Satan is released and deceives the nations Rev 20:8

[Desperaux]

There is not a thing in the bible that says those that live and reign with Christ can't reign with Christ, regardless of the possibility of receiving a mark, if it were a literal one, that is only your assumption. The bible doesn't say that.

Yes, it does.

Revelation 14:9-11
9 Then a third angel followed them, shouting, “Anyone who worships the beast and his statue or who accepts his mark on the forehead or on the hand 10 must drink the wine of God’s anger. It has been poured full strength into God’s cup of wrath. And they will be tormented with fire and burning sulfur in the presence of the holy angels and the Lamb. 11 The smoke of their torment will rise forever and ever, and they will have no relief day or night, for they have worshiped the beast and his statue and have accepted the mark of his name.”

[Raybob]

Yes, it does.

Revelation 14:9-11
9 Then a third angel followed them, shouting, “Anyone who worships the beast and his statue or who accepts his mark on the forehead or on the hand 10 must drink the wine of God’s anger. It has been poured full strength into God’s cup of wrath. And they will be tormented with fire and burning sulfur in the presence of the holy angels and the Lamb. 11 The smoke of their torment will rise forever and ever, and they will have no relief day or night, for they have worshiped the beast and his statue and have accepted the mark of his name.”

That's not what I said. This verse speaks of those that don't live and reign with Christ. I wrote about those that do.

[Desperaux]

That's not what I said. This verse speaks of those that don't live and reign with Christ. I wrote about those that do.

None of those reigning with Christ will be bearing the mark.

[Raybob]

None of those reigning with Christ will be bearing the mark.

Now that IS what I said, in so many words.

[Desperaux]

Now that IS what I said, in so many words.

Sorry, but in those many words, it seemed to be the opposite.

[billy-brown 2]

There has always been the promise that Jesus will rule from Jerusalem on earth for a time---that is the Millennial Reign. He doesn't come off one throne and rule another. He is Lord of all already, yet He will physically rule the nations from Jerusalem for a time.

Well, if Jesus is Lord of all already--and we agree on that, then Jesus is King already also. And if Jesus is King already, then Jesus is High Priest already.

In other words, the Lordship, Kingship, and High Priestly posture of Jesus Christ cannot be separated from each other--Jesus is Lord, King, and High Priest in one person: he is the also the BRANCH (see Zech. 6:12-13).

And, as a result, Jesus has already the four things listed below:

1) a Kingdom
John 18
36Jesus answered, “My kingdom is not of this world. If My kingdom were of this world, then My servants would be fighting so that I would not be handed over to the Jews; but as it is, My kingdom is not of this realm.”

2) a throne
Heb. 1
8But of the Son He says,
“YOUR THRONE, O GOD, IS FOREVER AND EVER,
AND THE RIGHTEOUS SCEPTER IS THE SCEPTER OF HIS KINGDOM.

3) a facility to house the throne
Heb. 8
1Now the main point in what has been said is this: we have such a high priest, who has taken His seat at the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens,
2a minister in the sanctuary and in the true tabernacle, which the Lord pitched, not man.

4) loyal subjects
Col. 1
13For He rescued us from the domain of darkness, and transferred us to the kingdom of His beloved Son,
14in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.

And the throne and tabernacle in the quote above are indeed ETERNAL . . . and of course, Jesus is IMMORTAL.

Now, put yourself in Jesus' shoes: would you leave all of that (in the quote above) and "rule from Jerusalem for a time during a Millennium Reign" (as you would say) that would have "death" around it (the "millennium" contains death, you know . . .)?

And remember, Jesus is Priest FOREVER already--and if he were on earth, he would not be Priest:

Heb. 7
23The former priests, on the one hand, existed in greater numbers because they were prevented by death from continuing,
24but Jesus, on the other hand, because He continues forever, holds His priesthood permanently.
25Therefore He is able also to save forever those who draw near to God through Him, since He always lives to make intercession for them.

Heb. 8
3For every high priest is appointed to offer both gifts and sacrifices; so it is necessary that this high priest also have something to offer.
4Now if He were on earth, He would not be a priest at all, since there are those who offer the gifts according to the Law;
5who serve a copy and shadow of the heavenly things, just as Moses was warned by God when he was about to erect the tabernacle; for, “SEE,” He says, “THAT YOU MAKE all things ACCORDING TO THE PATTERN WHICH WAS SHOWN YOU ON THE MOUNTAIN.”
6But now He has obtained a more excellent ministry, by as much as He is also the mediator of a better covenant, which has been enacted on better promises.

[Desperaux]

Well, if Jesus is Lord of all already--and we agree on that, then Jesus is King already also. And if Jesus is King already, then Jesus is High Priest already.

In other words, the Lordship, Kingship, and High Priestly posture of Jesus Christ cannot be separated from each other--Jesus is Lord, King, and High Priest in one person: he is the also the BRANCH (see Zech. 6:12-13).

And, as a result, Jesus has already the four things listed below:



And the throne and tabernacle in the quote above are indeed ETERNAL . . . and of course, Jesus is IMMORTAL.

Now, put yourself in Jesus' shoes: would you leave all of that (in the quote above) and "rule from Jerusalem for a time during a Millennium Reign" (as you would say) that would have "death" around it (the "millennium" contains death, you know . . .)?

And remember, Jesus is Priest FOREVER already--and if he were on earth, he would not be Priest:

Do you see Jesus on the throne in Jerusalem? Are you there now in your resurrected body ruling with Him right now?

No! This rule has yet to come to be. That is what we are looking for with His return! Why is that detail being ignored?

[billy-brown 2]

Do you see Jesus on the throne in Jerusalem? Are you there now in your resurrected body ruling with Him right now?

No! This rule has yet to come to be. That is what we are looking for with His return! Why is that detail being ignored?

I feel that you are missing what I am saying . . .

I am sure that you remember that the new covenant that we all live under as saints of the living God is being administered by our High Priest Jesus from the heavenly tabernacle at the right hand of the Father:

Heb. 8
1Now the main point in what has been said is this: we have such a high priest, who has taken His seat at the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens,
2a minister in the sanctuary and in the true tabernacle, which the Lord pitched, not man.
3For every high priest is appointed to offer both gifts and sacrifices; so it is necessary that this high priest also have something to offer.
4Now if He were on earth, He would not be a priest at all, since there are those who offer the gifts according to the Law;
5who serve a copy and shadow of the heavenly things, just as Moses was warned by God when he was about to erect the tabernacle; for, “SEE,” He says, “THAT YOU MAKE all things ACCORDING TO THE PATTERN WHICH WAS SHOWN YOU ON THE MOUNTAIN.”
6But now He has obtained a more excellent ministry, by as much as He is also the mediator of a better covenant, which has been enacted on better promises.

And thus, the new covenant requires a King/Priest--and Jesus is that and more. Remember, "we have" a high priest already; He "has taken" His seat at the Father's right hand--as taught here also:

Heb. 1
1God, after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways,
2in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world.
3And He is the radiance of His glory and the exact representation of His nature, and upholds all things by the word of His power. When He had made purification of sins, He sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high,
4having become as much better than the angels, as He has inherited a more excellent name than they.

5For to which of the angels did He ever say,
“YOU ARE MY SON,
TODAY I HAVE BEGOTTEN YOU”?
And again,
“I WILL BE A FATHER TO HIM
AND HE SHALL BE A SON TO ME”?

6And when He again brings the firstborn into the world, He says,
“AND LET ALL THE ANGELS OF GOD WORSHIP HIM.”

7And of the angels He says,
“WHO MAKES HIS ANGELS WINDS,
AND HIS MINISTERS A FLAME OF FIRE.”

8But of the Son He says,
“YOUR THRONE, O GOD, IS FOREVER AND EVER,
AND THE RIGHTEOUS SCEPTER IS THE SCEPTER OF HIS KINGDOM.

9“YOU HAVE LOVED RIGHTEOUSNESS AND HATED LAWLESSNESS;
THEREFORE GOD, YOUR GOD, HAS ANOINTED YOU
WITH THE OIL OF GLADNESS ABOVE YOUR COMPANIONS.”

Now, our resurrected glorified body is the reward for faith in Christ during this current age; it is the way death is abolished by Christ at the end of this age--notice the order below:

I Cor. 15
20But now Christ has been raised from the dead, the first fruits of those who are asleep.
21For since by a man came death, by a man also came the resurrection of the dead.
22For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ all will be made alive.
23But each in his own order: Christ the first fruits, after that those who are Christ’s at His coming,
24then comes the end, when He hands over the kingdom to the God and Father, when He has abolished all rule and all authority and power.
25For He must reign until He has put all His enemies under His feet.
26The last enemy that will be abolished is death.
27For HE HAS PUT ALL THINGS IN SUBJECTION UNDER HIS FEET. But when He says, “All things are put in subjection,” it is evident that He is excepted who put all things in subjection to Him.
28When all things are subjected to Him, then the Son Himself also will be subjected to the One who subjected all things to Him, so that God may be all in all.

//

50Now I say this, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable.
51Behold, I tell you a mystery; we will not all sleep, but we will all be changed,
52in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet; for the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed.
53For this perishable must put on the imperishable, and this mortal must put on immortality.
54But when this perishable will have put on the imperishable, and this mortal will have put on immortality, then will come about the saying that is written, “DEATH IS SWALLOWED UP in victory.
55“O DEATH, WHERE IS YOUR VICTORY? O DEATH, WHERE IS YOUR STING?”
56The sting of death is sin, and the power of sin is the law;
57but thanks be to God, who gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.

Do you understand what these verses are implying above?

Finally, Rev. 1:4-6 indicates the following:

Rev. 1
4John to the seven churches that are in Asia: Grace to you and peace, from Him who is and who was and who is to come, and from the seven Spirits who are before His throne,
5and from Jesus Christ, the faithful witness, the firstborn of the dead, and the ruler of the kings of the earth. To Him who loves us and released us from our sins by His blood—
6and He has made us to be a kingdom, priests to His God and Father—to Him be the glory and the dominion forever and ever. Amen.

Might you indicate your understanding of these verses from Rev. 1? (Just seeking to learn . . .)

[Desperaux]

I feel that you are missing what I am saying . . .

I am sure that you remember that the new covenant that we all live under as saints of the living God is being administered by our High Priest Jesus from the heavenly tabernacle at the right hand of the Father:



And thus, the new covenant requires a King/Priest--and Jesus is that and more. Remember, "we have" a high priest already; He "has taken" His seat at the Father's right hand--as taught here also:



Now, our resurrected glorified body is the reward for faith in Christ during this current age; it is the way death is abolished by Christ at the end of this age--notice the order below:



Do you understand what these verses are implying above?

Finally, Rev. 1:4-6 indicates the following:



Might you indicate your understanding of these verses from Rev. 1? (Just seeking to learn . . .)

I understand the verses, and have cut my spiritual teeth on them many moons ago---but are you denying that Jesus is to fulfill the promise of God to rule with that rod of iron for a Millennium, on earth, from Jerusalem?

[billy-brown 2]

I understand the verses, and have cut my spiritual teeth on them many moons ago---but are you denying that Jesus is to fulfill the promise of God to rule with that rod of iron for a Millennium, on earth, from Jerusalem?

Well, I don't know that I am denying that . . .

But here's what we know: the scriptures below from Psalm 110 are referred to by the NT authors in such a fashion that one has to conclude that they are some of the most important prophetic passages in all of the Bible:

Psalm 110
1The LORD says to my Lord: "Sit at My right hand until I make Your enemies a footstool for Your feet."
2The LORD will stretch forth Your strong scepter from Zion, saying, "Rule in the midst of Your enemies."

and in fact, it makes the notion of "Jesus fulfilling the promise of God to rule with that rod of iron for a Millennium, on earth, from Jerusalem?" impossible (for example).

Why?

Well, look at these verses below:

Heb. 8
1Now the main point in what has been said is this: we have such a high priest, who has taken His seat at the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens,
2a minister in the sanctuary and in the true tabernacle, which the Lord pitched, not man.
3For every high priest is appointed to offer both gifts and sacrifices; so it is necessary that this high priest also have something to offer.
4Now if He were on earth, He would not be a priest at all, since there are those who offer the gifts according to the Law;
5who serve a copy and shadow of the heavenly things, just as Moses was warned by God when he was about to erect the tabernacle; for, “SEE,” He says, “THAT YOU MAKE all things ACCORDING TO THE PATTERN WHICH WAS SHOWN YOU ON THE MOUNTAIN.”
6But now He has obtained a more excellent ministry, by as much as He is also the mediator of a better covenant, which has been enacted on better promises.

Yep.

(Did you see it?)

Indeed, Jesus is administering right now the new covenant from the Right hand of the Father as High Priest in a heavenly tabernacle that will NEVER BE DESTROYED. And this heavenly tabernacle is the ONLY mission appropriate "facility" for the Immortal KING/Priest/Lord Jesus. And there is only ONE facility to house the FOREVER THRONE of GOD at a time:

Heb. 1
8But of the Son He says,
“YOUR THRONE, O GOD, IS FOREVER AND EVER,
AND THE RIGHTEOUS SCEPTER IS THE SCEPTER OF HIS KINGDOM.

Therefore, He is also RULING from there as KING "until" . . . His enemies are made His footstool.

And death is the LAST enemy . . . and will be abolished at the end of our current age--as taught below (read carefully):

I Cor. 15
20But now Christ has been raised from the dead, the first fruits of those who are asleep.
21For since by a man came death, by a man also came the resurrection of the dead.
22For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ all will be made alive.
23But each in his own order: Christ the first fruits, after that those who are Christ’s at His coming,
24then comes the end, when He hands over the kingdom to the God and Father, when He has abolished all rule and all authority and power.
25For He must reign until He has put all His enemies under His feet.
26The last enemy that will be abolished is death.
27For HE HAS PUT ALL THINGS IN SUBJECTION UNDER HIS FEET. But when He says, “All things are put in subjection,” it is evident that He is excepted who put all things in subjection to Him.
28When all things are subjected to Him, then the Son Himself also will be subjected to the One who subjected all things to Him, so that God may be all in all.

//

50Now I say this, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable.
51Behold, I tell you a mystery; we will not all sleep, but we will all be changed,
52in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet; for the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed.
53For this perishable must put on the imperishable, and this mortal must put on immortality.
54But when this perishable will have put on the imperishable, and this mortal will have put on immortality, then will come about the saying that is written, “DEATH IS SWALLOWED UP in victory.
55“O DEATH, WHERE IS YOUR VICTORY? O DEATH, WHERE IS YOUR STING?”
56The sting of death is sin, and the power of sin is the law;
57but thanks be to God, who gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.

And Christ is returning ONCE--even the second time only . . . yes?

[Desperaux]

Well, I don't know that I am denying that . . .

But here's what we know: the scriptures below from Psalm 110 are referred to by the NT authors in such a fashion that one has to conclude that they are some of the most important prophetic passages in all of the Bible:



and in fact, it makes the notion of "Jesus fulfilling the promise of God to rule with that rod of iron for a Millennium, on earth, from Jerusalem?" impossible (for example).

Waiting for Zion to get the memo.

[billy-brown 2]

Waiting for Zion to get the memo.

LOL

Well, the following scripture is a prophesy that concerns the Lord Jesus Christ--that He is a Priest forever already:

Psalm 110
4The LORD has sworn and will not change His mind,
“You are a priest forever
According to the order of Melchizedek.”

Now, how loooooooong is FOREVER? That's a mighty looooooong time, yes? Is there a time limit on FOREVER?

Nope.

Indeed, this prophecy from Psalm 110:4 has been fulfilled already, because Christ Jesus is now Immortal, and will never die again:

Heb. 7
14For it is evident that our Lord (Jesus!) was descended from Judah, a tribe with reference to which Moses spoke nothing concerning priests.
15And this is clearer still, if another priest arises according to the likeness of Melchizedek,
16who has become such not on the basis of a law of physical requirement, but according to the power of an indestructible life.
17For it is attested of Him (Jesus!),
“YOU ARE A PRIEST FOREVER
ACCORDING TO THE ORDER OF MELCHIZEDEK.”

Therefore, Jesus can never "rule with that rod of iron for a Millennium, on earth, from Jerusalem" at all, because He then would not be a Priest at all--and He is Priest FOREVER ALREADY--and since His glorious resurrection from the dead:

Heb. 8
1Now the main point in what has been said is this: we have such a high priest, who has taken His seat at the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens,
2a minister in the sanctuary and in the true tabernacle, which the Lord pitched, not man.
3For every high priest is appointed to offer both gifts and sacrifices; so it is necessary that this high priest also have something to offer.
4Now if He were on earth, He would not be a priest at all, since there are those who offer the gifts according to the Law;
5who serve a copy and shadow of the heavenly things, just as Moses was warned by God when he was about to erect the tabernacle; for, “SEE,” He says, “THAT YOU MAKE all things ACCORDING TO THE PATTERN WHICH WAS SHOWN YOU ON THE MOUNTAIN.”
6But now He has obtained a more excellent ministry, by as much as He is also the mediator of a better covenant, which has been enacted on better promises.

And so, we need to understand therefore that Jesus Christ is NOW seated on a heavenly throne . . .

[Desperaux]

LOL

Well, the following scripture is a prophesy that concerns the Lord Jesus Christ--that He is a Priest forever already:



Now, how loooooooong is FOREVER? That's a mighty looooooong time, yes? Is there a time limit on FOREVER?

Nope.

Indeed, this prophecy from Psalm 110:4 has been fulfilled already, because Christ Jesus is now Immortal, and will never die again:



Therefore, Jesus can never "rule with that rod of iron for a Millennium, on earth, from Jerusalem" at all, because He then would not be a Priest at all--and He is Priest FOREVER ALREADY--and since His glorious resurrection from the dead:



And so, we need to understand therefore that Jesus Christ is NOW seated on a heavenly throne . . .

Jesus has yet to ascend His earthly throne where He will rule the nations for 1000 years. Remember?

[billy-brown 2]

Jesus has yet to ascend His earthly throne where He will rule the nations for 1000 years. Remember?

LOL

Well, we have gotten away a bit from the OP; we should be talking about "Satan is released and deceives the nations Rev 20:8" and so on. And this happens AFTER the "1000 years" indeed, yes? And so, will Jesus' rule end after the "1000 years" at all?

In other words, I feel that you are placing a limit on the rule of Christ here; you may not mean that, but that's what I am sensing. Am I wrong?

[Desperaux]

LOL

Well, we have gotten away a bit from the OP; we should be talking about "Satan is released and deceives the nations Rev 20:8" and so on. And this happens AFTER the "1000 years" indeed, yes? And so, will Jesus' rule end after the "1000 years" at all?

In other words, I feel that you are placing a limit on the rule of Christ here; you may not mean that, but that's what I am sensing. Am I wrong?

Your conclusions about what I am saying are only filtered through your misapprehension, so yes, you are wrong. Jesus' rule will never end, although the earthly Jerusalem will be superseded by the New Jerusalem of God. The only limitations is what the word of God places, which is a thousand year period on earth---which is all I was taking about, yet you seem to want to attach something weird and strange to it.