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Thread: Tongues and Prophecy : importance according to scripture

  1. #91
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    Re: Tongues and Prophecy : importance according to scripture

    Quote Originally Posted by Butch5 View Post
    You want me to believe Slug1? Show me the Christian who has the gift of being able to handle poisonous snakes and be bitten with "NO" ill efffects. Show me the Christian who can drink poison with "NO" ill effects. You claim the gifts are active, well, these are two of the gifts that Jesus said would follow those who believe.
    Come on Butch... show me in the scriptures the gift of the Holy Spirit called... handling snakes and drinking poison survival.

    Mark 16:17-18(KJV)
    17And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
    18They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.
    Sorry Butch, this scripture is about BEING LED by God and all this will follow those who are obedient. Not man taking up a challenge to handle snakes and drinking poison.

    Your poison argument is on the face page of every cessationist doctrine imaginable and the challenge to "show me a Christian" isn't aligned with scripture. It's not about... proving anything, it's about GOD PROTECTING those who are out there in the world doing His work and spreading the Gospel. It's about being led in the Holy Spirit and allowing Him to use you, and the signs in the Mark 16 verse, will follow.

    Here is the example we are given to be divided with the Mark 16 scriptures to help us understand that it's not about purposely drinking poison or handling snakes.

    BTW, you are the one who showed me this scripture a long time ago... you need to apply it in alignment with God's truth ("protection") as we see in the scriptures because the Mark scripture isn't about doing shots of poison or handling a snake ON PURPOSE and taking a snake bite for the team and calling out... "SEE, no harm... so THERE"

    Acts 28:3 But when Paul had gathered a bundle of sticks and laid them on the fire, a viper came out because of the heat, and fastened on his hand. 4 So when the natives saw the creature hanging from his hand, they said to one another, “No doubt this man is a murderer, whom, though he has escaped the sea, yet justice does not allow to live.” 5 But he shook off the creature into the fire and suffered no harm. 6 However, they were expecting that he would swell up or suddenly fall down dead. But after they had looked for a long time and saw no harm come to him, they changed their minds and said that he was a god.
    Slug1--out

    ~Does Predestination mean: Once of the devil, Always of the devil?~

    ~Limitations in a Christian’s life are due to limited prayer and limiting obedience~

    ~Forgiveness has nothing to do with forgetting that moment... it's all about freedom FROM that moment.~


    ~Your needs activate God's compassion and faith activates God's power~

    ~Three minutes is a lifetime, if you only have two, too live~


  2. #92
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    Re: Tongues and Prophecy : importance according to scripture

    Quote Originally Posted by Slug1 View Post
    Sorry Butch, this scripture is about BEING LED by God and all this will follow those who are obedient. Not man taking up a challenge to handle snakes and drinking poison.
    It's also key to remember that Jesus spoke in parables. Who did He call snakes? Serpents? What was he referring to when he said that? IMO, the demonic. And what is poison? If He's the Living Water, then what would be the poisoned water? If I was going to spread the gospel around the world, would I not need to be able to deal with the demonic and those that spread the demonic doctrine (i.e. brood of vipers)? And if I was going to preach the Gospel of the Living Water, might I also be exposed to many, many, many poisonous lies that are meant to kill not give life if one "drinks" them? Yet, God says if I am led to do these things, I can handle the brood of vipers, as he did, and their poisons and still preach the gospel purely and not become enslaved or killed by what I am hearing.
    Matt 9:13
    13 "But go and learn what this means: ' I DESIRE COMPASSION,AND NOT SACRIFICE,' for I did not come to call the righteous, but sinners."
    NASU

  3. #93
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    Re: Tongues and Prophecy : importance according to scripture

    Quote Originally Posted by Butch5 View Post
    The 10’s of thousands of them today were not “Given” by Christ. The passage in Ephesians 4 says that Christ literally gave certain men to the church. For instance, Philip was given as an evangelist; the twelve were given as apostles, etc.
    So you don't believe that any evangelists, pastors or teachers that walk the earth today are gifts that Christ literally has given to the church. If Christ has not given them, then they are not in Christ and out of order. I don't understand how that's possible.

  4. #94
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    Re: Tongues and Prophecy : importance according to scripture

    Quote Originally Posted by Brother Mark View Post
    It's also key to remember that Jesus spoke in parables. Who did He call snakes? Serpents? What was he referring to when he said that? IMO, the demonic. And what is poison? If He's the Living Water, then what would be the poisoned water? If I was going to spread the gospel around the world, would I not need to be able to deal with the demonic and those that spread the demonic doctrine (i.e. brood of vipers)? And if I was going to preach the Gospel of the Living Water, might I also be exposed to many, many, many poisonous lies that are meant to kill not give life if one "drinks" them? Yet, God says if I am led to do these things, I can handle the brood of vipers, as he did, and their poisons and still preach the gospel purely and not become enslaved or killed by what I am hearing.
    I fully agree..... also the Pharisee's were an example of "snakes" and the "poison" they spread. They never "affected" Christ, nor any of the many disciples who Christ sent out. You're getting into the between the lines "spiritual" meaning and truth of scriptures that to be seen, spiritual eyes are to be open

    Specially when it comes to the devils forces of wickedness and the demonic.
    Slug1--out

    ~Does Predestination mean: Once of the devil, Always of the devil?~

    ~Limitations in a Christian’s life are due to limited prayer and limiting obedience~

    ~Forgiveness has nothing to do with forgetting that moment... it's all about freedom FROM that moment.~


    ~Your needs activate God's compassion and faith activates God's power~

    ~Three minutes is a lifetime, if you only have two, too live~


  5. #95
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    Re: Tongues and Prophecy : importance according to scripture

    Quote Originally Posted by Slug1 View Post
    Come on Butch... show me in the scriptures the gift of the Holy Spirit called... handling snakes and drinking poison survival.



    Sorry Butch, this scripture is about BEING LED by God and all this will follow those who are obedient. Not man taking up a challenge to handle snakes and drinking poison.

    Your poison argument is on the face page of every cessationist doctrine imaginable and the challenge to "show me a Christian" isn't aligned with scripture. It's not about... proving anything, it's about GOD PROTECTING those who are out there in the world doing His work and spreading the Gospel. It's about being led in the Holy Spirit and allowing Him to use you, and the signs in the Mark 16 verse, will follow.

    Here is the example we are given to be divided with the Mark 16 scriptures to help us understand that it's not about purposely drinking poison or handling snakes.

    BTW, you are the one who showed me this scripture a long time ago... you need to apply it in alignment with God's truth ("protection") as we see in the scriptures because the Mark scripture isn't about doing shots of poison or handling a snake ON PURPOSE and taking a snake bite for the team and calling out... "SEE, no harm... so THERE"

    Acts 28:3 But when Paul had gathered a bundle of sticks and laid them on the fire, a viper came out because of the heat, and fastened on his hand. 4 So when the natives saw the creature hanging from his hand, they said to one another, “No doubt this man is a murderer, whom, though he has escaped the sea, yet justice does not allow to live.” 5 But he shook off the creature into the fire and suffered no harm. 6 However, they were expecting that he would swell up or suddenly fall down dead. But after they had looked for a long time and saw no harm come to him, they changed their minds and said that he was a god.
    So there you go Slug1, Only the gifts that you guys want can be witnessed. Whether intentional or not you can't show evidence of these gifts. So, you have to say only the gifts (subjective) that you guys want can be seen. Thanks Slug1

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    Re: Tongues and Prophecy : importance according to scripture

    Quote Originally Posted by Luciano Vinci View Post
    So you don't believe that any evangelists, pastors or teachers that walk the earth today are gifts that Christ literally has given to the church. If Christ has not given them, then they are not in Christ and out of order. I don't understand how that's possible.
    No, none of those walking around today were sent by Christ. However, being in Christ is a different story. One is "In Christ" by believing and being baptized.

  7. #97
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    Re: Tongues and Prophecy : importance according to scripture

    Quote Originally Posted by Brother Mark View Post
    It's also key to remember that Jesus spoke in parables. Who did He call snakes? Serpents? What was he referring to when he said that? IMO, the demonic. And what is poison? If He's the Living Water, then what would be the poisoned water? If I was going to spread the gospel around the world, would I not need to be able to deal with the demonic and those that spread the demonic doctrine (i.e. brood of vipers)? And if I was going to preach the Gospel of the Living Water, might I also be exposed to many, many, many poisonous lies that are meant to kill not give life if one "drinks" them? Yet, God says if I am led to do these things, I can handle the brood of vipers, as he did, and their poisons and still preach the gospel purely and not become enslaved or killed by what I am hearing.
    Well, if the serpents and the poison aren't literal, wouldn't that mean, healing, tongues, prophecy and the rest aren't literal either? If so, what would they represent and why do so many Christians claim them as literal. I mean when Christians claim to speak in tongues real words come out of their mouths. When they claim to heal it is real people they are trying to heal.

  8. #98
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    Re: Tongues and Prophecy : importance according to scripture

    Quote Originally Posted by Butch5 View Post
    Well, if the serpents and the poison aren't literal, wouldn't that mean, healing, tongues, prophecy and the rest aren't literal either? If so, what would they represent and why do so many Christians claim them as literal. I mean when Christians claim to speak in tongues real words come out of their mouths. When they claim to heal it is real people they are trying to heal.
    All we need to do is go back through scripture and see when they are literal or not. Did Paul refer to literal words? Yes. Did Jesus refer to literal snakes in the gospel or did he refer to people and their "father"?
    Matt 9:13
    13 "But go and learn what this means: ' I DESIRE COMPASSION,AND NOT SACRIFICE,' for I did not come to call the righteous, but sinners."
    NASU

  9. #99
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    Re: Tongues and Prophecy : importance according to scripture

    Quote Originally Posted by Butch5 View Post
    No, none of those walking around today were sent by Christ. However, being in Christ is a different story. One is "In Christ" by believing and being baptized.
    How were Stephan and Phillip sent by Christ (neither met Christ), and not the Rev. Joe Schmo down the street from my house. Has the Holy Spirit which chose them, no longer choosing out for Himself evangelists, pastors, teachers anymore?

  10. #100
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    Re: Tongues and Prophecy : importance according to scripture

    Quote Originally Posted by Luciano Vinci View Post
    How were Stephan and Phillip sent by Christ (neither met Christ), and not the Rev. Joe Schmo down the street from my house. Has the Holy Spirit which chose them, no longer choosing out for Himself evangelists, pastors, teachers anymore?
    I would also mention Silas who was a prophet! Or what of Barnabas who was an apostle!
    Matt 9:13
    13 "But go and learn what this means: ' I DESIRE COMPASSION,AND NOT SACRIFICE,' for I did not come to call the righteous, but sinners."
    NASU

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