Be not be drunk with wine... wine thread.

[MoreMercy]

What are you basing that on?

What do you believe He drank at the Last Supper?

Thank you Amos_with_goats
Wine I suppose because that was the drink he mentioned at that supper, when He did vow that he would not partake of it again until He returns.

But I know for sure that every drink made of the vine is not "strong drink" which I presented in context of the current topic on this thread. "strong drink"

[Frecs]

I did not post here that: He took a the vow of a Nazarite.
Please read what I posted again: I clearly posted that I see His life walking and teaching on earth as living a vow of a Nazarene. IE: filling the requirments of a vow of a Nazarene.


His peace to you.

Based on what? The only requirements of the Nazarite Vow was to obstain from anything from the grapevine (that would include non-fermented grape juice, grapes, raisins, grape leaves) and to cut the hair at the beginning and then the end of the vow. Based on what scripture do you summise that Jesus followed that dictate?

[MoreMercy]

Based on what? The only requirements of the Nazarite Vow was to obstain from anything from the grapevine (that would include non-fermented grape juice, grapes, raisins, grape leaves) and to cut the hair at the beginning and then the end of the vow. Based on what scripture do you summise that Jesus followed that dictate?

Hi again Frecs.
Again I do not and did not "summise that Jesus followed that dictate"
I communicated that I personally see His life lived as fulfilling said requirements, I do not and did not communicate that He intended or vowed to submit to said requirements.
What is so hard for you to digest there ?
Or why do you keep trying to put your words into my posted communication to another member here.

If you still desire to discuss this then please allow me to suggest that you create a thread with Nazarite Vow in its title.
I promise you here, that I will post there if that is your intention here ?



Peace.

[MoreMercy]

The only verse in the entire bible that speaks positively of wine is I Timothy 5:23. Even that verse says it is to be used for stomach trouble. A medicinal purpose...come to think of it, so is marijuana. The Bible doesn't say marijuana is a sin, was Christ smoking marijuana? Hey, the Bible doesn't say it was a sin...so.... OH. Also, the Bible doesn't say getting married is a sin, was Christ married? Mary of Magdalene? huh? I could go on this all day. THE fact is is that someone can "hang" or be around drunks and not drink. I have done that all the time. Christ's presence convicted of sin. Christ would not DRINK in the presence of those getting drunk. The Lord inspired the passage that says, "Abstain from all appearance of evil." Unless the Bible says that Christ actually drank fermented wine, then I am led to believe that he was consistent with the rest of scripture on the topic.

You are correct Christ life on earth walking and teaching was living a vow of the Nazarene which did not allow Him to partake of strong drink.

I desire to clearly show you ONE thing:
I desire to show you where you came here and condemn those who will partake of strong drink when you came to share your drink with us, when Christ did not condemn us when He came to us to offer to share His drink with us, even when we were drinking (strong drink).


Father bless.

[Frecs]

Hi again Frecs.
Again I do not and did not "summise that Jesus followed that dictate"
I communicated that I personally see His life lived as fulfilling said requirements, I do not and did not communicate that He intended or vowed to submit to said requirements.
What is so hard for you to digest there ?
Or why do you keep trying to put your words into my posted communication to another member here.


Peace.

You are, or appear to be, stating that Jesus did not drink fermented wine. I'm trying to find out from you where in scripture it says that. Because, it is bad practice to create doctrine that argues from silence. So, from your post, you say that you see his life as fulling the Nazarite vows (thus, my statement that you summised that he followed the Nazarite vow). Based on what scripture. It really a simple question with no ulterior motive other than to understand where you are deriving your conclusion.

[Firefighter]

The only verse in the entire bible that speaks positively of wine is I Timothy 5:23.

You forgot a few...

Category Wine Strong Drink
Use accepted as normal part of culture 58 1
Symbolic (The wine of his wrath, etc.) 32 1
Wine called a blessing from God 27 0
Use in offerings and sacrifices 24 1
Loss of wine an example of a curse from God 19 1
Examples of abuse of alcohol 16 3
Vows of abstinence 15 6
Warnings against abuse 13 4
Gifts between people 9 0
Comparisons (x is better than wine) 5 0
False accusations of drunkenness 3 1
Rules for selecting deacons 3 0
Miscellaneous 3 1
Abstinence in deference to weak consciences 1 0
Total 228 19

Psalms 104:14-15 “He causes the grass to grow for the cattle, and vegetation for the labor of man, so that he may bring forth food from the earth, And wine which makes man’s heart glad, so that he may make his face glisten with oil, and food which sustains man’s heart.”

Isa 25:6, “And the LORD of hosts will prepare a lavish banquet for all peoples on this mountain; a banquet of aged wine, choice pieces with marrow, and refined, aged wine.

[MoreMercy]

You are, or appear to be, stating that Jesus did not drink fermented wine. I'm trying to find out from you where in scripture it says that. Because, it is bad practice to create doctrine that argues from silence. So, from your post, you say that you see his life as fulling the Nazarite vows (thus, my statement that you summised that he followed the Nazarite vow). Based on what scripture. It really a simple question with no ulterior motive other than to understand where you are deriving your conclusion.

I do not desire to teach or create a new doctrine here on this thread or anywhere for that matter, and even if I did, I surely would not do it with one-liners or single verses.

That said:
If you still desire to discuss this then please allow me to suggest that you create a thread with Nazarite Vow in its title.
I promise you here, that I will post there if that is your intention here ?

Otherwise I have no other option than to place you on ignore list until I am finished posting to jandl on this thread here.
Would you please allow me to post to jandl now ?
I will not clarify anymore here on this thread to you, of what I have posted on this thread to jandl unless you create a thread with Nazarite Vow in its title.

Peace

[Amos_with_goats]

Ok. No reasonable follower of Christ can possibly miss the clear instruction to be not drunk with wine.

This thread is not advocating drunken behavoir.

However, there is a belief among many believers that wine is evil.

I do not see this in scripture. Actually, if not for love of my brothers I might propose that wine should be used for communion. I DO believe this is more accurate, but would not do it for fear that my 'weaker brother' might stumble.

I have wanted to start this thread for some time now, and will begin with a quote from UM...

Please set 'feelings' aside and let's discuss this... ok?

You forgot a few...

Category Wine Strong Drink
Use accepted as normal part of culture 58 1
Symbolic (The wine of his wrath, etc.) 32 1
Wine called a blessing from God 27 0
Use in offerings and sacrifices 24 1
Loss of wine an example of a curse from God 19 1
Examples of abuse of alcohol 16 3
Vows of abstinence 15 6
Warnings against abuse 13 4
Gifts between people 9 0
Comparisons (x is better than wine) 5 0
False accusations of drunkenness 3 1
Rules for selecting deacons 3 0
Miscellaneous 3 1
Abstinence in deference to weak consciences 1 0
Total 228 19

[Amos_with_goats]

Ok, so I moved the posts from the WOTM thread here...

Carry on.

[MoreMercy]

jandl

Originally Posted by jandl
The only verse in the entire bible that speaks positively of wine is I Timothy 5:23. Even that verse says it is to be used for stomach trouble. A medicinal purpose...come to think of it, so is marijuana. The Bible doesn't say marijuana is a sin, was Christ smoking marijuana? Hey, the Bible doesn't say it was a sin...so.... OH. Also, the Bible doesn't say getting married is a sin, was Christ married? Mary of Magdalene? huh? I could go on this all day. THE fact is is that someone can "hang" or be around drunks and not drink. I have done that all the time. Christ's presence convicted of sin. Christ would not DRINK in the presence of those getting drunk. The Lord inspired the passage that says, "Abstain from all appearance of evil." Unless the Bible says that Christ actually drank fermented wine, then I am led to believe that he was consistent with the rest of scripture on the topic.

You are correct Christ life on earth walking and teaching was living a vow of the Nazarene which did not allow Him to partake of strong drink.

I desire to clearly show you ONE thing:
I desire to show you where you came here and condemn those who will partake of strong drink when you came to share your drink with us, when Christ did not condemn us when He came to us to offer to share His drink with us, even when we were drinking (strong drink).


Father bless.

[Frecs]

Ok. No reasonable follower of Christ can possibly miss the clear instruction to be not drunk with wine.

This thread is not advocating drunken behavoir.

However, there is a belief among many believers that wine is evil.

I do not see this in scripture. Actually, if not for love of my brothers I might propose that wine should be used for communion. I DO believe this is more accurate, but would not do it for fear that my 'weaker brother' might stumble.

I have wanted to start this thread for some time now, and will begin with a quote from UM...

Please set 'feelings' aside and let's discuss this... ok?

Amos...I started the "Nazarite Vow" thread per MoreMercy's request. Should we combine them or let them both run?

[embankmentlb]

Matthew 11:19
The Son of Man came eating and drinking, and they say, 'Here is a glutton and a drunkard, a friend of tax collectors and "sinners." ' But wisdom is proved right by her actions."

[Amos_with_goats]

Amos...I started the "Nazarite Vow" thread per MoreMercy's request. Should we combine them or let them both run?

I am thinking let 'emboth run... the nazarite vow is more then drinking...

Hope they are both great discussions!

[MoreMercy]

Matthew 11:19
The Son of Man came eating and drinking, and they say, 'Here is a glutton and a drunkard, a friend of tax collectors and "sinners." ' But wisdom is proved right by her actions."

Woot Amen! *happy feet dance*

[MoreMercy]

I am thinking let 'emboth run... the nazarite vow is more then drinking...

Hope they are both great discussions!

I do not see Frecs thread, is it on a different board ?