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Thread: does sorcery refer to drug use?

  1. #1

    does sorcery refer to drug use?

    Listed among the people who will not inherit the kingdom of God is sorcerers, the greek word translated as sorcery in the new testament is pharmacao (sp?) and I have heard it said that this refers to any kind of drug use, however it makes much more sense to me that sorcery would refer to the use of drugs in divination and shaman type practices. Has anyone else heard this teaching that sorcery is drug use? What is your take on it?

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    Re: does sorcery refer to drug use?

    Gal 5:20 pharmakeia
    1. the use or administering of drugs
    2. poisoning
    3. sorcery, magical arts, often found in connection with idolatry and fostered by it
    4. metaph. the deceptions and seductions of idolatry

    Root is pharmakeus

    1. one who uses or prepares magical remedies
    2. scorcerer

    I would think that it applies to mind altering drugs in the negative sense. Hence the warning against intoxication.

    For the cause of Christ
    Roger

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    Re: does sorcery refer to drug use?

    Quote Originally Posted by notuptome View Post
    Gal 5:20 pharmakeia
    1. the use or administering of drugs
    2. poisoning
    3. sorcery, magical arts, often found in connection with idolatry and fostered by it
    4. metaph. the deceptions and seductions of idolatry

    Root is pharmakeus

    1. one who uses or prepares magical remedies
    2. scorcerer

    I would think that it applies to mind altering drugs in the negative sense. Hence the warning against intoxication.

    For the cause of Christ
    Roger
    Yeah. What our friend said. I was just about to post a less intelligent version of it.
    Psalm 19:14
    May the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart
    be pleasing in your sight,
    O LORD, my Rock and my Redeemer.

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    Re: does sorcery refer to drug use?

    The Greeks/Romans had begun to work with all kinds of "drugs".
    Narcotics(opiates) were in use as well as hallucinogens.

    Derived from poppy, wormwood, and certain spices.

    This had been going on from the time of the Persians at least.

    In fact there was an herb that they found in Egypt that was fairly successful to cause an early miscarriage for pregnant women. IOW they found a method to induce abortion...along the same lines as the "morning after Pill" of today. They ate the plant into extinction and it doesn't exist today.

    Even their "exorcists" used some of these hallucinogens to show the people the evil spirits that had invaded them. (usually wormwood). Of course most of these hallucinogens were highly addictive and expensive.

    All of these medicines were known as Pharmakeia as Notuptome has said. Allegiance to some kind of Greek god would have to be proclaimed.

    I still don't take that as a prohibition against taking an aspirin for a headache or fever though. Or some other kind of fool notion as that. There are always a few wackos that do think that all doctoring and medical science is witchcraft. Calvinists and Jehova Witnesses share a history that is infamous for being harsh against such evil things as blood transfusions.

    Ahh well...lets see what tomorrow brings.

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    Re: does sorcery refer to drug use?

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnDB View Post
    The Greeks/Romans had begun to work with all kinds of "drugs".
    Narcotics(opiates) were in use as well as hallucinogens.

    Derived from poppy, wormwood, and certain spices.

    This had been going on from the time of the Persians at least.

    In fact there was an herb that they found in Egypt that was fairly successful to cause an early miscarriage for pregnant women. IOW they found a method to induce abortion...along the same lines as the "morning after Pill" of today. They ate the plant into extinction and it doesn't exist today.

    Even their "exorcists" used some of these hallucinogens to show the people the evil spirits that had invaded them. (usually wormwood). Of course most of these hallucinogens were highly addictive and expensive.

    All of these medicines were known as Pharmakeia as Notuptome has said. Allegiance to some kind of Greek god would have to be proclaimed.

    I still don't take that as a prohibition against taking an aspirin for a headache or fever though. Or some other kind of fool notion as that. There are always a few wackos that do think that all doctoring and medical science is witchcraft. Calvinists and Jehovah Witnesses share a history that is infamous for being harsh against such evil things as blood transfusions.

    Ahh well...lets see what tomorrow brings.
    Bolded = Funny together. :-)

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    Re: does sorcery refer to drug use?

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnDB View Post
    The Greeks/Romans had begun to work with all kinds of "drugs".
    Narcotics(opiates) were in use as well as hallucinogens.

    Derived from poppy, wormwood, and certain spices.

    This had been going on from the time of the Persians at least.

    In fact there was an herb that they found in Egypt that was fairly successful to cause an early miscarriage for pregnant women. IOW they found a method to induce abortion...along the same lines as the "morning after Pill" of today. They ate the plant into extinction and it doesn't exist today.

    Even their "exorcists" used some of these hallucinogens to show the people the evil spirits that had invaded them. (usually wormwood). Of course most of these hallucinogens were highly addictive and expensive.

    All of these medicines were known as Pharmakeia as Notuptome has said. Allegiance to some kind of Greek god would have to be proclaimed.

    I still don't take that as a prohibition against taking an aspirin for a headache or fever though. Or some other kind of fool notion as that. There are always a few wackos that do think that all doctoring and medical science is witchcraft. Calvinists and Jehova Witnesses share a history that is infamous for being harsh against such evil things as blood transfusions.

    Ahh well...lets see what tomorrow brings.

    Great post.

    What is your take on Tobacco?
    I didnt know the link didnt work

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    Re: does sorcery refer to drug use?

    Quote Originally Posted by Realist1981 View Post
    What is your take on Tobacco?
    It's addictive and it causes cancer. And it smells bad.

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    Re: does sorcery refer to drug use?

    Quote Originally Posted by misticmike712 View Post
    Listed among the people who will not inherit the kingdom of God is sorcerers, the greek word translated as sorcery in the new testament is pharmacao (sp?) and I have heard it said that this refers to any kind of drug use, however it makes much more sense to me that sorcery would refer to the use of drugs in divination and shaman type practices. Has anyone else heard this teaching that sorcery is drug use? What is your take on it?
    It may just mean sorcery. But a sorcerer would use drugs to harm people. So a child of God should stay away from both sorcery and harmful drugs.

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    Re: does sorcery refer to drug use?

    Almost every archaic or ancient religion involved mind altering substances, mainly for the "WoW affect" to shore up the influence of the priest and or god or gods of that religion.

    I keep that in mind when I approach the word sorcery used in our New testaments, meaning: It is not a sin to take a drug to relieve my pain.
    But, it is a sin to tell someone that this or that god will soon take away your pain once you ingest this.

    The point being that it is not sin in itself to use a drug, it is a sin to use a drug to influence people other than ourselves, influence them to do another persons will by using drugs on them or requiring them to ingest drugs.

    That is the act of sorcery or a sorcerer, where the word sorcery is found in our New testaments. (:a person who efforts to influence others by the use of drugs/pharmacy to influence them to do another persons or entities will)


    Father bless.

  10. #10

    Cool Re: does sorcery refer to drug use?

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnDB View Post
    The Greeks/Romans had begun to work with all kinds of "drugs".
    Narcotics(opiates) were in use as well as hallucinogens.

    Derived from poppy, wormwood, and certain spices.

    This had been going on from the time of the Persians at least.

    In fact there was an herb that they found in Egypt that was fairly successful to cause an early miscarriage for pregnant women. IOW they found a method to induce abortion...along the same lines as the "morning after Pill" of today. They ate the plant into extinction and it doesn't exist today.

    Even their "exorcists" used some of these hallucinogens to show the people the evil spirits that had invaded them. (usually wormwood). Of course most of these hallucinogens were highly addictive and expensive.

    All of these medicines were known as Pharmakeia as Notuptome has said. Allegiance to some kind of Greek god would have to be proclaimed.

    I still don't take that as a prohibition against taking an aspirin for a headache or fever though. Or some other kind of fool notion as that. There are always a few wackos that do think that all doctoring and medical science is witchcraft. Calvinists and Jehova Witnesses share a history that is infamous for being harsh against such evil things as blood transfusions.

    Ahh well...lets see what tomorrow brings.
    I mostly agree with you, however in my experience and to the best of my understanding of what I believe the Spirit has revealed to me, Asprin is also garbage as well. Manufactured remedies are rigged to give people ease of prosperity that raptures them from the necessary suffering as a result of the immune response. However, extreme pain can be remedied by less narcotic natural alternatives...chamomile is anti-inflammatory, Kratom leave is the opiates' gentler and substantitally less addictive, and I'm not going to weigh in on marijuana...it's use and "benefits" are arguable (I find it to be more decapacitating than enabling).
    We are, of course, living in an unnatural state that contradicts God's original schematic for healthy living, due to the wonders of sin in this world, and thus medication is sometimes neccessary. I believe strongly that we should consume as many products from nature as possible. I was led in the Spirit to refuse the antibiotic Augmentin and take Echincea instead. I'm pretty sure it was the Spirt, I felt strongly convicted against it...and I'm pretty alive as we speak.
    But I am agreeing to disagree, and that ultimately we are unified as one body who confesses Christ as our only means of salvation.

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    Re: does sorcery refer to drug use?

    Quote Originally Posted by Realist1981 View Post

    What is your take on Tobacco?
    The government subsidizes it to growers and taxes it to end users.

    And it stinks.

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    Re: does sorcery refer to drug use?

    Quote Originally Posted by SNESster3 View Post
    I mostly agree with you, however in my experience and to the best of my understanding of what I believe the Spirit has revealed to me, Asprin is also garbage as well. .
    Why do you think the Spirit choose only you to reveal that to? Doesn't God care about the rest of us?

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    Re: does sorcery refer to drug use?

    I find wormwood an interesting drug, in that it is mentioned in Revelation 8:11. This could indicate a poisoning of water that leads to hallucinations and a susceptancy to lies.

  14. #14

    Re: does sorcery refer to drug use?

    What is a witch?

    H3784
    ?????
    ka^shaph
    kaw-shaf'
    A primitive root; properly to whisper a spell, that is, to inchant or practise magic: - sorcerer, (use) witch (-craft).


    A witch was a "sorcerer" (this can mean male or female). So what did a sorcerer do that was so wrong? They cast spells and while the modern type of "spell" is thought of as something spoken or read from a scroll, it was more about making potions. Things that could heal you (medicines), kill you (poisons), or alter you somehow (mind altering drugs). Even today "witch doctors" in primitive cultures make heavily mind altering things amde to cleanse you or help you see new things.)


    Revelation 22:15 For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.


    sorcerers

    This word is speaking of drugs, and those who use them...perhaps those who sell them to others as well!


    5332

    5332 pharmakeus {far-mak-yoos'}

    from pharmakon (a drug, i.e. spell-giving potion);; n m

    AV - sorcerer 1; 1

    1) one who prepares or uses magical remedies
    2) sorcerer


    A "sorcerer" nowadays means a "magical wizard" or something, but in the past it was a term for drug makers and users without regard to male or female.


    Thayer's

    5331 pharmakeia {far-mak-i'-ah}

    from 5332;; n f

    AV - sorcery 2, witchcraft 1; 3

    1) the use or the administering of drugs
    2) poisoning
    3) sorcery, magical arts, often found in connection with idolatry and
    fostered by it
    4) metaph. the deceptions and seductions of idolatry


    Act 8:9 But there was a certain man, called Simon, which beforetime in the same city used sorcery, and bewitched the people of Samaria, giving out that himself was some great one:
    Act 8:10 To whom they all gave heed, from the least to the greatest, saying, This man is the great power of God.
    Act 8:11 And to him they had regard, because that of long time he had bewitched them with sorceries.


    Drugs were the way this man was able to "bewitch" so many people into thinking he had magical powers to create these "magical" things.


    Gal 5:19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
    Gal 5:20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
    Gal 5:21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.


    "witchcraft"


    Strong's
    G5331
    pharmakeia
    far-mak-i'-ah
    From G5332; medication (“pharmacy”), that is, (by extension) magic (literal or figurative): - sorcery, witchcraft.


    Medication! Not good medication but they sure enjoyed it and those they got it from!



    Galatians 5:19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
    Galatians 5:20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
    Galatians 5:21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

    This should really read this way:


    Galatians 5:19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
    Galatians 5:20 Idolatry, **DRUG ABUSE**, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
    Galatians 5:21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.


    Note that these are "works of the flesh" meaning your body and don't drugs affect one's body (including the mind) in very strong ways?




    witches were known in the past for making "brews" and "potions" in their caldrons, another way to "cook" drugs and make up "medicenes" otherwise known as drugs. Even in the late 19th century cocaine and forms of it were commonly used as "medicenes" even though they didn't actually heal you.


    3784

    03784 kashaph {kaw-shaf'}

    a primitive root; TWOT - 1051; v

    AV - sorcerers 3, witch 2, witchcraft 1; 6

    1) (Piel) to practice [font color=red]witchcraft or sorcery[/font], use witchcraft
    1a) sorcerer, sorceress (participle)





    5331 pharmakeia {far-mak-i'-ah}

    from 5332;; n f

    AV - sorcery 2, witchcraft 1; 3

    1) the use or the administering of drugs
    2) poisoning
    3) sorcery, magical arts, often found in connection with idolatry and
    fostered by it
    4) metaph. the deceptions and seductions of idolatry


    from this word do we have "pharmacy" a place for drugs, and a pharmacy has long been a term for someone making or using any drug, even the bad addictive kinds like cocaine and etc.

    witches and sorcerers and those types were the first drug pushers and users.

    In the book of Enoch, which is not included in the bible so make up your own mind on it's validity, but, we read that some fallen angels were the ones who taught man how to create drugs and sorceries:

    Enoch Chapter 8

    1Moreover Azazyel taught men to make swords, knives, shields, breastplates, the fabrication of mirrors, and the workmanship of bracelets and ornaments, the use of paint, the beautifying of the eyebrows, the use of stones of every valuable and select kind, and all sorts of dyes, so that the world became altered.

    2Impiety increased; fornication multiplied; and they transgressed and corrupted all their ways.

    3Amazarak taught all the sorcerers, and dividers of roots:

    4Armers taught the solution of sorcery;


    Most drugs are derived originally from plants, their roots or leaves, and barks etc etc.

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    Re: does sorcery refer to drug use?

    5332 pharmakeus {far-mak-yoos'}

    from pharmakon (a drug, i.e. spell-giving potion);; n m

    AV - sorcerer 1; 1

    1) one who prepares or uses magical remedies
    2) sorcerer

    A "sorcerer" nowadays means a "magical wizard" or something, but in the past it was a term for drug makers and users without regard to male or female.

    Thayer's

    5331 pharmakeia {far-mak-i'-ah}

    from 5332;; n f

    AV - sorcery 2, witchcraft 1; 3

    1) the use or the administering of drugs
    2) poisoning
    3) sorcery, magical arts, often found in connection with idolatry and
    fostered by it
    4) metaph. the deceptions and seductions of idolatry
    I once heard a Preacher say that "pharmakeia" is a form of the Greek root from which we get our English words pharmacy and sorcery and fundamentally has to do with drugs or medicine. I find this interesting!

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