Popular Atheist Blogger turns to Catholicism

[the rookie]

So I can call myself a Mormon, Buddhist, Jehovah's Witness or Andrew-ist?

No, doctrine matters - right belief, right practice, right gospel, right Jesus.

All of these things are of the highest importance. If someone in a different stream expresses the same faith the apostles handed down to us, professing the same Jesus they knew, worshipped, and died for, then I'm calling that man or woman a brother or a sister in Christ.

I don't know any Mormons, Buddhists (my mom is a Buddhist), or Jehovah's Witnesses I would call a brother or sister in the faith. They profess a different gospel, and worship a different Jesus, unto a different end than I do. Buddhists really don't even worship God at all.

But I've interacted with many Catholics that express a deep, rich, authentic relationship with Jesus that looks nothing like the straw man produced earlier in the thread. Right doctrine - right faith in the right Jesus - produces the right fruit. We're to inspect that fruit and judge accordingly. Not from a distance, and not in religious pride.

I, for one, appreciate denominational labels and distinctives - it helps me to honor and cherish my brothers and sisters related to the distinctives they feel called to within the streams they are serving the Lord. Just had a great time with 800 mostly Baptist pastors the last few days. Not my cup of tea (related to worship style) in terms of my main assignment from heaven, but I appreciate and am blessed by what my Baptist brothers bring to the table in terms of dedication and fervency for the word of God.

[Dani H]

Haha! I guess the point I was trying to make is that it is very much relevant what we're calling ourselves to the world and what the teachings of those we affiliate ourselves with are. What do you think?

Our first relevance and supreme priority has to happen in relation to GOD.

If the world calls you a saint, you call yourself a "good person" and God calls you a sinner, then what are you?

If you call yourself a sinner and God calls you His, then what are you?

If you call yourself Protestant, what does that even mean?

State the name of Jesus, and be done with it. There's no other name that actually matters. Other names are all meaningless far as salvation is concerned, except maybe to gratify the desire of human peer belonging and affiliation, which happens on a strictly human level and quite frankly has nothing to do with God at that point. Keep the two separate because they have nothing to do with each other and lead to useless sqabblings.

It's about Jesus. Plus minus nothing. Because if He don't save you ... you're not saved, no matter what you call yourself.

[andrew_no_one]

Our first relevance and supreme priority has to happen in relation to GOD.

If the world calls you a saint, you call yourself a "good person" and God calls you a sinner, then what are you?

If you call yourself a sinner and God calls you His, then what are you?

If you call yourself Protestant, what does that even mean?

State the name of Jesus, and be done with it. There's no other name that actually matters. Other names are all meaningless far as salvation is concerned, except maybe to gratify the desire of human peer belonging and affiliation, which happens on a strictly human level and quite frankly has nothing to do with God at that point. Keep the two separate because they have nothing to do with each other and lead to useless sqabblings.

It's about Jesus. Plus minus nothing. Because if He don't save you ... you're not saved, no matter what you call yourself.

Can't rep you again so soon but I agree.

[Dani H]

Can't rep you again so soon but I agree.

If it helps as far as object lesson, the Pharisees called themselves "children of Abraham" and took all kinds of pride and entitlement from such self-definition. A lot of good that did them as far as Jesus' opinion of them was concerned. Not.

[Saved7]

No, doctrine matters - right belief, right practice, right gospel, right Jesus.

All of these things are of the highest importance. If someone in a different stream expresses the same faith the apostles handed down to us, professing the same Jesus they knew, worshipped, and died for, then I'm calling that man or woman a brother or a sister in Christ.

I don't know any Mormons, Buddhists (my mom is a Buddhist), or Jehovah's Witnesses I would call a brother or sister in the faith. They profess a different gospel, and worship a different Jesus, unto a different end than I do. Buddhists really don't even worship God at all.

But I've interacted with many Catholics that express a deep, rich, authentic relationship with Jesus that looks nothing like the straw man produced earlier in the thread. Right doctrine - right faith in the right Jesus - produces the right fruit. We're to inspect that fruit and judge accordingly. Not from a distance, and not in religious pride.

I, for one, appreciate denominational labels and distinctives - it helps me to honor and cherish my brothers and sisters related to the distinctives they feel called to within the streams they are serving the Lord. Just had a great time with 800 mostly Baptist pastors the last few days. Not my cup of tea (related to worship style) in terms of my main assignment from heaven, but I appreciate and am blessed by what my Baptist brothers bring to the table in terms of dedication and fervency for the word of God.

Amen, well said. Just as each of us are called to a different purpose and differing in gifts and abilities, we each bring something to the table that the other does not, whether Catholic or Baptist or non-denom or any other variation that is Christian at it's core.

[andrew_no_one]

Can we back up for a moment because I'm confused?
Are we saying that Catholics (collectively) are Christians but Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses (collectively) are not?
They don’t seem all that much different to me, at the end of the day they are all three works-based salvation. The penitent thief could have never been saved by their teachings because he didn’t have time for the sacraments, a spiritual check-list or delivering magazines.

[Athanasius]

Can we back up for a moment because I'm confused?
Are we saying that Catholics (collectively) are Christians but Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses (collectively) are not?
They don’t seem all that much different to me, at the end of the day they are all three works-based salvation. The penitent thief could have never been saved by their teachings because he didn’t have time for the sacraments, a spiritual check-list or delivering magazines.

Catholics are pretty good when it comes to Jesus; Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses are far off the mark.

[the rookie]

Can we back up for a moment because I'm confused?
Are we saying that Catholics (collectively) are Christians

I'm saying that, within the Catholic church presently, there are theologians and believers who you would meet and find more sincere than many Methodists, Episcopalians, Baptists, etc. AND, when you read their writings, you would find their exegesis of scripture surprisingly "Protestant" regarding faith and the human's role in salvation.

Secondly, you want to take note that there were many great men and women of God throughout church history that were Catholic. Was Augustine "saved"? Was Thomas Aquinas? St. Francis of Assisi? Bernard of Clairvaux? The question is - if they were saved, and pre-Reformation Catholics were saved (again, those who were authentically "in the faith"), when did Catholics stop "getting saved"? Are all post-Reformation Catholics considered apostate and bound for the Lake of Fire? What then, do we say about the "Counter-Reformation" and the Second Vatican Council? And the Charismatic Renewal within the Catholic Church from the 1970's onward (again - 113 million Charismatic Catholics today)? \

It's not so easy - in fact, it's arrogant - to simply say, "They all believe..." and "they are all apostate..."

but Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses (collectively) are not?

Very different gospel, Jesus, and history. We have a shared history with the Catholic Church, and our historic roots are found there - despite our current disagreements related to the sacraments, purgatory, and the nature of Mary. And, despite the things stated here, amongst my Catholic friends there is a big difference between the veneration of Mary (great respect and reverence) and the worship of Mary, which the leaders and theologians I know and have read do not do.

They don’t seem all that much different to me, at the end of the day they are all three works-based salvation. The penitent thief could have never been saved by their teachings because he didn’t have time for the sacraments, a spiritual check-list or delivering magazines.

Catholics don't believe in a works-based salvation. That's a bit too over-simplified.

Mormons believe in another Testament that is the equal of the New and see believers as becoming equal to Jesus (thus denying His divinity). JW's also deny the divinity of Christ as well...and believe stranger things than that. Huge difference with Catholicism, which worships Jesus as fully God, fully Man (the reason we believe this - and hold to the "Apostolic Creed" - is because of "Catholic" church councils held prior to the Middle Ages).

[Cyberseeker]

http://www.cnn.com/video/?hpt=hp_c2#...t-catholic.cnn

Thanks for sharing this. Christianity is wide and diverse but one thing defines it: we have made Jesus Christ our God! Praise the Lord!

(ps. I agree with Rookies comments too)

[NewInHim]

I happen to know a large number of Catholics whom I am proud to call "brother (or sister) in Christ". There's a genuine remnant of faith in every stream, tribe, and nation - just as there is the opposite. The "wheat and the tares" grow together, everywhere we look. To call an entire group of folk who profess Christ as Lord, "not Christian" is to miss the wave of genuine, Holy Spirit-led renewal that has been going on in the church since the 70's...as well as overlooking the rich history in the faith that predates Protestantism by many centuries. Some of the greatest heroes of the faith, martyrs, missionaries, and theologians in church history were numbered amongst the Catholics.

Just a side note

I feel the same way. Great post!

[nimblewillsgrace]

I hope her movement to catholicism is but a stepping stone to Christianity. It would be a pity if he escaped the snare only to fall into a pit.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

And we wonder why there are atheist?

[nimblewillsgrace]

Q. What’s your favorite Bible verse?

A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh. (Ezekiel 36:26)

Her favorite verse.

[whitetiger]

Unbelievable, how 'Popular atheist turns to Catholicism' has turned into anti-Catholic bigotry. Good job, 'Evangelicals'. At least your doctrine is correct.

I think it is part of the human condition to do that

[whitetiger]

Can we back up for a moment because I'm confused?
Are we saying that Catholics (collectively) are Christians but Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses (collectively) are not?
They don’t seem all that much different to me, at the end of the day they are all three works-based salvation. The penitent thief could have never been saved by their teachings because he didn’t have time for the sacraments, a spiritual check-list or delivering magazines.

Not all Catholics are Christians nor are all Evangelicals, Protestants, what have you are Christians but Catholics, Evangelicals, Protestants, what have you are Christians

[nimblewillsgrace]

I think it is part of the human condition to do that

Its part of the Christian condition not to.