Discussion: The problem with Lust

[-SEEKING-]

Can we apply James 1:14-15 to our own wives?:

Nope .

[david]

Nope .

If not, then we know that lust could not mean the desire of having sex, as people say, because otherwise James 1:14-15 would not be true.

[-SEEKING-]

If not, then we know that lust could not mean the desire of having sex, as people say, because otherwise James 1:14-15 would not be true.

It's not lusting to desire to have your own wife.

[andrew_no_one]

You are correct in saying that the words “masturbation” and “porn” are not included in Bible vernacular; however in modern English, these words both reek of sexual immorality, which we are commanded to flee from (1 Corinthians 6:18).
You are correct in saying that looking at a woman lustfully is adultery, but I do not think that lust enters into a marriage equation; love, desire, cherish...these are what is done between spouses. Husbands are commanded to love their wives just as Christ loved the Church (Ephesians 5:25) which involves a sacrificial non-selfish love, not lustful in any way. Lust is an emotion that longs to satisfy the cravings of the individual; “I want”, “I need”, “I covet”...this is lust. Never did Christ lust over the Church.
If you’re going to pull Leviticus into the mix, I’ll point out that this has to do with being ceremonially clean and not a condition of the heart.
The scripture you used from Acts relates to God commanding Peter to go to the home of a gentile, Cornelius, though at the time for a Jew to do such a thing was considered off-limits.
A man can certainly do things to make himself unclean. As Jesus said in Matthew 5:18-19
But the things that come out of the mouth come from the heart, and these make a man ‘unclean.’ For out of the heart come evil thoughts, murder, adultery, sexual immorality, theft, false testimony, slander.
From your post it seems that you are advocating masturbation and lust to those who are being led by the Spirit to forsake such things (I hope that was not your intention).

I hope you didn't miss this one. I hope it will at least clear up what lust is.

[Brother Mark]

If not, then we know that lust could not mean the desire of having sex, as people say, because otherwise James 1:14-15 would not be true.

Dude, there is a difference between sinful lust of anything (another woman, a car, a house, etc.) and desire for your wife.

[david]

I hope you didn't miss this one. I hope it will at least clear up what lust is.

We have not established whether or not lust is wrong or not. No one has brought up scripture that says "lust is wrong."

[andrew_no_one]

We have not established whether or not lust is wrong or not. No one has brought up scripture that says "lust is wrong."

Have you read anything that Brother Mark or baxpack7 had to say?

lust

–noun
1.
intense sexual desire or appetite.
2.
uncontrolled or illicit sexual desire or appetite; lecherousness.
3.
a passionate or overmastering desire or craving (usually fol. by for ): a lust for power.

[david]

Have you read anything that Brother Mark or baxpack7 had to say?

lust

–noun
1.
intense sexual desire or appetite.
2.
uncontrolled or illicit sexual desire or appetite; lecherousness.
3.
a passionate or overmastering desire or craving (usually fol. by for ): a lust for power.

Bring up any scripture that says "lust is wrong."

[Brother Mark]

Bring up any scripture that says "lust is wrong."

We already have multiple times. But here are some more again.


Matt 5:27-28

27 " You have heard that it was said, 'YOU SHALL NOT COMMIT ADULTERY'; 28 but I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart.
NASU

James 1:14-15
14 But each one is tempted when he is carried away and enticed by his own lust. 15 Then when lust has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and when sin is accomplished, it brings forth death.
NASU


James 4:1-3

4 What is the source of quarrels and conflicts among you? Is not the source your pleasures that wage war in your members? 2 You lust and do not have; so you commit murder. You are envious and cannot obtain; so you fight and quarrel. You do not have because you do not ask. 3 You ask and do not receive, because you ask with wrong motives, so that you may spend it on your pleasures.
NASU

2 Peter 1:4
4 For by these He has granted to us His precious and magnificent promises, so that by them you may become partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world by lust.
NASU

Note: corruption that is in the world by lust. That's pretty plain.

And an all encompassing verse.


1 John 2:16-17
16 For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh and the lust of the eyes and the boastful pride of life, is not from the Father, but is from the world. 17 The world is passing away, and also its lusts; but the one who does the will of God lives forever.
NASU

And we haven't even looked into the verses that deal with sexual immorality as a form of lust exclusively and there are many, many of them.

[david]

We already have multiple times. But here are some more again.


Matt 5:27-28

27 " You have heard that it was said, 'YOU SHALL NOT COMMIT ADULTERY'; 28 but I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart.
NASU

James 1:14-15
14 But each one is tempted when he is carried away and enticed by his own lust. 15 Then when lust has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and when sin is accomplished, it brings forth death.
NASU


James 4:1-3

4 What is the source of quarrels and conflicts among you? Is not the source your pleasures that wage war in your members? 2 You lust and do not have; so you commit murder. You are envious and cannot obtain; so you fight and quarrel. You do not have because you do not ask. 3 You ask and do not receive, because you ask with wrong motives, so that you may spend it on your pleasures.
NASU

2 Peter 1:4
4 For by these He has granted to us His precious and magnificent promises, so that by them you may become partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world by lust.
NASU

Note: corruption that is in the world by lust. That's pretty plain.

And an all encompassing verse.


1 John 2:16-17
16 For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh and the lust of the eyes and the boastful pride of life, is not from the Father, but is from the world. 17 The world is passing away, and also its lusts; but the one who does the will of God lives forever.
NASU

And we haven't even looked into the verses that deal with sexual immorality as a form of lust exclusively and there are many, many of them.

1. lusting after a woman is wrong
2. if lust is conceived, it gives birth to sin
3. murder might happen after lust
4. lust might bring corruption. It doesn't say lust will always bring corruption, it says lust might bring corruption.
5. lust of the flesh and lust of the eyes is not from the father

But it does not say that lust by itself is wrong. Any more verses?

[Brother Mark]

1. lusting after a woman is wrong

That's pretty much lust by itself right there.

2. if lust is conceived, it gives birth to sin

Lust when it has conceived is sin. There is lust again, by itself.

5. lust of the flesh and lust of the eyes is not from the father

Lust of the flesh is again, by itself and of the world.

Lust of the eyes, by itself, and of the world.

But it does not say that lust by itself is wrong. Any more verses?

It says it repeatedly. Lust of the flesh is when the flesh is lusting (sexual immorality, gluttony, etc.). Lust of the eye is when the eye sees something it wants but shouldn't have (i.e. greed, materialism, etc.) Both of them are listed by themselves in this passage...


1 John 2:16-17
16 For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh and the lust of the eyes and the boastful pride of life, is not from the Father, but is from the world. 17 The world is passing away, and also its lusts; but the one who does the will of God lives forever.
NASU

[david]

How do we know when lust has conceived or not? we dont know this only except when sin has been given birth, then we may know whether lust has been conceived.

There are
1. lust of the flesh
2. lust of the eyes
3. lusting after a woman

but we do not find "lust is wrong."

[david]

I have found the answer. Lust is the same thing as covet. See greek interlinear bible for Romans 7:7 and compare to 1 Thessalonians 4:5. Hence, you are right, lust is wrong, because god said we should not covet.

[Brother Mark]

I have found the answer. Lust is the same thing as covet. See greek interlinear bible for Romans 7:7 and compare to 1 Thessalonians 4:5. Hence, you are right, lust is wrong, because god said we should not covet.

Yes, to lust is to covet. I thought the verses in James made that clear. That's why I was confused about your responses. Lusting after sex is just a portion of all that lust entails.

[andrew_no_one]

I have found the answer. Lust is the same thing as covet. See greek interlinear bible for Romans 7:7 and compare to 1 Thessalonians 4:5. Hence, you are right, lust is wrong, because god said we should not covet.

Dude, that was in my post in the first page...