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    Jesus

    What exactly was sacrificed when Jesus was crucified? If he knew he was going to be resurrected wouldn't that make the entire sacrifice meaningless?

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    Re: Jesus

    Quote Originally Posted by Haptism View Post
    What exactly was sacrificed when Jesus was crucified? If he knew he was going to be resurrected wouldn't that make the entire sacrifice meaningless?
    No, that's what makes the sacrifice meaningful. Had he not been resurrected, it would have been pointless. As for what was sacrificed... Jesus was, for the sin of the world. His body, and his blood (more specifically).

  3. #3

    Re: Jesus

    But then he was resurrected and he got it all back. I think of it as someone sacrifice a calf to their deity although they know that when they do they will get another one. I always thought when someone sacrificed something it was gone permanently.

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    Re: Jesus

    The point of Jesus' sacrifice is that it does not need to be done again, it is once, for all.

    In the OT when they sacrificed a calf, they needed to do it again if they sinned.
    God says that without the shedding of blood, there is no remission of sins.
    Jesus Christ....who do you say He is?


    Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world. 1 John 4:1

  5. #5

    Re: Jesus

    So the point of it wasn't that anything was given up, just that blood was spilled?

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    Re: Jesus

    Quote Originally Posted by Haptism View Post
    What exactly was sacrificed when Jesus was crucified? If he knew he was going to be resurrected wouldn't that make the entire sacrifice meaningless?
    To answer your first question, the blood and physical body of Jesus Christ were sacrificed.

    Colossians 1:19-23 ..... "For God was pleased to have all his fullness dwell in him (Jesus) and through him to reconcile to himself all things, whether things on earth or things in heaven, by making peace through his blood, shed on the cross.

    Once you were alienated from God and were enemies in your minds because of your evil behavior. But now he has reconciled you by Christ’s physical body through death to present you holy in his sight, without blemish and free from accusation— if you continue in your faith, established and firm, and do not move from the hope held out in the gospel. This is the gospel that you heard and that has been proclaimed to every creature under heaven, and of which I, Paul, have become a servant."
    1 Peter 1:18-19 ..... "For you know that it was not with perishable things such as silver or gold that you were redeemed from the empty way of life handed down to you from your ancestors, but with the precious blood of Christ, a lamb without blemish or defect.
    As for your second question, I think you have the wrong idea of what a sacrifice is and was. Glenn Miller, in his commentary on sacrifice, says that a sacrifice is more about turning something over to God and not about the death per se.

    Here is his commentary, entitled If Jesus didn't stay dead, then how was it a REAL sacrifice?. It's quite lengthy and a little tedious, but an excellent read.

    As far as what I think, personally? Death was a punishment for sin. The Bible say that the "wages of sin is death". Jesus did not deserve to to die. He had to endure something that was a punishment reserved for the wicked.

    In the Garden of Gethsemane, he grieved to the point of almost DYING over what was about to take place.

    He was going to be separated from the Father. Acutely and cognizantly aware of every single sin committed by every single human being that has ever lived or will live.

    His body suffered pain like no other person. I don't see how Jesus knowing that He would be resurrected would diminish the experience of pain, undeserved separation from God, and, as the Bible says, BECOMING sin.

    Jesus didn't just take away our sins. Jesus Christ, the sinless Son of God, BECAME sin for us and died a cruel death so that his blood could save those of us who actually deserve the punishment.

    Sacrifice isn't necessarily a permanent death or permanent loss. It's a surrendering over to God.

    The Bible always commands us to be a living sacrifice every single day.
    ".....it's your nickel"

  7. #7

    Re: Jesus

    Ah well put. So Jesus and God (and the Holy Spirit) didn't become one until after the resurrection, correct? The reason I ask this is because if the Holy Trinity existed before that it would be like sacrificing yourself to yourself.

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    Re: Jesus

    Quote Originally Posted by Haptism View Post
    Ah well put. So Jesus and God (and the Holy Spirit) didn't become one until after the resurrection, correct? The reason I ask this is because if the Holy Trinity existed before that it would be like sacrificing yourself to yourself.
    Jesus said that He and the Father were "one" and He said this before the crucifixion.

    It's not that it was sacrificing yourself to yourself.

    It was like sacrificing a part of yourself for someone else. God sacrificed a part of His own nature, a nature that we call the Trinity, for humanity.

    ".....it's your nickel"

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    Re: Jesus

    Jesus is God who came in the flesh - a total human being, of blood.

    God installed the sacrifice of blood in the forgiveness of sin in the Mosaic Law - as forshadowing of the sacrifice one Man will make for all.

    When Jesus sacrificed himself, he was human. He was able to stop it, but proceeded. He was totally committed as Man to do the ultimate sacrifice, and win the spiritual war against satan.

    His knowledge was based of human faith. He showed that faith in God was stronger than fear of death. When He was ressurected, the battle was won - and the path was paved - all that believed (i.e. had faith) inherited the ressurection to paradise after the death of their flesh. We know this the same way Jesus knew it when he was human. It is knowledge by faith. It is the ulitimate test of faith!

    Anton

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    Re: Jesus

    The resurrection was God's stamp on the validity of Jesus' sacrifice. Because Jesus was no animal. He was/is God's spotless Lamb, in human form. The temple sacrifices just pointed to Him and made everyone aware of the fact that the life of something is in the blood, and that the shedding of blood grants the remission of sins. The innocent covering for the guilty. After Jesus' sacrifice and the shedding of His blood, there was never again a need for another. God let everyone know this by raising Him from the dead.

    It's about forgiveness of sin, yes, but also about the promise of eternal life that reaches beyond death. When we put our faith in the Lord, it's not just for this life but for the next one also. It's eternal. It's faith in the God of the resurrection, who lives forever.

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    Re: Jesus

    Quote Originally Posted by Haptism View Post
    But then he was resurrected and he got it all back.
    That's what happens when you defeat something

    Quote Originally Posted by Haptism View Post
    I think of it as someone sacrifice a calf to their deity although they know that when they do they will get another one. I always thought when someone sacrificed something it was gone permanently.
    In the context of Old Testament sacrifices, the answer would be 'no' - animal sacrifices didn't do anything.

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    Re: Jesus

    Jesus gave up His life, that was the sacrifice. It matters not that He came back to life. Every Human being who dies will come back to life to face the final judgement of God. And no one ceases to exists once they have experienced death.



    All Praise The Ancient Of Days

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    Re: Jesus

    1 Cor 15:13-15 - But if there be no resurrection of the dead, then is Christ not risen:And if Christ be not risen, then is our preaching vain, and your faith is also vain. Yea, and we are found false witnesses of God; because we have testified of God that he raised up Christ: whom he raised not up, if so be that the dead rise not.

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    Re: Jesus

    Quote Originally Posted by Haptism View Post
    What exactly was sacrificed when Jesus was crucified? If he knew he was going to be resurrected wouldn't that make the entire sacrifice meaningless?
    His body was sacrificed.

    If you had to sacrifice your body, would it be meaningless to you?

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    Re: Jesus

    Quote Originally Posted by Haptism View Post
    What exactly was sacrificed when Jesus was crucified? If he knew he was going to be resurrected wouldn't that make the entire sacrifice meaningless?
    His sacrifice was far from meaningless. Because of His willful sacrifice, He took upon Himself every sin that had ever been committed by every human being that would ever live.

    The perfect, sinless, holy God sacrificed Himself by becoming sin for us....to redeem us from those sins.

    His resurrection only showed His final, ultimate power over sin and death. That even though He humbled Himself to take upon that sin to the point of bodily death, He was still the eternal victor over it.

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