Paul's Thorn

[RollTide21]

<sup>2 Corinthians 12:


1</sup> I must go on boasting. Although there is nothing to be gained, I will go on to visions and revelations from the Lord. ² I know a man in Christ who fourteen years ago was caught up to the third heaven. Whether it was in the body or out of the body I do not know—God knows. ³ And I know that this man—whether in the body or apart from the body I do not know, but God knows— ⁴ was caught up to paradise and heard inexpressible things, things that no one is permitted to tell. ⁵ I will boast about a man like that, but I will not boast about myself, except about my weaknesses. ⁶ Even if I should choose to boast, I would not be a fool, because I would be speaking the truth. But I refrain, so no one will think more of me than is warranted by what I do or say, ⁷ or because of these surpassingly great revelations. Therefore, in order to keep me from becoming conceited, I was given a thorn in my flesh, a messenger of Satan, to torment me. ⁸ Three times I pleaded with the Lord to take it away from me. ⁹ But he said to me, “My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness.” Therefore I will boast all the more gladly about my weaknesses, so that Christ’s power may rest on me. ¹⁰ That is why, for Christ’s sake, I delight in weaknesses, in insults, in hardships, in persecutions, in difficulties. For when I am weak, then I am strong.

What was this "thorn" in Paul's flesh? I have previously thought that it was some sort of temptation that he was susceptible to, considering his use of the term "flesh" to describe the carnal nature. But...that is merely a guess. It could be any number of things. Physical ailment? Depression?

What do you think?

[VerticalReality]

<sup>2 Corinthians 12:


1</sup> I must go on boasting. Although there is nothing to be gained, I will go on to visions and revelations from the Lord. ² I know a man in Christ who fourteen years ago was caught up to the third heaven. Whether it was in the body or out of the body I do not know—God knows. ³ And I know that this man—whether in the body or apart from the body I do not know, but God knows— ⁴ was caught up to paradise and heard inexpressible things, things that no one is permitted to tell. ⁵ I will boast about a man like that, but I will not boast about myself, except about my weaknesses. ⁶ Even if I should choose to boast, I would not be a fool, because I would be speaking the truth. But I refrain, so no one will think more of me than is warranted by what I do or say, ⁷ or because of these surpassingly great revelations. Therefore, in order to keep me from becoming conceited, I was given a thorn in my flesh, a messenger of Satan, to torment me. ⁸ Three times I pleaded with the Lord to take it away from me. ⁹ But he said to me, “My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness.” Therefore I will boast all the more gladly about my weaknesses, so that Christ’s power may rest on me. ¹⁰ That is why, for Christ’s sake, I delight in weaknesses, in insults, in hardships, in persecutions, in difficulties. For when I am weak, then I am strong.

What was this "thorn" in Paul's flesh? I have previously thought that it was some sort of temptation that he was susceptible to, considering his use of the term "flesh" to describe the carnal nature. But...that is merely a guess. It could be any number of things. Physical ailment? Depression?

What do you think?

I believe the end of 2 Corinthians 11 reveals Paul's thorn, and with the continuation into chapter 12 it makes perfect sense to me that Paul's thorn was persecution that he endured for His name's sake.

[RollTide21]

I believe the end of 2 Corinthians 11 reveals Paul's thorn, and with the continuation into chapter 12 it makes perfect sense to me that Paul's thorn was persecution that he endured for His name's sake.

Perhaps. It just seems to be something more specific, however. The prick of a thorn is sharp and specific, with the pain isolated to a particular area. The use of the word "thorn" makes me think he's got a particular problem that he's having to deal with.

[shepherdsword]

Perhaps. It just seems to be something more specific, however. The prick of a thorn is sharp and specific, with the pain isolated to a particular area. The use of the word "thorn" makes me think he's got a particular problem that he's having to deal with.

Persecution such as being stoned and having your life sought out by some who swore to kill you sounds like an intense and specific pain to me. But who knows? We can only speculate.

[Nihil Obstat]

Paul's thorn has a similar ring to it as the OTs use of the word, as in Jos. 23:12-13. I understand his thorn to be his persecutors who bring confusion to the churches he establishes, the Judaizers. Often Paul uses "Satan" as a metonym to speak of these false teachers.

[Beckrl]

Paul's thorn in his flesh was a reminder of how he onces persecuted the chirstians and how himself now is persecuted. Therefore keeping him abase and not thinking to high of himself. I see this thorn as his persecutor's which persecute him in his flesh as he described by his infirmity. He speaks of them as messengers of Satan [flesh]. In other words those that taught the laws as he onces did and persecuted those that didn't follow.

[nzyr]

The scripture doesn't say what Paul's thorn in the flesh was. It may have been an injury that he got from being attacked. I believe he was beaten unconscious on at least one occasion. (Acts 14:19) (2 Corinthians 11:25) Some scholars think it may have left him an epileptic.

[Reynolds357]

The scripture doesn't say what Paul's thorn in the flesh was. It may have been an injury that he got from being attacked. I believe he was beaten unconscious on at least one occasion. (Acts 14:19) (2 Corinthians 11:25) Some scholars think it may have left him an epileptic.

The scripture does say what it was. It plainly says it was the "messenger of Satan."
I really do not understand why people refuse to acknowledge what the scripture says. Suppose I said "I am sending you a gun, a Colt 1911 Gold Cup, for you to use in a match. Someone then asked you "what kind of gun is Reynolds sending you?" You would say "I do not know?"
The passage says "A thorn in the flesh, THE MESSENGER OF SATAN." Messenger was translated from "angelos." Angelos is most commonly translated angel. Who is an angel of Satan? This passage is so simple one really has to try hard to complicate it.

[nzyr]

The scripture does say what it was. It plainly says it was the "messenger of Satan."
I really do not understand why people refuse to acknowledge what the scripture says. Suppose I said "I am sending you a gun, a Colt 1911 Gold Cup, for you to use in a match. Someone then asked you "what kind of gun is Reynolds sending you?" You would say "I do not know?"
The passage says "A thorn in the flesh, THE MESSENGER OF SATAN." Messenger was translated from "angelos." Angelos is most commonly translated angel. Who is an angel of Satan? This passage is so simple one really has to try hard to complicate it.

But it doesn't say what the thorn was. Yes a messenger of Satan hit (buffet) him. But Paul doesn't go into detail about what exactly the injury was.

[ProjectPeter]

What was the point of Paul's thorn in the side?

[VerticalReality]

What was the point of Paul's thorn in the side?

So that he would not be exalted above measure. Some people say that means so that Paul would not think of himself more highly than he ought to think. Others believe the purpose was so that other people wouldn't exalt Paul into something higher than a mere man (i.e. People thinking of him as being divine and the author of the powerful works God used him for).

[ProjectPeter]

So that he would not be exalted above measure. Some people say that means so that Paul would not think of himself more highly than he ought to think. Others believe the purpose was so that other people wouldn't exalt Paul into something higher than a mere man (i.e. People thinking of him as being divine and the author of the powerful works God used him for).

Safe to say that Scripture says that was the reason so that is the one fact that we do know. God's grace was sufficient for him. Personally... I believe it was a man, probably Alexander the Coppersmith that Paul was speaking of (wrote of him to Timothy and that timing would be pretty right too). Could have been a sickness such as he obviously had the eye thing going on of some sort... not totally discounting that. But the "what was the thorn" is a question that all of us can only take a guess on since he doesn't say straight up. I don't think the "who" or "what was the thorn" is the point we need to even ponder on though. WHAT was the point... that's where the meat is.

[RollTide21]

Safe to say that Scripture says that was the reason so that is the one fact that we do know. God's grace was sufficient for him. Personally... I believe it was a man, probably Alexander the Coppersmith that Paul was speaking of (wrote of him to Timothy and that timing would be pretty right too). Could have been a sickness such as he obviously had the eye thing going on of some sort... not totally discounting that. But the "what was the thorn" is a question that all of us can only take a guess on since he doesn't say straight up. I don't think the "who" or "what was the thorn" is the point we need to even ponder on though. WHAT was the point... that's where the meat is.

In my view, the most important part of that passage is "My Grace is sufficient for you".

It's an instruction for when we go through difficult trials and, it appears that, God isn't miraculously delivering us. We should understand that there are things that we must endure for the Will of God, and we can take comfort from this verse knowing that He is in control, working, and will ultimately glorify Himself in us, even if it SEEMS that He is ignoring us.

[Treasured]

In my view, the most important part of that passage is "My Grace is sufficient for you".

It's an instruction for when we go through difficult trials and, it appears that, God isn't miraculously delivering us. We should understand that there are things that we must endure for the Will of God, and we can take comfort from this verse knowing that He is in control, working, and will ultimately glorify Himself in us, even if it SEEMS that He is ignoring us.

Yup...that right there is truth! And how many times do we find ourselves in that place?!!...way too many and then we read James! Scheeech....and we need to get with the program and consider it pure joy! What's with that! Except that His grace is sufficient...and that He is working all things together for good...He will not miss one single opportunity to mould us into vessels fit for the Master's use...that, we can depend on!

[Reynolds357]

Safe to say that Scripture says that was the reason so that is the one fact that we do know. God's grace was sufficient for him. Personally... I believe it was a man, probably Alexander the Coppersmith that Paul was speaking of (wrote of him to Timothy and that timing would be pretty right too). Could have been a sickness such as he obviously had the eye thing going on of some sort... not totally discounting that. But the "what was the thorn" is a question that all of us can only take a guess on since he doesn't say straight up. I don't think the "who" or "what was the thorn" is the point we need to even ponder on though. WHAT was the point... that's where the meat is.

I have never really understood why it is "obvious" that Paul had eye problems. I have never seen anything in scripture that even remotely suggests that.