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Thread: Mental illness

  1. #1

    Mental illness

    Is it possible that some of people that were considered in the Bible to have demons really just had a mental illness that Jesus cured? Like in Mark 5:1 where He casts out Legion, He makes it very clear it was demons but is it possible that the people back then just thought anyone who acted weird was possessed? I mean with all the things we know now, Bi-polar disorder, autism, Split-personality, Schizophrenia etc. Couldn't it be possible most people took these for demonic possessions? And that brings up the question of whether someone with a mental illness is held accountable for their sins and actions.

  2. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffinator View Post
    Is it possible that some of people that were considered in the Bible to have demons really just had a mental illness that Jesus cured? Like in Mark 5:1 where He casts out Legion, He makes it very clear it was demons but is it possible that the people back then just thought anyone who acted weird was possessed? I mean with all the things we know now, Bi-polar disorder, autism, Split-personality, Schizophrenia etc. Couldn't it be possible most people took these for demonic possessions? And that brings up the question of whether someone with a mental illness is held accountable for their sins and actions.


    No.

    You are thinking backwards. We don't know anything about truth, human wisdom is foolishness (1 Corinthians 3:19), we just make up labels for things we don't understand. God knows truth and Scripture is God breathed (2 Tim 3:16).

    What we call mental illness is very often just people displaying exaggerated amounts of normal human emotion, due to poor parenting or societal abuse. Quite often though, it is demon possession or attack. The next time you walk down the street and some homeless person is yelling incoherencies at some un-seen entity, don't kid yourself. That person is talking to a demon.

    It is erroneous to think that we know more that people 2,000 years ago about the nature of humanity. Read the philosophers of the time.

    If the Bible says 'demon' it means 'demon'. God knows what He's talking about and you have to get your truth from scripture and apply it to the world, not the other way around.

    "Stop trusting in man, who has but a breath in his nostrils. Of what account is he?" (Isaiah 2:22).

    We are all accountable for our actions. Just because our "pass-the-buck" society has decided that justice doesn't need to be served if someone had a reason for committing a crime doesn't mean we don't have choice, and we will all be held accontable in the end.

    By the way, has schizophrenia even enabled someone to break chains with their bare hands? Since metal is harder than bone this is a physical impossibility unless some unknown agent is at work. The answers are in the text.

  3. #3
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    "I mean with all the things we know now, Bi-polar disorder, autism, Split-personality, Schizophrenia etc. "

    Back in the day, they didn't have clinical definitions, they had Jesus.

    Do you think GOD created us that way from the begining? No, we were made perfect.

    Is it good that man suffers from disease?, No, we were made perfect.

    Anything Bad and could harm us is not from GOD so if it's not from GOD where did it come from?

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryan R View Post

    No.

    You are thinking backwards. We don't know anything about truth, human wisdom is foolishness (1 Corinthians 3:19), we just make up labels for things we don't understand. God knows truth and Scripture is God breathed (2 Tim 3:16).

    What we call mental illness is very often just people displaying exaggerated amounts of normal human emotion, due to poor parenting or societal abuse. Quite often though, it is demon possession or attack. The next time you walk down the street and some homeless person is yelling incoherencies at some un-seen entity, don't kid yourself. That person is talking to a demon.

    It is erroneous to think that we know more that people 2,000 years ago about the nature of humanity. Read the philosophers of the time.

    If the Bible says 'demon' it means 'demon'. God knows what He's talking about and you have to get your truth from scripture and apply it to the world, not the other way around.

    "Stop trusting in man, who has but a breath in his nostrils. Of what account is he?" (Isaiah 2:22).

    We are all accountable for our actions. Just because our "pass-the-buck" society has decided that justice doesn't need to be served if someone had a reason for committing a crime doesn't mean we don't have choice, and we will all be held accontable in the end.

    By the way, has schizophrenia even enabled someone to break chains with their bare hands? Since metal is harder than bone this is a physical impossibility unless some unknown agent is at work. The answers are in the text.
    Wow. You must have a psychology degree, or maybe even a doctorate to speak on the subject with such authority and certainty? I'd be curious to know how many other Christians share a few of the radical opinions expressed above.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Philemon9 View Post
    Wow. You must have a psychology degree, or maybe even a doctorate to speak on the subject with such authority and certainty? I'd be curious to know how many other Christians share a few of the radical opinions expressed above.

    I second that emotion. It was pretty harsh to say the least. A degree??

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Mighty Sword View Post
    I second that emotion. It was pretty harsh to say the least. A degree??
    Really. I take it Ryan R has no friends or family with actual, medically diagnosed mental conditions or else he could simply tell them to stop pretending and/or exorcise the demon. I mean why do we even train psychologists in every college in the world? It's all made up right? How about Down's Syndrome - people with that condition sure are dedicated to their "story".

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    Quote Originally Posted by Philemon9 View Post
    Really. I take it Ryan R has no friends or family with actual, medically diagnosed mental conditions or else he could simply tell them to stop pretending and/or exorcise the demon. I mean why do we even train psychologists in every college in the world? It's all made up right? How about Down's Syndrome - people with that condition sure are dedicated to their "story".

    I don't know! But I do know it can be brought to his attention gently, as an example, as a Christian, wouldn't you agree?

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    Recommended lectures on mental illness

    For a balanced assessment of this topic covering both medical and spiritual aspects, I recommend a series of 6 lectures by Dr David P. Murray available for free download in audio, video and text formats on sermonaudio.com

    The first lecture, at http://www.sermonaudio.com/sermoninf...SID=6280684224 , gives an overview of the issues while the other five sermons go into certain aspects in more detail.
    Last edited by doug3; Sep 11th 2009 at 09:21 PM. Reason: Lectures on mental illness
    Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or danger, or sword? As it is written, ‘For your sake we are being killed all the day long; we are regarded as sheep to be slaughtered.’ No, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him who loved us. For I am sure that neither death nor life, nor angels nor rulers, nor things present nor things to come, nor powers, nor height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus our Lord.
    Rm 8:35-39

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Philemon9 View Post
    Wow. You must have a psychology degree, or maybe even a doctorate to speak on the subject with such authority and certainty? I'd be curious to know how many other Christians share a few of the radical opinions expressed above.


    A psychology degree? Philemon9, what did I just say? Didn't I just say that people have no knowledge? Wouldn't a psychology degree be an excellent example of one of those labels I just referred to? Would it make you feel better to know that I've designed coursework used for university psychology classes, that I was a contributor to a government document on brain injury, as well as a book on behavior modification and the psychology of brain wiring? It true, but it doesn't really matter, does it? Because it doesn't mean I know anything, does it? Why? Because I have no authority. The Bible has authority.

    Psychology is not evidence based and its not results based. There are about 500 different approaches to psychoanalysis, and none of them are accountable to any kind of standard of scientific rigor. None of them are shown to work any better than any other. The success of psychologists is comparable to the success of lay people in counseling when field tested. A study from the University of India showed that any culturally sanctioned figure will achieve similar results, including witchdoctors who achieve the results in a much shorter time. You want references on any of this? Would you read them? Believe them? Probably not, and why would you? It's just more human wisdom.

    What you ought to believe is the Bible. If the Bible says 'demon' and you say 'mental illness' you are calling God a liar. Look at Job. Will you 'gird up your loins like a man' when He calls out to you? Don't you have any fear?

    You have responded to my posts a number of times, and I have yet to see scripture even referenced. Have you read it? If so, where is the evidence of it in your communication?

    What difference would it make if I was the only one in the world to hold to these opinions? How many were with Elijah? The whole world can be wrong and scripture will still be right.

    If you have any kind of scriptural foundation for your objection, please, let me have it. You don't need to respect anything I say, but if the Bible says it, then believe it.

    No go ahead, show me how I'm wrong.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by The Mighty Sword View Post
    I don't know! But I do know it can be brought to his attention gently, as an example, as a Christian, wouldn't you agree?


    I like how your insinuation is that sarcasm is gentle.

    If that's gentle, then buckle up for a whole lot of gentle!

    I'm kidding.

    Seriously though, don't undersell the danger of re-writing God's Word. Any idea that we're smart enough to know better than the superstitions the Holy Spirit used back in the day is to accuse God of lying.

    I am a Christian, and my first commandment is love God. I love other Christians a lot, but you all come second. You understand I'm sure.


  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Philemon9 View Post
    Really. I take it Ryan R has no friends or family with actual, medically diagnosed mental conditions or else he could simply tell them to stop pretending and/or exorcise the demon. I mean why do we even train psychologists in every college in the world? It's all made up right? How about Down's Syndrome - people with that condition sure are dedicated to their "story".


    You talk a lot without research. I'm pleased to remind you that you don't know anything about my friends or family, nor my experience with exorcism.

    Nice straw man on the Down Syndrome.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryan R View Post

    I like how your insinuation is that sarcasm is gentle.

    If that's gentle, then buckle up for a whole lot of gentle!

    I'm kidding.

    Seriously though, don't undersell the danger of re-writing God's Word. Any idea that we're smart enough to know better than the superstitions the Holy Spirit used back in the day is to accuse God of lying.

    I am a Christian, and my first commandment is love God. I love other Christians a lot, but you all come second. You understand I'm sure.
    I'm not going to disagree with you concering The Word, but when an Individual is asking for help, then help, softly, words are very important and I'll leave that with you to ponder.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by The Mighty Sword View Post
    I'm not going to disagree with you concering The Word, but when an Individual is asking for help, then help, softly, words are very important and I'll leave that with you to ponder.
    Point taken.

    Sorry Jeffinator if I came across too harshly.

    If you know about my posts, I'm very convinced that Jesus is coming back really quickly and we don't have much time. The Word is inerrant and very important and I would like that point to be clear.

    Don't let my tone turn you off of my answer. I panic about each one of us facing the Judgement seat of Christ and having to account for every careless word, myself included.

    Blessings.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryan R View Post
    Point taken.

    Sorry Jeffinator if I came across too harshly.

    If you know anything about my posts, I'm very convinced that Jesus is coming back really quickly and we don't have much time. The Word is inerrant and very important and I would like that point to be clear.

    Don't let my tone turn you off of my answer. I panic about each one of us facing the Judgement seat of Christ and having to account for every careless word, myself included.

    Blessings.

    Humbleness is right there next to Godliness, U da man.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by The Mighty Sword View Post
    Humbleness is right there next to Godliness, U da man.
    Thanks. If that's what I've got when I see Him I'll be blessed indeed!

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