Churches debate whether to marry gays in NY

[Cornflake]

But once gay's and the states and our government try to infringe on our religious freedom to worship and obey our God as we see fit and are commanded to do I have a big problem with it.

This is kind of like an invasion where they are forcing their way into our churches through legislation and trying to gain.....what I don't know.

How in the heck does a country that is supposed to still be like 80 or 90 percent Christian allow this kind of thing to happen? It seems their definition of separation of church and state only applies in the ways that they want it to eh?

How is this infringing on anyone's religious freedom? How is this violating the separation of church and state? This has nothing to do with religious freedom.

[BrianW]

How is this infringing on anyone's religious freedom? How is this violating the separation of church and state? This has nothing to do with religious freedom.

I would say that the post below explains it very well.

We had a discussion about this at church since we live in NY. Right now, a gay couple can't demand a church to marry them. If a church says no, the two people can't "sue" the church.

However, a couple (same-gender) who come to any church to be a member must be treated as any other married couple and that means if they attend any Marriage Ministry meetings together or one (even a man if I understand the law correctly) wants to attend the Woman's Ministry... a church cannot stop this.

We better learn more hymns because some of us will be singing in jail for a long time the way this world is going.

[Cornflake]

As I and someone else noted below that, that's not true. Same as the church isn't forced to marry heterosexual couples they don't feel are fit for marriage or don't feel uphold the principles of the church body or whatever.

I think they think they'd be forced as a public accomodation but they wouldn't, as they're not now.

[Amos_with_goats]

A child is born.

Full of potential, a future before him or her.

A child is born under the curse of sin. They will make a decision...

Now, years later that child is making choices... some lead to life and others lead to death.

Do we morn for that child's decisions? Do we care at all? Or are we only concerned about this as it relates to us?

[Cornflake]

Of course we care, but as much as we can share the Word, counsel, seek to be light to them, etc., we don't control other people.

[Amos_with_goats]

Of course we care, but as much as we can share the Word, counsel, seek to be light to them, etc., we don't control other people.

A depressed man comes to you to buy a gun. Do you sell it to him so as not to control him?

[Cornflake]

I wouldn't sell it to him. That doesn't mean I control him. He can go off and find one someplace else, he can do 60 other things besides use a gun. We control our own actions and responses, not anyone elses.

[Amos_with_goats]

I wouldn't sell it to him. That doesn't mean I control him. He can go off and find one someplace else, he can do 60 other things besides use a gun. We control our own actions and responses, not anyone elses.

Yes, we do. We are all accountable for our actions.

There IS a part of this temporal existence we share. My sin DOES effect others, and if I love others my opinions, thinking, and ultimately my actions are going to reflect this belief.

I do not desire men be enslaved by sin.

I wish abortion were not permitted... because I do not want women to be under the penalty of killing their unborn child.

I wish 'gay marriage' were not permitted either... I would not want those chains to be placed on another human for whom Christ died... nor do I want the church to be a party to such a travesty.

[Cornflake]

I can wish people, including myself, were not enslaved to sin. I can wish people didn't do half the things they did, for various reasons in addition to it separating them from the Lord. That doesn't mean I can't recognize that the law of the land is not that of God, nor will it be until Jesus returns.

[Amos_with_goats]

I can wish people, including myself, were not enslaved to sin. I can wish people didn't do half the things they did, for various reasons in addition to it separating them from the Lord. That doesn't mean I can't recognize that the law of the land is not that of God, nor will it be until Jesus returns.

The effect of our words is not limited. The person who has questions about this, and reads your words that might seem to support this thing (gay marriage) as right (or permissible... or not a sin)... and takes from that an understanding that these things are not an 'issue' for a believer.... and votes for a candidate, or even speaks as through this does not matter....

They are a part of the problem, and by default so you may also be. Please do not be a party to this....

I CAN understand your (and others) desire... please be careful not to get caught in the trap the world would set.

James 4:17
17 Therefore, to him who knows to do good and does not do it, to him it is sin.

[Amos_with_goats]

There IS a right and a wrong side to this... evil has prevailed, and is knocking at the door of the Church.

Let our answer be clear... and one we can live with.... of eternity.