Self Defense~Is it sin?

[ClayInHisHands]

If one of them broke into my home to rob, rape or some other unknown crime, it would not be murder to kill them.

It would be murder if the intent of your heart was to SPECIFICALLY END THEIR LIFE.

I'm sorry, but imo, if the goal is not to first try and stop the person(s) but to simply be cocky about it and puff our chests out and say, I'm gonna blow this suckers head off....then I feel their heart may indeed be suspect. I don't think self defense is a sin, but self defense is a sin if your primary goal is to end that person(s) life and then ask questions would be.


I understand the argument that in the heat of the moment you don't know what you'll do, but we could argue about that in any situation in our lives and how we react.

[ewq1938]

It would be murder if the intent of your heart was to SPECIFICALLY END THEIR LIFE.

You can kill a person in self defense without it being murder.

I'm sorry, but imo, if the goal is not to first try and stop the person(s) but to simply be cocky about it and puff our chests out and say, I'm gonna blow this suckers head off....then I feel their heart may indeed be suspect. I don't think self defense is a sin, but self defense is a sin if your primary goal is to end that person(s) life and then ask questions would be.

Go ahead and try to stop someone, you will likely end up dead trying.

[Slug1]

It would be murder if the intent of your heart was to SPECIFICALLY END THEIR LIFE.

I'm sorry, but imo, if the goal is not to first try and stop the person(s) but to simply be cocky about it and puff our chests out and say, I'm gonna blow this suckers head off....then I feel their heart may indeed be suspect. I don't think self defense is a sin, but self defense is a sin if your primary goal is to end that person(s) life and then ask questions would be.


I understand the argument that in the heat of the moment you don't know what you'll do, but we could argue about that in any situation in our lives and how we react.

I have to disagree. If a person comes into my house and I declare that I am armed with a firearm and they don't leave and then they hear the chambering of a 00Buck shotgun shell into a magnum pump shotgun... BTW, that is VERY LOUD in a quiet home. If they don't leave and I hear them continuing to approach the area of the home where the family is sleeping, despite the verbal warning and despite hearing the shell, then they mean harm. I'm not gonna shoot to warn them, I'm not gonna shoot to scare them, I'm not gonna shoot to wound them... they are getting the round put into their chest which is exactly where 21+ years of combat training has enabled me to put the shot. If I was using a pistol or an M4, then there would be two shots, one in the face and one in the chest or two in the chest only based on clarity for the shots.

[ClayInHisHands]

Well there you have it. I'm not going to argue. I don't think self defense is a sin. But when you are premediating in your thoughts how you would approach a person and shoot them in the face and chest, come on, that sounds like vengeance as a result of pride may be the scent in the air. I respect you Slug, but I am suspect of this line of thinking. I don't know what else to say.

[Slug1]

Well there you have it. I'm not going to argue. I don't think self defense is a sin. But when you are premediating in your thoughts how you widapproach a person a shoot them in the face annd chest, come on, that sounds like vengeance as a result of pride may be the scent in the air. I respect you Slug, but I am suspect of this line of thinking. I don't know what else to say.

Well, know this... this line of thinking keeps the innocent alive and the evil doers, dead.

It's not vengeance, it's the end result of continuing to approach a person who has warned them twice that they are armed and then proved it. Their choice... not mine. If they don't want to be on the receiving end of a shotgun, then they can back off and leave or give up so I can call them into the police.

[Butch5]

I have to disagree. If a person comes into my house and I declare that I am armed with a firearm and they don't leave and then they hear the chambering of a 00Buck shotgun shell into a magnum pump shotgun... BTW, that is VERY LOUD in a quiet home. If they don't leave and I hear them continuing to approach the area of the home where the family is sleeping, despite the verbal warning and despite hearing the shell, then they mean harm. I'm not gonna shoot to warn them, I'm not gonna shoot to scare them, I'm not gonna shoot to wound them... they are getting the round put into their chest which is exactly where 21+ years of combat training has enabled me to put the shot. If I was using a pistol or an M4, then there would be two shots, one in the face and one in the chest or two in the chest only based on clarity for the shots.

It's this reasoning Slug1 that made me reject about your argument on the gifts.

[Slug1]

It's this reasoning Slug1 that made me forget about your argument on the gifts.

Hooah... your post don't change the Bible and how it says only murder is a sin and is evil... not killing. I don't argue, I post the scriptures and point out what God is saying. If anyone don't agree with the scriptures because they have another interpretation of scriptures to fit what they want... that's on them and I don't argue. I just keep posting the scriptures and I keep pointing out what God is saying and many say that this is "arguing"... it's not at all. Many times no interpretation is needed, just read the scriptures and either accept them or not. Many prefer their doctrines they've come to accept over the scriptures so "they" argue. The more I post the scriptures, the MORE they argue. Scripture don't get old nor change, doctrine and the arguments based on doctrine... does get old.

[Butch5]

Hooah... your post don't change the Bible and how it says only murder is a sin and is evil... not killing.

It's not an excuse Slug1, I just know that that is not the attitude of the Holy Spirit.

[Butch5]

Hooah... your post don't change the Bible and how it says only murder is a sin and is evil... not killing.

You might want to check that.

[Slug1]

You might want to check that.

I have... "thou shalt not murder". One of the very Ten Commandments.

[Slug1]

It's not an excuse Slug1, I just know that that is not the attitude of the Holy Spirit.

The Holy Spirit inspired the Bible, the Bible does not say killing is a sin... so how can you say that such an attitude is not of the Holy Spirit?

Butch, you have a personal INTERPRETATION that killing is sinful and evil... if it was, then God is sinful and evil. He's killed, is killing, and will kill. He's done this ALL throughout the Bible either directly by His own hand or through vessels, from Genesis through The Revelation. Either a person accepts that, or they don't. The only way a person don't accept that is by holding to a doctrine that say differently than what the Bible says.

[Butch5]

I have... "thou shalt not murder". One of the very Ten Commandments.

It's funny how you only choose that one word out of the definition.

[ewq1938]

It's funny how you only choose that one word out of the definition.

He isn't. The word there means murder specifically, not kill. God ordered man to kill certain criminals so naturally God isn't going to say don't kill, then say kill at other times.

[Slug1]

It's funny how you only choose that one word out of the definition.

Like I said... you have chosen a doctrine over the scriptures so you will continue to ARGUE against God's Holy Word.

Yes, I have put emphasis on that one word because God PUT THAT WORD in that commandment so we know what He's talking about. He's not talking about "killing", He's talking about murdering. You can either accept the Word of God, or you can continue to NOT accept the Word of God and stick to your doctrine. Your choice Butch... either way, I will continue to post the scripture and because you don't accept the scripture, you will continue to argue against the Word of God.

You're not arguing against me, I only post the scriptures and point out the error of your doctrine with the scriptures God has given us to correct error.

Your choice bro... either stop saying the scripture is wrong and your doctrine is right, or read the verse that says, MURDER is NOT to be done and accept God's Word.

[Butch5]

The Holy Spirit inspired the Bible, the Bible does not say killing is a sin... so how can you say that such an attitude is not of the Holy Spirit?

Butch, you have a personal INTERPRETATION that killing is sinful and evil... if it was, then God is sinful and evil. He's killed, is killing, and will kill. He's done this ALL throughout the Bible either directly by His own hand or through vessels, from Genesis through The Revelation. Either a person accepts that, or they don't. The only way a person don't accept that is by holding to a doctrine that say differently than what the Bible says.

It's not I who has the doctrine that is different from the Bible. If is was I'm sure one of you guys would have presented a passage of Scripture from the Law of Liberty that states it's OK to kill. However, here we at page 15 of this thread and all you guys have presented is arguments from the Law of Moses. Are you also going to seek justification and salvation from the Law of Moses? I'm sorry Slug1 but you can't live under both Laws and choose the aspects you like from each. Paul told the Galatians if that if they put themselves under the Law the were fallen from grace. I guess if you want to become a proselyte to Judaism you could put yourself under the Law and then you could use the Mosaic Law to justify your argument.