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Thread: Adam and Eve

  1. #16
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    Re: Adam and Eve

    Quote Originally Posted by fewarechosen View Post
    here below defines who Adam was.

    Gen 5:2 Male and female created he them; and blessed them, and called their name Adam, in the day when they were created.
    Plenty of scriptures also make a distinction between Adam and Eve. Adam is referring to a single man; however, he is also one flesh with his wife Eve. The name Adam doesn't mean that some nameless man joined with Eve and this union made them known as Adam. Eve, as the wife, is one flesh and submitted to the authority of her husband, Adam.
    "What you do does not define who you are; it's who you are that defines what you do."

    -- Dr. Neil T. Anderson

  2. #17

    Re: Adam and Eve

    Quote Originally Posted by quiet dove View Post
    If you are going to make Adam and Eve a parable, is then the tree of knowledge also a parable? Is the creation of the animals, is the promise regarding the woman's seed? Where do you stop and how do you decide. I mean, Noah and the flood, the tower of Babel. When does it stop and where is the dividing line?
    I generally see the dividing line at approximately the end of Genesis 11. The focus of Genesis and the style of writing noticeably shifts here as we go from a big picture world view to a very narrow focus on an individual person. Personally, I see most of the first 11 chapters of Genesis as allegorical, figurative, whatever term you want to use here. I have yet to determine whether I think there were a literal Adam and Eve. I think the creation of the animals happened, only over many, many years through the process of evolution (at least currently). I don't see evolution as being crucial; if the science were to eventually support a theory for the development of life other than the theory of evolution, then I would say the creation occurred via that method. If the science were to show that animals popped out of the ground fully formed, I would believe that, only it doesn't. I think there is no doubt the Earth is older than 6000 (or whatever number close to that you want to use) years. As for Noah and the flood, I lean toward there being an actual flood, only it was regional. As for the Tower of Babel, I tend to lean towards it not actually being the source of all the different languages, even if it actually happened.

    Quote Originally Posted by quiet dove View Post
    I agree. IMHO, when we start with trying to decide what is history verses what is myth, we are heading in the wrong direction. For me, my lack of being able to understand, grasp, or explain, is not reason to disbelieve. There are plenty of other things that we can see, understand, grasp and explain.

    The Bible is the most attacked and ripped apart writing that there has ever been and it has not nor will not fail to stand....thats how I feel about it anyway. I am sure you do also...

    Just because I can't figure it out, does not mean it is not fact.
    It is important to point out that not literal does not mean not true.

    Quote Originally Posted by DDGresham1 View Post
    That's a myth. Are there decendents of inbreeding couples in Appalachia that have issues because of it? Yes, but there is no more inbreeding going on in that area in this day that any other area of the country.
    That is not entirely true. I have a close friend who's father is from West Virginia and she has talked about the inbreeding in her father's side of the family. It may have decreased in rate, but it still happens more often than in other areas (where it essentially doesn't happen at all).

    Quote Originally Posted by John 8:32 View Post
    If one comes to believe that even one account such as this is myth, then what authority has any of the scriptures? If one is faulty, you must conclude that nothing is trustworthy. Or maybe it is as one Methodist minister in the local church I grew up in stated...
    I think you are misunderstanding the position. You are assuming that if the text isn't taken literally, then it is faulty, but that is not the case. There are many places that even you do not take the text of the Bible literally, but it still holds truth for you. Take Jesus' parables as one example. You do not believe they are all literal events that happened, but that does not change the truth which they are conveying. The beginning chapters of Genesis are no different. Whether the Earth was created 6000 or 5 billion years ago, the important part is that God created it. He is responsible for everything in existence and it is because of Him that we are here discussing this. This is the truth that matters, not when and how the creation occurred.

  3. #18

    Re: Adam and Eve

    Quote Originally Posted by VerticalReality View Post
    I was thinking the very same thing. If there are more than Adam and Even then sin would not have passed on to everyone. Additionally, if not all sinned then when they procreated it wouldn't have been a corrupted seed brought forth. No, logically speaking the only accurate deduction is that all have descended from Adam.
    If Adams children procreated with others outside of their family, his seed would have gone forth via his offspring.

  4. #19

    Re: Adam and Eve

    Quote Originally Posted by John 8:32 View Post
    If one comes to believe that even one account such as this is myth, then what authority has any of the scriptures? If one is faulty, you must conclude that nothing is trustworthy. Or maybe it is as one Methodist minister in the local church I grew up in stated...

    2Ti 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

    He explained this as being able to rightly divide the truth from the error in the scriptures. Me, I think that this applies...

    Joh 10:35 If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken;
    Let's change "myth" to "parable" but I'm not saying it's either...

  5. #20

    Re: Adam and Eve

    Also, it others were created (and apparently they were since Adams offspring left to find wives) it wouldn't be a stretch to think they sinned as well...the Bible just doesn't say who these people were.

  6. #21

    Re: Adam and Eve

    Again; I'm not saying I don't believe that God created man. I am saying that we may not have been told all that went down in that time. The Bible doesn't always give all the info that would clarify things. Sometimes you have to look at what it does say vs what it doesn't say.

  7. #22
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    Re: Adam and Eve

    Quote Originally Posted by DDGresham1 View Post
    If Adams children procreated with others outside of their family, his seed would have gone forth via his offspring.
    But why would pure and holy people be intermingling and procreating with the fallen seed of Adam? Wouldn't those who are pure and holy know to stay true to God and His seed? Furthermore, how long would it have taken for all of humanity to become fallen through Adam's seed by procreation?
    "What you do does not define who you are; it's who you are that defines what you do."

    -- Dr. Neil T. Anderson

  8. #23
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    Re: Adam and Eve

    Quote Originally Posted by DDGresham1 View Post
    Also, it others were created (and apparently they were since Adams offspring left to find wives) it wouldn't be a stretch to think they sinned as well...the Bible just doesn't say who these people were.
    I would say that would be adding a lot of assumption to the scriptures.
    "What you do does not define who you are; it's who you are that defines what you do."

    -- Dr. Neil T. Anderson

  9. #24
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    Re: Adam and Eve

    Quote Originally Posted by DDGresham1 View Post
    (and apparently they were since Adams offspring left to find wives)

    Where are you getting that idea from?


    Genesis 4:16 And Cain went out from the presence of the LORD, and dwelt in the land of Nod, on the east of Eden.
    17 And Cain knew his wife; and she conceived, and bare Enoch: and he builded a city, and called the name of the city, after the name of his son, Enoch.

    If your conclusions are based on this, all the text tells us is that Cain knew his wife. It doesn't tell us when he first met his wife, or where he first saw his wife. It's more logical that Cain already had a wife when he went out from the presence of the LORD, and dwelt in the land of Nod, on the east of Eden. Logically, he would take his wife with him I would think.


    Quote Originally Posted by DDGresham1 View Post
    the Bible just doesn't say who these people were.


    Of course it doesn't. Because there are no such people...maybe that's why.

  10. #25

    Re: Adam and Eve

    Quote Originally Posted by VerticalReality View Post
    But why would pure and holy people be intermingling and procreating with the fallen seed of Adam? Wouldn't those who are pure and holy know to stay true to God and His seed? Furthermore, how long would it have taken for all of humanity to become fallen through Adam's seed by procreation?
    How would they know who was fallen? Maybe they were fallen as well? All I know is that the bible says Adams sons left to find wives.

  11. #26

    Re: Adam and Eve

    Quote Originally Posted by VerticalReality View Post
    I would say that would be adding a lot of assumption to the scriptures.
    I am not assuming anything...it's just conjecture as I don't know what really happened...the bible doesn't say. All it does say is that Adams sons left and found wives.

  12. #27

    Re: Adam and Eve

    DDGresham1, the bible does not say, "...that Adams sons left and found wives." What is says is, "So Cain went out from the Lord's presence and lived in the land of Nod, east of Eden. Cain lay with his wife....," etc. Genesis 4:16-17. It doesn't say, or even infer, that he found his wife in Nod. If we are to call ourselves Christians then we must make a commitment to believe the word of God. God promises in the bible to keep His word. To me that means it says everything God wants it to say and that what it says is complete for His purposes and is correct. It's just as wrong to read into scriptures things it doesn't say as to disbelieve what it does say. The clear answer is that Adam and Eve's children married each other. When you read the scriptures and how long they lived Cain's wife could easily have been his niece or great niece, but that (of course) means at some point biological brothers and sisters mated. There was no biblical prohibition against this until the law was given. See Deuteronomy.

  13. #28

    Re: Adam and Eve

    are there laws in OT against mating with relatives sisters/mothers/fathers?

    if so then how do you reconcile God having them do it then telling em not to.

    God never changes. do you think he would have humanity growing up breeding in the family then all of a sudden change and say ok now dont sleep with your relatives even though thats how you all got here.

    Male and female created he them; and blessed them, and called their name Adam

  14. #29
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    Re: Adam and Eve

    Quote Originally Posted by quiet dove View Post
    But if God created other men and women besides Adam, they would have then been created like Adam with out sin, and there is your conflict. What happen to those people, did they all disobey God then because Adams sin would not have effected the others that you believe God created. Or were these who had not sinned just mixed in with the fallen then-which would not work either.

    Adam had to reproduce after himself, like kind, thus fallen mankind. Adam's fallen mankind son could not have found an un-fallen mankind women and it been ok to marry and reproduce children, nor would an un-fallen one have even considered such. That would be a major unequally yoked situation.

    If you are going to make Adam and Eve a parable, is then the tree of knowledge also a parable? Is the creation of the animals, is the promise regarding the woman's seed? Where do you stop and how do you decide. I mean, Noah and the flood, the tower of Babel. When does it stop and where is the dividing line?

    Regardless of genetics, or any of that, it will not work if God created more than just Adam and Eve because we know that all man kind are in a fallen state, reproduced in like kind from Adam and Eve. If others were created they would have been unaffected by Adams fall and thus a mixture of sinful and sinless.
    Bumping this post because it was so well written and pretty much sums the whole thing up.

    All races are descendents of Adam.
    Just as I am, without one plea, but that thy blood
    was shed for me, and that thou bidst me come to thee,
    Lamb of God, I come, I come.

  15. #30
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    Re: Adam and Eve

    I did read your post. I then quoted the post quite dove wrote. Did you read her post? Here it is again:

    Originally Posted by quiet dove
    But if God created other men and women besides Adam, they would have then been created like Adam with out sin, and there is your conflict. What happen to those people, did they all disobey God then because Adams sin would not have effected the others that you believe God created. Or were these who had not sinned just mixed in with the fallen then-which would not work either.

    Adam had to reproduce after himself, like kind, thus fallen mankind. Adam's fallen mankind son could not have found an un-fallen mankind women and it been ok to marry and reproduce children, nor would an un-fallen one have even considered such. That would be a major unequally yoked situation.

    If you are going to make Adam and Eve a parable, is then the tree of knowledge also a parable? Is the creation of the animals, is the promise regarding the woman's seed? Where do you stop and how do you decide. I mean, Noah and the flood, the tower of Babel. When does it stop and where is the dividing line?

    Regardless of genetics, or any of that, it will not work if God created more than just Adam and Eve because we know that all man kind are in a fallen state, reproduced in like kind from Adam and Eve. If others were created they would have been unaffected by Adams fall and thus a mixture of sinful and sinless.
    Just as I am, without one plea, but that thy blood
    was shed for me, and that thou bidst me come to thee,
    Lamb of God, I come, I come.

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