Where all of Jesus commands for all the people, all the time, throughout the ages?

[Noeb]

Actually that's not the original scripture. Here's the original

Deu 19:15 One witness shall not rise up against a man for any iniquity, or for any sin, in any sin that he sinneth: at the mouth of two witnesses, or at the mouth of three witnesses, shall the matter be established.
Deu 19:16 If a false witness rise up against any man to testify against him that which is wrong;
Deu 19:17 Then both the men, between whom the controversy is, shall stand before the LORD, before the priests and the judges, which shall be in those days;
Deu 19:18 And the judges shall make diligent inquisition: and, behold, if the witness be a false witness, and hath testified falsely against his brother;
Deu 19:19 Then shall ye do unto him, as he had thought to have done unto his brother: so shalt thou put the evil away from among you.
Deu 19:20 And those which remain shall hear, and fear, and shall henceforth commit no more any such evil among you.
Deu 19:21 And thine eye shall not pity; but life shall go for life, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot.

You have to include the verses that explain the summation of vs19-21. It actually starts before v15.
Where do you see any modification by Jesus to this governing principle?
This is about how government prosecutes the accused and false witness.
Jesus didn't address this at all. He left it alone, you know why?

Mat 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
Mat 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
Mat 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Jesus addressed what was not address when this governing principle is found in scripture. Jesus addressed how the individual behaves.

Mat 5:39 But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.
Mat 5:40 And if any man will sue thee at the law, and take away thy coat, let him have thy cloke also.
Mat 5:41 And whosoever shall compel thee to go a mile, go with him twain.
Mat 5:42 Give to him that asketh thee, and from him that would borrow of thee turn not thou away.

He did not address how government prosecutes the accused and false witness.

[Noeb]

And let me ask you this, does the country you live in do Deu 19:19 and 21?

[dan]

And let me ask you this, does the country you live in do Deu 19:19 and 21?

In 49 of the 50 United States you are the government and have the power to take a life to save a life.

Or, if necessary, to take a life to stop a maiming.

[Noeb]

I notice you didn't have anything to say about post #106.

In 49 of the 50 United States you are the government and have the power to take a life to save a life.

Or, if necessary, to take a life to stop a maiming.

What does this have to do with government taking eye for eye in the law in question? Where's diligent inquisition, witnesses, testimony, in self defense or defense in general?

So again, does the country you live in do Deu 19:19 and 21?

Deu 19:19 Then shall ye do unto him, as he had thought to have done unto his brother

Deu 19:21 And thine eye shall not pity; but life shall go for life, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot.

In what you said, where is the falsely accused having done to him, what he falsely accused his bother of?
If I accuse someone of stealing $2,000, and it is found that I am lying, will the law take $2,000 from me and give it to the one I falsely accused?
If I accuse someone of stealing $2,000, and it is found that I am telling the truth, will the law take just $2,000 from the justly accused and give it to me?

[tea]

Jesus changed it and made it very personal.

written
Ex 21:24 An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth:
So it is impossible that Jesus is changing it.

Mt 5:38 'Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth:
Mt 5:39 But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.'
This was spoken to His disciples very personally, and is for us, very personally, today!

Let's try it again.
Here is the original scripture:
DEUT 19:21 And thine eye shall not pity; [but] life [shall go] for life, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot.
But Jesus said:
MT 5:38 Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth:
MT 5:39 But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.

MT 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

Jesus modified eye for an eye and tooth for a tooth

You may be reading too much into it.

Even Dan agrees with me in this portion I've quoted above, perhaps he has a better way of putting it.

It's clear, it has being changed or modified to use Dan's word.

[tea]

What does this have to do with government taking eye for eye in the law in question?

This is a question for another thread, you have agreed that Jesus was talking to His disciples[in today, it's for us.]Why don't you strat a new thread with this question in it?

[Noeb]

Jesus changed it and made it very personal.

Mt 5:38 'Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth:
Mt 5:39 But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.'
This was spoken to His disciples very personally, and is for us, very personally, today!



Even Dan agrees with me in this portion I've quoted above, perhaps he has a better way of putting it.

It's clear, it has being changed or modified to use Dan's word.

I guess you could start a poll. Most probably agree with you, but that doesn't mean anything. Jesus said he didn't come to change it. How does he turn around and change it sentences later? You still have not addressed this fact.

[Noeb]

This is a question for another thread, you have agreed that Jesus was talking to His disciples[in today, it's for us.]Why don't you strat a new thread with this question in it?

It belongs here because that's what eye for an eye means and will (according to Jesus) til heaven and earth pass, and you contend Jesus did what he said he did not come to do. He didn't change any others, so why do you think he changed this one, after saying he didn't come to change the law? You still have not addressed this fact.

[Noeb]

For those that think I am crazy, take a look at what the JFB Commentary says concerning eye for eye. The other day when I mentioned the JFB was the first time I looked at it concerning this topic. Just now was the second. So I did not get my understanding from the commentary.

Exo 21:22 If men strive, and hurt a woman with child, so that her fruit depart from her, and yet no mischief follow: he shall be surely punished, according as the woman's husband will lay upon him; and he shall pay as the judges determine.
Exo 21:23 And if any mischief follow, then thou shalt give life for life,
Exo 21:24 Eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot,
Exo 21:25 Burning for burning, wound for wound, stripe for stripe.

Exo 21:23-25
eye for eye — The law which authorized retaliation (a principle acted upon by all primitive people) was a civil one. It was given to regulate the procedure of the public magistrate in determining the amount of compensation in every case of injury, but did not encourage feelings of private revenge. The later Jews, however, mistook it for a moral precept, and were corrected by our Lord (Mat_5:38-42).

Lev 24:17 And he that killeth any man shall surely be put to death.
Lev 24:18 And he that killeth a beast shall make it good; beast for beast.
Lev 24:19 And if a man cause a blemish in his neighbour; as he hath done, so shall it be done to him;
Lev 24:20 Breach for breach, eye for eye, tooth for tooth: as he hath caused a blemish in a man, so shall it be done to him again.
Lev 24:21 And he that killeth a beast, he shall restore it: and he that killeth a man, he shall be put to death.
Lev 24:22 Ye shall have one manner of law, as well for the stranger, as for one of your own country: for I am the LORD your God.

Lev 24:17-22
he that killeth any man shall surely be put to death — These verses contain a repetition of some other laws, relating to offenses of a social nature, the penalties for which were to be inflicted, not by the hand of private parties, but through the medium of the judges before whom the cause was brought.

Deu 19:16 If a false witness rise up against any man to testify against him that which is wrong;
Deu 19:17 Then both the men, between whom the controversy is, shall stand before the LORD, before the priests and the judges, which shall be in those days;
Deu 19:18 And the judges shall make diligent inquisition: and, behold, if the witness be a false witness, and hath testified falsely against his brother;
Deu 19:19 Then shall ye do unto him, as he had thought to have done unto his brother: so shalt thou put the evil away from among you.
Deu 19:20 And those which remain shall hear, and fear, and shall henceforth commit no more any such evil among you.
Deu 19:21 And thine eye shall not pity; but life shall go for life, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot.

Deu 19:16-21
Deu_19:16-21. Punishment of a false witness.
But if convicted of perjury, it will be sufficient for his own condemnation, and his punishment shall be exactly the same as would have overtaken the object of his malignant prosecution. (See on Exo_21:23; see also Lev_24:20).

Here is what Jesus said

Mat 5:38 Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth:
Mat 5:39 But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.
Mat 5:40 And if any man will sue thee at the law, and take away thy coat, let him have thy cloke also.
Mat 5:41 And whosoever shall compel thee to go a mile, go with him twain.
Mat 5:42 Give to him that asketh thee, and from him that would borrow of thee turn not thou away.

You do realize that if Jesus changed eye for eye to the above then Israel could no longer enforce civil and social justice for its citizens against evil doers and perjury. What you are saying is that Jesus wanted a lawless society for Israel. I find it astounding anyone would suggest Jesus did away with justice, especially since justice remains in the NT as Paul addressed, and as Brother Mark pointed out. Jesus' comments don't have anything to do with this law, but everything to do with how the law was misrepresented by man.

[dan]

I notice you didn't have anything to say about post #106.What does this have to do with government taking eye for eye in the law in question? Where's diligent inquisition, witnesses, testimony, in self defense or defense in general?

So again, does the country you live in do Deu 19:19 and 21?

Deu 19:19 Then shall ye do unto him, as he had thought to have done unto his brother

Deu 19:21 And thine eye shall not pity; but life shall go for life, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot.

In what you said, where is the falsely accused having done to him, what he falsely accused his bother of?
If I accuse someone of stealing $2,000, and it is found that I am lying, will the law take $2,000 from me and give it to the one I falsely accused?
If I accuse someone of stealing $2,000, and it is found that I am telling the truth, will the law take just $2,000 from the justly accused and give it to me?

Oh, I see what you mean.

So, that would be in court that it occurs in the case of a non-violent apprehension.

But, life for a life is still the Law Of The Land in some countries, and when we talk about self-defense.

[Noeb]

No. In every instance, see post #114 and their context, it is court and it is in any case. It is never individualists. It is always governmental.

Exo 21:22 "When men strive together and hit a pregnant woman, so that her children come out, but there is no harm, the one who hit her shall surely be fined, as the woman's husband shall impose on him, and he shall pay as the judges determine.
Exo 21:23 But if there is harm, then you shall pay life for life,

The "you" in v23 is the "judge" in v22.

Self defense is a God given right IMO, but it has nothing to do with life for life here, which was for officials to determine and enforce if and when a life was taken.

[JDMedia]

I'm sorry, but I don't even understand the question

Re: Where all of Jesus commands for all the people, all the time, throughout the ages?

[dan]

No. In every instance, see post #114 and their context, it is court and it is in any case. It is never individualists. It is always governmental.

Exo 21:22 "When men strive together and hit a pregnant woman, so that her children come out, but there is no harm, the one who hit her shall surely be fined, as the woman's husband shall impose on him, and he shall pay as the judges determine.
Exo 21:23 But if there is harm, then you shall pay life for life,

The "you" in v23 is the "judge" in v22.

Self defense is a God given right IMO, but it has nothing to do with life for life here, which was for officials to determine and enforce if and when a life was taken.

I see what you mean but, I disagree, a little:

Life for life in the individual situation is the basis for the court situation.

If the criminal is successful in murder the individual situation no longer exists, and the court must take over.

If the victim is successful in self-defense, there is no need for the court situation, except maybe to confirm the propriety of the individual's defense.

Saving a life is the obligation of the individual on the scene when the assault happens, and if a life must be forfeit, let it be the criminals.

EX 22:2 If a thief be found breaking up, and be smitten that he die, there shall no blood be shed for him.

MT 24:43 But know this, that if the goodman of the house had known in what watch the thief would come, he would have watched, and would not have suffered his house to be broken up.

REV 13:9 If any man have an ear, let him hear:
REV 13:10 He that leadeth into captivity shall go into captivity: he that killeth with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints.

[tea]

I guess you could start a poll. Most probably agree with you, but that doesn't mean anything. Jesus said he didn't come to change it. How does he turn around and change it sentences later? You still have not addressed this fact.

Sorry, which fact Noeb?

What we read in Mt 5 [and the rest of the New Covenant] is a fufillment of the law.

All Jesus was doing, was fufilling it, isn't that wonderful?

[Arrow]

These commandments are for all disciples for all time!

Agree! Except for the one about "love as he did". The rest were taught in principle in the old covenant. Those things are for all time both new and old.

I agree with episkopos, and you did too Mark in Number 27, but so far you have not shown us where;''If someone strike you on one cheek, turn to him the other.'' is taught in the law.

Or can you say you made a mistake?