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Thread: Mark of the Beast: Shepherds Chapel

  1. #31

    Re: Mark of the Beast: Shepherds Chapel

    If only Noah and his family where the only humans aboard the ark, and all flesh was destroyed,then how do you explain all the races of people today. There is no way that all the races could come from Noah's family. So then there must have been other people aboard the ark, or the whole earth was not flooded. It has to be one or the other. Also there will be no rapture. Jesus used Peter as an example when Peter said "LORD I will follow you to prison and even unto death." Jesus used this to teach that we will be tested as was Peter. Peter saw and knew Jesus like a brother and as soon as the people said you were with Jesus, he crumbled not once, not twice but 3 times. We will also be tested. What will you have done before the cock crows?

  2. #32
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    Re: Mark of the Beast: Shepherds Chapel

    Arnold Murray's views are not unique to Arnold Murray. The "Companion Bible" that he endorses (and the main editor thereof) is the fuel for much/most/all of his fire. E.W. Bullinger, with his teachings, put together The Companion Bible back in the early 1900's. He was known as a "hyperdispensationalist" (aka "Bullingerism").

    Murray comes across as very convincing because of his use of the Strong's Concordance. He'll talk about a particular word (e.g., "foundation", as in "before the foundation of the world"). Then he'll pull up the Strong's reference, in this case, 2602 in the Greek: "katabole"; from 2598. 2598 is "katabollo"; from 2596 and 906. 2596 is "kata", and 906 is "ballo". "Kata" means "down", and "ballo" means "throw". Therefore it means the "casting down" of the world, or the "overthrow" of the world. Then he uses that in the passage of Scripture: "chosen before the overthrow of the world".

    But because he fluently makes his way across the Strong's Concordance and can quickly cross reference Scripture from memory, it makes him appear to be an expert in the biblical languages, an expert in etymology, and thus an expert on what Scripture means. It's just that "katabole" doesn't mean "overthrow"; it means "casting down, or laying down", as if you're putting something on the ground to make a "foundation".

    All Murray is is a walking, talking Companion Bible with a pretty thorough memory of Scripture so that he can quickly and easily cross reference. He's not a "scholar", nor are his ideas "his" ideas.

    When I was 15, I saw a man explaining Hebrew and Greek definitions of words, and I thought that that MUST be what the Bible means. Once I learned that he doesn't know a thing about Hebrew and Greek outside of what the Companion Bible says and what the Strong's Concordance says, and that his interpretation of Hebrew and Greek etymology is a farce, it didn't take long for me to be able to divorce myself from his teachings.

  3. #33
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    Re: Mark of the Beast: Shepherds Chapel

    Quote Originally Posted by Psalms Fan View Post

    Murray comes across as very convincing because of his use of the Strong's Concordance.


    Speaking in general, this couldn't possibly be true. I've never noticed Murray coming off as convincing about anything. Unfortunately, only the very naive could find him convincing IMO, or someone who doesn't know the Bible very well to begin with.

  4. #34
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    Re: Mark of the Beast: Shepherds Chapel

    Quote Originally Posted by divaD View Post
    Speaking in general, this couldn't possibly be true. I've never noticed Murray coming off as convincing about anything. Unfortunately, only the very naive could find him convincing IMO, or someone who doesn't know the Bible very well to begin with.
    I'll rephase: those who would be inclined to find him convincing do so because of his use of the Strong's Concordance. When I was 14/15, I was definitely naive, and didn't know a thing about the Bible.

  5. #35
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    Re: Mark of the Beast: Shepherds Chapel

    Quote Originally Posted by 10150777 View Post
    If only Noah and his family where the only humans aboard the ark, and all flesh was destroyed,then how do you explain all the races of people today. There is no way that all the races could come from Noah's family. So then there must have been other people aboard the ark, or the whole earth was not flooded. It has to be one or the other. Also there will be no rapture. Jesus used Peter as an example when Peter said "LORD I will follow you to prison and even unto death." Jesus used this to teach that we will be tested as was Peter. Peter saw and knew Jesus like a brother and as soon as the people said you were with Jesus, he crumbled not once, not twice but 3 times. We will also be tested. What will you have done before the cock crows?
    They didn't descend differently from Noah, nor was there anyone but Noah and his family on the Ark. The diversity came after the tower of Babel and it was something that God did.




  6. #36
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    Re: Mark of the Beast: Shepherds Chapel

    Quote Originally Posted by blessedewing82 View Post
    OH THIS IS SO WRONG!! WHAT RIGHT DO YOU HAVE TO (JUDGE HIM). IF YOU THINK YOU KNOW SO MUCH ABOUT THE BIBLE , I GUESS YOU FORGOT THE PART TAHT SAYS JUDGE NOT LEST YE BE JUDGED!!!
    Noone is judging the eternal salvation of Arnold Murray.

    However, his false teachings are being judged and are being brought out into the light for the unsound teachings that they present.

    The Bible itself tells Christians to hold to sound doctrine, and to refute and rebuke unsound teachings.

    If Christians sit idly by and refuse to refute bad teachings, they allow Satan unrestrained victories in deceiving the unaware.

    Noone here judges Arnold Murray; however God's Word as presented by Christians in this post most certainly judge false teaching.

    Titus 1:9 "Holding fast the faithful word as he hath been taught, that he may be able by sound doctrine both to exhort and to convince the gainsayers. For there are many unruly and vain talkers and deceivers: Whose mouths must be stopped, who subvert whole houses, teaching things which they ought not, for filthy lucre's sake. This witness is true. Wherefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith"

    II Timothy 3:16 "All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness"

    II Timothy 4:2 "Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine. For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables. But watch thou in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, make full proof of thy ministry."

    Titus 2:7 "In all things shewing thyself a pattern of good works: in doctrine shewing uncorruptness, gravity, sincerity, Sound speech, that cannot be condemned; that he that is of the contrary part may be ashamed"


  7. #37
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    Re: Mark of the Beast: Shepherds Chapel

    Quote Originally Posted by 10150777 View Post
    If only Noah and his family where the only humans aboard the ark, and all flesh was destroyed,then how do you explain all the races of people today.
    The Bible teaches that only Noah and his family of 8 survived the great flood.

    The Bible says all other human beings were destroyed in the flood.

    As a bible-believing Christian, I can only faithfully accept that all people living today descended from Noah and his family of 8.

    Whether the whole planet was flooded or not is really irrelevant. The Bible tells us all flesh besides the 8 humans and gathered animals on the earth died in the flood; so whether it was a localized flood at a time when all the world's human population was still localized to that area, or it was global; doesn't matter.

    All humans except 8 died.


    Quote Originally Posted by 10150777 View Post
    There is no way that all the races could come from Noah's family. So then there must have been other people aboard the ark, or the whole earth was not flooded.
    All human flesh except Noah and his family of 8 died. Both the OT and the NT writers confirm this. If one is a Bible-believing Christian, there is no other option.

    All living human beings on the earth right now, are descended from Noah and Mrs. Noah....just like all humans living prior to the flood were descended from Adam and Eve.

  8. #38
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    Re: Mark of the Beast: Shepherds Chapel

    For those worried about "races", I would encourage you to do a little research about the genetic basis for such terminology. Genetically, races do not exist. What DOES exist, though, are haplogroups. People can be part of one haplogroup and have features that are consistent with people of a different haplogroup, and be confused with being part of a different haplogroup. For instance, a group of Central Asians split apart in the past. One group went West and became modern Europeans. Another group went East and populated the Americas. Yet both of those groups have the same genetic marker placing them both with a population of Central Asians. The same with groups of black Africans who are actually part of the same haplogroup as those in the Middle East, and not of those further south into the continent.

    Race is a very funny thing, and can be very confusing. Physical traits are not a good indicator for how people got to where they are, or how related they are to other groups. And, genetically, the genes that make up the difference in outward features are so minute of a proportion of the whole genome that they are just a hair's breadth above nonexistence.

  9. #39

    Re: Mark of the Beast: Shepherds Chapel

    Thanks for everyone's info on Murray's false teachings. Someone gave me a CD of Murray's on an unrelated topic, and I was unaware of his erroneous doctrine. A little leaven leaventh the whole lump. I will get rid of it immediatesly....Thank God for the body of Christ . Doctrinal purity is very important to me (as you have probably noticed in my posts), and being aware of and getting rid of false doctrine is a necessity in these last days..... Faithful

  10. #40

    Re: Mark of the Beast: Shepherds Chapel

    I would strongly recommend going to Mr Murray's website and read both his Statement of Faith and his post to answer critics. I sit in judgement of no man, but use the discernment granted me by my maker in situations like these. Read the information that Mr Murray has in these statements then apply the "acid test" of the Bible to find your way concerning his teachings and beliefs. I will state that these documents do seem to refute several comments attributed to him and the Shepard's Chapel by the critics I have seen on the Internet and this thread. I have watched his TV broadcasts and have heard none of these things thus far. I do not consider myself qualified to judge him and have found very little in his teachings that I have heard that I would disagree with to this point. As to his qualifications and background, I take him at his word until "facts" prove otherwise.

    study to show thyself approved, rightly dividing the word of God....

  11. #41
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    Re: Mark of the Beast: Shepherds Chapel

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnV View Post
    I would strongly recommend going to Mr Murray's website and read both his Statement of Faith and his post to answer critics. I sit in judgement of no man, but use the discernment granted me by my maker in situations like these. Read the information that Mr Murray has in these statements then apply the "acid test" of the Bible to find your way concerning his teachings and beliefs. I will state that these documents do seem to refute several comments attributed to him and the Shepard's Chapel by the critics I have seen on the Internet and this thread. I have watched his TV broadcasts and have heard none of these things thus far. I do not consider myself qualified to judge him and have found very little in his teachings that I have heard that I would disagree with to this point. As to his qualifications and background, I take him at his word until "facts" prove otherwise.

    study to show thyself approved, rightly dividing the word of God....



    I've been familiar with Arnold Murray since about 1995, when I first erected a 10 foot satellite dish in my backyard, and then discovered he had a 24/7 master feed on transponder 16 @ 99W, it's orbital location in space. As a matter of fact, that same feed is still there at that same location. I also still have a big satellite dish in my yard, except it's now a 7 and one half foot dish, but still big compared to the little Dishnetwork dishes. My point is, I've watched him a many a time, and am very familiar with what he teaches. I've come to the conclusion that he's not a good teacher, teaches false stuff, and that he takes Scriptures out of context big time, in order to make them fit his agendas. I've also come to the conclusion that only the naive and who don't know their Bible well enough, these would be the type that falls for his nonsense. Not everything he teaches would be nonsense, but the bigger majority of it would be. My advice to anyone who may be curious about the Shepherd's Chapel, as long as you don't take 90% of what he says as serious, then you'll probably be ok. But the best thing to do is just stay away from him to begin with, since 2 Timothy 4:3 comes to mind every time Arnold Murray's name comes up.

  12. #42
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    Re: Mark of the Beast: Shepherds Chapel

    Yeah the serpent seed doctrine is false. Satan caused a sin of a sexual nature, Murray's right about that ONE thing, but Satan was by no means directly involved. Murray has been trapped in this lie. Satan did not give birth to human children.

    Serpent seed doctrine operates on the assumption that you're born into being condemned, and no loving caring God would have you birthed into a world that you had no choice of being good or evil. Without a choice, they technically couldn't be evil, but God clearly states that what they are doing is evil. Also, if God is good and makes things perfect, then God couldn't have made Cain as an evil person as soon as leaving the womb. It fails the logic test.
    John 10 (KJV)
    27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:
    28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
    29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

  13. #43
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    Re: Mark of the Beast: Shepherds Chapel

    I listened to this guy every day for like 6 or 7 months when I was 19.
    The guy is a false teacher and he twists the scipture to fit his agenda whether it is on purpose or not.
    The irony here is that his biggest "Pet Peeve" or his favorite saying is "Study to show thyself approved" .

    And ironically the more you study the sciptures the more Pastor Murray's teachings are proven to be false.
    I didnt know the link didnt work

  14. #44
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    Re: Mark of the Beast: Shepherds Chapel

    Quote Originally Posted by Realist1981 View Post
    I listened to this guy every day for like 6 or 7 months when I was 19.
    The guy is a false teacher and he twists the scipture to fit his agenda whether it is on purpose or not.
    The irony here is that his biggest "Pet Peeve" or his favorite saying is "Study to show thyself approved" .

    And ironically the more you study the sciptures the more Pastor Murray's teachings are proven to be false.
    You know what though, and I am not ashamed to say this, but Pastor Murray got me to look at the bible in a different way. If it wasn't for him, I don't think God's message would have reached me in time, and not because I don't trust God but I didn't trust myself.

    Instead of us ridiculing Pastor Murray, maybe we should be trying to help him, warning him about continuing to teach this or that with biblical references to back it up. It's all you can do, really. If he doesn't want to change, he won't. But if he's humble and loves God, he'll change. I think I am going to write to him, I have to at least try.
    John 10 (KJV)
    27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:
    28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
    29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

  15. #45
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    Re: Mark of the Beast: Shepherds Chapel

    I always seem to find out why I don't attend church much. Judgemental folks. I guess I will continue to walk my own private walk with God. I also have watched Pastor Arnold Murray for years, off and on. He is a well read man. I may not agree with all of his teachings but for the most part he teaches from the bible, line by line. Dont see many on tv do that these days, everyone has that hand out, give me your seed money, God bless you brother. Nah, I think I will keep my money. Some folks "religion" is just like beauty, skin deep. You know I dont care for Benny Hinn's faith healing stuff, but Im not on here trashing the man. Peace out.

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