Many Shall Be Deceived!!!!!!!

[Firstfruits]

Actually I am very fond of emphasizing my words by bolding, underlining, caps or changing colors and I also love !!
It's just funny because I know a post is started by you when I see !!!! hahahaha

Okay you got me, by my works you shall know me!!!!!!

God bless you!

Firstfruits

[T W Taylor]

Hello Firstfruits,

Is Jesus not God?
Is the beast not against Jesus and God?
Is the antichrist not against Jesus and God?
All that are against God and Jesus are antichrist.

The answer to all your questions would have to be yes, BUT, that is not the whole answer. If my statistics are (about) right there are about 6 billion people on earth. There are about 2.1 billion Christians, that leaves about 4 billion that might fit your discription of antichrist.

The antichrist is mentioned in 5 verses, in 2 books by 1 man in our bible.
I think John is speaking of antichrist as a false prophet, rather than the “Beast”

1jo 4:1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.
1jo 4:2 Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:
1jo 4:3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.

2jo 1:7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

These two “Beast” of Revelation 13 I find is the same Beast as number 7 and 8 of Revelation 17, and the same horn of Daniel 7:24 and 25. And this fit’s the Roman Emperor Constantine. He is the first “Beast” that has deceived and changed the whole Christian world from following the bible and Apostles to following what he said to follow. TWTaylor

[Firstfruits]

Hello Firstfruits,


The answer to all your questions would have to be yes, BUT, that is not the whole answer. If my statistics are (about) right there are about 6 billion people on earth. There are about 2.1 billion Christians, that leaves about 4 billion that might fit your discription of antichrist.

The antichrist is mentioned in 5 verses, in 2 books by 1 man in our bible.
I think John is speaking of antichrist as a false prophet, rather than the “Beast”

1jo 4:1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.
1jo 4:2 Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:
1jo 4:3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.

2jo 1:7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

These two “Beast” of Revelation 13 I find is the same Beast as number 7 and 8 of Revelation 17, and the same horn of Daniel 7:24 and 25. And this fit’s the Roman Emperor Constantine. He is the first “Beast” that has deceived and changed the whole Christian world from following the bible and Apostles to following what he said to follow. TWTaylor

In what way does Constantine fit the beast of Revelaion 13?

Firstfruits

[moonglow]

Then if what Jesus said we should look for, and what Daniel said, and that which is written in 2 Thesalonians 2 are not the same person, if not, then all those events have not yet been fulfilled. So at some point the antichrist will claim to be God, as others have done before, but it will not be like those gone before.

Firstfruits

I am short on time so I give you this article to read that I think it explains alot of your questions very well:

An Eschatology of Victory
By W.A. Young, Jr. Th.D.

Who was or is the man of sin? We find him alluded to in 2 Thessalonians 2 as the man who would precede the Day of the Lord. A great deal of difficulty is around the common assumption that it is referring to events that take place just before the second coming of Christ. But this too is wrong. In verse 6, Paul tells us that the man of sin is restrained at the time he is writing his letter. In verse 7, he tells us that "the mystery of lawlessness is already at work" and that the restrainer "now restrains" the man of sin. If the man of sin was being restrained at the time Paul wrote this letter (51 to 52 A.D.), then Paul was not speaking of some person who would arise thousands of years later. The man of sin, who was alive at the time Paul wrote, was probably none other than Nero. The language Paul uses to describe him, is one "who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worship, so that he sit as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God", is identical language to several Old Testament prophets use to condemn certain political rulers (Isaiah 14: 4-21; Ezekiel 28: 2-19; Danial 11:36). Only one man fits Paul's description of the first century's man of sin; Nero, who died in 68 A.D. during the Jewish War.


Eschatological expectation intensified as the war between Jerusalem and Rome came to a head. Many believed that the Messiah would return to deliver them. False prophets took advantage of this expectation and deceived many as foretold by Matthew. Signs and wonder appeared as Halley's comet appeared in 66 A.D. Not long after that Nero committed suicide. Historians have linked the appearance of Halley's comet not only with the death of Nero, but with the destruction of Jerusalem four years later. Josephus recounts that "there was a star resembling a sword, which stood over the city, and a comet, that continued a whole year."

Josephus supports the biblical record when he reports, "And now these impostors and deceivers persuaded the multitude to follow them int the wilderness, and pretended that they would exhibit manifest wonders and sign, that should be performed by the providence of God." The temple was gone. The Messiah came in the person of Jesus Christ. He is "the temple" (John 2:21); "the lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world" (John 1:29); and He is the High Priest (Hebrews. 6:20). Jerusalem which is the city of the Old Covenant has now been replaced with the Jerusalem from above, the city of the living God (Hebrews. 12:22).

Read the full article at the link. There are a number of threads on the end times forum about Nero that might interest you.

God bless

[Firstfruits]

I am short on time so I give you this article to read that I think it explains alot of your questions very well:

An Eschatology of Victory
By W.A. Young, Jr. Th.D.

Who was or is the man of sin? We find him alluded to in 2 Thessalonians 2 as the man who would precede the Day of the Lord. A great deal of difficulty is around the common assumption that it is referring to events that take place just before the second coming of Christ. But this too is wrong. In verse 6, Paul tells us that the man of sin is restrained at the time he is writing his letter. In verse 7, he tells us that "the mystery of lawlessness is already at work" and that the restrainer "now restrains" the man of sin. If the man of sin was being restrained at the time Paul wrote this letter (51 to 52 A.D.), then Paul was not speaking of some person who would arise thousands of years later. The man of sin, who was alive at the time Paul wrote, was probably none other than Nero. The language Paul uses to describe him, is one "who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worship, so that he sit as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God", is identical language to several Old Testament prophets use to condemn certain political rulers (Isaiah 14: 4-21; Ezekiel 28: 2-19; Danial 11:36). Only one man fits Paul's description of the first century's man of sin; Nero, who died in 68 A.D. during the Jewish War.


Eschatological expectation intensified as the war between Jerusalem and Rome came to a head. Many believed that the Messiah would return to deliver them. False prophets took advantage of this expectation and deceived many as foretold by Matthew. Signs and wonder appeared as Halley's comet appeared in 66 A.D. Not long after that Nero committed suicide. Historians have linked the appearance of Halley's comet not only with the death of Nero, but with the destruction of Jerusalem four years later. Josephus recounts that "there was a star resembling a sword, which stood over the city, and a comet, that continued a whole year."

Josephus supports the biblical record when he reports, "And now these impostors and deceivers persuaded the multitude to follow them int the wilderness, and pretended that they would exhibit manifest wonders and sign, that should be performed by the providence of God." The temple was gone. The Messiah came in the person of Jesus Christ. He is "the temple" (John 2:21); "the lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world" (John 1:29); and He is the High Priest (Hebrews. 6:20). Jerusalem which is the city of the Old Covenant has now been replaced with the Jerusalem from above, the city of the living God (Hebrews. 12:22).

Read the full article at the link. There are a number of threads on the end times forum about Nero that might interest you.

God bless

The problem with it being nero is that Jesus did not come at that time, as you say, Nero died.

2 Thess 2:8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

2 Thess 1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
2 Thess 1:8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:

Nero would have to be destroyed at the return of Jesus, but it is clear that Jesus has not yet returned, so Nero is therefore not the beast of Revelation 13.

The beast in Revelation 13 will be here at the return of Christ when he will be destroyed.

Any false Christs or antichrists that have already died without the coming of Christ being fulfilled, cannot be the Beast in Revelation 13.

Firstfruits

[moonglow]

The problem with it being nero is that Jesus did not come at that time, as you say, Nero died.

2 Thess 2:8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

2 Thess 1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
2 Thess 1:8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:

Nero would have to be destroyed at the return of Jesus, but it is clear that Jesus has not yet returned, so Nero is therefore not the beast of Revelation 13.

The beast in Revelation 13 will be here at the return of Christ when he will be destroyed.

Any false Christs or antichrists that have already died without the coming of Christ being fulfilled, cannot be the Beast in Revelation 13.

Firstfruits

Everything you brought up is answered on this thread:http://bibleforums.org/showthread.php?200455-Nero-Beast

Matthew 24 was never about Christ second coming. It was about judgment.

God bless

[Firstfruits]

Everything you brought up is answered on this thread:http://bibleforums.org/showthread.php?200455-Nero-Beast

Matthew 24 was never about Christ second coming. It was about judgment.

God bless

Which judgment would that be, as judgment is not until the return of Christ, after the millenium?

As you have pointed out, Nero is already dead, but not by the return of Jesus, as will be the destruction of the beasts in Revelation 13, as stated in 2 Thessalonians.

Any antichrist not alive when Jesus returns cannot fit the bill.

Firstfruits



Firstfruits

[T W Taylor]

Hello Firstfruits,

In what way does Constantine fit the beast of Revelaion 13?

The first thing - there were a lot more than 10 kings of the Roman Empire before Constantine, I don’t understand witch 10 kings its talking about. - ????

He was different from the others, because he clamed to be Christian. --

He subdued 3 kings or Roman Emperors, Maximian, Maxentius, and Licinius. -

Persecuted saints, Made a law to work on the 7th day, and rest Sunday, and persecuted anybody that was not of his roman church. -

Change times and laws. - Changed Passover to Easter and Sabbath to Sunday, trying to change 4th commandment, (Remember the Sabbath, keep it holy)

Saints, - (Christian church) in his hands until Christ return.

Da 7:24 The ten horns are ten kings Who shall arise from this kingdom. And another shall rise after them; He shall be different from the first ones, And shall subdue three kings.

Da 7:25 He shall speak pompous words against the Most High, Shall persecute the saints of the Most High, And shall intend to change times and law. Then the saints shall be given into his hand For a time and times and half a time.

Re 17:10 "There are also seven kings. Five have fallen, one is, and the other has not yet come. And when he comes, he must continue a short time.

Re 17:11 "And the beast that was, and is not, is himself also the eighth, and is of the seven, and is going to perdition.

Re 17:7 But the angel said to me, "Why did you marvel? I will tell you the mystery of the woman and of the beast that carries her, which has the seven heads and the ten horns

Seven Kings (and Kingdoms) - (1) Egypt, - (2) Assyria, (3) Babylon, (4) Greece, (5) Persia, (6) Roman (one that is) (7) Christian Rome - Constantine, (8) Christian Rome again - The E.U.

(7)Christian Roman Empire carried the Roman Church, that Constantine help start.

(8) 2nd Christian Rome (E.U.) will also carry the woman (Roman Church)

Re 13:7 It was granted to him to make war with the saints and to overcome them. And authority was given him over every tribe, tongue, and nation.

Constantine’s Church Has authority over 1/3 of the worlds population now.

Re 13:8 All who dwell on the earth will worship him, whose names have not been written in the Book of Life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

Like I said 1/3 now.

Re 13:11 Then I saw another beast coming up out of the earth, and he had two horns like a lamb and spoke like a dragon.

Two horns - like a Lamb (2 powers , like Christians, But of the dragon -Satan) Constantine, and soon coming ruler of E.U.?

Re 13:12 And he exercises all the authority of the first beast in his presence, and causes the earth and those who dwell in it to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed.

Constantine’s Empire ended by the sword in 1453. date the Fall of Rome to 1453 when the Ottoman Turks took Constantinople by the sword, and killed Constantine XI

Re 13:14 And he deceives those who dwell on the earth by those signs which he was granted to do in the sight of the beast, telling those who dwell on the earth to make an image to the beast who was wounded by the sword and lived.

The image and mark Constantine gave the world. TWTaylor

[John146]

I am short on time so I give you this article to read that I think it explains alot of your questions very well:

An Eschatology of Victory
By W.A. Young, Jr. Th.D.

Who was or is the man of sin? We find him alluded to in 2 Thessalonians 2 as the man who would precede the Day of the Lord. A great deal of difficulty is around the common assumption that it is referring to events that take place just before the second coming of Christ. But this too is wrong. In verse 6, Paul tells us that the man of sin is restrained at the time he is writing his letter. In verse 7, he tells us that "the mystery of lawlessness is already at work" and that the restrainer "now restrains" the man of sin. If the man of sin was being restrained at the time Paul wrote this letter (51 to 52 A.D.), then Paul was not speaking of some person who would arise thousands of years later. The man of sin, who was alive at the time Paul wrote, was probably none other than Nero. The language Paul uses to describe him, is one "who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worship, so that he sit as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God", is identical language to several Old Testament prophets use to condemn certain political rulers (Isaiah 14: 4-21; Ezekiel 28: 2-19; Danial 11:36). Only one man fits Paul's description of the first century's man of sin; Nero, who died in 68 A.D. during the Jewish War.


Eschatological expectation intensified as the war between Jerusalem and Rome came to a head. Many believed that the Messiah would return to deliver them. False prophets took advantage of this expectation and deceived many as foretold by Matthew. Signs and wonder appeared as Halley's comet appeared in 66 A.D. Not long after that Nero committed suicide. Historians have linked the appearance of Halley's comet not only with the death of Nero, but with the destruction of Jerusalem four years later. Josephus recounts that "there was a star resembling a sword, which stood over the city, and a comet, that continued a whole year."

Josephus supports the biblical record when he reports, "And now these impostors and deceivers persuaded the multitude to follow them int the wilderness, and pretended that they would exhibit manifest wonders and sign, that should be performed by the providence of God." The temple was gone. The Messiah came in the person of Jesus Christ. He is "the temple" (John 2:21); "the lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world" (John 1:29); and He is the High Priest (Hebrews. 6:20). Jerusalem which is the city of the Old Covenant has now been replaced with the Jerusalem from above, the city of the living God (Hebrews. 12:22).

Read the full article at the link. There are a number of threads on the end times forum about Nero that might interest you.

God bless

There is a major problem with relating 2 Thess 2 to Nero and 1st century times. And that is that the context of 2 Thess 2 centers around things that would occur just before "the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and...our gathering together unto him", otherwise known as "the day of Christ" or "the day of the Lord". Do you think "the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and...our gathering together unto him" has already occurred?

[John146]

Everything you brought up is answered on this thread:http://bibleforums.org/showthread.php?200455-Nero-Beast

Matthew 24 was never about Christ second coming. It was about judgment.

God bless

He didn't quote Matthew 24, he quoted 2 Thess 2:8 and 2 Thess 1:7-8. Do you think those verses are already fulfilled?

[Firstfruits]

Hello Firstfruits,


The first thing - there were a lot more than 10 kings of the Roman Empire before Constantine, I don’t understand witch 10 kings its talking about. - ????

He was different from the others, because he clamed to be Christian. --

He subdued 3 kings or Roman Emperors, Maximian, Maxentius, and Licinius. -

Persecuted saints, Made a law to work on the 7th day, and rest Sunday, and persecuted anybody that was not of his roman church. -

Change times and laws. - Changed Passover to Easter and Sabbath to Sunday, trying to change 4th commandment, (Remember the Sabbath, keep it holy)

Saints, - (Christian church) in his hands until Christ return.

Da 7:24 The ten horns are ten kings Who shall arise from this kingdom. And another shall rise after them; He shall be different from the first ones, And shall subdue three kings.

Da 7:25 He shall speak pompous words against the Most High, Shall persecute the saints of the Most High, And shall intend to change times and law. Then the saints shall be given into his hand For a time and times and half a time.

Re 17:10 "There are also seven kings. Five have fallen, one is, and the other has not yet come. And when he comes, he must continue a short time.

Re 17:11 "And the beast that was, and is not, is himself also the eighth, and is of the seven, and is going to perdition.

Re 17:7 But the angel said to me, "Why did you marvel? I will tell you the mystery of the woman and of the beast that carries her, which has the seven heads and the ten horns

Seven Kings (and Kingdoms) - (1) Egypt, - (2) Assyria, (3) Babylon, (4) Greece, (5) Persia, (6) Roman (one that is) (7) Christian Rome - Constantine, (8) Christian Rome again - The E.U.

(7)Christian Roman Empire carried the Roman Church, that Constantine help start.

(8) 2nd Christian Rome (E.U.) will also carry the woman (Roman Church)

Re 13:7 It was granted to him to make war with the saints and to overcome them. And authority was given him over every tribe, tongue, and nation.

Constantine’s Church Has authority over 1/3 of the worlds population now.

Re 13:8 All who dwell on the earth will worship him, whose names have not been written in the Book of Life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

Like I said 1/3 now.

Re 13:11 Then I saw another beast coming up out of the earth, and he had two horns like a lamb and spoke like a dragon.

Two horns - like a Lamb (2 powers , like Christians, But of the dragon -Satan) Constantine, and soon coming ruler of E.U.?

Re 13:12 And he exercises all the authority of the first beast in his presence, and causes the earth and those who dwell in it to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed.

Constantine’s Empire ended by the sword in 1453. date the Fall of Rome to 1453 when the Ottoman Turks took Constantinople by the sword, and killed Constantine XI

Re 13:14 And he deceives those who dwell on the earth by those signs which he was granted to do in the sight of the beast, telling those who dwell on the earth to make an image to the beast who was wounded by the sword and lived.

The image and mark Constantine gave the world. TWTaylor

By claiming to be a christian means that he cannot fit the bill, as according to Daniel he will regard no other God, but that he will exalt himself as God.

Dan 11:36 And the king shall do according to his will; and he shall exalt himself, and magnify himself above every god, and shall speak marvellous things against the god of gods, and shall prosper till the indignation be accomplished: for that that is determined shall be done.

Dan 11:37 Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any God: for he shall magnify himself above all.

2 Thess 2:4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

Again I must point out that Constantine is dead. Have the vials already been fulfilled?

Rev 16:2 And the first went, and poured out his vial upon the earth; and there fell a noisome and grievous sore upon the men which had the mark of the beast, and upon them which worshipped his image.

Rev 16:10 And the fifth angel poured out his vial upon the seat of the beast; and his kingdom was full of darkness; and they gnawed their tongues for pain,

When therefore was the gathering for the battle at the great day of God (Christs return) at the 7th vial?

Firstfruits

[Amos_with_goats]

Among the excellent points to consider raised by Firstfruits, is the underlying one (please forgive me if it was mentioned). The position of certainty that Nero / past figure of your choice fulfilled the prophetic scripture advocates a relatively less significant emphasis on ideas like 'being prepared', and 'taking heed least you be deceived'.

The truth of scriptre is not changed by our opinions, or what is popular. To that end I appreciate and enjoy the exploration of these topics. I do however believe it is important to rely on the overall context of scripture it's self more then the history books to understand what we are to take away.

I believe that the significance of passages like Matthew 24 can not be overlooked, or down played in any way. Some may push it aside by saying that it 'only applies to the Jews' others say that it has already happened and only applies to judgment. The fact of the matter is that the Lord Himself gave a direct answer to the question;


“Tell us, when will these things be? And what will be the sign of Your coming, and of the end of the age?”

[T W Taylor]

Hello Firstfruits,

By claiming to be a christian means that he cannot fit the bill, as according to Daniel he will regard no other God, but that he will exalt himself as God.

WHY?? He said he was a Christian, He then killed his firstborn son, and Killed his wife. He wasn’t a preacher, He was the Emperor and he straitened out the church, and told them How and what to worship.

Dan 11:36 And the king shall do according to his will; and he shall exalt himself, and magnify himself above every god, and shall speak marvellous things against the god of gods, and shall prosper till the indignation be accomplished: for that that is determined shall be done.

Sounds like Constantine

Dan 11:37 Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any God: for he shall magnify himself above all.

The god of his fathers, were the Roman Pantheon, (roman gods) He Killed his wife, He called himself the 13th apostle, and I read somewhere, that he said he took the place of Jesus. (leader of the church)

2 Thess 2:4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

He didn’t go to Jerusalem, but sent his old Mother, and she found the wood cross that Jesus was Killed on, in perfect condition, (I think in a garbage dump) about 200 years after Jesus was killed on it. Would this temple of God, he sets in be God’s people.

Again I must point out that Constantine is dead. Have the vials already been fulfilled?

Constantine was the first beast of the two horns of Rev13, and he is still sitting in the temple, (God’s People) The things he started is still being done in the Christain church.

Rev 16:2 And the first went, and poured out his vial upon the earth; and there fell a noisome and grievous sore upon the men which had the mark of the beast, and upon them which worshipped his image.

The mark. And the image that he gave us is still with us, and will be until Christ return.

Rev 16:10 And the fifth angel poured out his vial upon the seat of the beast; and his kingdom was full of darkness; and they gnawed their tongues for pain,

The seat of the beast is still there, Sounds like more than just turning out the lights out.

When therefore was the gathering for the battle at the great day of God (Christs return) at the 7th vial?

Second horn or beast. Search, an read about Constantine, see what great things he did to DECEIVE the Christian Church. TWTaylor

[Firstfruits]

Hello Firstfruits,



WHY?? He said he was a Christian, He then killed his firstborn son, and Killed his wife. He wasn’t a preacher, He was the Emperor and he straitened out the church, and told them How and what to worship.



Sounds like Constantine



The god of his fathers, were the Roman Pantheon, (roman gods) He Killed his wife, He called himself the 13th apostle, and I read somewhere, that he said he took the place of Jesus. (leader of the church)



He didn’t go to Jerusalem, but sent his old Mother, and she found the wood cross that Jesus was Killed on, in perfect condition, (I think in a garbage dump) about 200 years after Jesus was killed on it. Would this temple of God, he sets in be God’s people.



Constantine was the first beast of the two horns of Rev13, and he is still sitting in the temple, (God’s People) The things he started is still being done in the Christain church.


The mark. And the image that he gave us is still with us, and will be until Christ return.



The seat of the beast is still there, Sounds like more than just turning out the lights out.



Second horn or beast. Search, an read about Constantine, see what great things he did to DECEIVE the Christian Church. TWTaylor

With the fact that Constantine is dead and the following has not been fulfilled, Contantine is not the beast, and let us not forget the 2nd beast of Rev.13.

2 Thess 2:8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

2 Thess 1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
2 Thess 1:8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:

Firstfruits

[moonglow]

There is a major problem with relating 2 Thess 2 to Nero and 1st century times. And that is that the context of 2 Thess 2 centers around things that would occur just before "the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and...our gathering together unto him", otherwise known as "the day of Christ" or "the day of the Lord". Do you think "the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and...our gathering together unto him" has already occurred?

John why do you ask that of me when I said on this post and many others and to your personally that no the Second Coming of Christ has not happened yet. Do I need to put it in my signature? You have asked that of me a number of times and its now getting a little insulting. If Fristfruit really wants answers to his questions all he has to do is read the link I provided, I am not going to go back to that thread and copy and paste information from there to here because he won't put in the effort to click on it himself and check it out. I thought he was truly seeking answer so I tried to provide information to him. Now its up to him to read or not. And you can very well do the same.