Anti - Semitism

[Johnny]

We know that the Jewish nation were hated during WWii. Today there are a new wave of hate against them. It is called Anti-Semitism. My question is as follows. Is it a term related to them or did they make it up for themselfs as some might believe. Is Anti-Semitism agains other nations as well as some believe for instance America against the Muslems. I believe it is purely against the Jewish nation.

Report: Anti-Semitism on the rise globally - CNN.com
14 Mar 2008 ... A report from the US State Department details "an upsurge" across the world of anti-Semitism -- hostility and discrimination toward Jewish ...
www.cnn.com/2008/US/03/14/anti-semitism/index.html - Cached - SimilarAnti-Semitism on the Rise in Europe - World - CBN News - Christian ...
In Europe Today, Most Jews Are Anxious. Some Are Scared, And Many Have Already Left For Israel Or The United States.
www.cbn.com/cbnnews/.../Anti-Semitism-on-the-Rise-in-Europe-/ - CachedAnti-Semitism on the Rise in America -- ADL Survey on Anti-Semitic ...
Anti-Semitism on the Rise in America -- ADL Survey on Anti-Semitic Attitudes Reveals 17 Percent of Americans Hold.
www.adl.org/presrele/asus_12/4109_12.htm - Cached - Similar"Anti-Semitism on the Rise in Europe" CBN News Newswatch

- 6 min - 1 Apr 2008
www.youtube.com Even though many European governments have condemned the new rise in anti-Semitism, there is a clear perception among many ...
www.youtube.com/watch?v=A7VsJY4DsfI - more videos »

Get more video results'Anti-Semitism on the rise in Sweden' - The Local
9 Feb 2009 ... An ugly wave of anti-Semitism is on the rise in Sweden, and politicians who compare Israel with Nazi Germany or apartheid-era South Africa ...
www.thelocal.se/17466/20090209/ - Cached - SimilarBBC NEWS | Europe | Anti-Semitism 'on rise in Europe'
31 Mar 2004 ... Attacks against Jews in Europe have sharply increased, says a report by a European anti-racism watchdog.
news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/3586543.stm - Cached - SimilarANTI SEMITISM ON THE RISE IN JERUSALEM AS POGROMS ARE PLANNED ...
24 Apr 2010 ... ANTI SEMITISM ON THE RISE IN JERUSALEM AS POGROMS ARE PLANNED ... Palestinians are Semites… any violence aimed towards them is ANTI-SEMITIC! ...
desertpeace.wordpress.com/.../anti-semitism-on-the-rise-in-jerusalem-as-pogroms-are-planned/ - CachedParisian Jews: Anti-Semitism on the rise - Israel Jewish Scene ...
15 Feb 2009 ... Jewish Scene: On three-year anniversary of murder of 23-year-old French Jew Ilan Halimi, community members say situation only worsened, ...
www.ynet.co.il › Ynetnews › Jewish Scene - CachedThe writing is on the synagogue wall | Denis MacShane - Times Online
16 Feb 2009 ... World depressions lead to a rise in anti-Semitism. ... The Great Depression gave rise to the worst expressions of anti-Semitism ever seen, ...
www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/.../guest.../article5740603.ece - SimilarYouTube - Anti-Semitism on the Rise in Europe
Even though many European governments have condemned the new rise in anti-Semitism, there is a clear perception among many Jews that Europe's terrible ...
www.youtube.com/watch?v=Youigj8iZho - Cached - Similar

[thedee]

We know that the Jewish nation were hated during WWii. Today there are a new wave of hate against them. It is called Anti-Semitism. My question is as follows. Is it a term related to them or did they make it up for themselfs as some might believe. Is Anti-Semitism agains other nations as well as some believe for instance America against the Muslems. I believe it is purely against the Jewish nation.

Report: Anti-Semitism on the rise globally - CNN.com
14 Mar 2008 ... A report from the US State Department details "an upsurge" across the world of anti-Semitism -- hostility and discrimination toward Jewish ...
www.cnn.com/2008/US/03/14/anti-semitism/index.html - Cached - SimilarAnti-Semitism on the Rise in Europe - World - CBN News - Christian ...
In Europe Today, Most Jews Are Anxious. Some Are Scared, And Many Have Already Left For Israel Or The United States.
www.cbn.com/cbnnews/.../Anti-Semitism-on-the-Rise-in-Europe-/ - CachedAnti-Semitism on the Rise in America -- ADL Survey on Anti-Semitic ...
Anti-Semitism on the Rise in America -- ADL Survey on Anti-Semitic Attitudes Reveals 17 Percent of Americans Hold.
www.adl.org/presrele/asus_12/4109_12.htm - Cached - Similar"Anti-Semitism on the Rise in Europe" CBN News Newswatch

- 6 min - 1 Apr 2008
www.youtube.com Even though many European governments have condemned the new rise in anti-Semitism, there is a clear perception among many ...
www.youtube.com/watch?v=A7VsJY4DsfI - more videos »

Get more video results'Anti-Semitism on the rise in Sweden' - The Local
9 Feb 2009 ... An ugly wave of anti-Semitism is on the rise in Sweden, and politicians who compare Israel with Nazi Germany or apartheid-era South Africa ...
www.thelocal.se/17466/20090209/ - Cached - SimilarBBC NEWS | Europe | Anti-Semitism 'on rise in Europe'
31 Mar 2004 ... Attacks against Jews in Europe have sharply increased, says a report by a European anti-racism watchdog.
news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/3586543.stm - Cached - SimilarANTI SEMITISM ON THE RISE IN JERUSALEM AS POGROMS ARE PLANNED ...
24 Apr 2010 ... ANTI SEMITISM ON THE RISE IN JERUSALEM AS POGROMS ARE PLANNED ... Palestinians are Semites… any violence aimed towards them is ANTI-SEMITIC! ...
desertpeace.wordpress.com/.../anti-semitism-on-the-rise-in-jerusalem-as-pogroms-are-planned/ - CachedParisian Jews: Anti-Semitism on the rise - Israel Jewish Scene ...
15 Feb 2009 ... Jewish Scene: On three-year anniversary of murder of 23-year-old French Jew Ilan Halimi, community members say situation only worsened, ...
www.ynet.co.il › Ynetnews › Jewish Scene - CachedThe writing is on the synagogue wall | Denis MacShane - Times Online
16 Feb 2009 ... World depressions lead to a rise in anti-Semitism. ... The Great Depression gave rise to the worst expressions of anti-Semitism ever seen, ...
www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/.../guest.../article5740603.ece - SimilarYouTube - Anti-Semitism on the Rise in Europe
Even though many European governments have condemned the new rise in anti-Semitism, there is a clear perception among many Jews that Europe's terrible ...
www.youtube.com/watch?v=Youigj8iZho - Cached - Similar

"Behold, I will make Jerusalem a cup of trembling unto all the people round about, when they shall be in the siege both against Judah and against Jerusalem." - Zechariah 12:2

[Amos_with_goats]

I have never heard anti-semitism described as any type of prejudice other then that against Jewish people.

Here is a definition from Wiki;

AntisemitismAntisemitism (also spelled anti-semitism or anti-Semitism) is prejudice against or hostility towards Jews, often rooted in hatred of their ethnic background, culture, and/or religion. In its extreme form, it "attributes to the Jews an exceptional position among all other civilizations, defames them as an inferior group and denies their being part of the nation[s]" in which they reside.

[David Taylor]

"Behold, I will make Jerusalem a cup of trembling unto all the people round about, when they shall be in the siege both against Judah and against Jerusalem." - Zechariah 12:2

"Jesus saith unto them, Did ye never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner: this is the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes? Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof. And whosoever shall fall on this stone shall be broken: but on whomsoever it shall fall, it will grind him to powder. And when the chief priests and Pharisees had heard his parables, they perceived that he spake of them." Matthew 21:42

"The kings of the earth stood up, and the rulers were gathered together against the Lord, and against his Christ. For of a truth against thy holy child Jesus, whom thou hast anointed, both Herod, and Pontius Pilate, with the Gentiles, and the people of Israel, were gathered together, For to do whatsoever thy hand and thy counsel determined before to be done." Acts 4:26

[Ryan R]

I have never heard anti-semitism described as any type of prejudice other then that against Jewish people.

Here is a definition from Wiki;

In the most technical sense it applies to anyone from the Middle East, after the Semitic linguistic family, named after Shem and his descendents, so technically anyone from the Middle East is Semitic, and therefore anti-Semitism is some times claimed to include Arabs, but this is so infrequently applicable that for all intents and purposes it means to think of Jews as inferior.

[Ryan R]

"Jesus saith unto them, Did ye never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner: this is the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes? Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof. And whosoever shall fall on this stone shall be broken: but on whomsoever it shall fall, it will grind him to powder. And when the chief priests and Pharisees had heard his parables, they perceived that he spake of them." Matthew 21:42

"The kings of the earth stood up, and the rulers were gathered together against the Lord, and against his Christ. For of a truth against thy holy child Jesus, whom thou hast anointed, both Herod, and Pontius Pilate, with the Gentiles, and the people of Israel, were gathered together, For to do whatsoever thy hand and thy counsel determined before to be done." Acts 4:26

So, you think that what God prophesied in Zechariak will not come to pass because of the above, unrelated verses?

Why?

The prophesy about the rejected cornerstone was in the Psalm 118:22-23 and Isaiah 28:16, and has no conflict with the fact that Israel will be a cup of trembling. No connection at all.

In both the Psalm and Isaiah we are told that there will be a saviour, rejected by Israel, and there was.

In Zecheriah we are told that in the end Israel will be a cup of trembling for all nations, and it is... but you contest this fulfullment of prophesy based on the accuracy of the fulfillment of unrelated prophesy?

I don't get it.

I see even less connection to Acts 4:26.

[napsnsnacks]

We know that the Jewish nation were hated during WWii. Today there are a new wave of hate against them. It is called Anti-Semitism. My question is as follows. Is it a term related to them or did they make it up for themselfs as some might believe. Is Anti-Semitism agains other nations as well as some believe for instance America against the Muslems. I believe it is purely against the Jewish nation.

Report: Anti-Semitism on the rise globally - CNN.com
14 Mar 2008 ... A report from the US State Department details "an upsurge" across the world of anti-Semitism -- hostility and discrimination toward Jewish ...
www.cnn.com/2008/US/03/14/anti-semitism/index.html - Cached - SimilarAnti-Semitism on the Rise in Europe - World - CBN News - Christian ...
In Europe Today, Most Jews Are Anxious. Some Are Scared, And Many Have Already Left For Israel Or The United States.
www.cbn.com/cbnnews/.../Anti-Semitism-on-the-Rise-in-Europe-/ - CachedAnti-Semitism on the Rise in America -- ADL Survey on Anti-Semitic ...
Anti-Semitism on the Rise in America -- ADL Survey on Anti-Semitic Attitudes Reveals 17 Percent of Americans Hold.
www.adl.org/presrele/asus_12/4109_12.htm - Cached - Similar"Anti-Semitism on the Rise in Europe" CBN News Newswatch

- 6 min - 1 Apr 2008
www.youtube.com Even though many European governments have condemned the new rise in anti-Semitism, there is a clear perception among many ...
www.youtube.com/watch?v=A7VsJY4DsfI - more videos »

Get more video results'Anti-Semitism on the rise in Sweden' - The Local
9 Feb 2009 ... An ugly wave of anti-Semitism is on the rise in Sweden, and politicians who compare Israel with Nazi Germany or apartheid-era South Africa ...
www.thelocal.se/17466/20090209/ - Cached - SimilarBBC NEWS | Europe | Anti-Semitism 'on rise in Europe'
31 Mar 2004 ... Attacks against Jews in Europe have sharply increased, says a report by a European anti-racism watchdog.
news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/3586543.stm - Cached - SimilarANTI SEMITISM ON THE RISE IN JERUSALEM AS POGROMS ARE PLANNED ...
24 Apr 2010 ... ANTI SEMITISM ON THE RISE IN JERUSALEM AS POGROMS ARE PLANNED ... Palestinians are Semites… any violence aimed towards them is ANTI-SEMITIC! ...
desertpeace.wordpress.com/.../anti-semitism-on-the-rise-in-jerusalem-as-pogroms-are-planned/ - CachedParisian Jews: Anti-Semitism on the rise - Israel Jewish Scene ...
15 Feb 2009 ... Jewish Scene: On three-year anniversary of murder of 23-year-old French Jew Ilan Halimi, community members say situation only worsened, ...
www.ynet.co.il › Ynetnews › Jewish Scene - CachedThe writing is on the synagogue wall | Denis MacShane - Times Online
16 Feb 2009 ... World depressions lead to a rise in anti-Semitism. ... The Great Depression gave rise to the worst expressions of anti-Semitism ever seen, ...
www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/.../guest.../article5740603.ece - SimilarYouTube - Anti-Semitism on the Rise in Europe
Even though many European governments have condemned the new rise in anti-Semitism, there is a clear perception among many Jews that Europe's terrible ...
www.youtube.com/watch?v=Youigj8iZho - Cached - Similar

Before you go any further you need to examine:

REV 2:9 I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan.

[Johnny]

Hi everyone,

Thanks for the replies. You have confirmed what i already know. Somehow South African christians don't get it and i wanted to see on the open forum if you agree/disagree with my beliefs.

God bless.

[Ryan R]

Before you go any further you need to examine:

REV 2:9 I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan.

Frequently in the NT when the term 'Jews' is used it means the leaders of Jerusalem, not anyone of the seed of Abraham. This is clear since Jesus' followers, often in crowds of thousands, were Jews but the reference to 'Jews' only includes the Sanhedrin.
But apart from that, again it isn’t because of Israel’s faithfulness to God’s Word that God uses them, but God’s faithfulness to His Word.

[Ryan R]

Hi everyone,

Thanks for the replies. You have confirmed what i already know. Somehow South African christians don't get it and i wanted to see on the open forum if you agree/disagree with my beliefs.

God bless.

Hey Johnny,

South African Christians don't get what?

[David Taylor]

Frequently in the NT when the term 'Jews' is used it means the leaders of Jerusalem, not anyone of the seed of Abraham. This is clear since Jesus' followers, often in crowds of thousands, were Jews but the reference to 'Jews' only includes the Sanhedrin.
But apart from that, again it isn’t because of Israel’s faithfulness to God’s Word that God uses them, but God’s faithfulness to His Word.

It's true that often-time the Gospels refer to the unbelieve Jewish leadership as 'the Jews'; but that's not always the case.

In light of this passage from Galatians, I would say the subsequent Gospel references to the Jews are referring to the 'faithful seed of Abraham' and not to the Sanhedrin rulers.

I believe too many times, people like to say "all Jews" and put them in a box one way or the other; instead of realizing that "some Jews" didn't believe and rejected Him; but "some Jews" did believe and did receive Him as Messiah, Savior, and Lord. Those are the true seed of Abraham, following the one singular "Seed" himself.


Galatians 3:26 "For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus. For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus. And if ye be Christ's, then ye are Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise."

John 4:22 "Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews. But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him."

John 8:30 "As Jesus spake these words, many believed on him. Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then ye are my disciples indeed"

John 11:45 "Then many of the Jews which came to Mary, and had seen the things which Jesus did, believed on him."

John 12:11 "many of the Jews went away, and believed on Jesus."

[Ryan R]

It's true that often-time the Gospels refer to the unbelieve Jewish leadership as 'the Jews'; but that's not always the case.

Yep, we agree on that.

In light of this passage from Galatians, I would say the subsequent Gospel references to the Jews are referring to the 'faithful seed of Abraham' and not to the Sanhedrin rulers.

So David, am I understanding correctly that you see the context of this passage as a reference to Galatians 3:28?

I believe too many times, people like to say "all Jews" and put them in a box one way or the other; instead of realizing that "some Jews" didn't believe and rejected Him; but "some Jews" did believe and did receive Him as Messiah, Savior, and Lord. Those are the true seed of Abraham, following the one singular "Seed" himself.

OK, but the thing to consider is the above is both true before and after the cross in terms of individual salvation. The nation of Israel was corporately God's people as the descendents of Abraham before the cross, but individually each unbeliever was responsible for their own faith, as we see in Hebrews 11. Salvation never was by any other means than faith, and yet God says that "Jacob I loved, but Esau I have hated" (Malachi 1:2-3), "For you are a holy people to the LORD your God; the LORD your God has chosen you to be a people for His own possession out of all the peoples who are on the face of the earth" (Deuteronomy 7:6).

So in the sense of individual salvation, nothing as changed but our level of awareness of what the shadowy figures meant. Everyone has always been saved by the grace of Jesus' sacrifice (even when it was to come) and individually accountable for their faith.

None-the-less, the OT is full of references to the nation of Israel according to the flesh corporately, in what God would do with them and to them as a result of faith, or alternately as a lack thereof. Then He told in advance which path they would elect and what the results would be, specifically that they would be cut off and the gentiles would be called His people but in the end He would bring Israel back to a state of repentance.

Just as God brought them out of Egypt as a corporate body regardless of their unbelief, so He can and does still guide the path of the nation of Israel corporately, despite their unbelief.

God said what He would do with the nation, and the individuals therein have the responsibility to come to Jesus accept the eternal consequences, but the choice of the individual is not what we see in prophesy until the end, at which point, in Hosea and elsewhere, it says they will come back to him and in Zechariah it says they will mourn Him who they have pierced. Once that happens they will again be the true seed of Abraham, and until that happens they are the branch that will be re-grafted.

The thing is that even their unbelief and our (gentiles) belief was foretold in advance in the OT as a consequence of their unbelief, as is the next step which was the foretold corporate return of Israel to God.

How God will win every Jewish heart, I don't know, but God spoke corporately about Israel all throughout the OT and as far as accountability is concerned it has always come down to faith, so there is no reason to cast off the concept of corporate Israel as a result of the fulfillment of the prophesies of the suffering Messiah.

And by the way, you yourself are guilty of the "all Jews" accusation, in that you are saying that all Jews have to individually come to Christ to have any involvement with God and His plan corporately. While this is true for salvation, it is Biblically unsupportable to exrapolate to ever portion of God's plan, as God has never been restricted by unbelief but reconciles all things to himself, even hardness of heart.

Galatians 3:26 "For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus. For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus. And if ye be Christ's, then ye are Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise."

Again, this is referring only to Christians and has no bearing on what God is doing with the unbelieving world. Did He mention Pharaoh in the ten commandments? No. Did He use Pharaoh for His will, despite Pharaoh’s hardness of heart? Yes.

This verse just doesn't relate to unbelievers and how and when He will use them for His purposes or if and when He will bring them into His fold.

John 4:22 "Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews. But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him."

Right, and this says nothing of prophesy, nor of Israel corporately coming back to God. It simply tells of the fulfillment of the prophesy of the time of the gentiles which was the forewarned result of disbelief and disobedience, and which takes place before Israel laments and comes back to God.

John 8:30 "As Jesus spake these words, many believed on him. Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then ye are my disciples indeed"

No one is arguing that the unbelieving Jews are Jesus' disciples, are they?

John 11:45 "Then many of the Jews which came to Mary, and had seen the things which Jesus did, believed on him."

And many of the Jews who saw the Red Sea parted abandon God for a golden calf of their own making the minute Moses walked up the mountain, and God's furious wrath burned against them, but God still followed through with what He said would happen to the corporately, even though individually they were not permitted to enter His rest, but had to die off before the few believers were permitted to enter the promise land.

God has always worked with Israel corporately and individually simultaneously, and I would argue scripture consistently through the OT and NT demonstrates that this is still so. They've always been a stiff-necked people according to God in the OT, and each one will account for his own actions, but God has chosen to say that He will bring them to repentance, so it will happen, despite current unbelief and disobedience.

We both know that God is capable of that, so we're not arguing over His ability, just what He's said and none of the verses you have mentioned state or demonstrate that God will not bring Israel back corporately, but that Jesus saves and that the time of the gentiles is upon us so those who were not His people are now called His people, as foretold in the OT. But the thing that's getting missed is these things are not mutually exclusive. Both were foretold. It's unraveling just as He said it would, and the next step is the Jews, who are not God's people now in the time of the gentiles, mourning Him whom they pierced.

John 12:11 "many of the Jews went away, and believed on Jesus."

Sure, and to them applies Galatians 3:28 and the rest face God's wrath, just like those who had faith under the Law verses those who didn't, but God still did corporately what He said He would with Israel, as He is and will continue to do.

[David Taylor]

So in the sense of individual salvation, nothing as changed but our level of awareness of what the shadowy figures meant. Everyone has always been saved by the grace of Jesus' sacrifice (even when it was to come) and individually accountable for their faith.

I agree.

None-the-less, the OT is full of references to the nation of Israel according to the flesh corporately, in what God would do with them and to them as a result of faith, or alternately as a lack thereof. Then He told in advance which path they would elect and what the results would be

I agree. And this stopped with the NT. Their task corporately, was to deliver the Christ through the lineages as prophesied from Adam to Noah to Abraham to Isaac to Jacob to David to the virgin Mary; thus fulfilling all the OT prophecies, promises, types, and shadows.

Task completed and successfully accomplished. Jesus said, "IT IS FINISHED"....and "beginning at Moses and all the prophets, he expounded unto them in all the scriptures the things concerning himself...."

After that, the corporate role ended, and just as the Gentiles, all peoples...every human being was solely left with the individual role to accept or reject Christ....and then take that gospel to all the ends of the earth.

That is the remaining earthly task...taking the gospel to all creatures, until the Lord returns and severs the wicked from the just; and raises and changes and glorifies the redeemed, removing the bondage and curse or sin from the creation.

specifically that they would be cut off and the gentiles would be called His people but in the end He would bring Israel back to a state of repentance.

No Ryan. There is no plan to cut off the Jews and to replace them with the Gentiles.

The plan was always to shine the light into the darkness, and to add the Gentiles in. ++-Addition, not replacement-XX. Romans 11, the unfortunate tour-de-force chapter of dispensationalism, at it's core shows this.
Not replacement; but removal of the unfaithful, and graffting in of both the faithful natural and faithful wild branches....together.

Isaiah 11:10 "And in that day there shall be a root of Jesse, which shall stand for an ensign of the people; to it shall the Gentiles seek: and his rest shall be glorious."
Israel, (the people) and the Gentiles....both partaking of the root of Jesse together.

Isaiah 42:6 "I the LORD have called thee in righteousness, and will hold thine hand, and will keep thee, and give thee for a covenant of the people, for a light of the Gentiles"
Israel, (the people) and the Gentiles....both partaking of the Lord of Righteousness together.

Isaiah 49:6 And he said, It is a light thing that thou shouldest be my servant to raise up the tribes of Jacob, and to restore the preserved of Israel: I will also give thee for a light to the Gentiles, that thou mayest be my salvation unto the end of the earth."
Israel, (the people) and the Gentiles....both partaking of the Light of Salvation together.

Isaiah 59:20 "And the Redeemer shall come to Zion, and unto them that turn from transgression in Jacob, saith the LORD. As for me, this is my covenant with them, saith the LORD; My spirit that is upon thee, and my words which I have put in thy mouth, shall not depart out of thy mouth, nor out of the mouth of thy seed, nor out of the mouth of thy seed's seed, saith the LORD, from henceforth and for ever. Arise, shine; for thy light is come, and the glory of the LORD is risen upon thee. For, behold, the darkness shall cover the earth, and gross darkness the people: but the LORD shall arise upon thee, and his glory shall be seen upon thee. And the Gentiles shall come to thy light, and kings to the brightness of thy rising.
Israel, (the people) and the Gentiles....both partaking of the Light of the Redeemer together.


That's the gospel; and it's completely race-less. That's why the NT stresses that over and over again. "Whosoever will". Partake of the gospel, and then take that same light, and shine it from the hilltop, and shout it from the moutains!

Just as God brought them out of Egypt as a corporate body regardless of their unbelief, so He can and does still guide the path of the nation of Israel corporately, despite their unbelief.

No Ryan. In the time of Egypt, God was keeping them together corporately, to preserve them, because through them the Messiah would come.

Acts 13:17 The God of this people of Israel chose our fathers, and exalted the people when they dwelt as strangers in the land of Egypt, and with an high arm brought he them out of it. And about the time of forty years suffered he their manners in the wilderness. And when he had destroyed seven nations in the land of Chanaan, he divided their land to them by lot. And after that he gave unto them judges about the space of four hundred and fifty years, until Samuel the prophet. And afterward they desired a king: and God gave unto them Saul the son of Cis, a man of the tribe of Benjamin, by the space of forty years. And when he had removed him, he raised up unto them David to be their king; to whom also he gave their testimony, and said, I have found David the son of Jesse, a man after mine own heart, which shall fulfil all my will. Of this man's seed hath God according to his promise raised unto Israel a Saviour, Jesus; And when they had fulfilled all that was written of him, they took him down from the tree, and laid him in a sepulchre. But God raised him from the dead: And he was seen many days of them which came up with him from Galilee to Jerusalem, who are his witnesses unto the people. And we declare unto you glad tidings, how that the promise which was made unto the fathers, God hath fulfilled the same unto us their children, in that he hath raised up Jesus"

Now, God guides the hearts and minds of all men, whosoever will repent, accept, and follow Him, by the leading of the Holy Spirit. As in the case of Paul, when repentence occurs, the scales of blindness falls off.

There is no need for anything corporately now, because Christ has come. Messiah has been born, preached His message, died, and was born again to offer Himself equally to all humans at any time; whenever they will choose to repent as the Spirit calls.

As the Israelite Isaiah taught long ago the the children of Israel, and as the Israelite Paul parrotted; "For Isaiah saith, I have heard thee in a time accepted, and in the day of salvation have I succoured thee: behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation."

Likewise, as the Jew Peter also proclaimed to all the house of Israel: "Therefore let ALL the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made the same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ. Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do? Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the LORD our God shall call. And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation. " Acts 2:36

There is no corporation now in NT times, just an offer to follow and serve a Risen Savior; inviting all men to participate; and a charge to those men to take this Gospel message out to the ends of the Earth.

[Ryan R]

Before we continue, do you reject the idea that the events in Revelation have yet to be fulfilled?

Actually, why don't you answer that on the new thread you created for this discussion?

[napsnsnacks]

We know that the Jewish nation were hated during WWii. Today there are a new wave of hate against them. It is called Anti-Semitism. My question is as follows. Is it a term related to them or did they make it up for themselfs as some might believe. Is Anti-Semitism agains other nations as well as some believe for instance America against the Muslems. I believe it is purely against the Jewish nation.

Report: Anti-Semitism on the rise globally - CNN.com
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- 6 min - 1 Apr 2008
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Semitic peoples are Jews/Hebrews/Palestinians and Arabs alike.

Like Europeans, Chinese and South Americans, they are all genetic family, The Jews/Hebrews come from Isaac and their half brothers the Arabs came from Ishmael, both sons of Abraham.

But, antisemitism is only ever applied to Jews/Hebrews as if they cornered the market on being hated.

First a little history and it isn't out of order to transpose "interest" with "usury" because it is the same thing with "usury" being Old English for the modern "interest" being the interest on your car, home, rental furniture, credit cards, is all equally usury. These particular type Jews hate barter and cash and carry because they have no method skimming as a middle man between the two.

EX 22:25 If thou lend money to any of my people that is poor by thee, thou shalt not be to him as an usurer, neither shalt thou lay upon him usury.

LEV 25:35 And if thy brother be waxen poor, and fallen in decay with thee; then thou shalt relieve him: yea, though he be a stranger, or a sojourner; that he may live with thee.
LEV 25:36 Take thou no usury of him, or increase: but fear thy God; that thy brother may live with thee.
LEV 25:37 Thou shalt not give him thy money upon usury, nor lend him thy victuals for increase.

DEUT 23:19 Thou shalt not lend upon usury to thy brother; usury of money, usury of victuals, usury of any thing that is lent upon usury:

DEUT 23:20 Unto a stranger thou mayest lend upon usury; but unto thy brother thou shalt not lend upon usury: that the LORD thy God may bless thee in all that thou settest thine hand to in the land whither thou goest to possess it.

NEH 5:7 Then I consulted with myself, and I rebuked the nobles, and the rulers, and said unto them, Ye exact usury, every one of his brother. And I set a great assembly against them.

NEH 5:9 Also I said, It is not good that ye do: ought ye not to walk in the fear of our God because of the reproach of the heathen our enemies?
NEH 5:10 I likewise, and my brethren, and my servants, might exact of them money and corn: I pray you, let us leave off this usury.
NEH 5:11 Restore, I pray you, to them, even this day, their lands, their vineyards, their oliveyards, and their houses, also the hundredth part of the money, and of the corn, the wine, and the oil, that ye exact of them.
NEH 5:12 Then said they, We will restore them, and will require nothing of them; so will we do as thou sayest. Then I called the priests, and took an oath of them, that they should do according to this promise.

PS 15:5 He that putteth not out his money to usury, nor taketh reward against the innocent. He that doeth these things shall never be moved.

PROV 28:8 He that by usury and unjust gain increaseth his substance, he shall gather it for him that will pity the poor.

IS 24:1 Behold, the LORD maketh the earth empty, and maketh it waste, and turneth it upside down, and scattereth abroad the inhabitants thereof.
IS 24:2 And it shall be, as with the people, so with the priest; as with the servant, so with his master; as with the maid, so with her mistress; as with the buyer, so with the seller; as with the lender, so with the borrower; as with the taker of usury, so with the giver of usury to him.
IS 24:3 The land shall be utterly emptied, and utterly spoiled: for the LORD hath spoken this word.
IS 24:4 The earth mourneth and fadeth away, the world languisheth and fadeth away, the haughty people of the earth do languish.

Now whether or not God gave them the concept of usury or they invented it and God put rules on it is irrelevant since it appears that they invented it and God put rules on it.

As far as 'antisemitism" being on the rise in Europe, this is nothing new. It happens periodically but it isn't antisemitism based on race, it is because of usury. History is heavily censored about why Jews were persecuted and kicked out of various places because only rarely is the truth ever spoken about why they were thrown out. The censors hope that you are so stupid to understand that it is literally impossible for so many races and nations in the world to want the skins of one race of people nailed on the wall.

Usury. Jews have a habit of scraping together every coin by the sweat of their own brow and then form a cabal and go into the money lending business. This always ends in trouble. Medieval Christendom had outlawed usury because of the vast amount of power, wealth and control to be obtained with the abuse of usury.

All the talk of race in the world during the course of my life as related to antisemitism is really cover for anti-usurer. The only reason that it comes to effect the garden variety Jew living somewhere is that because the top people in the usury business are and have always been Jews, they are hopelessly embedded as the financial bosses and for all the economic destruction an economic collapse that they create, people start to hate Jews in general because the main Jews that did it to the nation are out of reach of retaliation of the general populace so they take it out on the regular guy. Hitler was not the author of that type of social mentality, this type of social mentality is a human disease in general, he just took it to the extremes because Jews were being persecuted and killed thousands of years before Hitler was ever born but Hitler is used as the poster boy of "antisemitism".

This secondary situation of taking it out on the man in the streets provides cover for the real source, the source at the top of the financial food chain and that is usurer who happens to be Jewish.

Look at the global money cabal today and you won't be able to swing a dead cat in the United States or Europe without hitting a Jewish "financier". Now, it is apparent that If God did not want Jews or anyone else to practice usury he would have just simply banned it right? Right so He put rules on it but what good are any rules but to those who respect and obey God? As things progress you see what happened in Nehemiah right? Usury came into the hands of godless men and as such, even if they were their own people, were enemies of their own people. A sub-group.

OK, let's start there in understanding what "antisemitism" really is. These guys were obviously in the money lending business but were not the types to respect and obey God because the record shows that they were in gross violation of the Law.

Regulated usury in the hands of a God fearing Jew (or anyone else) can't be evil or God would not allow it, BUT, the abuse of usury in the hands of a godless, secular atheist who is a Jew, ones who may be satanically bent on absolute wealth and power can literally destroy the world at the push of a button regardless of what government may be in place anywhere in the world.

Yeah, it's true, a Jew, just like any another person, can be under the influence of the Devil, wow what a revelation.

Usury, as related in scripture, irregardless of whether the concept and practice of usury was invented by Jews or given to them by God, for the sheer fact that God put rules on usury, was never intended to be in the hands of a godless Jew or anyone else of such character. If so then what were the rules for since only those who would respect the rules would be one who would respect and obey God right? So, you get all these godless Jewish money lenders throughout history, who are only really a handful of Jews in comparison to the Jewish population in general but yet those Jews are protected and insulated from social retaliation for the damage that they do so society as a whole, who is just a wild ass anyway just has to get some vengeance and satisfaction, (just like in a riot, the upset can't get their hands on the politicians so they set fire to every car and store in the neighborhood) inevitably takes it out on the next best thing which is the garden variety Jewish person.

So, as a Christian, after reading probably thousands of documents in my life about antisemitism written from every quarter, slant, religion and politic imaginable I have no choice but to conclude that "antisemitism" is a Jewish problem that can only be resolved by Jews because overall, due the the acts throughout national, international and global financial history of a handful of Jews, they all gets bullets in their heads, are run out of town, are persecuted, when really they were just people like anybody else.

I never met a Jew that was any better or worse than anyone else. They lived their lives, minded their own business, worked, raised their kids, paid taxes, took out the trash, cut the grass, et al.

This is why overall in most societies around the world today have no understanding of antisemitism that has any basis in reality because it's all skewed.

The very source of antisemitism isn't with Hitler or Nazi's or the KKK or any other group but is to be blamed on Jewish bankers. "Antisemitism" really is "anti-practitioner-of usury". If it wasn't for the handful of those particular Jews and their cabal, I seriously doubt that any persecution and mass murder of Jews would have ever existed.

The man in the street Jew takes the racial wrap for the crooked Jewish bankers just like the average Black guy has to take the racial wrap for the Black crack dealer.

If there is ever going to be a solution to "antisemitism" then it has to by Jews and for Jews within the ranks of their own people, in order to save the assassinated character of their people that was perpetrated by their own people being those usurers in the financial industry.

All through history, Jews in general have been racially demonized for the works and deeds of the financial elite of their race of people. If Jews never stand up for themselves and stand up for their own people as if they are regular people and not spawns of the Devil then I don't think "antisemitism" will ever go away. It is a rogue element within the Jewish people that is the source of "antisemitism" so in essence it is a sub-group within their own people throughout history who have brought the hammer down on them as a whole.

It rains on everybody because the Jewish usurer was thrown into the oven along with the garden variety Jew.

These Jewish bankers throughout history have been mostly Zionists, secular atheists. Jews or not, God is the farthest thing from these people. One of these days God is going to put it into Jews hearts at large to demand justice from their own people for the sub-group who have endlessly assassinated the character of God's chosen people because they will then understand that a sub-group within their own group are the ones responsible for the mass graves.

When society goes full blown riot and that society can't get their hands on the perpetrator, insanity ensues and they torch and kill what ever is handy so if the bankers who caused a financial collapse are Jews then due to pure ignorance of the human mind Jews in general will be lined up and shot. The justice is out of focus so to speak since they should have went after the actual perpetrators instead of their racial kin. The same goes if the perpetrators were Whites, Blacks or whoever so this form of vengeance isn't actually an act of "antisemitism" because it is really "anti-usury".

"Antisemitism" as it has been lauded in America and abroad for decades is, if it is anything at all, is a misnomer and mass psychological manipulation. Could even be called propaganda.