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Thread: Is there a literal bottomless pit?

  1. #31

    Re: Is there a literal bottomless pit?

    • Is there a literal bottomless pit?


    Erm....a never ending vertical tunnel? No.....not literal I would say. That doesnt make sense.

  2. #32
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    Re: Is there a literal bottomless pit?

    Quote Originally Posted by John146 View Post
    It seems to me that if the key of the bottomless pit is spiritual or figurative, as most seem to agree that it is one or the other (and not physical), then it could only open a spiritual or figurative place which would mean the bottomless pit has to be a spiritual or figurative place.
    When peter was shut up in a physical prison, he was release by an angel. It does not appear that the angel had any physical key to open the doors and gates of that physical prison to let Peter out. I have to conclude then that the angel was able to open a physical prison with a spiritual key. Our current level of technology allows us to have keys of all sorts whether they be a physical key or a voice key or image scanner. The point is even today we do not have to have a physical key to unlock things. The angel may not have had a physical key to open the prison Peter was in but he did have authority from God to do so. I wonder if the key really represents authority or permission. How the angel opens the pit is irrelevant to the fact that he has the authority to do so and being given the "key" represents that authority or ability. But it can still be a physical place and the key can be spiritual. It can even be the word's Bippity, Boppity, Bo.
    Last edited by Old man; Mar 22nd 2012 at 07:39 PM. Reason: added content
    "He's wild, you know. Not like a tame lion."
    C.S. Lewis, "The Lion, The Witch and the Wardrobe."

    "Oh, but sometimes the sun stays hidden for years"
    "Sometimes the sky rains night after night, When will it clear?"

    "But our Hope endures the worst of conditions"
    "It's more than our optimism, Let the earth quake"
    "Our Hope is unchanged"

    Emmanuel, God is with us
    El Shaddai, all sufficient
    We never walk alone
    And this is our hope
    "Our Hope Endures" Natalie Grant

  3. #33

    Re: Is there a literal bottomless pit?

    Quote Originally Posted by noizey View Post
    John, who wrote Revelation, was a big fan of poetry and symbology and metaphors and all that jazz. So I think you were right in assuming it's not literally a bottomless pit.

    Revelation 9:2 And he opened the bottomless pit; and there arose a smoke out of the pit, as the smoke of a great furnace; and the sun and the air were darkened by reason of the smoke of the pit.

    To me, the pit being opened and the smoke coming out symbolizes the chaos about to ensue. The weird scorpion/locust things are about to torment mankind for 5 months. Also there are 2 more woes coming, although these don't proceed directly out of the Pit/Abyss like the first.

    I think God used the word bottomless to symbolize finality. If one was to stumble down a bottomless pit they obviously would not be coming back out, unless God reached down there and pulled them out.

    for the most part the book of revelation is highly symbolic , so it is not a literal pit , the same way that the locusts are not real locusts, but those locusts are certainly good at stripping things down , and exposing things in a big way , and they have been given authority to do that, it is interesting that a locusts life span is five months, so those locusts are stripping things down all of their life .

    so the question is ...........who are the locusts? one thing is for sure, they are doing a good job

    thats because they have a king over them, and it mentions it in verse 11

    They have over them a king, the angel of the abyss. In Hebrew his name is A·bad′don, but in Greek he has the name A·pol′lyon.revelation 9;11

    i though it was interesting that this name A·pol′lyon can also mean destroyer, and when we think about JESUS he is out to destroy Gods enemies , so the one over the locusts is JESUS , and those locusts must be doing his will, also he has the key in his hand ,and JESUS has the key in his hand also in

    revelation 20;1

    And I saw an angel coming down out of heaven with the key of the abyss and a great chain in his hand.

  4. #34

    Re: Is there a literal bottomless pit?

    I don't believe the angel with the key is Christ, I believe Rev 20:1 to be the last part of a day of atonement
    ceramony, where a fit man from the congragetion drives out the scape goat. So it would be an angel
    that binds and drives out the devil, after Christ the High Priest had transferred all the sins of all
    the believers and all of the congragetion of Israel that He had taken onto Himself onto the scapegoat
    the devil. So that Christ can rid Himself of the stain of sin that He now carries as can be seen when
    He returns in a vesture dipped in blood Rev 19:13, which He has to do if He and the Father are to
    be as close as they once were.
    And once again the bottomless pit if at the center of the earth is truely bottomless, because if at the center
    everyway you move is up, there is no down therefore NO BOTTOM !!

  5. #35
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    Re: Is there a literal bottomless pit?

    Quote Originally Posted by MEE View Post
    for the most part the book of revelation is highly symbolic , so it is not a literal pit , the same way that the locusts are not real locusts, but those locusts are certainly good at stripping things down , and exposing things in a big way , and they have been given authority to do that, it is interesting that a locusts life span is five months, so those locusts are stripping things down all of their life .

    so the question is ...........who are the locusts? one thing is for sure, they are doing a good job

    thats because they have a king over them, and it mentions it in verse 11

    They have over them a king, the angel of the abyss. In Hebrew his name is A·bad′don, but in Greek he has the name A·pol′lyon.revelation 9;11

    i though it was interesting that this name A·pol′lyon can also mean destroyer, and when we think about JESUS he is out to destroy Gods enemies , so the one over the locusts is JESUS , and those locusts must be doing his will, also he has the key in his hand ,and JESUS has the key in his hand also in

    revelation 20;1

    And I saw an angel coming down out of heaven with the key of the abyss and a great chain in his hand.
    Yes there are symbolic parts, they are visions. Visions generally have a lot of symbolism attached to them. Yet they have literal applications in our physical world. But even with the symbolism you are trying to connect verses together that don't belong together; such as equating Apollyon with Jesus. They are not the same. Jesus is never referred to as an angel in the New Testament. He is not a created being. Jesus is the creator. Be careful of attaching things you think have similarities as though they belong and equate to each other.
    "He's wild, you know. Not like a tame lion."
    C.S. Lewis, "The Lion, The Witch and the Wardrobe."

    "Oh, but sometimes the sun stays hidden for years"
    "Sometimes the sky rains night after night, When will it clear?"

    "But our Hope endures the worst of conditions"
    "It's more than our optimism, Let the earth quake"
    "Our Hope is unchanged"

    Emmanuel, God is with us
    El Shaddai, all sufficient
    We never walk alone
    And this is our hope
    "Our Hope Endures" Natalie Grant

  6. #36
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    Re: Is there a literal bottomless pit?

    Quote Originally Posted by allisraelsaved View Post
    I don't believe the angel with the key is Christ, I believe Rev 20:1 to be the last part of a day of atonement
    ceramony, where a fit man from the congragetion drives out the scape goat. So it would be an angel
    that binds and drives out the devil, after Christ the High Priest had transferred all the sins of all
    the believers and all of the congragetion of Israel that He had taken onto Himself onto the scapegoat
    the devil.
    So that Christ can rid Himself of the stain of sin
    Christ doesn't transfer the sin, He paid for it. The basic concept of atonement is one where the innocent i.e. the lamb is made to take the place and receive the punishment due to the guilty one. The innocent is not stained with the sin just pays the price for it. Even the scape goat was innocent where as the devil is not. The guilty (i.e. devil) cannot take the place nor pay the price of sin on behalf of others who are guilty (i.e. man). The idea that Christ transferred the sins he paid for to another is not supported by scripture anywhere. Where did you hear this from?

    that He now carries as can be seen when He returns in a vesture dipped in blood Rev 19:13,
    His vesture is not dipped in our blood nor in His own. When He raised for the dead and appeared to His followers there is no mention of Him having any blood on Him, whether from the nail wounds in His hands nor from the wound in His side. The blood mentioned here is a description of His enemies blood referring to the soon coming destruction of his enemies.

    which He has to do if He and the Father are to be as close as they once were.
    Mark 16:19 "So then, when the Lord Jesus had spoken to them, He was received up into heaven and sat down at the right hand of God."
    Luke 22:69 "But from now on THE SON OF MAN WILL BE SEATED AT THE RIGHT HAND of the power OF GOD."
    Acts 2:33 "Therefore having been exalted to the right hand of God, and having received from the Father the promise of the Holy Spirit, He has poured forth this which you both see and hear."
    Acts 5:31 "He is the one whom God exalted to His right hand as a Prince and a Savior, to grant repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins."
    Acts 7:55-56 "But being full of the Holy Spirit, he gazed intently into heaven and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing at the right hand of God; and he said, "Behold, I see the heavens opened up and the Son of Man standing at the right hand of God."

    He does not have to do anything to be as close to the Father as He once was. He already is.

    And once again the bottomless pit if at the center of the earth is truely bottomless, because if at the center
    everyway you move is up, there is no down therefore NO BOTTOM !!
    I am open to this idea.
    "He's wild, you know. Not like a tame lion."
    C.S. Lewis, "The Lion, The Witch and the Wardrobe."

    "Oh, but sometimes the sun stays hidden for years"
    "Sometimes the sky rains night after night, When will it clear?"

    "But our Hope endures the worst of conditions"
    "It's more than our optimism, Let the earth quake"
    "Our Hope is unchanged"

    Emmanuel, God is with us
    El Shaddai, all sufficient
    We never walk alone
    And this is our hope
    "Our Hope Endures" Natalie Grant

  7. #37

    Re: Is there a literal bottomless pit?

    Quote Originally Posted by Old man View Post
    Jesus is never referred to as an angel in the New Testament. He is not a created being. Jesus is the creator.


    Maybe that is for another thread

  8. #38
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    Re: Is there a literal bottomless pit?

    Quote Originally Posted by Realist1981 View Post
    The bottomless pit sounds like a blackhole in outerspace or even outerspace in general. Is it not endless?
    To me, bottomless, in this sense, carries the meaning that there is no comfort of security .... for ever just falling away.
    Fenris: "There are two ways to shoot an arrow into a bulls-eye You can shoot the arrow into the bulls-eye or you can shoot the arrow and paint the bulls-eye wherever it hits"

    Romans 12:19 Don't seek revenge ... give place to God's wrath. For it is written "Vengeance belongs to me; I will repay, says the Lord"

    Isa. 30:32
    And every blow of the rod of punishment, which the Lord will lay on him, will be with the music of tambourines and lyres; And in battles, brandishing weapons, He will fight them

    G_d was gracious He has shown favor

    What are you willing to die for? Now live for it!




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