OSAS Question

[Slug1]

If this doctrine was accurate in that a person's belief in Christ is SECURE... then why is God giving this warning?

Colossians 1:23 if indeed you continue in the faith, grounded and steadfast, and are not moved away from the hope of the gospel which you heard, which was preached to every creature under heaven, of which I, Paul, became a minister.

[Caleb]

If this doctrine was accurate in that a person's belief in Christ is SECURE... then why is God giving this warning?

Colossians 1:23 if indeed you continue in the faith, grounded and steadfast, and are not moved away from the hope of the gospel which you heard, which was preached to every creature under heaven, of which I, Paul, became a minister.

It is about how we might be presented by the Lord:

Col 1:22 in the body of His flesh through death, to present you holy, and blameless, and above reproach before Him--

IF indeed you continue in the faith, grounded and steadfast, and are not moved away from the hope of the gospel which you heard.

We 'have been' reconciled in the body of his flesh through death, even while we were still sinners.

[Slug1]

If this doctrine was accurate in that a person's belief in Christ is SECURE... then why is God giving this warning?

Rev 2:5 Remember therefore from where you have fallen; repent and do the first works, or else I will come to you quickly and remove your lampstand from its place—unless you repent.

[Slug1]

If this doctrine was accurate in that a person's belief in Christ is SECURE... then why is God giving this warning?

1 Timothy 3:6 not a novice, lest being puffed up with pride he fall into the same condemnation as the devil.

[Redeemed by Grace]

If this doctrine was accurate in that a person's belief in Christ is SECURE... then why is God giving this warning?

Rev 2:5 Remember therefore from where you have fallen; repent and do the first works, or else I will come to you quickly and remove your lampstand from its place—unless you repent.

Hi Slug,

Your assumption is that everyone votes Republican is a registered Republican, er no..... that every on who lives in the USA is an American, no er...... everyone who drives a Chevy wished it were a Ford... naw.... or everyone who declares that they are a Christian... are.

The Bible is replete of instruction and warnings, and only those who have His Spirit within them will listen and take heed. Your Revelation examples although able to give us a good application in things to do as a Christian, really speak to the time when believing in Jesus will be costly. The churches of this day will have 7 characteristics and there are folks who will come out of those churches tested as believers because they heeded the warnings... And others will be revealed for who they are. The time of judgement is then soon at hand.

Are all republican voters republican? Are all Chevy drivers closet Ford owners? Nope. The titles we give each other and ourselves can be real in representing us, or they can hold degrees of realness, but being in Christ has no degree, for you either are, or you are not... thus the testings, the warnings and instructions.

Thus in example.... to all Christians who say they are Christian: ""Hear ye Hear ye!!!! All who call them selves Christians... Remember therefore from where you were when you first stated you believed... was it real or pretend? If real, I see your practicing of sin..... repent!!!! Or if you stay as you are, then you will suffer as though you were never a believer... You have been warned and stand without excuse!"" To those who have ears to hear, they will examine themselves and apply and take all action needed... Those who don't have ears to hear will say... naw... and fall away.

[Reynolds357]

If this doctrine was accurate in that a person's belief in Christ is SECURE... then why is God giving this warning?

1 Timothy 3:6 not a novice, lest being puffed up with pride he fall into the same condemnation as the devil.

What exactly do you believe about salvation?
We can lose it and re-gain it?
We can lose it one time and never again be saved?

[Slug1]

If this doctrine was accurate in that a person's belief in Christ is SECURE... then why is God giving this warning?

1 Timothy 4:1 Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons,

[Redeemed by Grace]

If this doctrine was accurate in that a person's belief in Christ is SECURE... then why is God giving this warning?

1 Timothy 4:1 Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons,

Yep... the great apostasy of the end times... Think about this for a second... is there any difference between steel made in the US and steel made, er let's say China? If you say steel is steel, it doesn't matter where it's made, then your position of all faith is the same and thus makes sense as why you still hold this position. However, when steel is put under test to find it's tensile strength, as to what it will be used, then may folks will say no... that steel is too weak... we need the strongest steel for our products.

Now notice 1 Timothy is not declaring that these folks are of the elect who will depart, but of folks who say there are Christians -- but when tested found not to be made of the same metal of a true Christian. Think of the easy believerism moment that is happening today... It may be the basis of a future falling away. We will see.

[Slug1]

If this doctrine was accurate in that a person's belief in Christ is SECURE... then why is God giving this warning?

Hebrews 3:6 but Christ as a Son over His own house, whose house we are if we hold fast the confidence and the rejoicing of the hope firm to the end.

[Redeemed by Grace]

Hebrews 3:1 Therefore, holy brethren, partakers of a heavenly calling, consider Jesus, the Apostle and High Priest of our confession;

Here the writer of Hebrews, writing to a Hebrew audience is presenting the Gospel once again. ‘Consider Jesus… ‘being defined here as being the Apostle AND to the Jewish faith… the ultimate High priest.

Hebrews 3:2 He was faithful to Him who appointed Him, as Moses also was in all His house. 3 For He has been counted worthy of more glory than Moses, by just so much as the builder of the house has more honor than the house. 4 For every house is built by someone, but the builder of all things is God. 5 Now Moses was faithful in all His house as a servant, for a testimony of those things which were to be spoken later;

Here the writer is trying Jesus back to God and positioning Jesus as being superior to Moses, setting the stage to show the history of the Jewish faith cultivating in the divine works of Jesus Christ. Jesus is of God, Moses is just God’s servant.

Now to Verse 6.

6 but Christ was faithful as a Son over His house--whose house we are, if we hold fast our confidence and the boast of our hope firm until the end.

The writer is positioning Jesus as the head of the Jewish faith, but more so as the Son of God over the house of Israel and Judah and is the Christ, their messiah. Remembering the writer is writing to a Hebrew audience as a Hebrew himself, whereas building from the foundation of Hebrew history and traditions. So the Gospel of Jesus is being presented from a historic Jewish view, in the hopes that they understand and repent, moving from Judaism to faith in Jesus…. that Jesus is better than Moses and that Jesus is the Christ, and that Jesus is the Son of God.

7 Therefore, just as the Holy Spirit says,
"TODAY IF YOU HEAR HIS VOICE, 8 DO NOT HARDEN YOUR HEARTS AS WHEN THEY PROVOKED ME,
AS IN THE DAY OF TRIAL IN THE WILDERNESS, 9 WHERE YOUR FATHERS TRIED Me BY TESTING Me,
AND SAW MY WORKS FOR FORTY YEARS. 10 "THEREFORE I WAS ANGRY WITH THIS GENERATION,
AND SAID, 'THEY ALWAYS GO ASTRAY IN THEIR HEART,
AND THEY DID NOT KNOW MY WAYS'; 11 AS I SWORE IN MY WRATH,
'THEY SHALL NOT ENTER MY REST.'" 12 Take care, brethren, that there not be in any one of you an evil, unbelieving heart that falls away from the living God.


Verse 12 uses brethren not as those who believe, but to those who are ethnic Jews… and towards those Jews who may believe only by their lips --- at this point…. Thus the need for the warning as well as the preaching Christ to them.

So how does verse 6 apply to believers of today… I think verse 6 points to verse 12. For we know a true Christian has a changed heart. Thus verse 12 calls out to those who have an evil, unbelieving heart…. yet declare they believe. If your heart is not changed [v7] then you still have a hardened evil heart and you will fall away from your own proclamation of faith. It’s those hearts that will fall away… So the application again is, what is the metal of one’s faith? And that is what the writer continues to declare as seen in....

Hebrews 3:13 But encourage one another day after day, as long as it is still called "Today," so that none of you will be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin.

[Caleb]

If this doctrine was accurate in that a person's belief in Christ is SECURE... then why is God giving this warning?

Hebrews 3:6 but Christ as a Son over His own house, whose house we are if we hold fast the confidence and the rejoicing of the hope firm to the end.

Who’s HOUSE 'WE' are.

Are you or I the house or part of the house?

If some in the house don’t hold fast the hope, does the whole house lose salvation?

[Slug1]

If this doctrine was accurate in that a person's belief in Christ is SECURE... then why is God giving this warning?

2 Peter 2:20 For if, after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the latter end is worse for them than the beginning.

[Redeemed by Grace]

2 Peter 2:1 But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will also be false teachers among you, who will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing swift destruction upon themselves. 2 Many will follow their sensuality, and because of them the way of the truth will be maligned; 3 and in their greed they will exploit you with false words; their judgment from long ago is not idle, and their destruction is not asleep.

9 then the Lord knows how to rescue the godly from temptation, and to keep the unrighteous under punishment for the day of judgment,

2 Pet 2:12 But these, like unreasoning animals, born as creatures of instinct to be captured and killed, reviling where they have no knowledge, will in the destruction of those creatures also be destroyed, 13 suffering wrong as the wages of doing wrong. They count it a pleasure to revel in the daytime. They are stains and blemishes, reveling in their deceptions, as they carouse with you, 14 having eyes full of adultery that never cease from sin, enticing unstable souls, having a heart trained in greed, accursed children; 15 forsaking the right way, they have gone astray, having followed the way of Balaam, the son of Beor, who loved the wages of unrighteousness; 16 but he received a rebuke for his own transgression, for a mute donkey, speaking with a voice of a man, restrained the madness of the prophet. 17 These are springs without water and mists driven by a storm, for whom the black darkness has been reserved.

18 For speaking out arrogant words of vanity they entice by fleshly desires, by sensuality, those who barely escape from the ones who live in error, 19 promising them freedom while they themselves are slaves of corruption; for by what a man is overcome, by this he is enslaved. 20 For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world by the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and are overcome, the last state has become worse for them than the first. 21 For it would be better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn away from the holy commandment handed on to them. 22 It has happened to them according to the true proverb, "A DOG RETURNS TO ITS OWN VOMIT," and, "A sow, after washing, returns to wallowing in the mire."

Is this not to false prophets and teachers?

[Galatians 2:21]

We don't have any power/ability to save ourselves, correct? If we don't have any power/ability to save ourselves, then how can we have the power/ability to unsave ourselves?


I am persuaded that He is able to keep that which I have committed into His hands against that day. May 24th, 2007, I committed my life unto Him, and He has kept me safe thus far. We don't keep ourselves; we are kept by the power of God.

[Redeemed by Grace]

We don't have any power/ability to save ourselves, correct? If we don't have any power/ability to save ourselves, then how can we have the power/ability to unsave ourselves?


I am persuaded that He is able to keep that which I have committed into His hands against that day. May 24th, 2007, I committed my life unto Him, and He has kept me safe thus far. We don't keep ourselves; we are kept by the power of God.

I share the same testimony. And welcome to the boards...