Re: God loves all
If scripture made a distinction in the love between the two, then it would be easier. But scripture doesn't teach that God loves elect/non-elect differently.
Originally Posted by keyzer soze
BINGO! If Jesus didn't die for the unelect, then it is a lie to tell them he did! I asked the question earlier but have been gone for several days. I need to go back and see what the answer was.
Totally know why you would say this, this is the very reason that shakes my faith when I attempt to connect all the dots myself, but I believe it is biblically sound to say that God loves all humans at least while they are alive. LOL. I say this because I needed to tackle this concept in a practical way for witnessing to the unsaved because I didn't know how far to take John 3:16. Well I believe I can look at anyone in the eye and say Jesus loves you and died for you.... etc... which I struggled with BEFORE coming to this site.
There are mysteries in scripture for sure! But the love of God is not one of them KS. Scripture speaks clearly on this matter, IMO. He tells us in John 3:16 that he loves the world. He tells us in other places he died for the ungodly. He tells us in 1 John 2 that he paid for the sins of the saved and for the "whole world". He tells us in 1 Cor. 13 that love does not seek it's own. If God created men for the purpose of going to hell so that he could be glorfied, doesn't that make him self seeking? Isn't that a direct contradiction to 1 Cor. 13?
In bold above has been a real eye-opener for me. All I can figure is that God has left mysteries a mystery on purpose and I do believe that if one attempts to reason everything out to their level of understanding they will have to trample of some of God's truths and have problems. I believe we need to humble ourselves and recognize the fact that God's ways/reasons/love/etc... are INFINITELY bigger than us and simply TRUST HIM because that brings Him glory. It seems to be about the only thing we can offer God is our trust.
1 Cor 13:5
5 does not act unbecomingly; it does not seek its own
This is true. At some point, we must leave the mysteries of God as mysteries. My opinion is we take things way too far and create contradictions that we cannot explain and we move the mystery to a place where God did not put it.
A while back when I was reading the bible and deliberating on the OT it hit me that the entire foundation for God's chosen people, Israel, was stemmed around a commandment given by God to KILL a family member.... If I was to turn on the TV today and read how someone killed their child, or attempted to, because God told them to do it, I know what my natural thoughts about that person and act would be..... With God I don't believe He ever intended for us to be able to reason everything out (or at least not someone of my intellect) yet trust in Him regardless.
For instance, God did not make a mystery of whether he loves the lost or the saved the same. Man did. The mystery is in election and those not being elected. Leave it there. Scripture teaches that God loves all. Let God worry about election and non-election.
On a more encouraging note... The story of Abraham offering Isaac is the first mention of love in scripture. It is also the first mention of worship. Both point to Jesus. God does not require anything of us that he himself has not done or will not do. I thank God for that!
Grace to you,
"May the Lamb that was slain receive the just reward for His sufferings." A quote by Moravian missionary that sold himself (along with a friend) into slavery to reach those that the slave owner prevented from hearing the gospel.
May I live for Him and not for me.