Belief systems

[Abiding]

If you are a bible believing Christian, you fall into one of three belief systems.
In regard to salvation, there are three distinct schools of Christian theology.
Calvinism - Arminianism - Universalism.

In regards to salvation, every bible believing professed Christian falls into one of these categories, whether one understand or are aware of it or not.

If one disagrees, explain how, and I guarantee it will be one of the three, or possibly a mixture of two.

It does not matter what denomination one claims, everyone fits into one of these three.

So which belief system do you follow?

[Athanasius]

Only three? Alright... I believe that (1) God predestines some people to heaven, but that (2) all are given the chance to receive salvation, and none are predestined to hell. I also believe that salvation comes by (3) grace, through faith and works.

Without resorting to "that's not biblical!" What would you say?

[PneumaPsucheSoma]

D. None of the above.

[RabbiKnife]

I'm not certain that "universalism" is a Christian doctrinal system.

[Abiding]

I'm not certain that "universalism" is a Christian doctrinal system.

I do not believe it to be Christian either.

[WSGAC]

I'm not certain that "universalism" is a Christian doctrinal system.

I've heard some pretty good explanations of universal salvation. I know it grates against our inner sense of justice and a good many scriptural references, but there is an argument for it.

[Athanasius]

I've heard some pretty good explanations of universal salvation. I know it grates against our inner sense of justice and a good many scriptural references, but there is an argument for it.

And it is still... wrong.

[Psalms Fan]

I would love for salvation to be universal. And if the verse is correct that says that God "desires all men to be saved", then God would love that, too. But will it happen? It seems to me from my reading of Scripture that there will always be those who love themselves more than God and will never be open to repentance.

[Izdaari]

I had to vote "None".

My views on soteriology are pretty much identical to Lutheran, and they don't consider themselves Calvinist or Arminian, nor Universalist either.

I admit to hoping that Universal Reconciliation may turn out to be true, but that's all it is: hope, not belief. As Psalms Fan observed, it seems there will always be some who won't repent.

[WSGAC]

And it is still... wrong.

"As in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive." 1 Corinthians 15:22

If the curse of Adam is universal in scope (ie., it takes out every man and woman), but the cross of Christ is only able to reclaim "some" men and women, then doesn't sin get "some" victory?

I know free-will is very important to God, but in the end if *most* end up on the wide path to destruction, then Christ's victory over the curse is only partial. In other words, the work and blessings of the second Adam, are not able to overcome the universal curse of what the first Adam brought to us. How is this victory for God?

[Athanasius]

"As in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive." 1 Corinthians 15:22

If the curse of Adam is universal in scope (ie., it takes out every man and woman), but the cross of Christ is only able to reclaim "some" men and women, then doesn't sin get "some" victory?

I know free-will is very important to God, but in the end if *most* end up on the wide path to destruction, then Christ's victory over the curse is only partial. In other words, the work and blessings of the second Adam, are not able to overcome the universal curse of what the first Adam brought to us. How is this victory for God?

Do you believe all people are saved, regardless of time, culture, belief, practice, etc.?

[WSGAC]

Do you believe all people are saved, regardless of time, culture, belief, practice, etc.?

Let's put the litmus tests on hold for a moment. You didn't answer my question on predestination and salvation, so I too will hold off for now.

I simply said I have heard some good explanations for universal salvation. You said "it is still wrong." I then presented one of those explanations. If you don't want to go there Athanasius, that's fine.

[Athanasius]

Let's put the litmus tests on hold for a moment. You didn't answer my question on predestination and salvation, so I too will hold off for now.

Then take it up in the other thread, and in the mean time, step off that high horse of yours.

I simply said I have heard some good explanations for universal salvation. You said "it is still wrong." I then presented one of those explanations. If you don't want to go there Athanasius, that's fine.

Keep in mind that next time, you might want to make it clear that you're 'presenting' the explanation of another, and not your own position.

[WSGAC]

I believe God predestines all, and does so without violating the free will he gives us. This is because His choice of us springs from eternity, whereas our choice springs from the temporal.

Predestination can't be partial. If God predestines some to heaven, then he can't not predestine others elsewhere. If someone chooses you for a marriage partner, he/she has also made the choice not to choose another to be his/her partner.

Unless of course God works it so that all of creation will be saved. Paul does say that all Israel will one day be saved. So who knows, maybe God gets us even if we say no to the marriage proposal.

[Athanasius]

I believe God predestines all, and does so without violating the free will he gives us. This is because His choice of us springs from eternity, whereas our choice springs from the temporal.

Predestination can't be partial. If God predestines some to heaven, then he can't not predestine others elsewhere. If someone chooses you for a marriage partner, he/she has also made the choice not to choose another to be his/her partner.

I've asked you a question in the other thread, so again, take it up there.

Unless of course God works it so that all of creation will be saved. Paul does say that all Israel will one day be saved. So who knows, maybe God gets us even if we say no to the marriage proposal.

Universalism is compatible with Calvinism, not Arminianism (keep that in mind). As for the verse you provided, it refers only to those who are 'in Christ'. But I don't see the point in further explaining, as that isn't your view... Unless you want to defend it, then provide a counter-point.