Angel Of The Bottomless Pit?

**Samuel Cripps** · Nov 25th 2009, 04:36 PM

Originally Posted by Firstfruits

Where did the angel of the bottomless pit come from if not from the bottomless pit?

Firstfruits

Heaven. Read Revelation 9:1 again.

***Nihil Obstat*** · Nov 25th 2009, 04:37 PM

Originally Posted by Firstfruits

According to the scriptures the only ones that have the seal of God are of Israel, so all that do not have the seal of God will face the torments from God...

Will they not have to attack their own, since they will not have the seal of God either?

Attack their own? I'm not following you. Babylon in Revelation is not Jerusalem. The locusts (Babylon) come upon those who do not have the seal of God on their foreheads (apostate Israel). Does this help to clarify what I'm saying?

**Samuel Cripps** · Nov 25th 2009, 04:44 PM

Firstfruits,

Do you realize that the bottomless pit is simply the abode of the dead, i.e. sheol/hades? The Greek word abyssos is what is translated as "bottomless pit" in the KJV. This same word appears in Romans 10:7 where it is translated as "the deep":

"Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ again from the dead.)"

***Firstfruits*** · Nov 25th 2009, 04:46 PM

Originally Posted by Samuel Cripps

FF,

Please read this brief and thought-provoking article and tell me what you think.

http://www.quotedstatements.com/Bible-Files/abaddon.htm

Thanks Samuel,

According to the scripture is the key to the bottomless pit given to the fifth angel, and it is the 5th angel that opens the bottomless pit?

Rev 9:1 And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit.

The key is not given to the star, but to the 5th angel.

Firstfruits

**Samuel Cripps** · Nov 25th 2009, 04:47 PM

Originally Posted by Firstfruits

Thanks Samuel,

According to the scripture is the key to the bottomless pit not given to the fifth angel, and it is the 5th angel that opens the bottomless pit?

Rev 9:1 And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit.

The key is not given to the star, but to the 5th angel.

Firstfruits

Throughout the Book of Revelation, "stars" represent angels. The star that fell from Heaven is indeed the angel who was given the keys to the bottomless pit.

**Samuel Cripps** · Nov 25th 2009, 04:49 PM

Firstfruits,

Consider Revelation 1:20

"The mystery of the seven stars which thou sawest in my right hand, and the seven golden candlesticks. The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches: and the seven candlesticks which thou sawest are the seven churches."

In the Book of Revelation, stars = angels.

***John146*** · Nov 25th 2009, 04:58 PM

Originally Posted by Firstfruits

Thanks Eric,

When therefore would Satan have been put in the bottomless pit if he is released at the 5th trumpet?

God bless you!

Firstfruits

You remember that I told you in another thread that I believe Satan was bound at the cross, right? So, that would mean I believe he was cast into the bottomless pit at that time.

I also explained to you elsewhere that I don't believe the bottomless pit is a place where spirit beings are unable to move about or do anything at all. I don't see the bottomless pit as some place far from the earth that has no access to the earth. I see it as being the spirit realm outside of heaven.

I see a connection between Satan being bound and being cast out of heaven. I believe he was cast out when Christ died on the cross and rose again (John 12:31). I believe Satan's binding is something that restrains him from having the kind of power over the world that he had before Christ came (very, very few Gentiles were saved before Christ came) rather than his power being completely taken away.

***markedward*** · Nov 25th 2009, 05:15 PM

Originally Posted by Samuel Cripps

Throughout the New Testament, sheol is referred to as the abyss.

Where? I know there is one instance in which a demon begs not to be cast into the Abyss... but again, there is no connection made in that passage between Sheol/Hades and the Abyss. As you said, Hades is the given New Testament translation of the Old Testament Sheol... but there's nothing said relating the Abyss to either of them.

**Samuel Cripps** · Nov 25th 2009, 05:22 PM

Originally Posted by markedward

Where? I know there is one instance in which a demon begs not to be cast into the Abyss... but again, there is no connection made in that passage between Sheol/Hades and the Abyss. As you said, Hades is the given New Testament translation of the Old Testament Sheol... but there's nothing said relating the Abyss to either of them.

For starters:

The Greek word abyssos is what is translated as "bottomless pit" in the KJV. This same word appears in Romans 10:7 where it is translated as "the deep":

"Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ again from the dead.)"

***markedward*** · Nov 25th 2009, 05:32 PM

Great, thanks for providing that so quickly.

**Samuel Cripps** · Nov 25th 2009, 05:33 PM

Originally Posted by markedward

Great, thanks for providing that so quickly.

You're welcome. What are your thoughts on this verse?

***divaD*** · Nov 25th 2009, 05:40 PM

Originally Posted by Firstfruits

Thanks Samuel,

According to the scripture is the key to the bottomless pit given to the fifth angel, and it is the 5th angel that opens the bottomless pit?

Rev 9:1 And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit.

The key is not given to the star, but to the 5th angel.

Firstfruits

I'm not sure how you're coming to this conclusion, but the 5th angel only sounds, the 5th angel is not literally part of this scene. Also, the star that fell from heaven is not the 5th angel either, but it is to this falling star that the key of the bottomless pit is given to. That seems pretty clear according to the text. The 'him' in verse 1 belongs to the falling star, and not to the 5th angel.

***Firstfruits*** · Nov 25th 2009, 08:30 PM

Originally Posted by Samuel Cripps

Heaven. Read Revelation 9:1 again.

It is the 5th angel that is given the key to the bottomless pit, from which the angel of the pit comes after it has been opened.

Rev 9:1 And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit.

The 5th angel opens the bottomless pit, and those that come out from the pit have a leader/king.

Firstfruits

***Firstfruits*** · Nov 25th 2009, 08:36 PM

Originally Posted by divaD

I'm not sure how you're coming to this conclusion, but the 5th angel only sounds, the 5th angel is not literally part of this scene. Also, the star that fell from heaven is not the 5th angel either, but it is to this falling star that the key of the bottomless pit is given to. That seems pretty clear according to the text. The 'him' in verse 1 belongs to the falling star, and not to the 5th angel.

The 5th angel is part of the scene, since those in the pit cannot come out unless the 5th angel opens the pit with the key he has been given.

Who has the key?

Rev 20:1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.

Rev 20:3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.

Firstfruits

***Firstfruits*** · Nov 25th 2009, 08:45 PM

Originally Posted by John146

You remember that I told you in another thread that I believe Satan was bound at the cross, right? So, that would mean I believe he was cast into the bottomless pit at that time.

I also explained to you elsewhere that I don't believe the bottomless pit is a place where spirit beings are unable to move about or do anything at all. I don't see the bottomless pit as some place far from the earth that has no access to the earth. I see it as being the spirit realm outside of heaven.

I see a connection between Satan being bound and being cast out of heaven. I believe he was cast out when Christ died on the cross and rose again (John 12:31). I believe Satan's binding is something that restrains him from having the kind of power over the world that he had before Christ came (very, very few Gentiles were saved before Christ came) rather than his power being completely taken away.

If Satan is already in the pit then the beast and the false prophet must be here now, alive. All that they are to do when they are here must already have happened, and be happening now.

Why has there been no change to mankind apart from the fact that if we believe we shall have life with Christ. Sin continues and we still repent, this will not be during the millenium.

Man will refuse to repent.

Firstfruits