Gospel... moved from the law and eternal life thread

[Butch5]

He did. Christ went to sit at the right hand of the father, which allowed the Holy Spirit to come. See John 14-17

I asked why not send the Holy Spirit "Instead" of Christ, not after Christ.

[dagar]

Uh... Paul said that stuff against sound doctrine was ACCORDING to the gospel.

the law for sinners leads them to the gospel of Jesus Christ which frees them. That's what it says. It's just that simple. That's what everyone except you says it says. Tell me how what you are saying fits with the purpose of the author here. Sin is contrary to God? Really? Is that what the author is saying? No. He told Timothy and tells Timothy still to stay in Ephesus for the gospel's sake because of those teaching the law. He again repeats this in vs18, 19. He states the purpose of the law to bring sinners to Christ and free them.

1Ti 1:3 As I besought thee to abide still at Ephesus, when I went into Macedonia, that thou mightest charge some that they teach no other doctrine,
1Ti 1:4 Neither give heed to fables and endless genealogies, which minister questions, rather than godly edifying which is in faith: so do.
1Ti 1:5 Now the end of the commandment is charity out of a pure heart, and of a good conscience, and of faith unfeigned:
1Ti 1:6 From which some having swerved have turned aside unto vain jangling;
1Ti 1:7 Desiring to be teachers of the law; understanding neither what they say, nor whereof they affirm.
1Ti 1:8 But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;
1Ti 1:9 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,
1Ti 1:10 For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;
1Ti 1:11 According to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, which was committed to my trust.

He continues with this

1Ti 1:12 And I thank Christ Jesus our Lord, who hath enabled me, for that he counted me faithful, putting me into the ministry;
1Ti 1:13 Who was before a blasphemer, and a persecutor, and injurious: but I obtained mercy, because I did it ignorantly in unbelief.
1Ti 1:14 And the grace of our Lord was exceeding abundant with faith and love which is in Christ Jesus.
1Ti 1:15 This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief.
1Ti 1:16 Howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy, that in me first Jesus Christ might shew forth all longsuffering, for a pattern to them which should hereafter believe on him to life everlasting.
1Ti 1:17 Now unto the King eternal, immortal, invisible, the only wise God, be honour and glory for ever and ever. Amen.
1Ti 1:18 This charge I commit unto thee, son Timothy, according to the prophecies which went before on thee, that thou by them mightest war a good warfare;
1Ti 1:19 Holding faith, and a good conscience; which some having put away concerning faith have made shipwreck:

There's a purpose here PP and it's not that sin is contrary to the gospel. What would you think of someone driving home a point so obvious to all, even children? Not to mention saying that to another preacher! What you are saying isn't here!

Jesus as well spoke a lot of things called gospel. He didn't say it was any one particular event either. Everything He preached was the gospel.

Again, you keep saying this and have yet to provide a verse. Well you tried 1Timothy but since that's not one do you have any others?

[ProjectPeter]

the law for sinners leads them to the gospel of Jesus Christ who frees them. That's what it says. It's just that simple. That's what everyone except you says it says. Tell me how what you are saying fits with the purpose of the author here. Sin is contrary to God? Really? Is that what the author is saying? No. He told Timothy and tells Timothy still to stay in Ephesus for the gospel's sake because of those teaching the law. He again repeats this in vs18, 19. He states the purpose of the law to bring sinners to Christ and free them.

1Ti 1:3 As I besought thee to abide still at Ephesus, when I went into Macedonia, that thou mightest charge some that they teach no other doctrine,
1Ti 1:4 Neither give heed to fables and endless genealogies, which minister questions, rather than godly edifying which is in faith: so do.
1Ti 1:5 Now the end of the commandment is charity out of a pure heart, and of a good conscience, and of faith unfeigned:
1Ti 1:6 From which some having swerved have turned aside unto vain jangling;
1Ti 1:7 Desiring to be teachers of the law; understanding neither what they say, nor whereof they affirm.
1Ti 1:8 But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;
1Ti 1:9 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,
1Ti 1:10 For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;
1Ti 1:11 According to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, which was committed to my trust.

He continues with this

1Ti 1:12 And I thank Christ Jesus our Lord, who hath enabled me, for that he counted me faithful, putting me into the ministry;
1Ti 1:13 Who was before a blasphemer, and a persecutor, and injurious: but I obtained mercy, because I did it ignorantly in unbelief.
1Ti 1:14 And the grace of our Lord was exceeding abundant with faith and love which is in Christ Jesus.
1Ti 1:15 This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief.
1Ti 1:16 Howbeit for this cause I obtained mercy, that in me first Jesus Christ might shew forth all longsuffering, for a pattern to them which should hereafter believe on him to life everlasting.
1Ti 1:17 Now unto the King eternal, immortal, invisible, the only wise God, be honour and glory for ever and ever. Amen.
1Ti 1:18 This charge I commit unto thee, son Timothy, according to the prophecies which went before on thee, that thou by them mightest war a good warfare;
1Ti 1:19 Holding faith, and a good conscience; which some having put away concerning faith have made shipwreck:

There's a purpose here PP and it's not that sin is contrary to the gospel. What would you think of someone driving home a point so obvious to all, even children?

Again, you keep saying this and have yet to provide a verse. Well you tried 1Timothy but since that's not one do you have any others?

You can pick out words and bold type select ones and make it say what you want but what you didn't bold type is what you are ignoring. Those things are contrary to sound doctrine. According to the gospel.

As to other Scripture... Again... Acts is full of such examples... told you that already. Also told you the very teaching of Christ... every message He preached to folks was gospel. Mind you now we point them to life, death, and resurrection as first importance as the Scripture I also showed you in 1 Corinthians 15 says. Remember that one?

But try this on for size and it tells all about the gospel... little bit long to post so I will just post the beginning of it and you can read the rest.

Mark 1:1 *The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God.

[ProjectPeter]

Here are a couple of Acts passages for you to ponder.

Acts 24:24 *¶But some days later, Felix arrived with Drusilla, his wife who was a Jewess, and sent for Paul, and heard him speak about faith in Christ Jesus.
25 *And as he was discussing righteousness, self-control and the judgment to come, Felix became frightened and said, "Go away for the present, and when I find time, I will summon you."

Acts 26:15 *"And I said, `Who art Thou, Lord?´ And the Lord said, `I am Jesus whom you are persecuting.
16 *`But arise, and stand on your feet; for this purpose I have appeared to you, to appoint you a minister and a witness not only to the things which you have seen, but also to the things in which I will appear to you;
17 *delivering you from the Jewish people and from the Gentiles, to whom I am sending you,
18 *to open their eyes so that they may turn from darkness to light and from the dominion of Satan to God, in order that they may receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance among those who have been sanctified by faith in Me.´
19 *"Consequently, King Agrippa, I did not prove disobedient to the heavenly vision,
20 *but kept declaring both to those of Damascus first, and also at Jerusalem and then throughout all the region of Judea, and even to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God, performing deeds appropriate to repentance.

[dagar]

You can pick out words and bold type select ones and make it say what you want but what you didn't bold type is what you are ignoring. Those things are contrary to sound doctrine. According to the gospel.

As to other Scripture... Again... Acts is full of such examples... told you that already. Also told you the very teaching of Christ... every message He preached to folks was gospel. Mind you now we point them to life, death, and resurrection as first importance as the Scripture I also showed you in 1 Corinthians 15 says. Remember that one?

But try this on for size and it tells all about the gospel... little bit long to post so I will just post the beginning of it and you can read the rest.

Mark 1:1 *The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God.

Yes, the book synopsis is his life death and resurrection. Exactly.
Every message he preached was glad tidings?

[ProjectPeter]

Yes, the book synopsis is his life death and resurrection. Exactly.
Every message he preached was glad tidings?

Sure it was.... if you heard it and applied it or corrected it etc.

[dagar]

Here are a couple of Acts passages for you to ponder.

Acts 24:24 *¶But some days later, Felix arrived with Drusilla, his wife who was a Jewess, and sent for Paul, and heard him speak about faith in Christ Jesus.
25 *And as he was discussing righteousness, self-control and the judgment to come, Felix became frightened and said, "Go away for the present, and when I find time, I will summon you."

Acts 26:15 *"And I said, `Who art Thou, Lord?´ And the Lord said, `I am Jesus whom you are persecuting.
16 *`But arise, and stand on your feet; for this purpose I have appeared to you, to appoint you a minister and a witness not only to the things which you have seen, but also to the things in which I will appear to you;
17 *delivering you from the Jewish people and from the Gentiles, to whom I am sending you,
18 *to open their eyes so that they may turn from darkness to light and from the dominion of Satan to God, in order that they may receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance among those who have been sanctified by faith in Me.´
19 *"Consequently, King Agrippa, I did not prove disobedient to the heavenly vision,
20 *but kept declaring both to those of Damascus first, and also at Jerusalem and then throughout all the region of Judea, and even to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God, performing deeds appropriate to repentance.

ummm....what specifically did you have in mind here?

[dagar]

Sure it was.... if you heard it and applied it or corrected it etc.

I realize that's how christians read and attempt to understand scripture and all, but we are talking about what men are saved by and are to have hope in, not how you can apply a parable to your daily walk.

[ProjectPeter]

ummm....what specifically did you have in mind here?

Acts 26:15 *"And I said, `Who art Thou, Lord?´ And the Lord said, `I am Jesus whom you are persecuting.
16 *`But arise, and stand on your feet; for this purpose I have appeared to you, to appoint you a minister and a witness not only to the things which you have seen, but also to the things in which I will appear to you;
17 *delivering you from the Jewish people and from the Gentiles, to whom I am sending you,
18 *to open their eyes so that they may turn from darkness to light and from the dominion of Satan to God, in order that they may receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance among those who have been sanctified by faith in Me.´
19 *"Consequently, King Agrippa, I did not prove disobedient to the heavenly vision,
20 *but kept declaring both to those of Damascus first, and also at Jerusalem and then throughout all the region of Judea, and even to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God, performing deeds appropriate to repentance.

What is the way one turns from darkness to light and from the dominion of Satan to God thus receiving forgiveness of their sins and an inheritance among those sanctified by faith in Christ?

[ProjectPeter]

I realize that's how christians read and attempt to understand scripture and all, but we are talking about what men are saved by and are to have hope in, not how you can apply a parable to your daily walk.

Goodness... many ways. I think I need to split these post off though and put them in a different thread. We've veered so far off the beaten path here... the OP is about done anyway and keeps folks from having to wade through all that to get to this and then scratch their heads wondering what it has to do with the law. It'll only take a minute or two. Hang on.

[ProjectPeter]

Okay... the parables are all applicable to us today. The principles are timeless.

[BroRog]

I asked why not send the Holy Spirit "Instead" of Christ, not after Christ.

You really don't know?

[dagar]

Acts 26:15 *"And I said, `Who art Thou, Lord?´ And the Lord said, `I am Jesus whom you are persecuting.
16 *`But arise, and stand on your feet; for this purpose I have appeared to you, to appoint you a minister and a witness not only to the things which you have seen, but also to the things in which I will appear to you;
17 *delivering you from the Jewish people and from the Gentiles, to whom I am sending you,
18 *to open their eyes so that they may turn from darkness to light and from the dominion of Satan to God, in order that they may receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance among those who have been sanctified by faith in Me.´
19 *"Consequently, King Agrippa, I did not prove disobedient to the heavenly vision,
20 *but kept declaring both to those of Damascus first, and also at Jerusalem and then throughout all the region of Judea, and even to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God, performing deeds appropriate to repentance.

What is the way one turns from darkness to light and from the dominion of Satan to God thus receiving forgiveness of their sins and an inheritance among those sanctified by faith in Christ?

change your mind and believe the gospel?

[dagar]

You really don't know?

Sure he does, but the point is that without the gospel there'd be no Spirit for believers of the gospel. So you can't say what follows the gospel is part of the gospel. There's nothing about having to 'believe the Comforter would come' as The gospel. That's backwards. Believing the gospel gives the Promise of the Spirit. Not the other way around.

[ProDeo]

I asked a very very simple question.

What else besides the cross destroyed the works of the devil?

No what, who.

Jesus.

There is no power in the cross.