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Thread: "No Man Cometh Unto The Father, But By Me"

  1. #1
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    "No Man Cometh Unto The Father, But By Me"

    Jesus said "No man cometh to the Father but by me":

    Jn 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

    Yet God said that those that keep his commandments, statues and judgments are his people, they belong to God.

    Because of what Jesus has said, can we or can we not come to the Father by doing that which God said makes us his?

    God Bless you,

    Firstfruits

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    Re: "No Man Cometh Unto The Father, But By Me"

    Quote Originally Posted by Firstfruits View Post
    Jesus said "No man cometh to the Father but by me":

    Jn 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

    Yet God said that those that keep his commandments, statues and judgments are his people, they belong to God.

    Because of what Jesus has said, can we or can we not come to the Father by doing that which God said makes us his?

    God Bless you,

    Firstfruits
    Jesus meant that he is the judge. He is the one who decides who comes to the father. We may be surprised at who he allows to come to the Father. We may be even more surprised at those who he doesn't allow.

    Blessings

    and Popcorn


    "You can make the scriptures say whatever you want if you torture them long enough"

  3. #3
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    Re: "No Man Cometh Unto The Father, But By Me"

    Quote Originally Posted by shepherdsword View Post
    Jesus meant that he is the judge. He is the one who decides who comes to the father. We may be surprised at who he allows to come to the Father. We may be even more surprised at those who he doesn't allow.
    According to the following scripture we will be judged by Jesus according to His gospel:

    Rom 2:16 In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.

    If we come to God through his gospel, and it is for Jew and Gentile:

    Rom 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

    Is this the same as what God said would make us his people, by keeping the commandments, statues and judgments?

    Firstfruits

  4. #4

    Re: "No Man Cometh Unto The Father, But By Me"

    To me Jesus is saying without the new covenant made in His blood (Matt 26:28) and the regeneration which follows it, found in Ezekiel, you will not be reconciled to the Father. He is the only way.

    Ezekiel 36:26-27. I will sprinkle clean water on you, and you shall be clean from all your uncleannesses, and from all your idols I will cleanse you. And I will give you a new heart, and a new spirit I will put within you. And I will remove the heart of stone from your flesh and give you a heart of flesh. And I will put my Spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes and be careful to obey my rules. (ESV)

    Yaweh made a covenant with Israel the contract is smiler to the suzerain/vassal treaty and it places on the vassal (Israel) laws and ordinances that are to be followed, if the vassal was unfaithful there were consequences and if the vassal was faithful there was blessings. So the people who accepted the terms and conditions entered into a covenant with Yaweh and followed His commandments were marked out as His people. This does not mean however that everyone was faithful in keeping them, but they were trying and they were showing a willingness to follow and be obedient to the covenant made with Yaweh at Sinai. This is what i see is behind God saying, those who keep my commands are my people. But dont forget we are now under a new Covenant, one in which God is at work in you to act, and to will to do His good pleasure.


  5. #5

    Re: "No Man Cometh Unto The Father, But By Me"

    Quote Originally Posted by Firstfruits View Post
    Jesus said "No man cometh to the Father but by me":

    Jn 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

    Yet God said that those that keep his commandments, statues and judgments are his people, they belong to God.

    Because of what Jesus has said, can we or can we not come to the Father by doing that which God said makes us his?

    God Bless you,

    Firstfruits
    As Paul clearly demonstrated in Romans 1,18-3.19 there is no one who fully keeps His commandments, statutes, and judgments.

    Thus no one will finally come to God by keeping them. If we have offended in one point we are guilty of all (James 2.10).

    What of course the verses have in mind is the intent of people to keep them because they are humble and genuine servants of God Such observance, if genuinely done out of love for God, would be the sign of a true spiritual life.

    But in the end no one from Adam onwards comes to God in any other way than through Jesus Christ. It was His sacrifice offered once for all, reaching back to Adam ('sins done aforetime' - Romans 3.25) that provides the way back to the Father.

    Those in the Old Testament came through the sacrificial system which pointed forward to His death. Since His coming it is only through His sacrifice on the cross that we can come.

    He was pointing out that He was ultimate truth and ultimate life. Without these we cannot come to the Father (even though our grasp on the former may be limited). Without responding to His truth and receiving His life we cannot have forgivenessa and life.

    So once we have heard of Him unless our hearts are set towards Jesus Christ we cannot come to the Father. There is no other way to the Father. We have to have atonement and receive life. Only Jesus can give either.

    It has always been so.

    .

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    Re: "No Man Cometh Unto The Father, But By Me"

    Quote Originally Posted by Nobunaga View Post
    To me Jesus is saying without the new covenant made in His blood (Matt 26:28) and the regeneration which follows it, found in Ezekiel, you will not be reconciled to the Father. He is the only way.

    Ezekiel 36:26-27. I will sprinkle clean water on you, and you shall be clean from all your uncleannesses, and from all your idols I will cleanse you. And I will give you a new heart, and a new spirit I will put within you. And I will remove the heart of stone from your flesh and give you a heart of flesh. And I will put my Spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes and be careful to obey my rules. (ESV)

    Yaweh made a covenant with Israel the contract is smiler to the suzerain/vassal treaty and it places on the vassal (Israel) laws and ordinances that are to be followed, if the vassal was unfaithful there were consequences and if the vassal was faithful there was blessings. So the people who accepted the terms and conditions entered into a covenant with Yaweh and followed His commandments were marked out as His people. This does not mean however that everyone was faithful in keeping them, but they were trying and they were showing a willingness to follow and be obedient to the covenant made with Yaweh at Sinai. This is what i see is behind God saying, those who keep my commands are my people. But dont forget we are now under a new Covenant, one in which God is at work in you to act, and to will to do His good pleasure.
    So can we not come to God by the old covenant as they did before Jesus came?

    Firstfruits

  7. #7
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    Re: "No Man Cometh Unto The Father, But By Me"

    Quote Originally Posted by petepet View Post
    As Paul clearly demonstrated in Romans 1,18-3.19 there is no one who fully keeps His commandments, statutes, and judgments.

    Thus no one will finally come to God by keeping them. If we have offended in one point we are guilty of all (James 2.10).

    What of course the verses have in mind is the intent of people to keep them because they are humble and genuine servants of God Such observance, if genuinely done out of love for God, would be the sign of a true spiritual life.

    But in the end no one from Adam onwards comes to God in any other way than through Jesus Christ. It was His sacrifice offered once for all, reaching back to Adam ('sins done aforetime' - Romans 3.25) that provides the way back to the Father.

    Those in the Old Testament came through the sacrificial system which pointed forward to His death. Since His coming it is only through His sacrifice on the cross that we can come.

    He was pointing out that He was ultimate truth and ultimate life. Without these we cannot come to the Father (even though our grasp on the former may be limited). Without responding to His truth and receiving His life we cannot have forgivenessa and life.

    So once we have heard of Him unless our hearts are set towards Jesus Christ we cannot come to the Father. There is no other way to the Father. We have to have atonement and receive life. Only Jesus can give either.

    It has always been so.

    .
    So with regards to coming to God as they did according to the old covenant, is that way to God no longer valid?

    Firstfruits

  8. #8

    Re: "No Man Cometh Unto The Father, But By Me"

    Quote Originally Posted by Firstfruits View Post
    So can we not come to God by the old covenant as they did before Jesus came?

    Firstfruits
    Nobody could keep the law, The high priest had to atone for Israel's sins every year on Yom Kippur, it was a schoolmaster to lead us to Christ.

    Hebrew 10:11

    Day after day every priest stands and performs his religious duties; again and again he offers the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins. But when this priest had offered for all time one sacrifice for sins, he sat down at the right hand of God, and since that time he waits for his enemies to be made his footstool. For by one sacrifice he has made perfect forever those who are being made holy.

    The Holy Spirit also testifies to us about this. First he says:

    “This is the covenant I will make with them
    after that time, says the Lord.
    I will put my laws in their hearts,
    and I will write them on their minds.”

    Then he adds:

    “Their sins and lawless acts
    I will remember no more.”


    Why go back to the old ? This is not to say the moral law is bad or should not be followed but in our own flesh we cannot do it. (I know i cant anyway) but with the power of the Holy Spirit working in us bearing fruit, we are made able by Him to work and do His will.


  9. #9
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    Re: "No Man Cometh Unto The Father, But By Me"

    Quote Originally Posted by Nobunaga View Post
    Nobody could keep the law, The high priest had to atone for Israel's sins every year on Yom Kippur, it was a schoolmaster to lead us to Christ.

    Hebrew 10:11

    Day after day every priest stands and performs his religious duties; again and again he offers the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins. But when this priest had offered for all time one sacrifice for sins, he sat down at the right hand of God, and since that time he waits for his enemies to be made his footstool. For by one sacrifice he has made perfect forever those who are being made holy.

    The Holy Spirit also testifies to us about this. First he says:

    “This is the covenant I will make with them
    after that time, says the Lord.
    I will put my laws in their hearts,
    and I will write them on their minds.”

    Then he adds:

    “Their sins and lawless acts
    I will remember no more.”


    Why go back to the old ? This is not to say the moral law is bad or should not be followed but in our own flesh we cannot do it. (I know i cant anyway) but with the power of the Holy Spirit working in us bearing fruit, we are made able by Him to work and do His will.
    Thank you Nobunaga,

    So only by that which is according to the teaching of the gospel of Christ can we come to God?

    Firstfruits

  10. #10

    Re: "No Man Cometh Unto The Father, But By Me"

    Quote Originally Posted by Firstfruits View Post
    Thank you Nobunaga,

    So only by that which is according to the teaching of the gospel of Christ can we come to God?

    Firstfruits
    Yes...we can be reconciled to God through His Son and His Gospel. :-) this is the only way !...it not politically correct and some may even say it arrogant but it's God who gets to decide not us, we are law breakers and He has given us a way of escape by showing His love. God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us. Rom 5:8... Good news indeed


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    Re: "No Man Cometh Unto The Father, But By Me"

    Quote Originally Posted by Firstfruits View Post
    According to the following scripture we will be judged by Jesus according to His gospel:

    Rom 2:16 In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.

    If we come to God through his gospel, and it is for Jew and Gentile:

    Rom 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

    Is this the same as what God said would make us his people, by keeping the commandments, statues and judgments?

    Firstfruits
    We will be judged,just as the gospel says. Paul is saying that the gospel message includes judgement by Christ. He is saying that according to the what the gospel says we will be judged.He is focusing in on the point that Jesus made when he said all judgment was committed to the Son;

    Jn 5:22 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son:

    This is according to the gospel.

    We will be judged by Jesus according to the deeds we have done while in this physical body:

    2C 5:10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.

    Blessings

    and Popcorn


    "You can make the scriptures say whatever you want if you torture them long enough"

  12. #12
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    Re: "No Man Cometh Unto The Father, But By Me"

    With regards to the following, is it agreeable to say that we are called by the gospel of Christ?

    Jn 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

    Jn 6:45 It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me.

    Firstfruits
    Last edited by Firstfruits; Jun 21st 2011 at 06:34 PM.

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    Re: "No Man Cometh Unto The Father, But By Me"

    Quote Originally Posted by shepherdsword View Post
    We will be judged,just as the gospel says. Paul is saying that the gospel message includes judgement by Christ. He is saying that according to the what the gospel says we will be judged.He is focusing in on the point that Jesus made when he said all judgment was committed to the Son;

    Jn 5:22 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son:

    This is according to the gospel.

    We will be judged by Jesus according to the deeds we have done while in this physical body:

    2C 5:10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.
    Judgement most certainly is given to the Son. But...the Gospel is clear that Eternal life is given only THROUGH Christ.

    1 John 5:

    6 This is the one who came by water and blood—Jesus Christ. He did not come by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit who testifies, because the Spirit is the truth.
    7 For there are three that testify:
    8 the[a] Spirit, the water and the blood; and the three are in agreement.
    9 We accept human testimony, but God’s testimony is greater because it is the testimony of God, which he has given about his Son.
    10 Whoever believes in the Son of God accepts this testimony. Whoever does not believe God has made him out to be a liar, because they have not believed the testimony God has given about his Son.
    11 And this is the testimony: God has given us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.
    12 Whoever has the Son has life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have life.


    Am I confused, or are you saying that we are not saved by Faith in Christ? If you are making a different point that we are saved by Faith and obedience, that is a different discussion. But...we MUST receive the Spirit of God through faith in the blood of Jesus Christ in order to receive God's salvation.

    ***Edit***I just reread your post and I'm pretty sure you are merely making a point about a specific passage. Sorry if I came across as questioning your Faith in the pure Gospel.

  14. #14

    Re: "No Man Cometh Unto The Father, But By Me"

    Quote Originally Posted by Firstfruits View Post
    So with regards to coming to God as they did according to the old covenant, is that way to God no longer valid?

    Firstfruits
    Yes the old covenant has come to its fulfilment in the new as Jeremiah prophesied so long ago (Jeremiah 31.31; Hebrews 8.8-12). The whole point of a new agreement is to invalidate what has gone before. It has replaced it.

    'In that he says 'a new covenant' he has made the first old. Now that which decays and becomes old is ready to vanish away' (Hebrews 8.13).

    'If the first covenant was faultless there would have been found no place for the second' (Hwebrews 8.7).

    The old covenant was sealed with the blood of animals. It was temporary and insufficient. The new is sealed in the blood of Christ. It is fully efficacious. The new covenant is now the only one that can give life and change the heart.

    No man can come to the Father except by Him (John 14.6)

  15. #15

    Re: "No Man Cometh Unto The Father, But By Me"

    Quote Originally Posted by Firstfruits View Post
    With regards to the folowing, is it agreable to say that we are called by the gospel of Christ?

    Jn 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

    Jn 6:45 It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me.

    Firstfruits
    Putting it loosely the answer is yes. But of course the Gospel is simply the instrument that God uses through which to call us. In the end it is God Himself Who calls and draws and teaches us by His Holy Spirit.

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