Gospel... moved from the law and eternal life thread

[ProjectPeter]

Uh... on point? The death, burial, and resurrection are simply of first importance. The gospel does consist of more than just those three things. Not sure if that's exactly Rog's point but if not... I'm taking it there myself.

[BroRog]

Uh... on point? The death, burial, and resurrection are simply of first importance. The gospel does consist of more than just those three things. Not sure if that's exactly Rog's point but if not... I'm taking it there myself.

Yes, that is essentially my point. If someone were to ask me point blank, "What is THE one thing that destroys the works of the Devil? I would have to say that THE one thing that destroys the works of the Devil is the granting of the Holy Spirit, because the Holy Spirit works with each individual to overcome the devil's lies. Of course, the granting of the Holy Spirit wouldn't have been possible without the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus Christ. As Jesus said, unless I go away, the comforter can't come. But the works of the devil are destroyed in real time through a process that progresses through history, taking place individually on a case-by-case basis in the hearts and minds of believers.

But maybe I'm splitting hairs?

[dagar]

But maybe I'm splitting hairs?

Yes

Joh 16:5 But now I go my way to him that sent me; and none of you asketh me, Whither goest thou?
Joh 16:6 But because I have said these things unto you, sorrow hath filled your heart.
Joh 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.

No death burial and resurrection, no Holy Ghost

[dagar]

Uh... on point? The death, burial, and resurrection are simply of first importance. The gospel does consist of more than just those three things. Not sure if that's exactly Rog's point but if not... I'm taking it there myself.

You keep saying that but have not provide any scripture. Seems that is how you roll.

[ProjectPeter]

You keep saying that but have not provide any scripture. Seems that is how you roll.

Uh... did you miss the passage in 1 Corinthians 15 that I posted that said well... the death, burial, and resurrection were of first importance? Dang sure I posted it and matter of fact right sure I did. Weird how you would so cassually make such a falsehood when it was only a few post back. Interesting... is that how "you roll?"

[dagar]

You mean the one that says those things of first importance are the gospel? Uh, yeah...got news for ya....I posted it to you first (#186). Not surprising though seeing how you haven't read muuch else.

[the rookie]

*ADMIN NOTE*

I'd watch the tone and ask that it shift towards "more respectful", please.

[literaryjoe]

How did implementing the Mosaic Law advance the goal of redeeming mankind for eternal life?

Here's a take on answering the original post...

As I understand it the historic Christian articulation of the 3 purposes of the law is as follows:

1. to convict of sin,
2. to restrain evildoers,
3. and to instruct believers

The law of God as codified by Moses was not given to redeem mankind, but because they had been redeemed.

“You shall tell your son on that day, 'It is because of what the LORD did for me when I came out of Egypt.' And it shall be to you as a sign on your hand and as a memorial between your eyes, that the law of the LORD may be in your mouth. For with a strong hand the LORD has brought you out of Egypt." Exodus 13:8-9 (ESV)

How was the law to advance God's redemptive plan? God's plan was to show the world His image by selecting a people who were to imitate Him, to be transformed into his likeness, as indeed, they had been initially created. Paul reminds us of this in Eph 5..."Be imitators of God, therefore, like dearly beloved children."

So, the law advanced God's agenda by:

1. making plain to man his need of a Savior,
2. restraining the viciousness of a world bent by iniquity, and
3. shape His people ever more into His image

We were redeemed in order to live redemptive lives. It was God's intent that we would partner with Him in the process and practice of healing the world.

"...what sort of people ought you to be in lives of holiness and godliness, waiting for and hastening the coming of the day of God..." 2 Peter 3:11b-12a (ESV)

a process that is, indeed, entirely dependent on God for its progress and ultimate success, but in which we are privileged to participate.

[ProjectPeter]

You mean the one that says those things of first importance are the gospel? Uh, yeah...got news for ya....I posted it to you first (#186). Not surprising though seeing how you haven't read muuch else.

Actually it doesn't say "the gospel" but it says of first importance that Jesus lived, died, and rose again. Again... of first importance because unless a person believes that (remember at the time he was fixing to take them into those saying there was no resurrection of the dead)... they ain't even in the race to begin with because if there is no resurrection... we're most pittied people.

The gospel though consist of much more than Just once upon a time there was a man named Jesus who happened to be the Son of God and he lived on earth in a land far, far away. He upset the religious folk and they killed Him and three days later... He rose! Today He is in heaven and coming again some day!

Now... that's what most think the gospel is. Most are terribly wrong. It consist of much more than that.

Take for example Paul's writing to Timothy.

1 Timothy 1:8 *But we know that the Law is good, if one uses it lawfully,
9 *realizing the fact that law is not made for a righteous man, but for those who are lawless and rebellious, for the ungodly and sinners, for the unholy and profane, for those who kill their fathers or mothers, for murderers
10 *and immoral men and homosexuals and kidnappers and liars and perjurers, and whatever else is contrary to sound teaching,
11 *according to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, with which I have been entrusted.

Now... if those sins listed and sins like them aer contrary to the gospel... none of that is listed in the He lived, He died, and He rose again message. So the gospel is more than just those things... has to be.

Anything else clever to retort?

[dagar]

*ADMIN NOTE*

I'd watch the tone and ask that it shift towards "more respectful", please.

Thank you! ..........

[the rookie]

Thank you! ..........

I was talking to you

[dagar]

Actually it doesn't say "the gospel" but it says of first importance that Jesus lived, died, and rose again. Again... of first importance because unless a person believes that (remember at the time he was fixing to take them into those saying there was no resurrection of the dead)... they ain't even in the race to begin with because if there is no resurrection... we're most pittied people.

Right, gotta believe the gospel!

The gospel though consist of much more than Just once upon a time there was a man named Jesus who happened to be the Son of God and he lived on earth in a land far, far away. He upset the religious folk and they killed Him and three days later... He rose! Today He is in heaven and coming again some day!

Now... that's what most think the gospel is. Most are terribly wrong. It consist of much more than that.

Amen! This is only part of it!

Take for example Paul's writing to Timothy.

1 Timothy 1:8 *But we know that the Law is good, if one uses it lawfully,
9 *realizing the fact that law is not made for a righteous man, but for those who are lawless and rebellious, for the ungodly and sinners, for the unholy and profane, for those who kill their fathers or mothers, for murderers
10 *and immoral men and homosexuals and kidnappers and liars and perjurers, and whatever else is contrary to sound teaching,
11 *according to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, with which I have been entrusted.

Now... if those sins listed and sins like them aer contrary to the gospel... none of that is listed in the He lived, He died, and He rose again message. So the gospel is more than just those things... has to be.

Oh man! you lost it

1Ti 1:8 But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;
..............
........
1Ti 1:11 According to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, which was committed to my trust.

See how that flows? What exactly are you saying is part of the gospel with this passage? All it says is the gospel frees sinners from Law.

[dagar]

I was talking to you

Really? Hmmm..was just following the lead of the other Admin here. I thought you meant both of us. This isn't a one way thingy here is it?

[ProjectPeter]

Right, gotta believe the gospel!

Amen! This is only part of it!

Oh man! you lost it

1Ti 1:8 But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;
..............
........
1Ti 1:11 According to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, which was committed to my trust.

See how that flows? What exactly are you saying is part of the gospel with this passage? All it says is the gospel frees sinners from Law.

No that isn't what it says and you can't even twist it otherwise... all you can do is ignore what it says. If those sins are contrary to sound doctrine and the gospel... those things are mentioned in the gospel don't you think? You take out verse 9 and 10... you can make up the in between. But when the folks see what is actually in between verses 8 and 11... you're look at what it says is quite needing a lot of help.

[ProjectPeter]

Really? Hmmm..was just following the lead of the other Admin here. I thought you meant both of us. This isn't a one way thingy here is it?

Okay... my turn now. Knock it off. Enough being silly. I'll take a lot of junk from folks but don't sling it to the other mods and admin in here. Clear?