Judaism moving beyond animal sacrifices

[claybevan]

Does God have some other plan of salvation that God hasn't announced?

John 10:9 I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture.

Jhn 10:26 But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you. 27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: 28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. 29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand. 30 I and my Father are one.


John 8:24 I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.

John 6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Where else in the scripture is there any other way to eternal life?

He's certainly got a plan in Revelations for them and I have no doubt whatsoever that all those who see him and believe at the second coming will be saved!
I just think it's dangerous to be so arrogant about it, he is after all God and if he sees his blessed Israel and has mercy on them? who are we to shout " hang on a minute, you said" we're not talking about the rest of the world, we are talking about his beloved children. I know there's not any scripture to back this up, but I can't help thinking he has back up plan for them. So from this cranky old English girl have a good day.

[claybevan]

Yeah, I understand. Don't worry, it's all good.

what da ya mean you understand? You hadn't already come to that conclusion, had you?

[PneumaPsucheSoma]

He's certainly got a plan in Revelations for them and I have no doubt whatsoever that all those who see him and believe at the second coming will be saved!
I just think it's dangerous to be so arrogant about it, he is after all God and if he sees his blessed Israel and has mercy on them? who are we to shout " hang on a minute, you said" we're not talking about the rest of the world, we are talking about his beloved children. I know there's not any scripture to back this up, but I can't help thinking he has back up plan for them. So from this cranky old English girl have a good day.

And this is EXACTLY how Dispensationalism diminshes the Gospel of Jesus Christ and His shed blood in inspired scripture.

There is no backup plan for anyone. God came in the likeness of sinful flesh. His OWN Logos became flesh. THAT's the plan. He laid down His (psuche) life for us. Greater love hath no man than this.

You're right. There is no scripture to back you up. That won't stop you and untold numbers of others from believing there's another way, truth, and life whereby men can be saved. It's another gospel... a false gospel.

[claybevan]

Isa 49:14 But Zion said, The LORD hath forsaken me, and my Lord hath forgotten me.
Isa 49:15 Can a woman forget her sucking child, that she should not have compassion on the son of her womb? yea, they may forget, yet will I not forget thee.

Exactly, couldn't have said it better myself. Good those scriptures eh!

[Fenris]

what da ya mean you understand? You hadn't already come to that conclusion, had you?

These are all the regulars here, we know where we all stand on these issues.

[claybevan]

And this is EXACTLY how Dispensationalism diminshes the Gospel of Jesus Christ and His shed blood in inspired scripture.

There is no backup plan for anyone. God came in the likeness of sinful flesh. His OWN Logos became flesh. THAT's the plan. He laid down His (psuche) life for us. Greater love hath no man than this.

You're right. There is no scripture to back you up. That won't stop you and untold numbers of others from believing there's another way, truth, and life whereby men can be saved. It's another gospel... a false gospel.

Didn't say the rest of the world, I was talking about the Jewish people. I know that no one comes to the father except through him, it's just, well he's so full of love for them....
We may well be around at the end times, with the grace and strength of the Lord we may see for ourselves. Until then I'm not writing them off only he can do that.

[claybevan]

These are all the regulars here, we know where we all stand on these issues.

Nuts makes the world a little more bearable sometimes.
Having this discussion about God abandoning you lot, you obviously don't think so?

[PneumaPsucheSoma]

Didn't say the rest of the world, I was talking about the Jewish people. I know that no one comes to the father except through him, it's just, well he's so full of love for them....
We may well be around at the end times, with the grace and strength of the Lord we may see for ourselves. Until then I'm not writing them off only he can do that.

Yes, and that greater love is why He laid down His own (psuche) life. For all who believe, repent, confess.

The arrogance isn't in proclaiming this truth of the Gospel. The arrogance is in insisting God will make an exception.

[divaD]

Didn't say the rest of the world, I was talking about the Jewish people. I know that no one comes to the father except through him, it's just, well he's so full of love for them....
We may well be around at the end times, with the grace and strength of the Lord we may see for ourselves. Until then I'm not writing them off only he can do that.

Acts 3:22 For Moses truly said unto the fathers, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear in all things whatsoever he shall say unto you.
23 And it shall come to pass, that every soul, which will not hear that prophet, shall be destroyed from among the people.

Clearly this has to be meaning Jesus is that prophet. Clearly the people here would have to be ethnic Israel. Verse 23 says this...And it shall come to pass, that every soul, which will not hear that prophet, shall be destroyed from among the people. So how can someone among the people choose not to hear that prophet, yet not be destroyed?

All I'm doing is presenting Scripture. The Scripture says what it says. The question then is, does the Scripture mean what it says?

[Fenris]

Having this discussion about God abandoning you lot, you obviously don't think so?

Yeah, that's what most Christians seem to believe. It doesn't bother me though. I don't think it's true.

[claybevan]

Yes, and that greater love is why He laid down His own (psuche) life. For all who believe, repent, confess.

The arrogance isn't in proclaiming this truth of the Gospel. The arrogance is in insisting God will make an exception.

Didn't insist he would make an exception! just don't want to say a definite 'he won't'.

[claybevan]

Yeah, that's what most Christians seem to believe. It doesn't bother me though. I don't think it's true.

Bothers them though and it's because they want you to enter the Kingdom, sorry, you know all that. Why do you think the the Jewish people of the day didn't believe he was the Messiah? and most still don't?

[Fenris]

Why do you think the the Jewish people of the day didn't believe he was the Messiah? and most still don't?

Because he did not fulfill the messianic prophecies as expected.

[claybevan]

Acts 3:22 For Moses truly said unto the fathers, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear in all things whatsoever he shall say unto you.
23 And it shall come to pass, that every soul, which will not hear that prophet, shall be destroyed from among the people.

Clearly this has to be meaning Jesus is that prophet. Clearly the people here would have to be ethnic Israel. Verse 23 says this...And it shall come to pass, that every soul, which will not hear that prophet, shall be destroyed from among the people. So how can someone among the people choose not to hear that prophet, yet not be destroyed?

All I'm doing is presenting Scripture. The Scripture says what it says. The question then is, does the Scripture mean what it says?

Oh course scripture means what it says, but, well it's just a feeling, that's all. Take no notice of little old me!

[claybevan]

Because he did not fulfill the messianic prophecies as expected.

Excuse my ignorance Fenris, but what prophecies were they expecting to be filled?