Young vs. Mature Christians

[Proverbs31Woman]

I stand corrected re: your rigidity. I do not believe, though, that Slug is purposefully causing offense and creating disruption. I believe he is doing exactly what God told him to do. I believe he heard the Lord and is being obedient and you believe otherwise. Perhaps that is the crux of our disagreement?

W

Yes, that does seem to be the crux of our disagreement.

I do want to thank you and Slug for this discussion. I have really enjoyed it and I am so happy that I found a Message Board where everyone can share their hearts about a matter and not have everything turn into name calling. I don't know why I stayed on an unmoderated board for so long!

[Watchman]

Yes, that does seem to be the crux of our disagreement.

I do want to thank you and Slug for this discussion. I have really enjoyed it and I am so happy that I found a Message Board where everyone can share their hearts about a matter and not have everything turn into name calling. I don't know why I stayed on an unmoderated board for so long!

Glad you found us, too. This board is extremely well moderated!

blessings,

Andy aka Watchman

[Watchman]

I don't need to ask God about this matter. God has already spoken about church unity and order and how members of His body are not to draw attention away from Him by apearance, disrupting service, or causing division. God has already spoken about how we are to show deference and love in regard to the consciences of our fellow brothers and sisters in Christ. If there is an issue within the church God has written how that is to be dealt with. Scripture trumps any supposed private word from God that one thinks they might have received.

God has told us in His written word how we are to worship Him and to go against that method is not true worship nor is it obedience and is therefore sinful.

Sorry I missed this previously, P31W...I have a bad habit of clicking on the most recent post instead of backtracking. Perhaps we should have a discussion of exactly what worship is and whether corporate worship is...ummm...well, whatever you think it is?

W

[John146]

It is not the appearance that God cares about, no. Is is the drawing attention away from Him and also people going against their conscience and offending the consciences of others that God cares about.

Is it your job to determine whether that is occurring or not? How do you know if that is what someone is intending to do or not?

If someone is dressing in a way that distracts others from the worship of God (either by dressing to show off their wealth or by dressing down too much) they are in the wrong.

Sure. I agree that people should not do anything to distract others from the worship of God regardless of what that might be. But in the case of our friend Slug here, I don't believe that was his intention at all.

If someone feels in there conscience that they are to wear their "sunday best" because they feel that they should look their best when going before a Holy God for corporate worship then for them to go against that is sinful

Okay, but I can't help but wonder what makes them feel that way. Shouldn't our beliefs come from scripture? There certainly isn't any scripture to support that notion. Scripture says that it is man (not God) who is concerned with impressing others with outward appearance but God looks at the heart. The Bible also teaches that God wants us to dress modestly so it isn't as if He doesn't care at all about our appearance but we certainly can't dress to impress Him. Why do people think God cares about what they're wearing as if they can impress Him by how they dress? The focus should be on the condition of our hearts, not our physical appearance.

and for someone like slug to offend that or try to cause them to go against that is sinful. For someone to attend worship wearing missing articles of clothing causing people to stare and gawk and become upset is wrong, it is against Scripture's call for unity, peace, order, and love within the church and, IMO, it is also rather disrespectful towards God.

But he has explained that there was a purpose for it. He was not purposely trying to cause dissension, he was trying to make a point. That's a lot different than someone purposely dressing in a certain way just because they like the attention and no other reason. He didn't do it for the attention or to cause a distraction so that people wouldn't worship God. Why can't you give him the benefit of the doubt on that instead of accusing him of sinning?

[Slug1]

It is not the appearance that God cares about, no. Is is the drawing attention away from Him and also people going against their conscience and offending the consciences of others that God cares about.

Thus the reason for something to afflict their consciences, so that WHAT is hindering them from having a relationship that God WANTS to have WITH them, is brought to their consciences.

They "judged" people by what was "worn" or HOW worn and for a righteous God... HE MUST judge those who judge... with the same measure that they judge others.

In the end, and the end of this season is almost over... many were corrected.

P31W... attention to God was NEVER drawn away from Him. For those who judged... sure, they will SAY attention is drawn away from God. But this was the whole point God was making FOR THEM. If they cannot "worship" God because a man is simply NOT wearing shoes during a service... the reason is not the shoeless associate pastor... it is THEM. Worshiping Jesus is to be done in the midst of anything and if a man is not wearing shoes STOPS a person from being able to worship Him?

God wanted to fix them. Some had their eyes and hearts opened and corrected (thus the problem within them was fixed), some did not. They still will not allow God to have the relationship He desires WITH them and they continue to "blame" a shoeless pastor.

I can only pray that before this season is over, they actually DO see what God is attempting to point out to them as the problem in their heart.

We are about to move to a new area and God led us to a whole school building that is to be our new location for a church. God has big plans and those who remained... will be those who God will use in this new season.