your work of faith, and labour of love, and patience of hope in our Lord Jesus Christ, in the sight of God and our Father;

1 Cor 15:58 Therefore, my beloved brethren, be ye stedfast, unmoveable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, forasmuch as ye know that your labour is not in vain in the Lord.

Eph 4:28 Let him that stole steal no more: but rather let him labour, working with his hands the thing which is good, that he may have to give to him that needeth.

I hope that answers your question.

Firstfruits

[Kahtar]

Answers one or two of them. Thanks FF.

[Firstfruits]

Answers one or two of them. Thanks FF.

God is triune. God the Father and God the Son are one and the same God. Therefore the law of God and the law of Christ would be the same law, would it not?

If they are the same then why can we not be justified by doing what is written in the law whereas we can be justified by doing what Jesus has commanded?

Acts 13:39 And by him all that believe are justified from all things, from which ye could not be justified by the law of Moses.

Gal 6:2 Bear ye one another's burdens, and so fulfil the law of Christ.

Can you fulfil the law of Moses by showing love to on another?

Heb 8:9 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued Not in my covenant, and I regarded them Not, saith the Lord.

They are not the same.

Firstfruits

[Kahtar]

If they are the same then why can we not be justified by doing what is written in the law whereas we can be justified by doing what Jesus has commanded?

Where does it say we are justified by fulfilling the law of Christ? We are not justified by our works, whether they be according to the old or new covenant. We are justified by faith in Christ. Period. But our works show our faith. Acts 13:39 And by him all that believe are justified from all things, from which ye could not be justified by the law of Moses.

Can you fulfil the law of Moses by showing love to on another?

Yes, you can. Because, as Jesus said, all the law and prophets hang upon the two, loving God and loving neighbor. And the OT law SAID to love God and love neighbor.
Only thing is, you cannot perfectly fulfill the law of God, be it through the old or the new covenant. You cannot perfectly fulfill the law of Christ either (which, since Christ IS God, is therefore the law of God). But THAT is the reason Christ came.

If you closely examine the 613 laws of the old covenant, you will find that each of them fits into one of two categories, either loving God, or loving neighbor.
The law written upon stone is the physical law. The law written upon our hearts is the spiritual law. The physical law said 'You shall not kill', the spiritual law says 'If you are even angry with your brother without a cause, you have already killed him in your heart'.
The physical law says 'Don't kill your brother'. The Spiritual law says 'Bring life to your brother'.
The physical law says 'Don't steal from your brother', the spiritual law says 'Give to your brother'. Etc.
The physical law was simply physical, carried out in the physical realm. The spiritual law is a matter of our heart, and carried out in both realms.
For instance, you can religiously, physically go out and feed the hungry. But God looks not at your action, but what's in your heart. If you feed the hungry all the while begrudging him, ridiculing him, hating him in your heart, you have wasted your effort.
The Jews were sacrificing, but their hearts were far from God. They were fulfilling the law outwardly, but inwardly, they were ravening wolves and whited sepulchers. That is what the new covenant changed.
We are still to feed the hungry, but the REASON we are doing it is the determining factor. Are we seeking the praise of men, or of God? Are we religiously going through the motions, or is our desire to show them the love of God?
The old covenant required the sacrificing of lambs. The one bringing the sacrifice would place his hands upon the head of the lamb to 'transfer' his sins to the lamb. The lamb is then sacrificed, in the place of he who brought it.
The new covenant requires the acceptance of the Lamb that was slain. The one accepting the Sacrifice in effect embraces the Lamb, and 'transfers' his sin to the Lamb. The Lamb was sacrificed in the place of we who accept His gift of death in our place.

[Coptichristian]

Eze 4:9-16
12 Prepare and eat this food as you would barley cakes. While all the people are watching, bake it over a fire using dried human dung as fuel and then eat the bread." 13 Then the Lord said, "This is how Israel will eat defiled bread in the Gentile lands to which I will banish them!"
14 Then I said, "O Sovereign Lord, must I be defiled by using human dung? For I have never been defiled before. From the time I was a child until now I have never eaten any animal that died of sickness or was killed by other animals. I have never eaten any meat forbidden by the law."
15 "All right," the Lord said. "You may bake your bread with cow dung as fuel instead of human dung."
Holy Bible, New Living Translation ®, copyright © 1996, 2004 by Tyndale Charitable Trust. Used by permission of Tyndale House Publishers. All rights reserved.

If that does not answer the question for you, then .

The NLT? Oh boy. Talk about adding to God's word! Please show me the Hebrew word in this passage which should be translated as "fuel". e

Also, roadwarrior, did you see my last post to you cocnerning the deleted thread? Peace

[Firstfruits]

Where does it say we are justified by fulfilling the law of Christ? We are not justified by our works, whether they be according to the old or new covenant. We are justified by faith in Christ. Period. But our works show our faith. Acts 13:39 And by him all that believe are justified from all things, from which ye could not be justified by the law of Moses.




Yes, you can. Because, as Jesus said, all the law and prophets hang upon the two, loving God and loving neighbor. And the OT law SAID to love God and love neighbor.
Only thing is, you cannot perfectly fulfill the law of God, be it through the old or the new covenant. You cannot perfectly fulfill the law of Christ either (which, since Christ IS God, is therefore the law of God). But THAT is the reason Christ came.

If you closely examine the 613 laws of the old covenant, you will find that each of them fits into one of two categories, either loving God, or loving neighbor.
The law written upon stone is the physical law. The law written upon our hearts is the spiritual law. The physical law said 'You shall not kill', the spiritual law says 'If you are even angry with your brother without a cause, you have already killed him in your heart'.
The physical law says 'Don't kill your brother'. The Spiritual law says 'Bring life to your brother'.
The physical law says 'Don't steal from your brother', the spiritual law says 'Give to your brother'. Etc.
The physical law was simply physical, carried out in the physical realm. The spiritual law is a matter of our heart, and carried out in both realms.
For instance, you can religiously, physically go out and feed the hungry. But God looks not at your action, but what's in your heart. If you feed the hungry all the while begrudging him, ridiculing him, hating him in your heart, you have wasted your effort.
The Jews were sacrificing, but their hearts were far from God. They were fulfilling the law outwardly, but inwardly, they were ravening wolves and whited sepulchers. That is what the new covenant changed.
We are still to feed the hungry, but the REASON we are doing it is the determining factor. Are we seeking the praise of men, or of God? Are we religiously going through the motions, or is our desire to show them the love of God?
The old covenant required the sacrificing of lambs. The one bringing the sacrifice would place his hands upon the head of the lamb to 'transfer' his sins to the lamb. The lamb is then sacrificed, in the place of he who brought it.
The new covenant requires the acceptance of the Lamb that was slain. The one accepting the Sacrifice in effect embraces the Lamb, and 'transfers' his sin to the Lamb. The Lamb was sacrificed in the place of we who accept His gift of death in our place.

So you do not have to keep anything else in the law of Moses as long as you love and show love to one another? This as we know fulfils the law of Christ, does the same apply to the law of Moses?

Firstfruits

[Firstfruits]

Where does it say we are justified by fulfilling the law of Christ? We are not justified by our works, whether they be according to the old or new covenant. We are justified by faith in Christ. Period. But our works show our faith. Acts 13:39 And by him all that believe are justified from all things, from which ye could not be justified by the law of Moses.




Yes, you can. Because, as Jesus said, all the law and prophets hang upon the two, loving God and loving neighbor. And the OT law SAID to love God and love neighbor.
Only thing is, you cannot perfectly fulfill the law of God, be it through the old or the new covenant. You cannot perfectly fulfill the law of Christ either (which, since Christ IS God, is therefore the law of God). But THAT is the reason Christ came.

If you closely examine the 613 laws of the old covenant, you will find that each of them fits into one of two categories, either loving God, or loving neighbor.
The law written upon stone is the physical law. The law written upon our hearts is the spiritual law. The physical law said 'You shall not kill', the spiritual law says 'If you are even angry with your brother without a cause, you have already killed him in your heart'.
The physical law says 'Don't kill your brother'. The Spiritual law says 'Bring life to your brother'.
The physical law says 'Don't steal from your brother', the spiritual law says 'Give to your brother'. Etc.
The physical law was simply physical, carried out in the physical realm. The spiritual law is a matter of our heart, and carried out in both realms.
For instance, you can religiously, physically go out and feed the hungry. But God looks not at your action, but what's in your heart. If you feed the hungry all the while begrudging him, ridiculing him, hating him in your heart, you have wasted your effort.
The Jews were sacrificing, but their hearts were far from God. They were fulfilling the law outwardly, but inwardly, they were ravening wolves and whited sepulchers. That is what the new covenant changed.
We are still to feed the hungry, but the REASON we are doing it is the determining factor. Are we seeking the praise of men, or of God? Are we religiously going through the motions, or is our desire to show them the love of God?
The old covenant required the sacrificing of lambs. The one bringing the sacrifice would place his hands upon the head of the lamb to 'transfer' his sins to the lamb. The lamb is then sacrificed, in the place of he who brought it.
The new covenant requires the acceptance of the Lamb that was slain. The one accepting the Sacrifice in effect embraces the Lamb, and 'transfers' his sin to the Lamb. The Lamb was sacrificed in the place of we who accept His gift of death in our place.

The first question has already been answered.

Heb 6:10 For God is not unrighteous to forget your work and labour of love, which ye have shewed toward his name, in that ye have ministered to the saints, and do minister.

1 Thess 1:3 Remembering without ceasing your work of faith, and labour of love, and patience of hope in our Lord Jesus Christ, in the sight of God and our Father;

1 Cor 15:58 Therefore, my beloved brethren, be ye stedfast, unmoveable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, forasmuch as ye know that your labour is not in vain in the Lord.

Eph 4:28 Let him that stole steal no more: but rather let him labour, working with his hands the thing which is good, that he may have to give to him that needeth.

Firstfruits

[Firstfruits]

The NLT? Oh boy. Talk about adding to God's word! Please show me the Hebrew word in this passage which should be translated as "fuel". e

Also, roadwarrior, did you see my last post to you cocnerning the deleted thread? Peace

Is this what you are looking for?

Ezek 4:15 Then he said unto me, Lo, I have given thee cow's dung for man's dung, and thou shalt prepare thy bread therewith.

Firstfruits

[Coptichristian]

Yes, firstfruits.

[Firstfruits]

Yes, firstfruits.

What do you think was the reason for God to say as he did?

Ezek 4:15 Then he said unto me, Lo, I have given thee cow's dung for man's dung, and thou shalt prepare thy bread therewith.

Firstfruits

[Philip dT]

Well, yes, but that doesn't really answer my question, does it? It almost does, though. 'everything we do' = what? What do we do?
Is it enough to just SAY we love our neighbor? Or is it enough to just FEEL love in our hearts toward our neighbor? Or are we expected to DO something as well?

James 2:14-18 What [doth it] profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him? (15) If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food, (16) And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be [ye] warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what [doth it] profit? (17) Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. (18) Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.

The fact that we live by the principle of love and not the letter of the law means:

1) the way we approach ethics and morality starts with the right attitude / heart
2) we can only accomplish this by the work of love of God's Spirit within us.
3) this principle encompasses all situations and all scenario's (more than all the laws of the letter could ever do).

Another question: We are not saved by works. We all know this. Would you agree that that same principle applies to the law of Christ as well as the law of Moses? Will keeping the law of Christ save you? Or are you putting yourself under the law by keeping the law of Christ?

The fundamental difference between the law of Christ and the law of Moses, is that the law of love is a all-inclusive principle, in the domain of freedom and spirit. The law of Moses was in the domain of the letter, and only a trainer to Christ (Gal 3:23-26) until Christ who is the end of the written law for those who believe. As Paul points out in Romans 5 through 7, the law of Moses is considered as the law of sin and death.

(explained in post # 746 on http://bibleforums.org/showthread.php?t=135926&page=50 )

Rom 7:6 "But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter."

We are not under the law of the letter any more (Rom 6:15), which is the law of Moses, but under the law of faith and love: that is the law of the spirit / Spirit (Rom 8:2).

God is triune. God the Father and God the Son are one and the same God. Therefore the law of God and the law of Christ would be the same law, would it not?

The fact that the command of love is called "Christ's law" does not mean it is only Christ's law, as if seperate from the other Persons. The same triune God established all covenants (marked by laws). It is not God that changed, the covenants has. The new covenant renders the old covenant of the letter obsolete, ready to vanish away (Heb 8:13).

[RoadWarrior]

Also, roadwarrior, did you see my last post to you cocnerning the deleted thread? Peace

You have been sent a message regarding the moved thread. It veered into a subject that did not fit in BC, but in World Religions. Please check your messages.

[Coptichristian]

roadwarrior,

I am unable to view any messages that I might have. Do I have insufficient privileges to do so?