Is it better to obey God or the Government?

[Colight]

No where in the bible does He say He did it!

Is God so weak that he can not protect his own house?
Therefore it is LOGICAL that it was GODS will that the temple was cast down and over One million Jews was killed in that siege.
Is God so weak that he would allow prosperity of those who cast down his house and slay his people. It was HIS WILL.

Here you contradict yourself, you first say 'he' did it, then you say ,Rome did it???

Jesus Christ CONTROLS history. Rome was the hammer God used to strike those arrogant Jews.
These men had rejected his son and looked to false teachings as their salvation.
They mocked the truth and followed the lie.

If, I've heard that one before! Are you sitting at God's right hand, and He wispered in your ear that you say this, or is it just what you want to believe, in spite of what Jesus teaches about love, peace, and gentleness?

The mocking tone that you have, shows what is in your heart.
How is mocking a sign of teaching and gentleness?
The pharisee will mock, Christ set about teaching.
Is it the heart of Christ to teach or mock?

Judea had undergone several revolts against Rome.
So the Roman Legions marched in and put a end to the whole mess.
From that they had over a hundred years of peace.

Were you there, or are you presuming they were CHRISTIAN?

A record of the faith of many Romans in their military is on display thru CHRISTS own words.
mat 8
5 And when Jesus entered Capernaum, a centurion came to Him, imploring Him, 6 and saying, “Lord, my servant is lying paralyzed at home, fearfully tormented.”
7 Jesus *said to him, “I will come and heal him.”
8 But the centurion said, “Lord, I am not worthy for You to come under my roof, but just say the word, and my servant will be healed.
9 For I also am a man under authority, with soldiers under me; and I say to this one, ‘Go!’ and he goes, and to another, ‘Come!’ and he comes, and to my slave, ‘Do this!’ and he does it.”
10 Now when Jesus heard this, He marveled and said to those who were following, “Truly I say to you, I have not found such great faith with anyone in Israel.

I am glad you said this. Leaders are ;'..gods servants. used to strike those who do evil.' not the one following the commands of the King.

And by Romans 13. we are called to be in subjection to the leaders God has over us.

As I have tried to point out time and again, God can do it without you Colight,look at Ananias in Acts struck down by God, He does not need little missiles, bombs and automatic weapons to destroy,

Why do you wish to preserve the lives of evil men, who kill attack and oppress?

By the standard you set forth,
When Hitler was marching across the world we should just sit back let him take over our nation and kill our Jewish friends and hope he would eventually fall over from a heart attack.

His mighty arm is far better at doing His will, and then also, only those hand picked get hit, not innocent woman and children and even ones own men, hit in 'friendly fire'.

Jesus Christ controls history..if it they are to die that way. then there is not stopping them. If they are not then they will live.

A Close family member of mine recently put a loaded shotgun to his forehead and pulled the trigger.
The doctors have no way they can explain why the bullets never entered his skull or did other massive damage.
He was out of the hospital in a week.
If God has a reason to keep you alive then even a gunshot to the forehead will not kill you.

Also why is it you act he same God can remove evil leaders with out violence is unable to keep those he wills alive in violence?

If they are killing and they say they are following His commands, well, there are no command in the New Covenant to go and kill!

The killing is thru the governing powers God has established.
Not by us running around and killing as we may.
If we like freedom then we had best support and defend thru MILITARY and POLICE service those powers who support freedom.
Even King David had many philistine subjects who served under him because he was just in rule.
If you do not like the freedom and ways of the American government perhaps you should repatriate to a country that is less warlike and more Christ like , as you see Christ to be.

[Arrow]

If we like freedom then we had best support and defend thru MILITARY and POLICE service those powers who support freedom.

Colite, what i see you saying is you do not trust God at all to bring freedom,as this quote suggests. I don't like the freedom that man brings, only the freedom that God brings. Man brings a shallow and false freedom.

There are people who serve Christ in countries with a terrible government, but the freedom they have in Jesus Christ is far superior to ours in the U.S.A! Why? Because they trust Him and not the government.

[Arrow]

Is God so weak that he can not protect his own house?
.

I think someone else made the point here before, God's temple are people. Is it possible you are still in the Old Testament way of thinking? Maybe that's why you lean toward violence as a means to an end?

[Colight]

I think someone else made the point here before, God's temple are people. Is it possible you are still in the Old Testament way of thinking? Maybe that's why you lean toward violence as a means to an end?

excuse me..
But you are extremely rude

If you had read the context of my post and understood biblical history, you would not make such a charge.

The TEMPLE was the House of God in Israel prior to 70 ad.

You dont just waltz into the temple and tear it down unless it was Gods will for you to do so.

Again it is very rude to come in and toss a personal attack like you just did.

[tea]

The mocking tone that you have, shows what is in your heart.

I am not mocking at all, I am being 100% serious, or how else can anyone anyone support violence in the Name of Jesus when there in no support for this in the New Covenant?

Not only do you seem to hear wisperings, but you seem to be able to read another's heart, or did you get that in a wisper too?

You still have not answered my 4 simple questions I asked you. Go read your post 99 and see.

Here they are again;'

1] Do you believe those who disobey Jesus command as;'people who resist him.'?

2] He didn't strike the whole church did He?'

3] Was Peter in Acts sinning against God by disobeying the government?

4] Are you thus saying that we should go and destroy a city or a nation by force, so that they can experience a blessing from God?

Added

5] Was the New Covenant in opperation in AD 70?

6] Is the New Covenant an important guide and reference for life today?

Jesus Christ controls history..if it they are to die that way. then there is not stopping them. If they are not then they will live.
A Close family member of mine recently put a loaded shotgun to his forehead and pulled the trigger.
The doctors have no way they can explain why the bullets never entered his skull or did other massive damage.
He was out of the hospital in a week.
If God has a reason to keep you alive then even a gunshot to the forehead will not kill you.

7] Are you saying that christians can just go around shooting and God will just protect folk, or what are you saying?

Perhaps let's get over the first questions before we go onto any others, is that ok with you?

[Colight]

I am not mocking at all, I am being 100% serious, or how else can anyone anyone support violence in the Name of Jesus when there in no support for this in the New Covenant?

Unless you are posting under the name of ARROW, that post was not directed at you.
However...
I am sure when one totally ignores Romans 13:1-7 one could come to the conclusion.

4] Are you thus saying that we should go and destroy a city or a nation by force, so that they can experience a blessing from God?

It does not get any more simple than this..

For a Christian (or any other person) to resist government is to resist the One from Whom authority has been granted.
If God has ordained the existence of a government and we disobey it, we resist not only government, but God. For this we will suffer judgment.
So now if our Government declares the need to destroy another country, under the authority given to the ruler by God we are to OBEY his command..

[Colight]

tea

3] Was Peter in Acts sinning against God by disobeying the government?

Perhaps you mis understand Peter,,

1 Peter 2:13-14
13 Submit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake: whether it be to the king, as supreme;
14 Or unto governors, as unto them that are sent by him for the punishment of evildoers, and for the praise of them that do well.

So if the leaders of our country call up a draft to military service, IT IS OUR DUTY AS CHRISTIANS to obey that draft. It is to God that we will obey that order.

[Zack702]

If God says one thing, and the government says another who do we obey.

For example, if the Government says;'Have an obortion.' and God says; 'Do not kill' Whom do you obey?

This goes for all issues of conscience, faith, doctrine, & ethics.

Can someone who knows how, create a poll for me? I am new in here and don't know how to.

Give 2 options in the poll, 1) Obey God, 2) Obey Government.

Thanks

That is a trick question, the same one that they asked Jesus "should we pay or taxes".

There are things that a government should not be doing which they do.

The classic example of this is when Moses was hidden from the Egyptians knowing they demanded to kill all newborn Hebrews.

We should obey the government.

However when the governments orders goes directly against what you know/think is right by God then it is a difficult situation.

[tea]

Unless you are posting under the name of ARROW, that post was not directed at you.
However...

See your post 106, It was addressed to me I wonder if you'll find any humility to say sorry for you mistakes, you seem to like throwing things.

[tea]

Here's the question
3] Was Peter in Acts sinning against God by disobeying the government?

You answer

Perhaps you mis understand Peter,,

1 Peter 2:13-14
13 Submit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake: whether it be to the king, as supreme;
14 Or unto governors, as unto them that are sent by him for the punishment of evildoers, and for the praise of them that do well.

So if the leaders of our country call up a draft to military service, IT IS OUR DUTY AS CHRISTIANS to obey that draft. It is to God that we will obey that order.

To answer you need to say yes, no, or I don't know.

Perhaps you believe that Peter contradicts himself in disobeying the government on one hand, but on the other he obeys.

I obey the government when they say drive on the right side of the road, but when they tell me to kill, or not to preach, I disobey, now, do you think you can answer, or try question 3 again?

You did the same with trying to answer 4]

I asked ;'4] Are you thus saying that we should go and destroy a city or a nation by force, so that they can experience a blessing from God?'

As you can see, you didn't answer. And there are 7 questions.

God bless

[tea]

That is a trick question, the same one that they asked Jesus "should we pay or taxes".

There are things that a government should not be doing which they do.

The classic example of this is when Moses was hidden from the Egyptians knowing they demanded to kill all newborn Hebrews.

We should obey the government.

However when the governments orders goes directly against what you know/think is right by God then it is a difficult situation.

I agree, it is hard sometimes to obey Him. Jesus said;' enter by the narrow way,' it s gonna be tough

[rom826]

Here's the question
3] Was Peter in Acts sinning against God by disobeying the government?

You answer


To answer you need to say yes, no, or I don't know.

Perhaps you believe that Peter contradicts himself in disobeying the government on one hand, but on the other he obeys.

I obey the government when they say drive on the right side of the road, but when they tell me to kill, or not to preach, I disobey, now, do you think you can answer, or try question 3 again?

You did the same with trying to answer 4]

I asked ;'4] Are you thus saying that we should go and destroy a city or a nation by force, so that they can experience a blessing from God?'

As you can see, you didn't answer. And there are 7 questions.

God bless

I am just curious. Are you the military?

[Colight]

Here's the question
3] Was Peter in Acts sinning against God by disobeying the government?

You answer


To answer you need to say yes, no, or I don't know.

Perhaps you believe that Peter contradicts himself in disobeying the government on one hand, but on the other he obeys.

I obey the government when they say drive on the right side of the road, but when they tell me to kill, or not to preach, I disobey, now, do you think you can answer, or try question 3 again?

You did the same with trying to answer 4]

I asked ;'4] Are you thus saying that we should go and destroy a city or a nation by force, so that they can experience a blessing from God?'

As you can see, you didn't answer. And there are 7 questions.

God bless

Does government gets its power from God?
The Bible says it gets its power from God.

If government gets its power from God and the Government calls men to military service then it is GODS will they serve and kill.
To rebel against Gods will is unchristian.

If government gets its power from God and the Government executes a man for some crime.. then it is Gods will that man be executed.
To rebel against Gods will is unchristian.

[episkopos]

Does government gets its power from God?
The Bible says it gets its power from God.

If government gets its power from God and the Government calls men to military service then it is GODS will they serve and kill.
To rebel against Gods will is unchristian.

If government gets its power from God and the Government executes a man for some crime.. then it is Gods will that man be executed.
To rebel against Gods will is unchristian.

This is the exact mindset that made Germany follow Hitler. Gott mit uns (God is with us) was written on the belt buckles of German soldiers in both world wars. Does that make it true?

I was only obeying orders????

[tea]

Colight,
I have asked you 7 questions.[and if anyone else wants to answer, that's fine]. You have not answered even one. Now if you are keen to go ahead, please do go ahead and answer.
They're only one page back.

God bless