Sanctification is an event
Sanctification is a process
both
Salvation is also an event and a process. Unless we continue the process that the initial salvation has begun....we will no longer benefit from that process. It is like...chewing and swallowing could be seen as 2 separate events...but they are of the same process called eating. So those who think that swallowing is optional have not understood the need of food to survive.
So also sanctification is the very purpose of our salvation. So to not go on to a full maturity in Christ is to forfeit the benefit of our very redemption. We are not saved in order to be saved but rather to be reconciled to a Holy God by actually walking in the resurrection power of holiness IN Christ. Without a continued (and increasing) holiness none shall see the Lord. Or how long can a person stay in grade 1 and claim to be educated? Indefinitely?
Formerly "Adullam" from other sites!
Striving to apprehend that for which I have been apprehended in Christ Jesus.
Walk in the Light! (התהלכו באור)
Yes, saving justification, regeneration, cleansing, and positional sanctification are freely given the moment a person repents and savingly trusts Jesus for salvation, yet saving faith is not a temporary faith that has no root, fails to abide in Christ/continue in the faith and fails to produce fruits of holiness/love. Faith that does not persevere is not saving faith.
Blessings to you
I'm quite comfortable in how languange is used. I don't start off in a subject saying we need to define terms, but then, when doing so redefines my understanding of the subject, say it's just quibbling over semantics. Lexicons aren't always right either. Bible dictionaries aren't always right either. Right as far as etymology is concerned but you have to let scripture define the word because that is how God reveals himself, not through mans definitions.
God is holy.
God is not sanctified.
Selah
He has always been holy.
He never needed to be sanctified.
Howdy!
You hit the nail on the head, but:
When we think we are "in the way" or walking in the Spirit/following Christ/walking by faith according to scripture, those short sentences mean something else to us, don't they? I mean, we aren't looking for another because we think we are doing what we are supposed to be doing.
Thanks for reading what I wrote there and pin pointing those verses! I believe this is one of, if not the biggest problem in the Church. Walking a path that's not even found in scripture.


I have tried to reason with you, many people here have gone over this time and time again with you but instead of trying to find common ground and understanding you prefer to be divisive.
Lexicons have their problems correct but if you dont speak Hebrew or Greek then you are at the mercy of lexicons and translations so to denigrate these valuable tools for Theology is simply cutting your nose off to spite your face...this is really getting farcical.
I agree with this... what exactly is your point ? We are not God though.. if you have repented and believed the Gospel then you have been justified by God through faith in His Son's substitutionary atonement. God is Holy and perfect but you my friend and especially me .....are not ! this is why we are urged to be so, this can legitimately be called a sanctification process and if you dont like that term its really to bad.
My position on the subject has not changed... i voted both and continue to say both ? please explain why you think my position has changed ?
How do you grow in grace?
Isa 7:14 Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel.
Isa 7:15 Butter and honey shall he eat, that he may know to refuse the evil, and choose the good.
Isa 7:16 For before the child shall know to refuse the evil, and choose the good, the land that thou abhorrest shall be forsaken of both her kings.
Luk 2:40 And the child grew, and waxed strong in spirit, filled with wisdom: and the grace of God was upon him.
2Pe 3:18 But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and for ever. Amen.
I would reject the word temporary as well.yet saving faith is not a temporary faith
Interesting that you use the word "root".that has no root
BTW, I agree with this statement. Faith without root dies very, very quickly, ( was it ever alive in the first place? It depends on what the root spoken of happens to be.) What do you suppose Jesus means by root in this passage?
Matthew 13: 20 The one who received the seed that fell on rocky places is the man who hears the word and at once receives it with joy.21 But since he has no root, he lasts only a short time. When trouble or persecution comes because of the word, he quickly falls away
I agree that those who have faith are abiding in Christ, and are kept by the power of God, but there are numerous warnings in the Bible that seem to indicate that it is possible for a truly saved person to depart from Christ and from faith. This raises the question of "if it is impossible for a truly regenerate person to depart from faith and Christ, why are there so many warnings?"fails to abide in Christ/continue in the faith...Faith that does not persevere is not saving faith.
It would seem that perserverance is conditioned on patiently continuing in the faith and not departing from the hope that has been given us. Now if the conditions of justification are repentance and faith, and faith and abiding are also conditions of growing in holiness, am I wrong to believe that faith and abiding are also conditions of perserverance?
Amen, living faith always produces fruits of holiness and love, and it also always grows. Faith that does not produce good fruit or that stagnates is dead faith.and fails to produce fruits of holiness/love
Blessings to you as well, brother.
1 John 1:7- But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.
2 Corinthians 7:1- Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God.
Everything has to do with jesus words - Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect - it means the perfection of love - True love
It is true that there are variant meanings for Greek words. We must allow context to determine the meaning of the word in these cases. For instance, the word in question is Hagiozo.God is holy.
God is not sanctified.
Selah
He has always been holy.
He never needed to be sanctified
1) to render or acknowledge, or to be venerable or hallow
2) to separate from profane things and dedicate to God
a) consecrate things to God
b) dedicate people to God
3) to purify
a) to cleanse externally
b) to purify by expiation: free from the guilt of sin
c) to purify internally by renewing of the soul
When applied to God, Hagiozo cannot have the meaning of definitions 2 and 3, because God already is and always has been Holy in the sense of separated and pure. So the first meaning is the correct meaning, to sanctify God is to hallow or venerate him as Holy. For example, in the Lord's prayer, " our Father who is in heaven, hallowed be your name..." Hallowed is this very word "hagiozo". So sanctify God in your hearts means to "hallow" God in your heart.
As far as sanctifying believers, I believe God performs all three.
1. We become Holy before God positionally (due to our position in Christ).
2. He sets us apart from sin to become His very own.
3. He purifies us internally, and that internal purification leads to external purification as we perfect holiness in the fear of the Lord, and work out what God has worked in.
Our holiness in Christ is instantaneous and complete, and happens at conversion. We are set apart by God at this time as well. We are cleansed internally through faith by the Blood of Jesus, the renewing of the Holy Spirit, and the washing of regeneration. This internal cleansing causes us to increasingly become holy in action, word, thought, motive, etc.
1 John 1:7- But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.
2 Corinthians 7:1- Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God.
1 John 1:7- But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.
2 Corinthians 7:1- Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God.
I'm not a Greek Scholar either, and only have a very limited understanding of it. As I said,
God is holy.
God is not sanctified.
He has always been holy.
He never needed to be sanctified.
Why don't we say -why doesn't scripture say- God is sanctified? Does God need to be purified? Who would sanctify God, and would he be God if he needed?
hagios (αγιον) -holy- is the attribute
hagiazō (αγιαση) -sanctify- is action that gives the attribute
hagiazō (ηγιασθητε) -sanctified- is one that has been given the attribute, or describes having been given the attribute
Are these the same? No. Scripture does not apply the last two to God because they are different than holy and not applicable. God is, and has always been, holy.
When scripture describes what happens in us after we are born again it never uses those last two because they are different than holy and not applicable. We already are holy, having already been sanctified completely by God -in Him.
From the same root
hagion- holy place, sanctuary
We are not a holy place. God is our holy place.
Now for the one in which this thread is really about.
hagiasmos- properly purification, that is, (the state) purity; concretely (by Hebraism) a purifier: - holiness, sanctification.
We find this (αγιασμω) translated holiness and sanctification, and here are the 4 verses.
1Th 4:7 For God hath not called us unto uncleanness, but unto holiness.
1Ti 2:15 Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety.
2Th 2:13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:
1Pe 1:2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.
We are called to a state -purity-, to continue in that state and to pursue it, a state accomplished by God through the Spirit in Christ. That is, we are all baptized by one Spirit into the body of Christ. I do not see how this is talking about a progressive process (the state is progressively manifested through the Spirit) but I see the state of purity accomplished by God. If there is a disagreement, here is where we find it. I know most see 2Th 2:13, and 1Pe 1:2 (through sanctification of the Spirit) as a process and I certainly understand that, but again, the state is progressively manifested through the Spirit. We are not progressively building our sanctification. That's a huge difference. Some may I'm quibbling over semantics, but am I? Are we the author of the faith? Do we finish it, or does he? Again, Jesus said the word brings forth fruit of itself. Do we work or are we his workmanship, created in him unto good works? Which is it?
Here's the rest of the verses that variations of hagiasmos is found in -all of them;
unto a state. How can you continue in sin because of your state?
Rom 6:19 I speak after the manner of men because of the infirmity of your flesh: for as ye have yielded your members servants to uncleanness and to iniquity unto iniquity; even so now yield your members servants to righteousness unto holiness.
unto a state. Free from sin because of your state.
Rom 6:22 But now being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life.
Follow purity? Pursue purity? Pursue the state we have been given.
Heb 12:14 Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord:
Gotta give the context of this one! It is of him the state is manifested.
1Co 1:25 Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men.
1Co 1:26 For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called:
1Co 1:27 But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty;
1Co 1:28 And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are:
1Co 1:29 That no flesh should glory in his presence.
1Co 1:30 But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:
1Co 1:31 That, according as it is written, He that glorieth, let him glory in the Lord.
The will of God -abstain- to know how to possess in. Sounds like purity to me. Sounds like we need to know something. How to possess our vessel in a state of purity.
1Th 4:3 For this is the will of God, even your sanctification, that ye should abstain from fornication:
1Th 4:4 That every one of you should know how to possess his vessel in sanctification and honour;
I know people will continue to read these way they always have, unless God reveals otherwise. The process of sanctification taught and so popularly believed is the long hard road to holiness based on works of the flesh, claiming to do what Jesus has already done -crucify us, which is frustrating the grace of God.
Gal 2:20-21 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me. I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.
This doctrine is so prevalent and powerful, giving people the feeling they are contributing in some way and actually doing something in and with God. To hear what you are doing and believe is not necessary, vain, not the way and gospel Jesus gave us, is not easy for everyone to swallow. You really have to be down right fed up with being in bondage to sin and ready to do it God's way, which is the only way that gives him glory.
glad4mercy,
tele -far off, afar, at or to a distance,
where we get telescope, telegraph, telephone
Look at these two verses (KJV)
Php 3:12 Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect (teleioō): but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus.
Php 3:15 Let us therefore, as many as be perfect (teleios), be thus minded: and if in any thing ye be otherwise minded, God shall reveal even this unto you.
Sounds like a contradiction but it's not. It's two different meanings with the same root. (ESV)
Php 3:12 Not that I have already obtained this or am already perfect (teleioō), but I press on to make it my own, because Christ Jesus has made me his own.
Php 3:15 Let those of us who are mature (teleios) think this way, and if in anything you think otherwise, God will reveal that also to you.
Verse 12 is about the resurrection mentioned in verse 11 which absolute perfection, and verse 15 is maturity -full of age from growth mentally and in character. Tele is used other ways as well. End. End, as in death, dead, die. See telos.
Did you happen to read post 130?God is holy.
God is not sanctified.
He has always been holy.
He never needed to be sanctified.
Why don't we say -why doesn't scripture say- God is sanctified? Does God need to be purified? Who would sanctify God, and would he be God if he needed?
Hagios- Saint, one who has been sanctified. Also used as an adjective, as in Holy Spirit or Holy city.hagios (αγιον) -holy- is the attribute
hagiazō (αγιαση) -sanctify- is action that gives the attribute
hagiazō (ηγιασθητε) -sanctified- is one that has been given the attribute, or describes having been given the attribute
Hagiazo- The act of sanctification itself.
Hagiasmos- Holiness.
Granted, but what about the word hagiōsynē, as it is used in 2 Corinthians 7:1 and 1 Thessalonians 3:13? How do you exegete these passages? I have already quoted 2 Corinthians 7:1 numerous times, so I will just post 1 Thessalonians 3:12-13 here...( emphasis added)We are called to a state -purity-, to continue in that state, a state accomplished by God through the Spirit in Christ. That is, we are all baptized by on Spirit into the body of Christ. I do not see how this is talking about a progressive process (the state is progressively manifested through the Spirit) but I see the state of purity accomplished by God. If there is a disagreement, here is where we find it. I know most see 2Th 2:13, and 1Pe 1:2 (through sanctification of the Spirit) as a process and I certainly understand that, but again, the state is progressively manifested through the Spirit. We are not progressively building our sanctification. That's a huge difference. Some may I'm quibbling over semantics, but am I? Are we the author of the faith? Do we finish it, or does he? Again, Jesus said the word brings forth fruit of itself. Do we work or are we his workmanship, created in him unto good works? Which is it?
1 Thessalonians 3:12 And the Lord make you to increase and abound in love one toward another, and toward all men, even as we do toward you:13 To the end he may stablish your hearts unblameable in holiness before God, even our Father, at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ with all his saints.
Excellent example and point taken on roots sometimes having different meanings. This is a good "iron sharpens iron" discussion.glad4mercy,
tele -far off, afar, at or to a distance,
where we get telescope, telegraph, telephone
Look at these two verses (KJV)
Php 3:12 Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect (teleioō): but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus.
Php 3:15 Let us therefore, as many as be perfect (teleios), be thus minded: and if in any thing ye be otherwise minded, God shall reveal even this unto you.
Sounds like a contradiction but it's not. It's two different meanings with the same root. (ESV)
Php 3:12 Not that I have already obtained this or am already perfect (teleioō), but I press on to make it my own, because Christ Jesus has made me his own.
Php 3:15 Let those of us who are mature (teleios) think this way, and if in anything you think otherwise, God will reveal that also to you.
1 John 1:7- But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.
2 Corinthians 7:1- Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God.
I agree with you! But there is more to the process...
How do yo read this?
2Pe 1:3 According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:
2Pe 1:4 Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.
2Pe 1:5 And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge;
2Pe 1:6 And to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness;
2Pe 1:7 And to godliness brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness charity.
2Pe 1:8 For if these things be in you, and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.
2Pe 1:9 But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins.
2Pe 1:10 Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:
2Pe 1:11 For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.
Formerly "Adullam" from other sites!
Striving to apprehend that for which I have been apprehended in Christ Jesus.
Walk in the Light! (התהלכו באור)
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