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Thread: What does this mean, Jesus nailed the ordinances to His cross?

  1. #1
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    Question What does this mean, Jesus nailed the ordinances to His cross?

    Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross..." Romans 2:14 Anyone wish to expound on what this means and the ramafications relating to us?

  2. #2
    By the way it's Colossians 2:14. Hope this helps.

    "Col. 2:14 the record of debt that stood against us. In the Greco-Roman world, the “record of debt” (Gk. cheirographon) was a written note of indebtedness. Paul uses this as a word picture to characterize each person's indebtedness to God because of sin. God himself has mercifully resolved this problem for all who put their faith in Jesus by taking this note and nailing it to the cross, where Jesus paid the debt. The image comes from the notice fastened to a cross by the Roman authorities, declaring the crime for which the criminal was being executed (see John 19:19–22)."

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    Quote Originally Posted by -SEEKING- View Post
    By the way it's Colossians 2:14.
    Of course you realize I knew that, uh? Just a slip! I will read you post in earnest when I get up from my nap.

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    When Christ died on the Cross, all physical ordinances such as water baptism, the Passover Supper, divers washings {baptisms} Sabbath keeping, all 600 and all other ordinances including the law were done away with. All were types and Shadows of Christ. Now that we have the reality, Christ and if we put our faith in Him completely, minus any physical ordinances we have salvation. God then sees Christ's fulfilling the Law and all of it requirements paid in full by Christ's righteousness for us. That makes us just as Holy and righteous as God himself except for our flesh that will go to the grave. However those who place themselves under works such as water baptism will not find grace for salvation because grace and works are against each other. If a many works for salvation in any other way then he has broken the law just by being born into sin and can't please God with works. Also we can't please God with any kind of ordinances after being born again, other then in spirit only, for grace and water laws still apply after salvation because again the law and ordinances are still abolished. How that effects modern Christianity puts it in the toilet because man has invented its own ordinances such as communion, Sunday Sabbath, water baptism as a show of faith, with it denominational holy days; none of this is found in scripture. We can't please God with works before salvation and we can't please God with works {physical ordinances} after salvation that are done with the flesh for all ordinances require works of the flesh.

    Philippians 3:3 *For we are the circumcision, which worship God in the spirit, and rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh.
    Here is the proof:

    Ephesians 2:15 *Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;

    Since through faith we have peace with God, why return again to the elements of the law?

    Galatians 4:9 *But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?


    Romans 3:27 *Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith.
    28 *Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.


    These two verses alone put man's ordinances of none effect because if we can't be justified before salvation by works, wither they are so called Christian ordinances, which by the way are not found in Scripture. So they are not going to be any more value after salvation. God wants us to walk in his word after salvations such as having unity of the spirit. We are not under any kind of Bondage after Salvation. We are to do all in Christ's name {Our family name} after salvation. Not many do for the identify with other names.

    Colossians 3:17 *And whatsoever ye do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus, giving thanks to God and the Father by him.


    These are the kind of commandments believers are to be subject to. God says its our responsibility to find out his will with this next commandment.

    2 Timothy 2:15 *Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

    Here is another example:

    2 Timothy 2:16 *But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness.

    God also does not want us to add so called Christian ordinances for if he did He would have told us to. It would also been against His instructions for us in the Church.

    Romans 10:17 *So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

    Romans 14:23 *And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin.


    I hope the above may be a blessing to those with water on their heart.

    Tomlane

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sojourner View Post
    Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross..." Romans 2:14 Anyone wish to expound on what this means and the ramafications relating to us?
    Rom 7:1 Know ye not, brethren, (for I speak to them that know the law,) how that the law hath dominion over a man as long as he liveth?

    If Christ by his death is dead to the law then we through his death are also dead to the law as it is written.

    Rom 7:4 Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.

    God bless you!

    Firstfruits

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    Paul here is making a reference to a Second Temple Jewish belief that there were angels writing down every sin and deed that people did. But when Jesus dies and is raised for us he takes away the books and pens of the angels which are the powers and authorities in verse 15. Jesus takes their jobs from them making them a public spectacle. Some debate where these angels were in heaven or hell/hades/she'ol/under the earth.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sojourner View Post
    Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross..." Romans 2:14 Anyone wish to expound on what this means and the ramafications relating to us?
    Greetings Sojourner,

    In ancient times the way a written bond, or debt was cancelled was by driving a nail through it. In this way the obligation was paid, or fulfilled. If this is what is meant, this expression means that the obligation of the Jewish laws ceased on the death of Jesus, as if He had taken them and nailed them to His own cross, in the manner in which a bond or debt was cancelled.

    He "blotted out" the transgression contained in the law of commandments and ordinances that He might reconcile us to God.

    Eph 2:15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;
    Eph 2:16 And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:

    Many Blessings,
    RW

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    RW, would you agree that when people today state we have christian ordinances like water baptism, wouldn't that be adding to God's word since only water baptism {as a washng} was mentioned after the law was nailed to the cross and all ordinances were abolished?

    Thanks, I will look forward to your answer,

    Tomlane

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tomlane View Post
    RW, would you agree that when people today state we have christian ordinances like water baptism, wouldn't that be adding to God's word since only water baptism {as a washng} was mentioned after the law was nailed to the cross and all ordinances were abolished? Tomlane
    Except for one thing, the Lord commanded it.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Tomlane View Post
    RW, would you agree that when people today state we have christian ordinances like water baptism, wouldn't that be adding to God's word since only water baptism {as a washng} was mentioned after the law was nailed to the cross and all ordinances were abolished?

    Thanks, I will look forward to your answer,

    Tomlane
    Greetings Tom,

    While I agree with you that water baptism is not necessary for salvation, I cannot agree that Christ did not institute water baptism and the Lord's Supper. I find biblical support for both these ordinances Christ gave His universal church during her sojourn in time. The problem is not with the ordinances, but rather with how we interpret or misinterpret the ordinances. Christ said, "Go ye therefore....baptizing them" and "This cup is the new testament in my blood: this do ye, as oft as ye drink it, in remembrance of me"..."ye do shew the Lord's death till he come."

    Many Blessings,
    RW

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    Sojourner, Just because you said The Lord commanded it; does not make it so. That is just an opinion. Do you base your religion on opinions?

    1 Thessalonians 5:21 Prove all things; hold fast that which is good.

    Can you prove it Sojourner?

    Tomlane

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tomlane View Post
    Sojourner, Just because you said The Lord commanded it; does not make it so. That is just an opinion. Do you base your religion on opinions?

    1 Thessalonians 5:21 Prove all things; hold fast that which is good.

    Can you prove it Sojourner?

    Tomlane
    Hello! Jesus said, Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: Matt. 28:19 That's in the mission field and a local church. I guess I'm not understanding, how clearer could it be.

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    Hi RW, I was afraid you were going to state that.

    But this is what this place is for my friend.

    Here is why I believe that doctrine is in error. The scriptures you quoted {and I do thank you for using scripture} is that the Kingdom was still being offered to Israel, when the Church as not even revealed yet as the Lord gave Paul that job to do. Can't you see the Lord kept the Kingdom separate from the church? That is why Paul gave the mystery of the Church while Christ fulfilled prophesy concerning the Kingdom. Water baptism was for repentance and never for salvation nor was it an outward sign of an inward work as the Baptist like to chant. Also you don't have the signs that were given for that command that are found in Mark 16.

    The way I see this misunderstanding is that people don't realize they are free from ordinances because we are under grace. Also, all ordinances were abolished and it never says all except for water and the so called Lord supper that is really the Passover feast that has been so twisted out of meaning. I'm sure you have heard these position many times and you're going to cling to it like a lost brother. Oh well.

    Sorry RW, but your proof doesn't hold water.

    But I sure appreciate your reply.

    Tomlane

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    Hi again Sojourner, and thank you for your quick reply.

    Hi again Hello! Jesus said, Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: Matt. 28:19 That's in the mission field and a local church. I guess I'm not understanding, how clearer could it be.
    I had a feeling that was going to be your answer.

    Mark 16:17 And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
    18 They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.


    How come you ignore the above scripture because that says you have to have these signs that will follow those who do this command and you don't have a one of them?

    The reason why is because this was doing business for Israel and not the church. The church was none existent at that time. That job was given to the new kid on the block, Paul the Apostle and Paul made it plan he baptized very few. The reason being that through inspired revelation Paul learned water baptism was abolished.

    Ephesians 2:15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;

    We have peace with God because Christ did it all for us. How can you add to perfection unless its with unbelief?

    1 Corinthians 1:14 ¶I thank God that I baptized none of you, but Crispus and Gaius;
    15 Lest any should say that I had baptized in mine own name.
    16 And I baptized also the household of Stephanas: besides, I know not whether I baptized any other.
    17 ¶For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect.
    18 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.

    Shouldn't we be more concerned with preaching the cross to them that are perishing then showing how we have confidence in our flesh and do physical ordinances that water down the word of Salvation?Wouldn't we do better to worship God in spirit rather than with physical ordinances that have been abolished?

    Philippians 3:3 For we are the circumcision, which worship God in the spirit, and rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh.


    Thanks again Sojourner, I do really appreciate your answer.

    Tomlane

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sojourner View Post
    Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross..." Romans 2:14 Anyone wish to expound on what this means and the ramafications relating to us?
    Hopefully you are talking about Ephesians 2:14 or what I am about to say won't make much sense.

    Here is the passage in context.

    But now in Christ Jesus you who formerly were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ. For He Himself is our peace, who made both [groups into] one and broke down the barrier of the dividing wall, by abolishing in His flesh the enmity, [which is] the Law of commandments [contained] in ordinances, so that in Himself He might make the two into one new man, [thus] establishing peace, and might reconcile them both in one body to God through the cross, by it having put to death the enmity. And He came and preached peace to you who were far away, and peace to those who were near; for through Him we both have our access in one Spirit to the Father. Ephesians 2:13-18

    I think the previous few sentences are Paul's build up to his concluding statement of this paragraph. He makes the point that both Jews and Gentiles have access to the Father via the Spirit. Notice the building blocks of Paul's case, which I will form as a list.

    1. Jesus brought near those who were once far away.

    2. Jesus is our peace, uniting two groups into one new group.

    3. Jesus metaphorically broke down the dividing wall.

    4. The two groups became united in the body of Christ.

    I believe the two groups were the Jews and the Gentiles. The Gentiles, who were far away, could not unite with the Jews and maintain their cultural/national/ethnic identity because in order for a Gentile to gain access to God he had to stop being a Gentile and become a Jew.

    During this time there were Gentiles who loved and feared God and lived according to moral principles, but did not convert to Judaism. These were called "God fearers." These were not allowed to have access to the temple, even though they love and respected God, due to the fact that a dividing wall existed, which kept the Gentiles from gaining access under penalty of death. We read about this in Acts 21:28 where some accused Paul of bringing a Gentile past the wall into the temple.

    On the wall was a sign, which contained a written decree (an ordinance) specifying that Gentiles were subject to the death penalty if they entered beyond the dividing wall.

    Paul is saying that Christ reconciled the two groups, i.e. Jews and Gentiles making them into one new group through his blood on the cross and in Christ, both Jew and Gentile have access to the Father in the Spirit. Metaphorically speaking, Christ destroyed the dividing wall that separated Jews from Gentiles and nailed the decree specifying "death to those Gentiles who enter" to his cross. Gentiles didn't need to become Jews, and thus enter the temple grounds in order to gain access to the Father, because Christ made it possible for both Gentiles and Jews to gain access through the Spirit of God.

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