OSAS Question

[Slug1]

If this doctrine was accurate in that a person's belief in Christ is SECURE... then why is God giving this warning?

2 Peter 3:¹⁷ You therefore, beloved, since you know this beforehand, beware lest you also fall from your own steadfastness, being led away with the error of the wicked;

[Redeemed by Grace]

They are belief [faith] which then yields: Walk [Obedience, Learning, Growing]; and Examination [Warnings, Challenges]. They are not tripartite in being saved, but walk and examination confirm one's beliefs.

Faith happens when the wisdom of hearing the Gospel clicks within the recipient's heart and is the birth of the believer.... How many times have each of us heard the gospel and said how nice, until that one time we heard it and it was like something we never heard nor understood before... The Ah Ha moment of Faith realized. Now the reading of the bible and with the indwelling of the Holy Spirit -- becomes our GPS so to speak, for it now gives us a purposeful destination, full of instruction and correction to keep on the Path. Faith comes [by hearing the Gospel] once and is complete. Walking and warnings and testing confirm or refute the metal of the foundation of our faith. Faith can be from God.... Or Faith can be from Self.... Thus with the bible 1) proclaims the Gospel 2) gives instruction to those who now have faith and 2) test and challenge individually to make sure we are what we say we are.

2 Peter 1:5 Now for this very reason also, applying all diligence, in your faith supply moral excellence, and in your moral excellence, knowledge, 6 and in your knowledge, self- control, and in your self- control, perseverance, and in your perseverance, godliness, 7 and in your godliness, brotherly kindness, and in your brotherly kindness, love. 8 For if these qualities are yours and are increasing, they render you neither useless nor unfruitful in the true knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. 9 For he who lacks these qualities is blind or short- sighted, having forgotten his purification from his former sins. 10 Therefore, brethren, be all the more diligent to make certain about His calling and choosing you; for as long as you practice these things, you will never stumble; 11 for in this way the entrance into the eternal kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ will be abundantly supplied to you

[quiet dove]

Imho, the context is regarding the false teachings that were already arising regarding the returning of the Lord. Peter exhorts these believers to remain steadfast in the truths they have been taught regarding Christ Second Advent.

Just because He has not returned yet doesn't me He isn't going to...He is And they were to stand steadfast in the truth they had been taught regarding that He would return

[Redeemed by Grace]

Imho, the context is regarding the false teachings that were already arising regarding the returning of the Lord. Peter exhorts these believers to remain steadfast in the truths they have been taught regarding Christ Second Advent.

Just because He has not returned yet doesn't me He isn't going to...He is And they were to stand steadfast in the truth they had been taught regarding that He would return

Good contextual observation QD! Amen.

[Slug1]

If this doctrine was accurate in that a person's belief in Christ is SECURE... then why is God giving this warning?

James 5:19 Brethren, if anyone among you wanders from the truth, and someone turns him back, 20 let him know that he who turns a sinner from the error of his way will save a soul[f] from death and cover a multitude of sins.

[Saved7]

Funny that you posted about this.: I was thinking about this last night. There are so many warnings to us to continue in faith. Not to mention all those who were mentioned as having turned away or loving the world more. Or what about the GREAT FALLING AWAY? You can't fall away from something that you weren't a part of.

[quiet dove]

If this doctrine was accurate in that a person's belief in Christ is SECURE... then why is God giving this warning?

James 5:19 Brethren, if anyone among you wanders from the truth, and someone turns him back, 20 let him know that he who turns a sinner from the error of his way will save a soul[f] from death and cover a multitude of sins.

Please clarify what you mean by "loose" salvation. If that is what you are trying to prove is possible.

First, clarifying what one who has salvation is... we have:

-A person who has believed the Gospel of Jesus Christ-his life, death, and resurrection
-ask Him into their heart, repenting of their sinfulness and accepted Christ-giving themselves to Him
-cleansed from their sins, by the atoning blood of the Lamb
-is now alive in Christ Jesus, born again
-thus indwelt by the Spirit
-and is a new creature in Christ Jesus having eternal life in Christ

.... would that define saved?

--------------------------------------------------

In reverse then, loosing salvation would mean:

-choosing to no longer, or that one no longer believe/s, (recant their acceptance and belief)
and thus being:
-removed and no longer in Christ Jesus
-there sins back upon them and no longer cleansed, the atoning blood of the Lamb removed and the sins back as they were not ever cleansed
-the Spirit removing Himself from indwelling that person...that person no longer being sealed
-that person going from born again alive in Christ to dead again
-that person going from the new creature they were made in Christ back to the old creature they were


....Does that define loosing salvation?

And if so, what can cause this to happen...in a nut shell...sin, inaccurate understandings of doctrine(any or just certain ones)...stop believing the Gospel of Christ??

[Redeemed by Grace]

If this doctrine was accurate in that a person's belief in Christ is SECURE... then why is God giving this warning?

James 5:19 Brethren, if anyone among you wanders from the truth, and someone turns him back, 20 let him know that he who turns a sinner from the error of his way will save a soul[f] from death and cover a multitude of sins.

Gold always need to be tested.... There is no place within the NT that Christians are referred to as sinners... It doesn't say that he who turns a brother in the faith from the error of his way, but states that he who turns a "SINNER" from the error of his way..... so James is saying that within the that very early church, there may be those who are still sinners amongst them... and if they turn from their sins, then now they are amongst the faithful.

Of a true Christian: Belief [faith] which then yields: Walk [Obedience, Learning, Growing]; and Examination [Warnings, Challenges]. They are not tripartite in being saved, but walk and examination confirm one's beliefs.

[PJW]

So faith without the walk, (sinning), is a false faith. I agree. There are no sinners in Christ's body. "For we are members of His body, of His flesh, and of His bones. (Eph 5:30)

[Slug1]

If this doctrine was accurate in that a person's belief in Christ is SECURE... then why is God giving this warning?

Matthew 24:⁹ “Then they will deliver you up to tribulation and kill you, and you will be hated by all nations for My name’s sake. ¹⁰ And then many will be offended, will betray one another, and will hate one another. ¹¹ Then many false prophets will rise up and deceive many. ¹² And because lawlessness will abound, the love of many will grow cold. ¹³ But he who endures to the end shall be saved.

[Redeemed by Grace]

If this doctrine was accurate in that a person's belief in Christ is SECURE... then why is God giving this warning?

Matthew 24:⁹ “Then they will deliver you up to tribulation and kill you, and you will be hated by all nations for My name’s sake. ¹⁰ And then many will be offended, will betray one another, and will hate one another. ¹¹ Then many false prophets will rise up and deceive many. ¹² And because lawlessness will abound, the love of many will grow cold. ¹³ But he who endures to the end shall be saved.

This is written to a specific generation who will be alive at the time that will enter into the End Times, for which there will be great persecution and even death for faith in Jesus... But if you are the one who survives all this, your earthly life is saved and will enter the kingdom of God.

[Caleb]

If this doctrine was accurate in that a person's belief in Christ is SECURE... then why is God giving this warning?

James 5:19 Brethren, if anyone among you wanders from the truth, and someone turns him back, 20 let him know that he who turns a sinner from the error of his way will save a soul[f] from death and cover a multitude of sins.

Can I ask, If you believe that someone who has wondered from the truth, has somehow lost their salvation, can they (by coming back) be born again a second time or even several times?

[Caleb]

If this doctrine was accurate in that a person's belief in Christ is SECURE... then why is God giving this warning?

Matthew 24:⁹ “Then they will deliver you up to tribulation and kill you, and you will be hated by all nations for My name’s sake. ¹⁰ And then many will be offended, will betray one another, and will hate one another. ¹¹ Then many false prophets will rise up and deceive many. ¹² And because lawlessness will abound, the love of many will grow cold. ¹³ But he who endures to the end shall be saved.

The passage speaks of persecution and tribulation.

Paul says that nothing shall separate us from His love. Not even persecution nor tribulation, nor life nor death.

Again I would like to point out that Paul does not say 'who can separate God's love from us' because that is without question impossible. If it were possible that we could stop God from loving us, or separate His love from us, then we would be His god, because we have changed Him.

So, who or what can separate 'us' from His love?
Unless you think Paul was somewhat misguided in his persuasions, then the answer is nothing and no one!

Do you believe he got it wrong?
Do you know something that Paul did not know?

[PJW]

God has always loved us, but those who sin are separate from Him, There is no sin in God's kingdom.
You can't be alive in Christ and dead in tresspasses and sin at the same time.
Those who obey their lusts (servants of sin, Jo 8:34) instead of God have promoted themselves to a higher status than God. That's idolatry.

[RollTide21]

God has always loved us, but those who sin are separate from Him, There is no sin in God's kingdom.
You can't be alive in Christ and dead in tresspasses and sin at the same time.
Those who obey their lusts (servants of sin, Jo 8:34) instead of God have promoted themselves to a higher status than God. That's idolatry.

So...what is your position regarding whether or not we can lose our salvation?