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Thread: Sinning as a Christian = sinner?

  1. #91

    Re: Sinning as a Christian = sinner?

    Quote Originally Posted by faithfulfriend View Post
    Christians do not commit sin. Those that do commit sin are not saved, but in fact, sinners. Christ came to deliver us FROM sin: Matthew 1:21. I John 3:8 states "He that committeth sin is of the devil...."Pretty simple to me. It doesn't say "He that habitually committeth sin is of the devil" but rather "He that committeth..."
    Christians do not commit sin?How are you doing living your perfect life?

  2. #92

    Re: Sinning as a Christian = sinner?

    Quote Originally Posted by Reynolds357 View Post
    Christians do not commit sin?How are you doing living your perfect life?
    Some on here say they don't but I personally don't believe it. Christ said to even think one of the sins is sinning...seen a nice car you covet lately or maybe a woman you find attractive? Maybe there are some that can go through life after being saved and not sin but I find it difficult to believe.

  3. #93
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    Re: Sinning as a Christian = sinner?

    Quote Originally Posted by DDGresham1 View Post
    Some on here say they don't but I personally don't believe it. Christ said to even think one of the sins is sinning...seen a nice car you covet lately or maybe a woman you find attractive? Maybe there are some that can go through life after being saved and not sin but I find it difficult to believe.
    "He who is WITHOUT SIN cast the first stone"


    Good luck finding anyone to throw that one.
    "You're gonna make a difference when you lay down your life, and in complete submission to God, choose to die with Him in service to other people."
    "Sometimes it concerns me, you know, the number of people that can quote my songs, and-- or they can quote the songs of several different people, but they can't quote the Scriptures."
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xZLFGZ6zpeI
    Rich Mullins

    For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father

  4. #94
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    Re: Sinning as a Christian = sinner?

    Romans 7:15-20 For what I am doing, I do not understand. For what I will to do, that I do not practice; but what I hate, that I do. If, then, I do what I will not to do, I agree with the law that it is good. But now, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me. For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh) nothing good dwells; for to will is present with me, but how to perform what is good I do not find. For the good that I will to do, I do not do; but the evil I will not to do, that I practice. Now if I do what I will not to do, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me.

    Galatians 2:20 I have been crucified with Christ; it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself for me.


    Ol' buddy Paul apparently blamed someone else for whatever he did!!!

    W
    Sunset remembers Eden...sunrise prophesies its return.

  5. #95
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    Re: Sinning as a Christian = sinner?

    Quote Originally Posted by Watchman View Post
    Romans 7:15-20 For what I am doing, I do not understand. For what I will to do, that I do not practice; but what I hate, that I do. If, then, I do what I will not to do, I agree with the law that it is good. But now, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me. For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh) nothing good dwells; for to will is present with me, but how to perform what is good I do not find. For the good that I will to do, I do not do; but the evil I will not to do, that I practice. Now if I do what I will not to do, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me.

    Galatians 2:20 I have been crucified with Christ; it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself for me.


    Ol' buddy Paul apparently blamed someone else for whatever he did!!!

    W

    Alas, the sin hangover of every Christian on this side of glory....
    "Enter by the Narrow Gate...
    Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way...
    ... there are few who find it."


    -----------------------------------------------

    * All Scripture when quoted is taken from:

    The New American Standard Bible®,
    Copyright © 1960, 1962, 1963, 1968, 1971, 1972, 1973,
    1975, 1977, 1995 by The Lockman Foundation
    Used by permission." (www.Lockman.org)

    Italics, bold, color and/or underline are added for emphasis


  6. #96
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    Re: Sinning as a Christian = sinner?

    Quote Originally Posted by Redeemed by Grace View Post
    Alas, the sin hangover of every Christian on this side of glory....
    Excellent expression! Sin hangover...its what's for dinner...and every other meal taken apart from the power of God!
    Sunset remembers Eden...sunrise prophesies its return.

  7. #97
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    Re: Sinning as a Christian = sinner?

    Slug1---Post 89,
    If a person who acted as if he were a Christian, and maybe even had been baptized by me, had turned to sin, we wouldn’t drive him out, but that sin starts (or finishes) a portrait of his life. Never is there 1 sin that shows someone is false. It is a progression of small things that lead to a break with righteousness. If he is false, he won’t stick around to repent. Sinners want the easy way out and generally gravitate to “churches” that foster a climate of “nobody is perfect” , “nobody can serve God the way He wants you to”. “Everybody sins”. “Birds of a feather flock together”. Just as a real Christian won’t stay at a defiled “church”, a sinner won’t stay in a pure church. God won’t allow a man who seeks to please Him to wallow in the filth of corruption. God provides for those who seek Him.
    Longsufferer---Post 90,
    If there are people who say they don’t continually or habitually sin, find out how long they ARE pure. It will turn out to be NEVER. “But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed. Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.” (Ja 1:14-15) There is no accidental sin. Sin is a choice. As for your interp’ of I Jo 1:8, those who cannot say they have no sin are the people from verse 6 “who walk in darkness”. I am of verse 7, one of those who walk in the light, as He is in the light.
    Reynolds357---Post 91,
    A day of my “perfect life” starts with prayer, then reading. Then if I’m out shopping I’ll put a few fliers on some cars as I walk into the store. Then witnessing to folks as God provides opportunities through the day. Then more reading and prayer. Then a little “forum” time to discuss living true to my savior. But my day includes breakfast and lunch and dinner, (Thank God), and taking care of my blood sugar, shopping, reading the newspaper, and doing the puzzles, walking my leash trained cat, and cleaning the house. On weekends I volunteer at a foodbank. This Sunday I’m going to put out 1000 tracts at a NASCAR race, God permitting. I watch TV. Mostly news, but I’m a baseball fan and like other sports as well. I don’t watch sports where the athletes must wear immodest clothes. No swimming or track or gymnastics, etc. Just a normal life, but I make every effort to “abstain from all appearance of evil”. (I Thes 5:22), and, “Make not provision for the flesh, to fulfill the lusts thereof.” (Ro 13:14) My life is full, but it is Jesus’ life, not my own. My goal in life is to let people know that there are people who truly love and obey God. And not only when it is convenient. People who ARE perfect. NON-SINNERS. I’m losing my hair, still getting acne, have diabetes, wear glasses, take blood pressure medicine, can’t remember people’s names, (but I never forget a face). I am leary around big dogs. I have problems with algebra. I am perfect in Christ Jesus. I will die before I offend Jesus who was tortured to death so I could say I am in Christ and my flesh is dead and buried. I am perfect and you can be too.
    ChristianCoffee---Post 93,
    You address an old testament event, when no man could live by the Law of Moses and all the other add on traditions. You can be without sin now. Jesus freed us from the flesh, and lust. “And they that are Christ’s have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.” (Gal 5:24) However a real Christian wouldn’t cast a stone because God said, “Thou shalt not kill”. That “law” is written on my heart and in my mind.
    Watchman---Post 94,
    The past tense part of Romans 7 is summed up in verse 23 where Paul writes, “But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the LAW OF SIN which is in my members.” But in Romans 8:2, Paul writes, “For the LAW OF THE SPIRIT OF LIFE IN CHRIST JESUS hath made me free from THE LAW OF SIN and death. He’s not battling something he’s been freed from, is he?

  8. #98
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    Re: Sinning as a Christian = sinner?

    Quote Originally Posted by PJW View Post
    Slug1---Post 89,
    If a person who acted as if he were a Christian, and maybe even had been baptized by me, had turned to sin, we wouldn’t drive him out, but that sin starts (or finishes) a portrait of his life. Never is there 1 sin that shows someone is false. It is a progression of small things that lead to a break with righteousness. If he is false, he won’t stick around to repent. Sinners want the easy way out and generally gravitate to “churches” that foster a climate of “nobody is perfect” , “nobody can serve God the way He wants you to”. “Everybody sins”. “Birds of a feather flock together”. Just as a real Christian won’t stay at a defiled “church”, a sinner won’t stay in a pure church. God won’t allow a man who seeks to please Him to wallow in the filth of corruption. God provides for those who seek Him.
    While there are those who "act" like Christians... many more ARE Christians who are either not discipled or are discipled but due to a circumstance, have turned to error. When a "Christian" turns to error...TO many in the Body of Christ write them off and say they were "never" truly a Christian. This is a serious problem within the Body of Christ... so great, it's greater then the problem of the Christians who have turned to error.

    If a Christian who has turned to error, leaves what you call a "pure" church (fantasy church in my opinion because no one in such a church would turn to error) it's for two reasons... they were kicked out due to there error, or the church didn't pursue turning them away "from" their error and the church let them leave. Again, that would make the church... not pure, in my opinion.

    Granted such a person who has turned to error can up and leave due to their error (usually embarrassment for having fallen into error) but that don't stop a church from praying and still paying them visits and let them know they are welcome to help and counseling and that they are welcome to attend while they battle.
    Slug1--out

    ~Does Predestination mean: Once of the devil, Always of the devil?~

    ~Limitations in a Christian’s life are due to limited prayer and limiting obedience~

    ~Forgiveness has nothing to do with forgetting that moment... it's all about freedom FROM that moment.~


    ~Your needs activate God's compassion and faith activates God's power~

    ~Three minutes is a lifetime, if you only have two, too live~


  9. #99
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    Re: Sinning as a Christian = sinner?

    I agree....I try hard every day, but I still struggle. But, the fact that I am struggling not to sin( and often slip up) means I love God and want to please Him. Only through His Grace can we change. His blood cleanses us.

  10. #100
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    Re: Sinning as a Christian = sinner?

    Quote Originally Posted by MaryE View Post
    I agree....I try hard every day, but I still struggle. But, the fact that I am struggling not to sin( and often slip up) means I love God and want to please Him. Only through His Grace can we change. His blood cleanses us.
    Hooah, I've been directing a Biblical Recovery Ministry for years now... I know how it is and help is offered through many churches.

    Cept maybe those pure churches who may not believe there is a need for a Biblical Recovery Ministry because "real" Christians don't struggle with sin (according to pure churches).
    Slug1--out

    ~Does Predestination mean: Once of the devil, Always of the devil?~

    ~Limitations in a Christian’s life are due to limited prayer and limiting obedience~

    ~Forgiveness has nothing to do with forgetting that moment... it's all about freedom FROM that moment.~


    ~Your needs activate God's compassion and faith activates God's power~

    ~Three minutes is a lifetime, if you only have two, too live~


  11. #101
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    Re: Sinning as a Christian = sinner?

    Man oh man, I really pig-out at christmas and thanksgiving dinners, an I do mean "really" pig-out too ! (I just made myself hungry)
    Does that mean I am a gluten ?
    Unless I am living/getting out of bed to eat, then no.
    Guess what folks, glutens are on our bibles short list of those who will in no way enter the Kingdom of Heaven, figure that one out.

    I lied of my age just yesterday, does that mean I am a liar ?
    Unless I am living/getting out of bed to lie, or if I am making a daily living or function daily with lies, then no.
    Guess what folks, liars are on our bibles short list of those who will in no way enter the Kingdom of Heaven, figure that one out.

    I killed men when I was in the military, does that mean I am a murderer ?
    Unless I am living/getting out of bed to kill other men with out my government's sanction, or unless I premeditate/lay in wait/set traps to kill them, then no.
    Guess what folks, murderers are on our bibles short list of those who will in no way enter the Kingdom of Heaven, figure that one out.

    Abraham lied to Pharaoh and to Pharaohs's chiefs, but Abraham did not live or function daily by practicing lies.
    David murdered and committed adultery too, but David did not live or function daily by practicing murder and adultery.
    Peter forsook and denied Jesus (Three times in one night), but Peter did not continue living day by day practicing forsaking and denying His Lord, High-Priest and King.

    Saul of Tarsus delivered christains to the Sanhedrin to be flogged, ridiculed and then murdered, and he held the coats for those men while they stoned Steven to death. But Christ chose him Saul to be Paul an apostle. G
    o figure that one out...
    And these examples are our "biblical" patriarchs folks, and the list goes on and on and on and on...

    Could it be that Jesus and His Father know our heart's motives, and we can only assume our heart's motives and our fellows heart's motives ?

    Jesus and His Father both made it extremely clear to me that we all sin still and also that there will not be one righteous man when Christ returns to claim what He redeemed.
    Jesus says that even if we allow a single temptation to enter our mind, we sin !
    His Father says that if a man claims that he has no sin in himself, then that man calls God a liar !



    Father bless those who look to you, but have mercy on all of us to glorify your name.

  12. #102
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    Re: Sinning as a Christian = sinner?

    I have an idea. Why don't you just stop sinning? No one has a gun to your head.
    Jesus came so we could walk in the light, as He is in the light. (I Jo 1:5-6) Jesus said a certain truth would free you from servitude to sin. (Jo 8:32, 34) That truth is THAT YOU CAN BE FREE FROM SIN. If you have an all powerful God that is a consuming fire, one that you owe everything in your life to, don't you think that He would make a way for His children to walk the way He wants? He is coming back for a "pure" church. (Eph 5:27) That church is on earth now, and when Jesus comes back He will find His brothers and sisters obedient, unto death.
    How are you going to spend the rest of your days? Are you going to keep making excuses for your actions or are you going to "man-up" and take the responsibility for your acts that you will be judged for? God demands your love and if you would rather join the millions who have already died in their sins, their idolatry, their hate, then that is your choice. But don't say nobody can be free from sin.

  13. #103
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    Re: Sinning as a Christian = sinner?

    Quote Originally Posted by PJW View Post
    I have an idea. Why don't you just stop sinning? No one has a gun to your head.
    Jesus came so we could walk in the light, as He is in the light. (I Jo 1:5-6) Jesus said a certain truth would free you from servitude to sin. (Jo 8:32, 34) That truth is THAT YOU CAN BE FREE FROM SIN. If you have an all powerful God that is a consuming fire, one that you owe everything in your life to, don't you think that He would make a way for His children to walk the way He wants? He is coming back for a "pure" church. (Eph 5:27) That church is on earth now, and when Jesus comes back He will find His brothers and sisters obedient, unto death.
    How are you going to spend the rest of your days? Are you going to keep making excuses for your actions or are you going to "man-up" and take the responsibility for your acts that you will be judged for? God demands your love and if you would rather join the millions who have already died in their sins, their idolatry, their hate, then that is your choice. But don't say nobody can be free from sin.
    So are you saying that sanctification happens the moment a person accepts Christ?

    Or is it a process that we do through Christ as the Bible shows us?

    Or are you really saying that a person accepts Christ, then the Holy Spirit convicts the person of every single piece of their flesh and their life that is not aligned with God's will and at that instant, they are able to stop ALL that is not in alignment with God's will? They pray and when the prayer of accepting Christ is completed, then they never sin again?

    I understand that a person CAN be sanctified and thus... discipleship is necessary to help people. Like Paul went to the Corinthians and discipled them... otherwise, all those who accepted Christ, would not have lived eternally with God in the end if they had not been discipled and shown how NOT to be sinful.

    Is that how "pure" churches come about... the moment a person struggles, they are let go to fend for themselves and those who don't struggle (or who don't show their struggles) remain in the walls of the church and then they can consider themselves... pure?

    To me, such a church isn't a real church but a bunch of deluded and deceived people standing on top of the pile of sinners pointing their fingers at everyone else below them.
    Slug1--out

    ~Does Predestination mean: Once of the devil, Always of the devil?~

    ~Limitations in a Christian’s life are due to limited prayer and limiting obedience~

    ~Forgiveness has nothing to do with forgetting that moment... it's all about freedom FROM that moment.~


    ~Your needs activate God's compassion and faith activates God's power~

    ~Three minutes is a lifetime, if you only have two, too live~


  14. #104
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    Re: Sinning as a Christian = sinner?

    Sanctify, To make holy, purify, consecrate, hallow, be holy. (Strongs concordance.
    Peter said, "Repent, (turn from, change) and be baptized everyone of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, (wash away your old sins) and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call. (Acts 2:38-39)
    Turn from sin, change to a non-sinner, wash away the sins of the past. That is what separates, sanctifies, us from the earthy that don't love God above all else. This having been accomplished, God will fill you with His Spirit. God does not allow His Spirit to inhabit a defiled "temple". We are the temple of God on earth. (I Co 6:19)
    God has given every person a conscience. Every body knows His will. (Ro 1:19-20) Those that choose disobedience have their own blood on their hands.
    New Christians do need teachers, but no to be told "don't do this or that", for every one of us knows right from wrong. Teachers are made available to us for examples to follow. People who can help us understand scriptures that seem hard to understand. Like 1 John 1:8. We all struggle, but not with sin. That is cut-and-dried. But how we are to dress or wear our hair as a representative of Christ in modern society comes with association to others that love God, and love us. Others may find that they need to switch jobs or cancel subscriptions to worldly periodicals, or button their lips when necessary.
    Pastors and deacons lead by example. A sinner cannot tell a man to quit something if he is doing the same thing. (Ro 2:1)
    Those in a "pure" church are sanctified because they are holy and separate from the lures of this world. If one guy decides he isn't going to believe anymore, we all try to reason with him about his defiance of Christ, but if he leaves, that is on him, not us. That man sought something contrary to the will of God. We have seen men leave and come back, two and three times, and we accept them if they repent, but those people have now all gone away. They manifested their true love, and it wasn't God.
    "Unto the pure all things are pure: but unto them that are defiled and unbelieving is nothing pure; but even their mind and conscience is defiled. They profess that they know God; but in works they deny Him, (sinning), being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good workreprobate. (Titus 1:15-16)
    Oh, and a prayer for accepting Christ is not of the bible: or wouldn't Paul have been cited as using it?

  15. #105

    Re: Sinning as a Christian = sinner?

    Quote Originally Posted by PJW View Post
    Reynolds357---Post 91,
    A day of my “perfect life” starts with prayer, then reading. Then if I’m out shopping I’ll put a few fliers on some cars as I walk into the store. Then witnessing to folks as God provides opportunities through the day. Then more reading and prayer. Then a little “forum” time to discuss living true to my savior. But my day includes breakfast and lunch and dinner, (Thank God), and taking care of my blood sugar, shopping, reading the newspaper, and doing the puzzles, walking my leash trained cat, and cleaning the house. On weekends I volunteer at a foodbank. This Sunday I’m going to put out 1000 tracts at a NASCAR race, God permitting. I watch TV. Mostly news, but I’m a baseball fan and like other sports as well. I don’t watch sports where the athletes must wear immodest clothes. No swimming or track or gymnastics, etc. Just a normal life, but I make every effort to “abstain from all appearance of evil”. (I Thes 5:22), and, “Make not provision for the flesh, to fulfill the lusts thereof.” (Ro 13:14) My life is full, but it is Jesus’ life, not my own. My goal in life is to let people know that there are people who truly love and obey God. And not only when it is convenient. People who ARE perfect. NON-SINNERS. I’m losing my hair, still getting acne, have diabetes, wear glasses, take blood pressure medicine, can’t remember people’s names, (but I never forget a face). I am leary around big dogs. I have problems with algebra. I am perfect in Christ Jesus. I will die before I offend Jesus who was tortured to death so I could say I am in Christ and my flesh is dead and buried. I am perfect and you can be too.
    Jesus taught us how to pray our daily prayer. He said we are to ask our Heavenly Father to "give us this day our daily bread and forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive those who trespass against us" Are you not able to pray this daily prayer?
    Do you miss out the asking out Father in Heaven for forgiveness?

    Jesus went to great lengths to impress upon the disciples the need and importance to forgive (as well as others) a brother who sins against them.
    Why would Jesus do that, if no true brother in Christ would ever sin against another brother in Christ?

    If you believe that a true Christian is perfect and cannot sin, then why do you avoid places of temptations?
    If you are free from the ability to sin, then no amount of temptation will cause you to stumble.

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