some bible verses on the matter
rev 21:6 He said to me: “It is done. I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End. To the thirsty I will give water without cost from the spring of the water of life.
col 1:16 For in him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things have been created through him and for him.
rom 11:33 Oh, the depth of the riches of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable his judgments, and his paths beyond tracing out!
jer 32:17 “Ah, Sovereign LORD, you have made the heavens and the earth by your great power and outstretched arm. Nothing is too hard for you.
psa 103:19 The LORD has established his throne in heaven, and his kingdom rules over all.
rom 8:28 And we know that in all things God works for the good of those who love him, who have been called according to his purpose.
Eph 1:19 And what is the exceeding greatness of his power to us-ward who believe, according to the working of his mighty power, 20Which he wrought in Christ, when he raised him from the dead, and set him at his own right hand in the heavenly places, 21Far above all principality, and power, and might, and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this world, but also in that which is to come: 22And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church,
Matt 28:18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.
Despite Jesus being sovereign over all things that does not mean everyone does what He wants. Isn't the Calvinistic definition of the sovereignty of God that everything that happens is His will? Since Jesus being sovereign over all things doesn't result in everyone doing what He wants that means that man can choose to either accept Christ and obey Him or reject Him. Does the Calvinistic definition of the sovereignty of God say that man uses his free will to choose whether to accept Christ or not or does it say that salvation is entirely up to God's choice? It says it is entirely God's choice and not man's, right? So, you tell me which one is scriptural.
The final sacrifice of the temple system was the Lamb of God. After that sacrifice was complete the veil was torn in two. The blood of bulls and goats could never take away the sins of man. That was all a tutor to lead us to Christ. To teach man that sin was offensive to God and that God demanded payment for sin. Blood needed to be shed. Without the shedding of blood there is no remission of sin. You think all of those animal sacrifices were just to remind the Jews of sin? It was much more than that. It was to show the seriousness of sin. An innocent life shed its blood. Jesus is consistently referred to as the sacrificial lamb. Yes He redeemed us but He also fully satisfied the demands of God to fully punish sin in His perfect justice. (propitiation)
edited to add: I just ran across some articles while searching for a Biblical definition of propitiation. Here is some interesting reading:
and even wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Propitiation
I'm guessing that you must have a source that defines propitiation as something other than appeasing the wrath of God.
That passage that says God cannot lie, it seems you understand that as an inability to lie. Let me suggest another understanding. I'd like to suggest that God cannot lie because it is against His character, not because He is unable. Scripture says that man is made in God's image, man is able to lie. How could it be possible for man to have an ability that God Himself did not have?
On another note, wouldn't that be outside of God's sovereignty?
Don't worry about the word propitiation, look at the Greek words translated propitiation. They are "Hilasterion and Hilasmos". They appear in both the New Testament and the Greek Old Testament. Nowhere are they translated propitiation except in Roman 3, and 1 John 2 and 4. The majority of times the word Hilasterion is translated Mercy seat.
However, Even if we assume propitiation (The Calvinist's translation) where does Scripture say that it was God's wrath that was propitiated?
Paul tells us that the wages of sin is death. Wages are something we earn not something we pay. Can you please show me Scripture that shows God demanded payment for sin?To teach man that sin was offensive to God and that God demanded payment for sin.
OK, can you show me? Paul said the sacrifices were to remind the Jews of sins, if as you say it's more than that please show me.You think all of those animal sacrifices were just to remind the Jews of sin? It was much more than that.
Again, can you please show me where you find this in Scripture?Yes He redeemed us but He also fully satisfied the demands of God to fully punish sin in His perfect justice.
It's an English word chosen by the translators. Read those verses that have propitiation in them and replace the word propitiation with mercy seat and you will find that it reads just fine. You see if you have a preconceived idea of satisfying God wrath, you'll likely choose the word propitiation. However, that word isn't the necessitated choice, mercy seat fit perfectly and is much more line with that John is speaking of when he says God is Love.I'm guessing that you must have a source that defines propitiation as something other than appeasing the wrath of God.
I’ll have a look at your links but I suspect they are going down the same line of reasoning
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