The Book of Job...explain????

[LankyLee]

I have been discussing this among friends and we have several different views about what the meaning behind the story is.

??????
anyone care to try and explain this book and the meaning.

Here is the question that was posed to me.

Why would God have to prove anything to Satan about one of his righteous people in the way he did it?

I need to study up on this and maybe get a few words from some here about this, because the topic will come up again and I would like to present a response with more depth next time.

My response was the basic.
satan thought without Gods protection and blessings Job would turn from God. God knew Job would not, so he allowed satan to bring heartache on Job. Although Job did ask why he never cursed God, and praised God throughout the ordeal. Job endured and was restored with more blessings in the end. Bad things do happen to the righteous and we can't explain this mystery of God with our human brain.

This is about all I had, which did not seem to satisfy

.....help

[VerticalReality]

The situation with Job happened because Job needed to learn and grow in his knowledge of the Lord. I do not believe God was allowing Satan to do stuff to Job in order to basically prove Satan wrong. God doesn't have to prove anything, and I certainly do not believe that God is insecure enough to be coerced into doing something because Satan was trying to push His buttons.

I think people often mistake blameless for sinless perfection or something. Job was blameless but he wasn't perfect.

[IMINXTC]

Q: Must God's people suffer?

A: Why not?

[VerticalReality]

Q: Must God's people suffer?

A: Why not?

You answered your own question with why not?

[IMINXTC]

An old addage concerning the book of Job and it's purpose.

[Butch5]

I have been discussing this among friends and we have several different views about what the meaning behind the story is.

??????
anyone care to try and explain this book and the meaning.

Here is the question that was posed to me.

Why would God have to prove anything to Satan about one of his righteous people in the way he did it?

I need to study up on this and maybe get a few words from some here about this, because the topic will come up again and I would like to present a response with more depth next time.

My response was the basic.
satan thought without Gods protection and blessings Job would turn from God. God knew Job would not, so he allowed satan to bring heartache on Job. Although Job did ask why he never cursed God, and praised God throughout the ordeal. Job endured and was restored with more blessings in the end. Bad things do happen to the righteous and we can't explain this mystery of God with our human brain.

This is about all I had, which did not seem to satisfy

.....help

Why would God have to prove anything to Satan about one of his righteous people in the way he did it?

I don't think He was proving it to Satan. I think he was proving it to the angles.


Ephesians 3:7-13 ( KJV )
Whereof I was made a minister, according to the gift of the grace of God given unto me by the effectual working of his power.
Unto me, who am less than the least of all saints, is this grace given, that I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ;
And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:
To the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places might be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God,
According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord:
In whom we have boldness and access with confidence by the faith of him.
Wherefore I desire that ye faint not at my tribulations for you, which is your glory.

[LankyLee]

I don't think He was proving it to Satan. I think he was proving it to the angles.

My friend will like that one. We have not thought to bring this up.......yet.

[Butch5]

My friend will like that one. We have not thought to bring this up.......yet.

There is a line of thought that you can't really look into the Scriptures and say here it is. But it is Kind of hinted at. The idea is that God is showing the angels that he is just. The idea is that Satan charged God as unjust and God is showing that He is just. He is basically defending his character. As I said, you can't really pinpoint it, but there are things that kind of hint at it, such as that passage in Ephesians. Another thing that hints at it is the Ransom that Jesus Paid. The early church held a different understanding of the Atonement than the one the church holds today. They saw Adam and Eve's fall in garden as obeying Satan and consequently falling under his power by obeying. God definitely had the power to destroy Satan and take mankind back, yet he didn't instead, He paid a ransom for mankind. Again this seems to point to the idea of God justifying His Character before the angles.

I also think that iswhy Paul told the women to veil their heads. It is an act of obedience showing they are sumbissive to their headship. He says to do this because of the angles. I think he is referring to what he said in Ephesians 3.

1 Corinthians 11:2-10 ( KJV )
Now I praise you, brethren, that ye remember me in all things, and keep the ordinances, as I delivered them to you.
But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God.
Every man praying or prophesying, having his head covered, dishonoureth his head.
But every woman that prayeth or prophesieth with her head uncovered dishonoureth her head: for that is even all one as if she were shaven.
For if the woman be not covered, let her also be shorn: but if it be a shame for a woman to be shorn or shaven, let her be covered.
For a man indeed ought not to cover his head, forasmuch as he is the image and glory of God: but the woman is the glory of the man.
For the man is not of the woman; but the woman of the man.
Neither was the man created for the woman; but the woman for the man.
For this cause ought the woman to have power on her head because of the angels.

[episkopos]

The book of Job is about a righteous man learning holiness. He receives the double portion through suffering as a witness of God's faithfulness. He meets the Lord after he is tested. The trials are meant to elevate him into God's presence.

[divaD]

The situation with Job happened because Job needed to learn and grow in his knowledge of the Lord. I do not believe God was allowing Satan to do stuff to Job in order to basically prove Satan wrong. God doesn't have to prove anything, and I certainly do not believe that God is insecure enough to be coerced into doing something because Satan was trying to push His buttons.

I think people often mistake blameless for sinless perfection or something. Job was blameless but he wasn't perfect.

But wasn't it satan's idea in the first place? Had not satan brought up the fact that God had a hedge around Job, etc, would there have even been any need on God's part to allow satan to do certain things?

Job 1:7 And the LORD said unto Satan, Whence comest thou? Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.
8 And the LORD said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil?
9 Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, Doth Job fear God for nought?
10 Hast not thou made an hedge about him, and about his house, and about all that he hath on every side? thou hast blessed the work of his hands, and his substance is increased in the land.
11 But put forth thine hand now, and touch all that he hath, and he will curse thee to thy face

Had not satan challenged, what would have motivated God to allow satan to do certain things to Job and his house? Do you think if satan wouldn't have made a single mention of anything here, that God would still have said..you know what, satan? Behold, all that he hath is in thy power; only upon himself put not forth thine hand. That doesn't even make sense nor agrees with the context, if we take satan's challenge out of the picture.

[teddyv]

I'll just throw this out there. I have been slowly reading through the on-line version of this book. It is a very interesting read, but I'm only part way through it so have no conclusions. I agree with the main point of the book being a theodicy. The entire book is available here.
http://www.bookofjob.org/

There is also a link to a summary:
http://www.bookofjob.org/quick%20summary2.htm

[VerticalReality]

But wasn't it satan's idea in the first place? Had not satan brought up the fact that God had a hedge around Job, etc, would there have even been any need on God's part to allow satan to do certain things?

Job 1:7 And the LORD said unto Satan, Whence comest thou? Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.
8 And the LORD said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil?
9 Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, Doth Job fear God for nought?
10 Hast not thou made an hedge about him, and about his house, and about all that he hath on every side? thou hast blessed the work of his hands, and his substance is increased in the land.
11 But put forth thine hand now, and touch all that he hath, and he will curse thee to thy face

Had not satan challenged, what would have motivated God to allow satan to do certain things to Job and his house? Do you think if satan wouldn't have made a single mention of anything here, that God would still have said..you know what, satan? Behold, all that he hath is in thy power; only upon himself put not forth thine hand. That doesn't even make sense nor agrees with the context, if we take satan's challenge out of the picture.

I don't focus on Satan's challenge. Had there been no benefit for Job, I don't think it ever would have happened . . . challenge or not. I believe God's ultimate motivation for the trials in Job's life is seen at the end of the book when Job repents.

[Phish]

I don't focus on Satan's challenge. Had there been no benefit for Job, I don't think it ever would have happened . . . challenge or not. I believe God's ultimate motivation for the trials in Job's life is seen at the end of the book when Job repents.

Spot on......................

[LookingUp]

I don't think He was proving it to Satan. I think he was proving it to the angles.


Ephesians 3:7-13 ( KJV )
Whereof I was made a minister, according to the gift of the grace of God given unto me by the effectual working of his power.
Unto me, who am less than the least of all saints, is this grace given, that I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ;
And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:
To the intent that now unto the principalities and powers in heavenly places might be known by the church the manifold wisdom of God,
According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord:
In whom we have boldness and access with confidence by the faith of him.
Wherefore I desire that ye faint not at my tribulations for you, which is your glory.

[ProDeo]

I don't think He was proving it to Satan. I think he was proving it to the angles.

Precisely.

Scripture that goes even further,

1 Cor 4:9 For, I think, God has exhibited us apostles last of all, as men condemned to die, because we have become a spectacle to the world, both to angels and to people.

God not only teaches us. Angels too. May angels ever wonder why hell is a too harsh punishment for their fallen brethren because of their rebellion then looking at the things their fallen brethren did to God's creation they will notice God's justice and the righteousness and that it will be fair they deserve the Lake of Fire.