Has God Already Written His Law on Our Hearts and Minds? What Does that Look Like?

[fewarechosen]

So why do we still have teachers then? Are all these teachers, false teachers?

I will try to answer this. first scripture.

Jer 31:33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.
Jer 31:34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.


the scripture above is speaking to Isreal, I understand that to be spiritual Isreal the true Isreal the children of promise. not a fleshy jew born to isreal, although those can be included cause it is open to all.

they will no longer teach eachother of God because they will know him, he says from the least of "them" to greatest of "them" the "them" is Isreal those given the Spirit of adoption the ones who are grafted in.

now the ones with Holy Spirit need no teacher because its the Spirit that teaches them, that is not to say they cannot learn from eachother. And is not to say they all know the same or all get to same level or all know the same at the same time. but the Spirit in one will agree with the knowledge from the Spirit in another if the knowledge overlaps because it is from same truth. The spirit teaches One truth, even if one may get more of it than another.

Joh_14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

the above scripture is Christ himself telling them who will teach them. When you read the story of Christ notice how He told em a whole bunch of stuff while He was with them but they never really got it till they recieved the Holy Spirit.
so Christ taught them but they couldnt really get it till the Holy Spirit was given to them and then the Holy Spirit brought them to rememberance of what Christ said and show them the Truth of the matter. The Spirit teaches Spirit.

teaching is a gift given by the Spirit, its the Spirit teaching through them. That in no way conflicts with them not needing a man to teach them.

now as far as false teachers, remember how He said things would get even worse ? look at all the false teachers Christ came across, now know the amount of false teachers is far far worse than then.

God can teach you anything He wants in any instant He wants or block anything He may not want you to know. He is all powerful and can destroy planets and lives at his whim. so why would anyone appeal to man for knowledge when the most powerful one and the one with all the answers is God ?

He is the only one who can lead us into all truth.

[divaD]

No, not all teachers are false teachers. The spiritual gift of teaching is not obsolete. But when you are taught by someone who has that gift it is really the Holy Spirit teaching you and not the teacher himself because the Holy Spirit reveals the truth to the teacher and gives him the wisdom and discernment he needs in order to teach. So, I believe 1 John 2:27 not only means that we can receive teaching directly from the Holy Spirit since He dwells in us but also that we can receive teaching from the Holy Spirit through people who have the gift of teaching. Either way, it's the Holy Spirit who is teaching us rather than things that are just coming from the imaginations of men rather than from God. Notice how Paul gives full credit to the Holy Spirit for his teaching:

I agree with you here. But unfortunately I don't see this agreeing with Jer 31:34, since that seems to be an entirely different context all together. And I did notice that you indicated you saw a connection between 1 John 2:27 and Jer 31:34.

Jeremiah 31:33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.
34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.


What's interesting about this, notice what we find out as we read on in that chapter.

Jeremiah 31:38 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that the city shall be built to the LORD from the tower of Hananeel unto the gate of the corner.
39 And the measuring line shall yet go forth over against it upon the hill Gareb, and shall compass about to Goath.
40 And the whole valley of the dead bodies, and of the ashes, and all the fields unto the brook of Kidron, unto the corner of the horse gate toward the east, shall be holy unto the LORD; it shall not be plucked up, nor thrown down any more for ever.

I would think this is meaning somewhere over in the middle east. Verse 40 indicates this city built to the LORD, it shall not be plucked up, nor thrown down any more for ever. With all the turmoil still occurring in the middle east, I just can't envision this part being true yet...it shall not be plucked up, nor thrown down any more for ever. Is there any reason to not understand any of this literally, such as there is no literal location matching this description on the planet earth?

How are you understanding this city that shall be built to the LORD?

While I'm thinking about it, before we even get to verse 39 and 40, we read this...Jeremiah 31:37 Thus saith the LORD; If heaven above can be measured, and the foundations of the earth searched out beneath, I will also cast off all the seed of Israel for all that they have done, saith the LORD. How can that context have any relation to the future NT church, especially since the NT church is comprised of Gentiles? My point is, not that the seed of Israel can't be a part of the NT church in the future, in relation to these prophecies in Jer 31, but how can Gentiles be in mind here as well, since the LORD isn't meaning all that the seed of Israel and the seed of Gentiles have done, but all that only the seed of Israel had done? I would think this same seed of Israel is who that is in focus in
Jeremiah 31:34.

[divaD]

I will try to answer this. first scripture.

Jer 31:33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.
Jer 31:34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.


the scripture above is speaking to Isreal, I understand that to be spiritual Isreal the true Isreal the children of promise. not a fleshy jew born to isreal, although those can be included cause it is open to all.

they will no longer teach eachother of God because they will know him, he says from the least of "them" to greatest of "them" the "them" is Isreal those given the Spirit of adoption the ones who are grafted in.

now the ones with Holy Spirit need no teacher because its the Spirit that teaches them, that is not to say they cannot learn from eachother. And is not to say they all know the same or all get to same level or all know the same at the same time. but the Spirit in one will agree with the knowledge from the Spirit in another if the knowledge overlaps because it is from same truth. The spirit teaches One truth, even if one may get more of it than another.

Joh_14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

the above scripture is Christ himself telling them who will teach them. When you read the story of Christ notice how He told em a whole bunch of stuff while He was with them but they never really got it till they recieved the Holy Spirit.
so Christ taught them but they couldnt really get it till the Holy Spirit was given to them and then the Holy Spirit brought them to rememberance of what Christ said and show them the Truth of the matter. The Spirit teaches Spirit.

teaching is a gift given by the Spirit, its the Spirit teaching through them. That in no way conflicts with them not needing a man to teach them.

now as far as false teachers, remember how He said things would get even worse ? look at all the false teachers Christ came across, now know the amount of false teachers is far far worse than then.

God can teach you anything He wants in any instant He wants or block anything He may not want you to know. He is all powerful and can destroy planets and lives at his whim. so why would anyone appeal to man for knowledge when the most powerful one and the one with all the answers is God ?

He is the only one who can lead us into all truth.

I'll be honest with you, I see this as a very logical possibility. I'll have to treat it as food for thought for a bit. Maybe after I've thought on it a bit, maybe I can then try and debate anything that I can't see your way.

[fewarechosen]

I agree with you here. But unfortunately I don't see this agreeing with Jer 31:34, since that seems to be an entirely different context all together. And I did notice that you indicated you saw a connection between 1 John 2:27 and Jer 31:34.

Jeremiah 31:33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.
34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.


What's interesting about this, notice what we find out as we read on in that chapter.

Jeremiah 31:38 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that the city shall be built to the LORD from the tower of Hananeel unto the gate of the corner.
39 And the measuring line shall yet go forth over against it upon the hill Gareb, and shall compass about to Goath.
40 And the whole valley of the dead bodies, and of the ashes, and all the fields unto the brook of Kidron, unto the corner of the horse gate toward the east, shall be holy unto the LORD; it shall not be plucked up, nor thrown down any more for ever.

I would think this is meaning somewhere over in the middle east. Verse 40 indicates this city built to the LORD, it shall not be plucked up, nor thrown down any more for ever. With all the turmoil still occurring in the middle east, I just can't envision this part being true yet...it shall not be plucked up, nor thrown down any more for ever. Is there any reason to not understand any of this literally, such as there is no literal location matching this description on the planet earth?
How are you understanding this city that shall be built to the LORD?

While I'm thinking about it, before we even get to verse 39 and 40, we read this...Jeremiah 31:37 Thus saith the LORD; If heaven above can be measured, and the foundations of the earth searched out beneath, I will also cast off all the seed of Israel for all that they have done, saith the LORD. How can that context have any relation to the future NT church, especially since the NT church is comprised of Gentiles? My point is, not that the seed of Israel can't be a part of the NT church in the future, in relation to these prophecies in Jer 31, but how can Gentiles be in mind here as well, since the LORD isn't meaning all that the seed of Israel and the seed of Gentiles have done, but all that only the seed of Israel had done? I would think this same seed of Israel is who that is in focus in
Jeremiah 31:34.

to address the bolded

Eph 2:18 For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.
Eph 2:19 Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;
Eph 2:20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;
Eph 2:21 In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord:
Eph 2:22 In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit.

Christ was the cornerstone, they are lively stones and built together into the temple of the Lord, that is why the kingdom is within. It comes not with observation because its not a foundation you see with your eyes. He has to give you the eyes to see that kingdom.

That city that is founded on Christ as the corner will never be plucked up or thrown down, thats another tie in, Hes not talking about a temporary city made of rock but of the Holy city formed with Christ and saints.

the NT church is not made up of just gentiles its open to anyone, a jew from isreal can follow Christ.

Hi daviD btw, I am in no way trying to attack your thoughts or anything just offering my own, my thoughts come out short so not trying to badger you into thinking the way i think or something, just conversing.

[divaD]

to address the bolded

Eph 2:18 For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.
Eph 2:19 Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;
Eph 2:20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;
Eph 2:21 In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord:
Eph 2:22 In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit.

Christ was the cornerstone, they are lively stones and built together into the temple of the Lord, that is why the kingdom is within. It comes not with observation because its not a foundation you see with your eyes. He has to give you the eyes to see that kingdom.

I can certainly see the city being mentioned in Jeremiah 31 as meaning the one in Eph 2. Your point is certainly valid.

the NT church is not made up of just gentiles its open to anyone, a jew from isreal can follow Christ.

I fully agree. I never meant to imply it was just made up of Gentiles.

Hi daviD btw, I am in no way trying to attack your thoughts or anything just offering my own, my thoughts come out short so not trying to badger you into thinking the way i think or something, just conversing.

First of all, that never even crossed my mind, that you were attacking my thoughts or something. And since I've conversed with you in the past, that's exactly what I see you doing..just conversing. No problemos from my end.

[Walls]

When two opponents get down to detail, very often the other readers get lost in the argument. So for the record I will summarize the differences between myself and John146. I do not desire to "win" an argument. Rather I attempt to present arguments that otherwise get lost in detailed discussion.

I maintain that according to the simple grammar and truth of statement of Jeremiah 31 that the New Covenant is;

(1) A New Covenant of Law. That these Laws are mostly the Laws of Moses is clear from Matthew 5:18; “For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.” That is, the Laws of Moses will remain at least till the end of the Millennium. And this is strengthened by Luke 16:17. “And it is easier for heaven and earth to pass, than one tittle of the law to fail.” The context of this discourse was adultery. As Israel will again occupy their Land in the Millennium, the Laws pertaining to adultery will still be in place, this time, on their hearts

To qualify my word “mostly”, I grant that some Laws are changed, but only due to the changes in the Priesthood (Heb.7:11-16). The High Priest in the Millennium will be from the tribe of Judah, not Levi, and not from the order of Aaron but Melchisedec.

The argument that the Laws of the New Covenant are somehow different to the Old because God called them “my Laws” is not valid because God often called the Law of Moses “His Laws” (Ex.16:28, 18:16; Ps.105:45; Ezek.44:24; Dan.9:10 etc.). Rather it strengthens my conclusion that they are the same.

John146 contends that there is a difference between the Law of Moses and the Law of God in Jeremiah 31, then shortly afterwards contends that the Law of God is same as the Law of Christ. How can this be? Both the Law of Moses and the Law of God, which as shown above are interchangeably used by scripture, are Covenants of Law. But the Law of Christ is to bear another Christian’s burdens (Gal.6:2).

I contend that what happens to a Christian at rebirth is that Christ comes into that Christian’s spirit (Rom.8:9-10). When this happens, the Christian inherits the whole humanity of Jesus, His life, His death and His resurrection. That is, when the Christian turns to his/her spirit, the resources that are available are everything Christ was, is, and accomplished as a MAN. That is why Romans 8 starts with those “walking after the Spirit” (verse 1) and in so doing walk according to the LIFE of Jesus (verse 2). Example; the Christian is about to buy a Mercedes. He/she does not know whether he/she should be that extravagant. On the one hand the New Testament tells us in 1st Timothy 6:17, “… the living God, who gives us richly all things to enjoy”, and on the other hand, we should “deny” ourselves. What shall he/she do? There are no instructions, or even conflicting instructions concerning this. Well, the Christian should turn to the spirit, and Christ in that person’s spirit will react according to His Life. Soon a small still voice in the Christian will whisper the answer.

This is the Law of Life in Christ Jesus and is totally different to a Law that is written on stone tablets or the heart. The laws of God are a fixed Law; “you must be circumcised on the eight day”, or, “you shall go down to Jerusalem three times a year and feast,” or, “When thou buildest a new house, then thou shalt make a battlement for thy roof, that thou bring not blood upon thine house, if any man fall from thence” (Deut.22:8). It is these Laws that multiple scriptures in Romans, Galatians and Colossians tell us do NOT apply to the Christian.

(2) Exclusively for Israel (10 northern tribes) and Judah (2 southern tribes). There is not one verse in scripture that includes the Church in this New Covenant of Law. On the contrary the plain language of Jeremiah and Hebrews is that it is limited to Israel and Judah, the divided nation of the sons of Israel. To contend anything else is to accuse God of misleading us.

The contention by John146 that according to Ephesians 2, the New Covenant is a Covenant of Promise as he did in posting #8 cannot be upheld. There were two Covenants given 430 years apart (Gal.3:15-18) - the Covenant of Promise to Abraham which is fulfilled in Christ, and the Covenant of Law which has failed, passed away and is about to be replaced by a New Covenant of Law. The last verse of Galatians Chapter 3 shows how we Gentiles do NOT enter a New Covenant of Promise but inherit the Abrahamic Covenant by being Christ’s. Paul pointedly states that the second Covenant, that of Sinai, does NOT annul the first (v.17). So if anything, the Church is under one of the oldest Covenants – that made with Abraham.

The contention that the blood of Christ only does one thing, that is, takes away sins, and that this is the New Covenant defies the grammar and the history of sacrifices in the bible. In Matthew 26:28, Mark 14:24 and Luke 22:20 the Lord presents His blood as two distinct things. (1) The blood that ratifies the New Testament, and (2) the blood that is shed for many. It is the same blood, but it accomplishes two distinct things. Example; When Abraham slew his offering when he made the Covenant with God in Genesis Chapter 15, the blood shed in this offering was not for his sins. Notice Hebrews 9:18-20; “Whereupon neither the first testament was dedicated without blood. 19 For when Moses had spoken every precept to all the people according to the law, he took the blood of calves and of goats, with water, and scarlet wool, and hyssop, and sprinkled both the book, and all the people, 20 Saying, This is the blood of the testament which God hath enjoined unto you.” This is what Moses did in Exodus 24:3-8, not what Moses did in Exodus 12:22 when he sprinkled the blood to avoid the angel of death. Notice also that if we continue our text from Hebrews 9 above, verse 21 starts with “moreover”, and continues about what is “purged” with blood. Webster gives the definition of “moreover” as “in addition to.” Are there not two things here – a Covenant “dedicated” with blood, and other things “purged” with the same blood? John146 dismisses such accuracy as “you are really reaching”, but is this not what language is about? Shall we not credit the greatest mind of the universe with such accuracy in His writings? May the reader judge.

The beauty of the Church life is that a prophet speaks and the others judge. It is the right and privilege of each reader to judge the matter. In this case, judge whether my arguments follow scripture and follow a simple and logical build up of the accurate stated word. Or do I have to twist scripture and to add things that are not there to fit a preconceived idea that has minimal backing by direct statements.

Israel entered the Good Land by the Covenant of Promise, because God keeps His promises. But He also gave them a Covenant of Law so that they could maintain their presence in this Good Land. This they broke and were cast out of the Land. Israel will be re-united at a future date and returned to their Land, because God again keeps His promise to Abraham. And again they will receive a New Covenant of Law, this time written on their inward parts, that they may never be cast out again. Notice what the Holy Spirit says after the prediction of the New Covenant by Jeremiah in Chapter 31:35-40 “35 Thus says the Lord, … 36 "If those ordinances depart From before Me, says the Lord, Then the seed of Israel shall also cease From being a nation before Me forever." 37 Thus says the Lord: "If heaven above can be measured, And the foundations of the earth searched out beneath, I will also cast off all the seed of Israel For all that they have done, says the Lord. 38 "Behold, the days are coming, says the Lord, that the city shall be built for the Lord from the Tower of Hananel to the Corner Gate. 39 The surveyor's line shall again extend straight forward over the hill Gareb; then it shall turn toward Goath. 40 And the whole valley of the dead bodies and of the ashes, and all the fields as far as the Brook Kidron, to the corner of the Horse Gate toward the east, shall be holy to the Lord. It shall not be plucked up or thrown down anymore forever."

Here, directly after predicting the New Covenant with Israel and Judah, God threatens them that if these Laws are not kept He will blot Israel from the face of the earth. But He ends by measuring physical parts of Israel and predicting that it will be holy and never be plucked up or thrown down again. That is, the New Covenant of Law will function and Israel will never again be driven from their Land. Notice too, that in connection with the Laws of this New Covenant, God calls them “ordinances” (v.36), the same word our eminent translators used for the Law that was nailed to the cross in Colossians 2:14.

Can there be any doubt that the New Covenant is a Covenant of Law?

The Church inherits the Covenant of Promise according to Ephesians Chapter 2. This Promise revolves totally round One Seed of Abraham, Jesus Christ. Our Lord Jesus Christ is not only promised the Good Land as a seed of Abraham, but the whole earth and the nations. Any person inheriting via Jesus Christ inherits the whole earth with Him (Rom.4:13). That is why the co-kings of Christ rule the NATIONS with a rod of iron during the Millennium while Israel only get their Land back. Far from having Laws written on their hearts, the resource of a Christian is the in-dwelling Christ with all His humanity, all He achieved and all He obtained. This is the Law of LIFE in Christ Jesus and is far superior to mere “Ordinances” written on the inward parts. The Jew may keep the Laws of God and display God’s righteousness, but the Christian can be in the image of Christ (Rom.8:29; 2nd Cor.3:18).

[fewarechosen]

just another thought about City, some food for thought.

1Co_3:9 For we are labourers together with God: ye are God's husbandry, ye are God's building.

notice this line in jeramiah

39 And the measuring line shall yet go forth over against it upon the hill Gareb, and shall compass about to Goath.

now this

Zec 2:1 I lifted up mine eyes again, and looked, and behold a man with a measuring line in his hand.
Zec 2:2 Then said I, Whither goest thou? And he said unto me, To measure Jerusalem, to see what is the breadth thereof, and what is the length thereof.
Zec 2:3 And, behold, the angel that talked with me went forth, and another angel went out to meet him,
Zec 2:4 And said unto him, Run, speak to this young man, saying, Jerusalem shall be inhabited as towns without walls for the multitude of men and cattle therein:
Zec 2:5 For I, saith the LORD, will be unto her a wall of fire round about, and will be the glory in the midst of her.

in my understanding these two scriptures are speaking about the Holy city the New jerusalem, this same one below.

Rev_3:12 Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name.

in zecharia notice how He will be the glory in the midst of the city ? thats because our bodies are His temple and the the Holy Spirit is Him in us, we are lively stones built up into a building and He inhabits us so He is the glory.

you will notice in jeramiah he speaks of a measuring line that had yet go forth. In zecharia he is speaking of that line and a man using it to measure and whahe is measuring. Now obviously all must be read in context but those are some scriptures that helped me understand a few things.

also the scripture below speaks of same thing, no idea why it pasted huge but oh well lol

Eze 40:2 In the visions of God brought he me into the land of Israel, and set me upon a very high mountain, by which was as the frame of a city on the south.
Eze 40:3 And he brought me thither, and, behold, there was a man, whose appearance was like the appearance of brass, with a line of flax in his hand, and a measuring reed; and he stood in the gate


There are many more tied into those, such as the white stone given and the measure of city in rev but dotn want to derail thread

[Walls]

There are many more tied into those, such as the white stone given and the measure of city in rev but dotn want to derail thread

Dear fewarechosen, I think many better scholars than I will agree with you. The measurements encompass roughly the area of Jerusalem. I say "roughly" to avoid derailing the thread by causing a huge discussion about a few meters, yards or cubits. As this will be the abode of Christ in the Millennium it is regarded as "holy." The outer court of Ezekiel's Temple has these rough dimensions too. It will encompass the whole of Jerusalem (depending in what stage of it's development you measure it).

I included it to show that the New Covenant will function and not fail like the Old one because King Jesus Messiah will physically live surrounded by His people Israel in the Millennium. If Israel are ever cast out again our Lord Jesus would be forced to withdraw as well. The last time Israel were cast out of their Land, God elegantly withdrew first so as not to be violated or humbled by the approaching armies of Nebuchadnezzar. This is the beginning of Ezekiel. The end of Ezekiel is the plans for the building of the Millennial Temple with the promises of restoration in between.

[John 8:32]

Please write whatever insight you have about this issue, quoting as much Scripture as is helpful.

One can start with Mat 5:1 through Mat 7:29.

[divaD]

Jeremiah 31:34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.


The context is clearly about the house of Israel. In this verse it says...for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more. That agrees with the following..."Jeremiah 31:37 Thus saith the LORD; If heaven above can be measured, and the foundations of the earth searched out beneath, I will also cast off all the seed of Israel for all that they have done, saith the LORD". Since we know that would be an impossibility, that the LORD really would cast off all the seed of Israel for all that they have done, we can then know in verse 34, this is referring to forgiving them of all they had done, their iniquities and sins mentioned in that verse. With that in mind then, let's go to Hebrews 10 again.

Hebrews 10:16 This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;
17 And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.


Notice verse 17...And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more. So why would that not be specifically meaning all that they had done, meaning the house of Israel, according to Jeremiah 31? So if verse 17 is referring to all that the house of Israel had done, and that their sins and iniquities will the Lord remember no more, then why wouldn't verse 16 be specifically meaning the house of Israel as well?

[John146]

I agree with you here. But unfortunately I don't see this agreeing with Jer 31:34, since that seems to be an entirely different context all together. And I did notice that you indicated you saw a connection between 1 John 2:27 and Jer 31:34.

Jeremiah 31:33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.
34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.


What's interesting about this, notice what we find out as we read on in that chapter.

Jeremiah 31:38 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that the city shall be built to the LORD from the tower of Hananeel unto the gate of the corner.
39 And the measuring line shall yet go forth over against it upon the hill Gareb, and shall compass about to Goath.
40 And the whole valley of the dead bodies, and of the ashes, and all the fields unto the brook of Kidron, unto the corner of the horse gate toward the east, shall be holy unto the LORD; it shall not be plucked up, nor thrown down any more for ever.

I would think this is meaning somewhere over in the middle east. Verse 40 indicates this city built to the LORD, it shall not be plucked up, nor thrown down any more for ever. With all the turmoil still occurring in the middle east, I just can't envision this part being true yet...it shall not be plucked up, nor thrown down any more for ever. Is there any reason to not understand any of this literally, such as there is no literal location matching this description on the planet earth?

How are you understanding this city that shall be built to the LORD?

While I'm thinking about it, before we even get to verse 39 and 40, we read this...Jeremiah 31:37 Thus saith the LORD; If heaven above can be measured, and the foundations of the earth searched out beneath, I will also cast off all the seed of Israel for all that they have done, saith the LORD. How can that context have any relation to the future NT church, especially since the NT church is comprised of Gentiles? My point is, not that the seed of Israel can't be a part of the NT church in the future, in relation to these prophecies in Jer 31, but how can Gentiles be in mind here as well, since the LORD isn't meaning all that the seed of Israel and the seed of Gentiles have done, but all that only the seed of Israel had done? I would think this same seed of Israel is who that is in focus in
Jeremiah 31:34.

I think you are completely missing my points. I am not trying to claim that the Gentiles are mentioned specifically anywhere within Jeremiah 31:31-40. I'm not saying the house of Israel that Jeremiah mentioned is actually the church or anything like that. It was a mystery at that time that the Gentiles would be included in the new covenant. And God intended it that way because he wanted that to be revealed at a certain time.

Rom 16:25 Now to him that is of power to stablish you according to my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret since the world began, 26 But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith:

Eph 3:How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words, 4 Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ) 5 Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit; 6 That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:

Do you understand that the new covenant is all about God providing salvation and the forgiveness of sins for people through the shed blood of His Son Jesus Christ (read Matt 26:27-28 and Heb 8-10)? If we only read Jeremiah 31 and didn't read the NT it would be easy to conclude that the new covenant only applies to the house of Israel and house of Judah and not to the Gentiles. But the NT revealed the mystery that it also applies to Gentile believers. Therefore, there is no reason to read Jeremiah 31:31-34 and conclude that the new covenant has nothing to do with Gentiles just because Gentiles are not specifically mentioned there. That is the point I'm trying to make. Do you agree or disagree with that?

[BroRog]

Jer 31:33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.
Jer 31:34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

1Jn_2:27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.


Whereof the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before,16 This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;17 And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.

I saw some thoughts referencing this.

that promise is the promise of the spirit, its a promise made to Israel the True Israel, not the israel that the pharisees were party to.

the reason they dont teach eachother is because the Holy Spirit teaches them, its written in their heart they have need of no man to teach them. Thats the tie in to those two scriptures. the sin an iniquities is tie in to other.

The passage in Jeremiah is not about teaching. To "know" the Lord in that context is to have a covenant relationship with the Lord. During the time of Jesus, one of the good things done by the Pharisees was the call back to a covenant relationship with God. During that time, many were encouraging the brethren to keep the covenant. Jeremiah is saying that during the time of the New Covenant (which I believe is still in Israel's future) a man will not need to encourage his neighbor "be in covenant relationship with (know) the Lord" because they will all be in covenant relation with (know) the Lord.

[John146]

Jeremiah 31:34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.


The context is clearly about the house of Israel. In this verse it says...for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more. That agrees with the following..."Jeremiah 31:37 Thus saith the LORD; If heaven above can be measured, and the foundations of the earth searched out beneath, I will also cast off all the seed of Israel for all that they have done, saith the LORD". Since we know that would be an impossibility, that the LORD really would cast off all the seed of Israel for all that they have done, we can then know in verse 34, this is referring to forgiving them of all they had done, their iniquities and sins mentioned in that verse. With that in mind then, let's go to Hebrews 10 again.

Hebrews 10:16 This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;
17 And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.


Notice verse 17...And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more. So why would that not be specifically meaning all that they had done, meaning the house of Israel, according to Jeremiah 31? So if verse 17 is referring to all that the house of Israel had done, and that their sins and iniquities will the Lord remember no more, then why wouldn't verse 16 be specifically meaning the house of Israel as well?

It does mean the house of Israel as well. But that doesn't mean the new covenant only applies to the house of Israel. Do you not think you are saved under the new covenant just because you are not part of the house of Israel (I assume)? Jesus Himself said the shedding of His blood for the remission of sins is what the new covenant is about (Matt 26:27-28). Did Jesus not shed His blood for Gentiles? You know He did. So, shouldn't it be clear that Gentiles are saved and have their sins forgiven under the new covenant as well? Are Gentile believers not fellowheirs with Jewish believers (Eph 2:11-3:6)? What is your understanding of the new covenant?

[BroRog]

Do you understand that the new covenant is all about God providing salvation and the forgiveness of sins for people through the shed blood of His Son Jesus Christ (read Matt 26:27-28 and Heb 8-10)?

Not exactly. This is part of it, certainly. But the New Covenant is a national agreement between God and Israel that he would be their God and they would be his people. The blood of the covenant, which Jesus shed, provides forgiveness of sins and reconciliation with God, resulting in eternal life for all who believe. Yes. But it also provides forgiveness of Israel's iniquity and national sin, which results in peace and reconciliation with God on a national level. Both are true.

[fewarechosen]

this scripture is the new covenant in action.

Mat 15:22 And, behold, a woman of Canaan came out of the same coasts, and cried unto him, saying, Have mercy on me, O Lord, thou Son of David; my daughter is grievously vexed with a devil.
Mat 15:23 But he answered her not a word. And his disciples came and besought him, saying, Send her away; for she crieth after us.
Mat 15:24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
Mat 15:25 Then came she and worshipped him, saying, Lord, help me.
Mat 15:26 But he answered and said, It is not meet to take the children's bread, and to cast it to dogs.
Mat 15:27 And she said, Truth, Lord: yet the dogs eat of the crumbs which fall from their masters' table.
Mat 15:28 Then Jesus answered and said unto her, O woman, great is thy faith: be it unto thee even as thou wilt. And her daughter was made whole from that very hour.


notice the woman is from cannan and they point that out. and notice how He says not a word to her, Hes blowing her off so to speak. also notice he must have been blowing her off for awhile because the disciples were complaining to Christ and wanted him to make her go away.

she comes to Christ and asks for help and He says to his disciples, hes not even talking to her (paraphrase) - i only come for lost sheep of israel

that becomes very key later because the promise to house israel is the promise we gentiles are grafted into.

He then tells her about scraps to children and dogs - Hes speaking to how the promise is to israel and what is for them should not be given to dogs. Hes not letting her have her wish and is making a point about it and why.

then she aknowledges Christ is right about the dog, so she agrees with him and has faith in what Hes saying and then adds her thoughts on how the dog does get scraps. Christ sees faith and makes her wishes so even though she was not from the fleshy house of israel.