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Thread: Angel Of The Bottomless Pit?

  1. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firstfruits View Post
    The 5th angel is part of the scene, since those in the pit cannot come out unless the 5th angel opens the pit with the key he has been given.

    Who has the key?

    Rev 20:1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.

    Rev 20:3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.

    Firstfruits

    Revelation 9:1 And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit.

    Revelation 20:1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.

    IMO these verses are not parallel. One verse depicts the releasing of it's occupants, the other depicts the confining of occupants. There's also an angel to consider in both passages. And since it should be pretty apparent that these 2 passages are not describing parallel accounts, then neither can these angels be the same angel in both accounts, otherwise we have this same angel descending from heaven on 2 seperate occasions.


    If we make Rev 9 parallel with Rev 20, then we have to conclude that Rev 9 transpires at the beginning of the millenium, and that satan isn't bound for 1000 yrs at all, but that he's immedietly released if the 2 passages are parallel. And if one is Amil, and sees these passages as parallel, then they would have to conclude Rev 9 occured in the 1st century. I don't know if Amils see these passages as parallel, but if they do, that's what their conclusions would add up to.

  2. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Samuel Cripps View Post
    Throughout the Book of Revelation, "stars" represent angels. The star that fell from Heaven is indeed the angel who was given the keys to the bottomless pit.
    The angel of the bottomless pit is not the 5th angel.

    Firstfruits

  3. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firstfruits View Post
    If Satan is already in the pit then the beast and the false prophet must be here now, alive. All that they are to do when they are here must already have happened, and be happening now.

    Why has there been no change to mankind apart from the fact that if we believe we shall have life with Christ.
    Oh, is that all? No big change there, right?

    How many Gentiles were saved before Christ came the first time? How about after?

    Sin continues and we still repent, this will not be during the millenium.

    Man will refuse to repent.

    Firstfruits
    Where does it say that man refuses to repent during the millennium?

  4. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by divaD View Post
    Revelation 9:1 And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit.

    Revelation 20:1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.

    IMO these verses are not parallel. One verse depicts the releasing of it's occupants, the other depicts the confining of occupants. There's also an angel to consider in both passages. And since it should be pretty apparent that these 2 passages are not describing parallel accounts, then neither can these angels be the same angel in both accounts, otherwise we have this same angel descending from heaven on 2 seperate occasions.


    If we make Rev 9 parallel with Rev 20, then we have to conclude that Rev 9 transpires at the beginning of the millenium, and that satan isn't bound for 1000 yrs at all, but that he's immedietly released if the 2 passages are parallel. And if one is Amil, and sees these passages as parallel, then they would have to conclude Rev 9 occured in the 1st century. I don't know if Amils see these passages as parallel, but if they do, that's what their conclusions would add up to.
    I don't know if all amils see it this way, but I believe that Satan is loosed from the bottomless pit at the fifth trumpet. That's the connection between the two chapters that I see. So, I don't see Rev 9:1-2 as being parallel with Rev 20:1-3. In one case the pit is being opened and in the other it is being shut. Instead, I see Rev 9:1-2 being parallel with Rev 20:7.

  5. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firstfruits View Post
    It is the 5th angel that is given the key to the bottomless pit, from which the angel of the pit comes after it has been opened.

    Rev 9:1 And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit.

    The 5th angel opens the bottomless pit, and those that come out from the pit have a leader/king.

    Firstfruits
    No, it's the star that falls from heaven that is given the key of the bottomless pit. That is more easily seen in this translation (Young's Literal Translation):

    Rev 9:1 And the fifth messenger did sound, and I saw a star out of the heaven having fallen to the earth, and there was given to it the key of the pit of the abyss,

    The NIV has it right:

    1The fifth angel sounded his trumpet, and I saw a star that had fallen from the sky to the earth. The star was given the key to the shaft of the Abyss.

    Stars that fall from heaven are angels.

  6. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by Firstfruits View Post
    The angel of the bottomless pit is not the 5th angel.

    Firstfruits
    I didn't suggest otherwise. Re-read my post more carefully.

  7. #52

    Let's re-cap

    First Fruits and all,

    So what have we concluded so far?

    First, it seems clear that the angel of the bottomless pit is not Satan, for this very same angel is the one that locks up Satan for 1000 years.

    Second, it is clear that the bottomless pit is synonymous with Hades.

    So, who is this angel of the bottomless pit? Could it be Jesus? Afterall, both Jesus and this angel are said to be destroyers and to hold the keys to death and Hades.

  8. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Firstfruits View Post
    Thanks Samuel,

    According to the scripture is the key to the bottomless pit given to the fifth angel, and it is the 5th angel that opens the bottomless pit?

    Rev 9:1 And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit.

    The key is not given to the star, but to the 5th angel.

    Firstfruits

    Amplified tells me:

    THEN THE fifth angel blew [his] trumpet, and I saw a star that had fallen from the sky to the earth; and to the angel was given the key of the shaft of the Abyss (the bottomless pit).



    It is very helpful to check out other translations in order to get a better view of what scripture is really saying. In fact, it is highly recommended over entertaining the views of all and sundry. It just muddies the waters.

  9. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by astrongerthanhe View Post
    Attack their own? I'm not following you. Babylon in Revelation is not Jerusalem. The locusts (Babylon) come upon those who do not have the seal of God on their foreheads (apostate Israel). Does this help to clarify what I'm saying?
    Those that come from the pit attack all that do not have seal of God, so unless they have the seal of God they would have attack their own.

    Firstfruits

  10. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by John146 View Post
    Oh, is that all? No big change there, right?

    How many Gentiles were saved before Christ came the first time? How about after?

    Where does it say that man refuses to repent during the millennium?
    Rev 9:20 And the rest of the men which were not killed by these plagues yet repented not of the works of their hands, that they should not worship devils, and idols of gold, and silver, and brass, and stone, and of wood: which neither can see, nor hear, nor walk:

    Rev 16:9 And men were scorched with great heat, and blasphemed the name of God, which hath power over these plagues: and they repented not to give him glory.

    Rev 16:11 And blasphemed the God of heaven because of their pains and their sores, and repented not of their deeds.

    God bless you!

    Firstfruits

  11. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by divaD View Post
    Revelation 9:1 And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit.

    Revelation 20:1 And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.

    IMO these verses are not parallel. One verse depicts the releasing of it's occupants, the other depicts the confining of occupants. There's also an angel to consider in both passages. And since it should be pretty apparent that these 2 passages are not describing parallel accounts, then neither can these angels be the same angel in both accounts, otherwise we have this same angel descending from heaven on 2 seperate occasions.


    If we make Rev 9 parallel with Rev 20, then we have to conclude that Rev 9 transpires at the beginning of the millenium, and that satan isn't bound for 1000 yrs at all, but that he's immedietly released if the 2 passages are parallel. And if one is Amil, and sees these passages as parallel, then they would have to conclude Rev 9 occured in the 1st century. I don't know if Amils see these passages as parallel, but if they do, that's what their conclusions would add up to.
    Who then is being released from the bottomless pit by the angel with the key to the bottomless pit? Who would have sealed them there?

    Firstfruits

  12. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by John146 View Post
    No, it's the star that falls from heaven that is given the key of the bottomless pit. That is more easily seen in this translation (Young's Literal Translation):

    Rev 9:1 And the fifth messenger did sound, and I saw a star out of the heaven having fallen to the earth, and there was given to it the key of the pit of the abyss,

    The NIV has it right:

    1The fifth angel sounded his trumpet, and I saw a star that had fallen from the sky to the earth. The star was given the key to the shaft of the Abyss.

    Stars that fall from heaven are angels.
    Would you agree that it is not Satan that has the key to the bottomless pit, as he would therefore be able to deceive the nations whenever he chose to?

    Let us not forget the OP: Who is the angel of the bottomless pit, not who has the key to the bottomless pit.

    Rev 9:11 And they had a king over them, which is the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in the Hebrew tongue is Abaddon, but in the Greek tongue hath his name Apollyon.

    Firstfruits

  13. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by John146 View Post
    I don't know if all amils see it this way, but I believe that Satan is loosed from the bottomless pit at the fifth trumpet. That's the connection between the two chapters that I see. So, I don't see Rev 9:1-2 as being parallel with Rev 20:1-3. In one case the pit is being opened and in the other it is being shut. Instead, I see Rev 9:1-2 being parallel with Rev 20:7.
    So if Satan is released from the bottomless pit a the 5th trumpet, is the 5th trumpet therefore the end the the millenium with regards to the following scripture when satan is released from the bottomless pit?

    Rev 20:2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
    Rev 20:3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.

    God bless you!

    Firstfruits

  14. #59
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    If satan is already bound, if he is already in the bottomless pit, then he cannot be free to walk around seeking whom he may devour, as the following scriptures tell us that he is.

    1 Pet 5:8 Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:

    Eph 6:16 Above all, taking the shield of faith, wherewith ye shall be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked.

    has he already been imprisoned by the angel with the key to the bottomless pit?

    Rev 20:3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.

    If we agree that Satan is still walking around seeking whom he may devour, then can we at the same time say that he is bound, and that we are in the millenium.

    When does the angel with the key to the bottomless pit bind Satan if he is then released at the 5th trumpet and before the gathering for the battle at Armageddon?

    God bless you!

    Firstfruits

  15. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firstfruits View Post
    Would you agree that it is not Satan that has the key to the bottomless pit, as he would therefore be able to deceive the nations whenever he chose to?
    Yes, I agree that it is not Satan that has the key to the bottomless pit.

    Let us not forget the OP: Who is the angel of the bottomless pit, not who has the key to the bottomless pit.

    Rev 9:11 And they had a king over them, which is the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in the Hebrew tongue is Abaddon, but in the Greek tongue hath his name Apollyon.

    Firstfruits
    What is your point here? How does this support your claim that Rev 9:1 is saying that the fifth angel is given the key of the bottomless pit rather than the star that falls from heaven to the earth?

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